Joining copper sheet
Bob Engelhardt
with 2 sides, each of which will have some 3 dimensionality. The 2
sides need to be joined at the edges.
He is talking about brazing, but I feel that for the effort & cost, it
is overkill and soft solder would be adequate and sooo much easier. I'm
pretty sure that he does not have an acetylene torch, or access to one.
MAPP/propylene yes.
Suggestions?
Thanks,
Bob
Michael Koblic
FWIW:
If there are more than one joint I would avoid soft solder: The heating of
the piece becomes critical and I have nearly lost my marbles while soldering
one joint with the other joints coming apart simultaneously. There may be
other issues with exposing soft-solder joints to weather.
I have had good success silver soldering using MAPP gas only with a
Bernzomatic torch. I use the lowest melting point alloy.
--
Michael Koblic
Campbell River, BC
Jim Wilkins
I've assembled durable 3D shapes in copper by folding a flange over
for mechanical strength before soldering.
Depending on his soldering experience an iron may be easier to control
than a flame. Once for fun I duplicated the TIG pattern of overlapping
circles on the soldered seams around some RF filter cans by moving the
iron back and forth and watching the puddle.
It's all practice. I have been at it so long I can splice 0.015"
solder end to end into rings with an iron. Try it!
jsw
N Morrison
> The 2 sides need to be joined at the edges.
I'd tin the entire inside faces with solder, then sweat the edges
together.
Bob Engelhardt
> If there are more than one joint I would avoid soft solder: The heating of
> the piece becomes critical and I have nearly lost my marbles while soldering
> one joint with the other joints coming apart simultaneously.
> I have had good success silver soldering using MAPP gas only with a
> Bernzomatic torch. I use the lowest melting point alloy.
Wouldn't silver solder have the same problem with previous joints coming
undone? Ideally you would have a progression of solders with decreasing
melting points.
> There may be other issues with exposing soft-solder joints to weather.
Well, they use soft solder on copper gutters, or don't they?
Thanks,
Bob
Michael Koblic
"Bob Engelhardt" <bobeng...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:h4g89...@news2.newsguy.com...
> Michael Koblic wrote:
>> If there are more than one joint I would avoid soft solder: The heating
>> of the piece becomes critical and I have nearly lost my marbles while
>> soldering one joint with the other joints coming apart simultaneously.
> ...
>> I have had good success silver soldering using MAPP gas only with a
>> Bernzomatic torch. I use the lowest melting point alloy.
>
> Wouldn't silver solder have the same problem with previous joints coming
> undone? Ideally you would have a progression of solders with decreasing
> melting points.
Not in my experience. The heat conduction through copper is such that it is
not difficult to achieve the 200-odd degC needed to melt the soft solder
quite a distance away from the joint you are working on. It is much harder
to do the same for a melting point of 600-odd degC. The heat tends to
dissipate before it gets there unless the joints are *very* close together.
> > There may be other issues with exposing soft-solder joints to weather.
>
> Well, they use soft solder on copper gutters, or don't they?
True, I think.
Bob Engelhardt
> I've assembled durable 3D shapes in copper by folding a flange over
> for mechanical strength before soldering.
Just doubled thickness:
| |
| |
| |
||||
||||
or having overlapping edges:
| |
| |
| |
------ |
''''''''
or seams:
| |
|____ |
____| |
| _____|
|_____
How did you handle the problem of previous joints coming undone when
soldering the next?
> Depending on his soldering experience an iron may be easier to control
> than a flame.
What size iron are we talking about here? I have a old iron that's just
a 1 lb hunk of copper & is heated over a torch. Never used it - how
would it compare to 'lectric?
> ...
> It's all practice. I have been at it so long I can splice 0.015"
> solder end to end into rings with an iron. Try it!
I think that I'll need a little more practice first <G>.
Thanks,
Bob
Bob Engelhardt
> I'd tin the entire inside faces with solder, then sweat the edges
> together.
