Gas Pressure for small MIG welder???
Mark Zivley
MIG from flux core. We have the regulator, but no flow meter in the
"upgrade" kit.
Obviously, flow rate is probably the best measure, but we don't have
that so if anyone has a suggestion for the pressure setting to use I'd
appreciate hearing what target pressure works best.
Our testing this evening was between 15-20 psig.
Thanks,
Mark
Greg & Joanne Jordison
I have 2 MIG's one with a regulator and one with a flowmeter
and both work well. The regulator is set to 20 psi when I am
working inside with just an exhaust fan, if the doors are open
I turn the pressure to 35 -50 psi (depending on wind speed)
or use a small wind break on my table made out of 2-18" squares
of 1/2" drywall gyproc bolted together at 90 degrees with a piece of
light angle iron.
Hope this helps
Greg
"Mark Zivley" <mzi...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:3CB104D8...@sbcglobal.net...
Mike Graham
wrote:
>My brother and I have just converted the small Lincoln weld pak 100 to
>MIG from flux core. We have the regulator, but no flow meter in the
>"upgrade" kit.
If you got a regulator with a gauge on it in the upgrade kit, then I
strongly suspect that it *is* a flow-meter. They come in dial-type as
well as ball-type. What is the range of numbers on the dial?
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Mike Graham | Fighting the good fight against porosity,
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Mark Zivley
It looks and behaves like a pressure gauge. The range goes from 0 to
probably 50-60ish but I didn't look at the top number.
I started with the reducing regulator adjustment screw all the way out
and when I cracked the bottle, the gauge didn't move. As I dialed in
the adjustment screw the needle on the gauge moved upwards accordingly,
but remained at the adjusted number. I would have suspected that once
the adjustment had been made (and the gas solenoid was off) that a flow
indicator would have returned to 0 once the pressure stopped increasing?
I'll take a closer look tonight and see if the units on the gauge are
pressure or perhaps flow as you mentioned.
Thanks for the reply.
Mark
Mike Graham
wrote:
>I started with the reducing regulator adjustment screw all the way out
>and when I cracked the bottle, the gauge didn't move. As I dialed in
>the adjustment screw the needle on the gauge moved upwards accordingly,
>but remained at the adjusted number. I would have suspected that once
>the adjustment had been made (and the gas solenoid was off) that a flow
>indicator would have returned to 0 once the pressure stopped increasing?
This is a wee bit contrary. You're right that it sounds more like a
pressure gauge than a flow gauge, but I would expect the pressure
gauge to read higher when the flow is off than when it's on. In the
top middle of the gauge face does it say "PSI"?
Zorro
story. If there's a unit of time in there, then it's a flow meter. If you
don't understand what the units stand for, bring them back here and we'll
help out or else plug them into your favorite search engine.
For reference:
bar = barometric (pressure)
PSI = pounds per square inch
Scfh = square cubic feet per hour
L/min = liters per minute
...flow gauges usually are marked for the type of gas intended. Example
yours may say "Ar/CO2" because different density gasses flow differently at
same pressures.
Keith Marshall
two round gauges, one for tank pressure and the other for flow. Technically
I don't believe it's a true flow meter but instead is a pressure meter
calibrated to display the "expected" flow rate through a given size outlet
port at the set pressure and should show "expected" flow in cubic feet per
hour. Since the pressure is there even when there is no flow it will
continue to display a value. The units should be "SCFH" or "CFH"
It's not the best setup but it works fine for me and is pretty typical for
the cheaper units.
There's a picture of one at
http://store2.yimg.com/I/weldingdirect_1678_4219567
Best Regards,
Keith Marshall
kmars@progressivelogic(dot)com
"Mark Zivley" <mzi...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:3CB18FF3...@sbcglobal.net...
Greg & Joanne Jordison
Regulator is set to 1-1 1/2 PSI up to 3-4 PSI with the doors open. At 20 -50
PSI a tank wouldn't last much more than a couple of weeks, maybe a month.
Greg
--
Greg Jordison -- g.j.jordi...@shaw.ca
(Interprovincial Journeyman
Welding Shop Owner)
" If you can buy one buy it,
If you cannot I'll try anything once,
Twice If I can make a profit"
"Greg Jordison" wrote in message
news:2ibs8.29590$%3.26...@news1.calgary.shaw.ca...
Dave Benham
Dave
Zorro <Zo...@juno.com> wrote in message
news:54is8.130$CA6....@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Stuart Wheaton
>
> Sorry Not PSI -But CFH
> Regulator is set to 1-1 1/2 PSI up to 3-4 PSI with the doors open. At 20 -50
> PSI a tank wouldn't last much more than a couple of weeks, maybe a month.
You have a flowmeter...cfh is cubic feet/hour, a rate of flow.
I bet Mark will find the same thing.