Good point. That might help with something that he's worried about:
keeping solder from where he doesn't want it. I.e., on the outside
surfaces.
Thanks,
Bob
Bob Engelhardt
> "Bob Engelhardt" wrote in message
>> Wouldn't silver solder have the same problem with previous joints coming
>> undone? ...
>
> Not in my experience. The heat conduction through copper is such that it is
> not difficult to achieve the 200-odd degC needed to melt the soft solder
> quite a distance away from the joint you are working on. It is much harder
> to do the same for a melting point of 600-odd degC. The heat tends to
> dissipate before it gets there unless the joints are *very* close together.
OK, I can see that. But, talking about heat being dissipated, is it
hard to get large pieces of copper hot enough for silver solder? Oh, I
guess MAPP would do a much better job than propane.
Thanks again,
Bob
Lloyd E. Sponenburgh
news:h4g9r...@news2.newsguy.com:
> How did you handle the problem of previous joints coming undone when
> soldering the next?
>
Bob, just as they say in the electronics trade, "Solder ain't glue".
Soft solder has virtually no tensile strenght, but is fairly strong in
sheer. Hard solders are stronger, but still aren't intended to hold
things together until after they cool completely; they are pretty weak
when heated near-melting, but not quite.
Solder shouldn't provide the mechanical attachment; it strenghtens the
joint, keeps it from moving after soldering, and keeps it sealed to
the weather. The joint itself should be _mechanical_ in nature, and
at least strongly-enough joined so that it will endure the forces of
handing and fixturing during the soldering.
LLoyd
Lloyd E. Sponenburgh
> Good point. That might help with something that he's worried about:
> keeping solder from where he doesn't want it. I.e., on the outside
> surfaces.
Properly applied, the solder will form a meniscus between parts, and
won't flow over the edges unless you apply too much.
You could apply a masking substance where you don't want it to
migrate. I don't have any brand names at the tip of my tongue, but
there are several for just that purpose. You might find them at a
well-equipped art supplier.
Also, soft solder planes off any surface pretty easily with just a
sharp knife. You could clean up any buggers fairly easily, then re-
buff or re-texture the surface.
LLoyd
KD7HB
>
> OK, I can see that. But, talking about heat being dissipated, is it
> hard to get large pieces of copper hot enough for silver solder? Oh, I
> guess MAPP would do a much better job than propane.
>
> Thanks again,
> Bob
Propane is plenty hot enough for most silver solder on copper. Have to
use plenty of flux to keep the copper from oxidizing while it is hot.
The biggest problem with heating for silver solder is keeping the
copper from walking away from the heat. Any sheet form will warp and
twist from uneven heating. Need to clamp it quite well.
The lower heat from leaded solder will not warp near as much. Again,
lots of flux!
Paul
rangerssuck
<lloydspinsidemindspring.com> wrote:
> Bob Engelhardt <bobengelha...@comcast.net> fired this volley innews:h4g9r...@news2.newsguy.com:
Jus this afternoon, I was out in the garden and noticed that my wife
had ponded some nails into a post and wrapped wire around them for a
vine to climb on. I asked her about it, and she said she had done this
a couple of years ago, with a roll of wire on my workbench.
It turns out that the wire was .020" flux core solder, and had been
out in the elements for a couple of years, holding up a clematis with
no ill effects. Given that bit of empirical data, I wouldn't hesitate
to soft-solder a weathervane.
Also, if you apply the correct amount of heat, you really don't need
to worry about adjacent joints. I, too, have amused myself by splicing
solder. It's really not hard once you get the touch.
.
AL A.
> You could apply a masking substance where you don't want it to
> migrate. I don't have any brand names at the tip of my tongue, but
> there are several for just that purpose. You might find them at a
> well-equipped art supplier.
> LLoyd
>
One commonly used masking substance (often called "anti-flux") is
yellow ocher. You can get it from any of the jewelry supply places, on
line or elsewhere. Jewelers use it for just that, to keep solders from
flowing where you don't want them to flow. Just one such is here:
[http://www.contenti.com/products/soldering/510-810.html]
Googling "yellow ocher" will find lots of others on the web as well.
For small stuff, I often use white-out, the correction fluid stuff.
Works great. Just beware that some formulations (the non water based
ones)of it are flammable and it makes nasty smelly and probably somewhat
hazardous fumes when you first heat it. Take appropriate precautions and
have good ventilation, etc.
As an aside, get yourself of a few of the jewelers supply catalogs.
They have a whole world of cool neat-O tools, supplies, chemicals and
gadgets, sure to fascinate most anyone who spends much time here...
-Al A.
Lloyd E. Sponenburgh
news:53f6b4ee-2729-4410-a26f-3ee0951c7a54
@k26g2000vbp.googlegroups.com:
> It turns out that the wire was .020" flux core solder, and had been
> out in the elements for a couple of years, holding up a clematis
with
> no ill effects. Given that bit of empirical data, I wouldn't
hesitate
> to soft-solder a weathervane.
>
There's no question that soft solder will withstand the elements, but
I'll bet dollars to doughnuts that the 20-thou. solder was not
"holding up a clematis". Rather, it provided a growth path along
which the clematis vines found their own purchases along the way. 60-
40 Kester .020 electronics solder has a tensile strength of about
10lb, when virgin and not corroded. Still... it would take quite a
length of vine to equal 10lb, so it might have been holding it up, at
least until it reached another catch point.
(pretty stuff, that, especially on a walk-under arbor)
LLoyd
dca...@krl.org
> OK, I can see that. But, talking about heat being dissipated, is it
> hard to get large pieces of copper hot enough for silver solder? Oh, I
> guess MAPP would do a much better job than propane.
>
> Thanks again,
> Bob
Propane is plenty hot enough, but large copper pieces do require
thinking. I like to use IFB ( insulating firebrick ) to surround the
work. If it is really big two or more hand held propane torches may
be required. If it is not too big, I will first heat the part away
from where I want to silver braze. So that that part is not sucking
heat away from where I need the heat.
You might consider SilFos. It is copper with some silver ( up to
15% ) and some phosphorous which makes it self fluxing. But sometimes
I still use some flux. Silfos is no good on steel, but is good for
copper. Should be available at welding supply or plumbing supply
places.
Dan
Martin H. Eastburn
flat looking bronze - it is for plumbing - that of the air conditioning brazing.
It is easily done with MAPP.
Martin
F. George McDuffee
========
I would suggest that this is not a new product/project as similar
weather vanes have been around for 200 years or more.
Why not check and see how the people did it in the past as their
techniques must have worked and lasted.
My guess would be a high tin soft solder and an organic flux with
a big copper soldering iron. Most likely there were considerable
mechanical joints/tabs/folds/rivets [and possible some wire
lacing or stitching] and the solder was just used to seal things.
for some current production see
http://www.theweathervanefactory.com/weathervane.html
old time
http://www.weathervanesale.com/category/collectible_antique_weathervanes_and_famous_makers-2.html
http://www.theweatherstore.com/anwe2.html
There are many more sites.
Unka' George [George McDuffee]
-------------------------------------------
He that will not apply new remedies,
must expect new evils:
for Time is the greatest innovator: and
if Time, of course, alter things to the worse,
and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better,
what shall be the end?
Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman.
Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).
Lloyd E. Sponenburgh
volley
in news:q9en651b1vubv8boe...@4ax.com:
> s_and_famous_makers-2.html http://www.theweatherstore.com/anwe2.html
>
> There are many more sites.
>
>
> Unka' George [George McDuffee]
> -------------------------------------------
> He that will not apply new remedies,
> must expect new evils:
> for Time is the greatest innovator: and
> if Time, of course, alter things to the worse,
> and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better,
> what shall be the end?
>
> Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman.
> Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).