Stuart
Zorro
pecking at the keyboard faster that my pumpkin head could think! ;-)
Brunhilda D. Buttinski
> Mike,
> I started with the reducing regulator adjustment screw all the way out
> and when I cracked the bottle, the gauge didn't move. As I dialed in
> the adjustment screw the needle on the gauge moved upwards accordingly,
> but remained at the adjusted number. I would have suspected that once
> the adjustment had been made (and the gas solenoid was off) that a flow
> indicator would have returned to 0 once the pressure stopped increasing?
>
Harris. They *are* regulators, except they're calibrated differently and the
gas flows through an orifice. You should see the letters "CFH" on the gauge
somewhere. The gauge actually measures the backpressure of the gas as it
attempts to flow through the orifice. If I wanted to change the gauges to
work with a gas other than argon, I would need to change the orifice size.
If I set the flow to 20 CFH then the gas solenoid shuts off, the needle will
usually rise a bit, to perhaps 25. It will stay there indefinitely
(supposing there are no leaks) until the solenoid opens, then drop to 20
again. The reason this happens (i.e., the gauge doesn't return to zero) is,
again, because it's actually a pressure gauge. There is no "flow" but there
is pressure in the line. When the solenoid opens the flow resumes through
the orifice, and the pressure drops accordingly.
The ball type gauge may behave the way you expect. The gauge-type flow meter
came with my TIG machine, when I bought a second bottle of gas and flowmeter
I was too cheap to cough up the extra $30 ($80 vs $50) for a ball gauge. I
sort of regret that decision now. Ah, well. Live and learn.
Anyway, bottom line: I think you do have a flow meter.
-B.
Ed Huntress
news:547F4410E7825DE3.D7DC2F2A...@lp.airnews.net...
> >
> That's exactly how my flow gauges work. One is a Smith and the other is a
> Harris. They *are* regulators, except they're calibrated differently and
the
> gas flows through an orifice. You should see the letters "CFH" on the
gauge
> somewhere. The gauge actually measures the backpressure of the gas as it
> attempts to flow through the orifice. If I wanted to change the gauges to
> work with a gas other than argon, I would need to change the orifice size.
All of this raises a question that's of interest to me. A few years ago I
had a really nice Harris two-stage regulator rebuilt, without much thought
of what I'd use it for. It was on a nitrogen bottle that I used in my photo
lab 30 years ago. My welding equipment supplier tells me it's the same
number they sell for use with argon, and that I can use it for that.
I thought I might use it for back purging, and, when I move on to TIG, that
perhaps it would have some use there. I've since given up on the idea of
using it for TIG but this thread has given me renewed interest in using it
for back purging when I'm using my O/A rig for stainless and so on.
Are the orifices available as an aftermarket item? Do they just screw on to
a standard regulator? Or are they built into the body somehow?
Ed Huntress
Brunhilda D. Buttinski
"Ed Huntress" <hunt...@optonline.net> wrote in message news:BmQs8.4525
(snip)
>
> Are the orifices available as an aftermarket item? Do they just screw on
to
> a standard regulator? Or are they built into the body somehow?
>
regulators. Except for the markings on the gauge, the only difference is the
size of the brass coupler on the output side, the two units are otherwise
identical. I suspect (without actually taking the flow meter apart to look)
that the orifice is built into that brass output coupler. The Harris and
Smith flowmeters both have identical pieces there, this leads me to think
they're more or less industry standard items.
Some more info: the Smith flowmeter is calibrated in CFH and LPM (liters per
minute). It says 'Use .032" orifice for Argon'. The Harris flowmeter is
calibrated in PSIG and CFH. This, I think, is the source of the original
poster's confusion. The Harris says 'For Carbon Dioxide use .036" orifice.'
Both units are currently set up for argon.
From this I think we can assume that *any* standard, non-fuel gas regulator
could be converted to a "flowmeter" with the appropriate orifice and a
conversion chart that allows one to make the leap from PSIG output to
expected gas flow. I can't imagine that the gas output through a fixed
orifice remains linear as the input pressure varies, so the conversion chart
would have to be non-linear - or more likely, over the typical range of
output for a welder the calibration error is insignificant.
-B.
Ed Huntress
because it could save me a few bucks and give me the satisfaction of not
having wasted my money by having the old regulator rebuilt.
I got a special price when I had that regulator and my two old two-stage
Smith O and A regulators rebuilt at the same time. Still, I'd like to use
the Harris in some constructive way.
Ed Huntress
"Brunhilda D. Buttinski" <lumpy...@buttugly.org> wrote in message
news:BB62109A929A3E09.DEAF47CE...@lp.airnews.net...
Mark Zivley
gauge is marked with flow units, not pressure units as I had assumed.
Thanks very much to everyone that helped me to figure this out. I've
seen the ball in tube flow meters and when I didn't see one of those I
just assumed that I was looking at a pressure gauge. Doh!
Mark