>
Um, Unk? When you make a post like that, you should suppress your sig
line! <G>
LLoyd
Richard J Kinch
> ... dollars to doughnuts ...
This doesn't mean what it used to. Dunkin Donuts at the Florida Turnpike
service plazas now charges $1 per donut. Parity has finally arrived.
Jim Wilkins
> Jim Wilkins wrote:
> > I've assembled durable 3D shapes in copper by folding a flange over
> > for mechanical strength before soldering.
> How did you handle the problem of previous joints coming undone when
> soldering the next?
>
> a 1 lb hunk of copper & is heated over a torch. Never used it - how
> would it compare to 'lectric?
>
> Bob
I made one piece larger and hammered a right angle flange, trimmed the
flat edge on the other piece to fit inside it, then folded the flange
over a little at a time. The problem is keeping the edges planar so
they fit together after hammering the shape. I didn't get it right at
first but was able to fold over the flange at the few places that met,
then work around the edges to bring the rest in. The curved shape
wasn't strong enough to withstand squeezing the pieces together with
clamps. I think I used a piece of 1/4" steel upright in the vise for
the anvil for outside curves and water pipe for the inside ones.
These days I have temperature controlled soldering irons, a nice one
at work and an old Hakko without a readout at home. They are much
nicer than uncontrolled ones because they can use a 2X - 3X more
powerful heater without burning the tinning off the tip.
Previously I used a soldering gun or a 100W iron for larger jobs where
a torch would cause damage, like melting wire insulation. If necessary
I preheat the work on a hotplate or with a hot air gun.
The electric iron localizes the heat well enough to control the molten
area. Solder changes appearance when it melts, less than steel but
more than aluminum when TIG welding.
jsw
Bob Engelhardt
> ... Any sheet form will warp and
> twist from uneven heating. Need to clamp it quite well. ...
Ah, yeah - warping. Soldering iron might be better in that respect.
Thanks,
Bob
Bob Engelhardt
<snip>
> You might consider SilFos. It is copper with some silver ( up to
Thanks - I kinda' remembered that there was a copper-specific braze.
Bob
Bob Engelhardt
> Bob, just as they say in the electronics trade, "Solder ain't glue".
>
> Hard solders are stronger, ...
>
> Solder shouldn't provide the mechanical attachment; ...
> The joint itself should be _mechanical_ in nature, ...
Thanks. I'm beginning to think that solder, hard or soft, is going to
be a lot of trouble and maybe purely mechanical is the way to go.
Copper pop rivets is my current favorite.
Bob
Bob Engelhardt
> I made one piece larger and hammered a right angle flange, trimmed the
> flat edge on the other piece to fit inside it, then folded the flange
OK - like this:
\ /
\ /
\ \ /
\ \ /
\ \/
\/
or this
\ /
\ /
\ \ /
\ \ /
\ \ /
\ \/
> The problem is keeping the edges planar so
> they fit together after hammering the shape. I didn't get it right at
> first but was able to fold over the flange at the few places that met,
> then work around the edges to bring the rest in. The curved shape
> wasn't strong enough to withstand squeezing the pieces together with
> clamps. ...
Oh, sure - the problem is that it's a closed space & you can't get
inside to back up the spot you're working on. Jeez, that must be
frustrating.
> These days I have temperature controlled soldering irons, ...
> Previously I used a soldering gun or a 100W iron for larger jobs ...
Temperature controlled is probably not in the picture, but I have a big
electric iron that is at least 100w.
> The electric iron localizes the heat well enough to control the molten
> area. ...
An iron is starting to sound a lot better than a torch.
Thanks,
Bob
Bob Engelhardt
> Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
>
>> You could apply a masking substance where you don't want it to
> One commonly used masking substance (often called "anti-flux") is
> yellow ocher. You can get it from any of the jewelry supply places, ...
Thanks. That's something that I'd hadn't heard of.
Bob
Bob Engelhardt
> I would suggest that this is not a new product/project as similar
> weather vanes have been around for 200 years or more.
>
> Why not check and see how the people did it in the past as their
> techniques must have worked and lasted.
It's obvious now that so many considerations are coming up: this should
be researched. When we were thinking "We'll just solder this together"
it seemed easy enough.
Thanks,
Bob
Ed Huntress
I have two electric irons that were made for sheet-metal work. One is 350 W;
the other is 300 W. You need a *big* iron to solder copper sheet. I've also
used two or even three furnace-heated soldering coppers simultaneously for
that work. The big electric iron is better for most of us.
As for the tensile strength of conventional soft solders, they run around
5,000 psi. Likewise for their shear strength, which, in well-designed
joints, is the more likely mode in which they'll be loaded. High-silver and
tin/silver solders made for work where food is involved can be stronger. Sn
95/ Sb 5 has tensile and shear strength of 8,000 psi +. You are not likely
to approach that overall strength in copper, or even 5,000 psi, with
mechanical fasteners, which load only a very small area of the sheet.
BTW, my uncle was quite expert at soldering copper stills during
Prohibition, which he did to supplement his paltry salary as a shop teacher
in public school. He made it clear to me that tinning was absolutely the way
to go with any sheet-metal work that was more involved than a simple
straight lap. Copper whiskey stills were soldered with lead-bearing solder
by using double folds -- an especially tricky thing to solder, which was
almost impossible to do without tinning the spots where you wanted the
solder to stick.
--
Ed Huntress
Ed Huntress
Consider, too, that more heat causes more problems with warping. SilFos will
be much more of a problem than soft solder in that regard.
--
Ed Huntress
dca...@krl.org
> Propane is plenty hot enough, but large copper pieces do require
> thinking. I like to use IFB ( insulating firebrick ) to surround the
> work. If it is really big two or more hand held propane torches may
> be required. If it is not too big, I will first heat the part away
> from where I want to silver braze. So that that part is not sucking
> heat away from where I need the heat.
>
> Dan
You will have less problems with warping regardless of whether you use
soft solder or brazing, if you insulate the work as best you can and
get the whole assembly hot.
Dan
Jim Wilkins
> Thanks,
> Bob
No, like a Y, so the seam can be squeezed or hammered shut. The ones
you showed will warp and open up when heated and you can't heat both
sides equally without smearing extra solder on the face of the metal.
The iron tip itself doesn't transfer much heat, both it and the sheet
have to be tinned so a substantial volume of liquid solder clinging to
them can heat the work. This means you have to carefully consider
where the heat needs to be applied before making the joint. On the
folded seam you heat both pieces by pressing the iron into the
depression that the solder will fill.
The type of joint you showed is quite ambitious and difficult for
someone who has to ask how to do it. It's possible to melt the flanged
edge on both pieces back to the hammered shape with a torch or TIG and
file the edge smooth but you need the skill to be able to fill
accidental holes. I can barely do it on auto body steel, I wouldn't
try copper without practice.
Otherwise the two halves could be carefully fitted dry, tinned, then
weighted and reflowed in an oven.
If you don't like the appearance of the flat folded joint you could
try an upright flange on both pieces so they snap together like an
aspirin tin. The advantage is that you can adjust the edges in and out
to match each other without disturbing the sculpted curves as much as
attempting to make the edge of both pieces fit flat would do. Warpage
will make the width of the joint vary but that isn't too noticeable
from a distance. Use a few sheet metal screws to hold it together
during assembly, solder can easily be dragged across small holes.
If you are only trying to hide the solder you could tin the inside of
oversized flat edges on both pieces, clamp short areas together and
solder them at the outer edge, then trim the edge back clean. The
joint is unlikely to be continuous and watertight so leave a gap at
the bottom to drain it.
Seams across a surface aren't as difficult as they look. Fold both
edges and hook them together, pound them shut, then flatten the good
side against an anvil with a 'seamer', a punch with a shallow
rectangular groove milled across the end. For one-off jobs I've
clamped three thick plates in the vise with the middle one lowered and
hammered the sheet metal down onto them. That was to form louvers on a
curved surface for a stainless steel cat-con heat shield, but the idea
is the same.
jsw
Bob Engelhardt
> I have two electric irons that were made for sheet-metal work. One is 350 W;
> the other is 300 W. You need a *big* iron to solder copper sheet. I've also
> used two or even three furnace-heated soldering coppers simultaneously for
> that work. The big electric iron is better for most of us.
100w seemed small to me, but I thought that Jim meant that he had used
100w iron on copper sheet.
> ... You are not likely
> to approach that overall strength in copper, or even 5,000 psi, with
> mechanical fasteners, which load only a very small area of the sheet.
True, but this IS a weathervane - how much strength could it need
(famous last words). Or, we could could the rivets to get it assembled
& then solder.
> BTW, my uncle was quite expert at soldering copper stills during
> Prohibition, which he did to supplement his paltry salary as a shop teacher
> in public school. He made it clear to me that tinning was absolutely the way
> to go with any sheet-metal work that was more involved than a simple
> straight lap. Copper whiskey stills were soldered with lead-bearing solder
> by using double folds -- an especially tricky thing to solder, which was
> almost impossible to do without tinning the spots where you wanted the
> solder to stick.
Cool uncle.
Thanks,
Bob
Ed Huntress
You don't know the half of it. His other part-time job was wrenching the
three Liberty aircraft engines on the Fleur de Lis, a 55-foot-long rum
runner that was clocked at over 50 mph around Sandy Hook, with a hold full
of booze. Empty, she was off the charts, and the Coast Guard never had a
chance.
Then he became the head of the New Jersey Industrial Arts Education
Association. <g>
--
Ed Huntress
Lloyd E. Sponenburgh
>> One commonly used masking substance (often called "anti-flux") is
>> yellow ocher. You can get it from any of the jewelry supply places,
...
>
> Thanks. That's something that I'd hadn't heard of.
>
Just don't confuse it with "anti-Borax", which IS a strong flux, not a
mask.
LLoyd
Joseph Gwinn
Bob Engelhardt <bobeng...@comcast.net> wrote:
> Michael Koblic wrote:
> > If there are more than one joint I would avoid soft solder: The heating of
> > the piece becomes critical and I have nearly lost my marbles while
> > soldering
> > one joint with the other joints coming apart simultaneously.
> ...
> > I have had good success silver soldering using MAPP gas only with a
> > Bernzomatic torch. I use the lowest melting point alloy.
>
> Wouldn't silver solder have the same problem with previous joints coming
> undone? Ideally you would have a progression of solders with decreasing
> melting points.
>
> > There may be other issues with exposing soft-solder joints to weather.
>
> Well, they use soft solder on copper gutters, or don't they?
I have copper gutters, and they are soldered.
I have also had houses with soldered copper window pans in a bay window,
intended for flowerpots, so watering the flowers wouldn't rot the wood.
Soldered copper is the traditional way to fabricate flashing for windows
as well. Since the time of the Romans.
And weathervanes have been made of soldered copper sheet forever. Here
the issue is making sure that the constant motion doesn't wear the
bearings out too soon. A piece of brass soldered into the copper may be
a good idea. I would also make sure that the vane cannot be lifted off
the vertical pole by any reasonable storm wind. The definition of
reasonable is whatever will cause the wing to fly away, probably 150 to
200 mph.
I would not worry about the durability of soldered copper, indoors or
outdoors.
Joe Gwinn
Rich Grise
> Bob Engelhardt wrote:
>> A friend is making a copper weather vane. Basically a silhouette, but
>> with 2 sides, each of which will have some 3 dimensionality. The 2
>> sides need to be joined at the edges.
>>
>> He is talking about brazing, but I feel that for the effort & cost, it
>> is overkill and soft solder would be adequate and sooo much easier. I'm
>> pretty sure that he does not have an acetylene torch, or access
>> to one. MAPP/propylene yes.
>
> the piece becomes critical and I have nearly lost my marbles while soldering
You need a heat sink between the joint you're soldering and the previous
joints. Maybe a couple of pieses of scrap copper, or even aluminum,
clamped around the metal near the joint, to absorb the head and dissipate
it before it melts the other joints.
Good Luck!
Rich
Rich Grise
> ...
> I, too, have amused myself by splicing
> solder. It's really not hard once you get the touch.
> .
Me, too! ;-)
Cheers!
Rich
charlie
"Rich Grise" <rich...@example.net> wrote in message
news:pan.2009.07.27....@example.net...
even a cold rag would do it
sta...@prolynx.com
> "Bob Engelhardt" <bobengelha...@comcast.net> wrote in message
>
> - Show quoted text -
For large chunks of sheet, a large soldering copper is hard to beat.
I inherited a bucket full. The old-timers used to use kerosene or
gasoline blowtorches to heat them, most of the torches had a rest for
the copper's shank. A propane torch could be used for heating, given
a solid rest for the iron. Makes even a 300 watt iron look sick. But
the user has to know when to clean them, when to tin them and
everything has to be just so. Got to have a tinning block, too, a cube
of ammonium chloride, for tinning the irons. Tinning the work
beforehand is almost mandatory, the only time I've gotten away without
it is when using some patented solder paste that had powdered solder
in with the flux. Worked well but was expensive. Both surfaces have
to be absolutely clean and shiny, whatever method is used for
soldering. No fingerprints, either.
For stop-off, I've used a talc stick like the welders use for marking
out, works fine. Read about that in Brownell's Gunsmith Kinks.
Stan
Ed Huntress
<sta...@prolynx.com> wrote in message
news:76acd558-f7f9-47a5...@z28g2000vbl.googlegroups.com...
.to be absolutely clean and shiny, whatever method is used for
>soldering. No fingerprints, either.
I'm old enough that I had to use coppers to solder my tin cup in 7th-grade
metal shop class. <g>
I sold my last ones at a yard sale a few years ago. So far, I haven't
regretted it.
>For stop-off, I've used a talc stick like the welders use for marking
>out, works fine. Read about that in Brownell's Gunsmith Kinks.
Same here. I have a bunch of them, and I've used them for that purpose --
another trick taught to me by my uncle.
--
Ed Huntress
Jman
Take the time to set-up everything nice and square and you don't need
to fold anything either...
Things you need:
- $10.00 bottle of Propylene, MAPP or PROPANE with the 'finest' tip
you can find..
- A few sticks of "CopperPhosphate" or otherwise known as "Copperphos"
(Contains NO Silver and the Color match is just about PERFECT..., also
NO FLUX is needed for this, as it is a 'Self Fluxing' composition that
actually works !)
- 100 grit or finer piece of sandpaper
A) Sand your edges on both sides of the copper sheet ALONG with your
Copperphos ROD, then wipe down with dry clean cloth.
B) Bind the copper sheet together as you would like it. Keep it down
TIGHT, as the heat will obviously try to move it.
C) Turn on the Propylene (not the same as MAPP) and gently pre-heat
the SEAM from left to right (or whatever you prefer) and then keep
tapping the rod into the heated joint / seam until it starts to flow.
Once you have that going, move the heat and the rod (while still
gently tapping) and you'll get a good flow going. Before you know it,
you'll have a nicely bound seam that won't come apart and will likely
be the EXACT color of your copper.
D) Once cool, move to the next part and follow the same steps
**If you need to keep the other areas cool, you can use everything
from THICK, WET RAGS to DRYWALL MUD as a heat shield.
Good Luck,
/MM
Leo Lichtman
"charlie" wrote: even a cold rag would do it
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Or a wet rag at room temerature ;-)
Rich Grise
That's still cold, relative to the HAX. ;-)
Cheers!
Rich