WELL, SO MUCH FOR WIND POWER! Blowhard T.Boone Pickens Capitulates To Big Foreign Oil!
John Fartlington Poopnagle
By Steven Mufson
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, July 8, 2009
T. Boone Pickens has temporarily shelved plans to build the world's
biggest wind farm in the Texas Panhandle because of tight credit
markets and low natural gas prices, and his company Mesa Power is
looking for other projects that could use the $2 billion worth of wind
turbines already on order.
Pickens unveiled plans in 2007 for the 4,000-megawatt wind farm -- big
enough to power 1.3 million homes -- at a projected cost of $10
billion. In May 2008, Pickens ordered 667 wind turbines from General
Electric for the first of four project phases. Mesa is scheduled to
begin taking delivery in 2011.
The project was a symbol of the oilman's commitment to his high-
profile campaign to slash the nation's dependence on foreign oil with
a combination of wind power and the use of natural gas in vehicles.
"Boone still remains committed and focused on developing wind energy
in the United States," said Jay Rosser, a spokesman for Pickens's BP
Capital Management. "The timing is not as aggressive as he originally
outlined because of the collapse of the capital markets and because of
the steep downturn of natural gas prices." (Many utilities are
choosing natural gas to generate electricity.)
Rosser said Mesa Power was also unable to borrow $2 billion for
transmission lines to link the wind farm to the Texas grid. "Now we're
going to wait for the state to put the transmission [lines] in, which
will invariably be slower than what we were planning," Rosser said.
He said Mesa Power was looking at projects in the Midwest and Canada
that might need the turbines.
Pickens made his fortune in the oil business but last year lost a big
chunk of it in oil trading because he failed to anticipate a swift
drop in prices. He has spent $60 million promoting the Pickens Plan
for reducing U.S. dependence on foreign oil.
Rosser said, "We've got a lot of skin in the game -- and a lot of
turbines."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/07/AR2009070702455.html
John Fartlington Poopnagle
Bret Cahill
Just wait a year and the price of oil will be right up there where it
was a year ago.
Pickens could set of a foundation in case he dies before next year to
make sure the project goes ahead.
We have enough medical foundations.
Bret Cahill
softsofa
<perry...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>T. Boone Pickens [. . .] company Mesa Power is
>looking for other projects that could use the $2 billion worth of wind
>turbines already on order. [. . .]
Washington DC. Follow the wind.
[]softsofa[]
Fredric L. Rice
>T. Boone Pickens has temporarily shelved plans to build the world's
>biggest wind farm in the Texas Panhandle because of tight credit
>markets and low natural gas prices, and his company Mesa Power is
>looking for other projects that could use the $2 billion worth of wind
>turbines already on order.
Put paddles on them and automatically spank rightards who waste
our tax payer money.
---
Hitler and Sarah Palin: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3IzNPEGWNos
Bill O'Reilly phone rape: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBu1b_GpXM8
softsofa
Rice) wrote:
>John Fartlington Poopnagle <perry...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>T. Boone Pickens has temporarily shelved plans to build the world's
>>biggest wind farm in the Texas Panhandle because of tight credit
>>markets and low natural gas prices, and his company Mesa Power is
>>looking for other projects that could use the $2 billion worth of wind
>>turbines already on order.
>
>Put paddles on them and automatically spank rightards who waste
>our tax payer money.
But forget Progressive money-wasters because there aren't enough
paddles.
[]softsofa[]
Lamont Cranston
90% of the national debt was incurred during Republican
administrations.
>
>
>
> []softsofa[]
Day Brown
credit problems we now have from collapsed banks. Has nothing whatever
to do with the technology of windpower, and everything to do with the
fucked up financial system.
The right wing usta be fiscal conservatives who understood finance.
softsofa
So you're saying that most of the national debt is a waste of money?
"I" agree.
However, the majority of unfunded liabilities were incurred by
programs started during Democratic administrations (eg.
Medicare/Social Security currently $44 Trillion, 4 times the national
debt) In any case, Obama is going for the record.
The proper response is not "Republicans/Democrats waste more", it's
"Stop spending money like you're on a crack binge, you pee-brain
morons!"
[]softsofa[]
.
> So you're saying that most of the national debt is a waste of money?
> "I" agree.
>
> However, the majority of unfunded liabilities were incurred by
> programs started during Democratic administrations (eg.
> Medicare/Social Security currently $44 Trillion, 4 times the national
> debt) In any case, Obama is going for the record.
>
> The proper response is not "Republicans/Democrats waste more", it's
> "Stop spending money like you're on a crack binge, you pee-brain
> morons!"
>
We need to keep with the 2004 idea of spending big money on corn for methanol
fuel, Congress and Bush said that it was a good idea.
If not, importing our energy from other countries isn't a bad idea. We've
done it before and continue to do so, and being a conservative, I don't like
change.
What's wrong with importing what we need? Everyone worships the almighty
American buck.
Shit! The last TV set made in North America was an Electrohome in Kitchener
Ontario Canada, in 1985, but we have plenty of television sets!
What's the problem?
Lamont Cranston
I didn't say anything remotely close to that. Why are you
so fucking dishonest?
Bert Hyman
news:2afe5030-2645-4bb8...@u16g2000pru.googlegroups.com
Bret Cahill <BretC...@aol.com> wrote:
> We have enough medical foundations.
We don't need medical foundations.
The State will take care of everything.
--
Bert Hyman St. Paul, MN be...@iphouse.com
softsofa
<Lamont....@WhoKnowsWhatEvilLurksInTheHeartsOfRepugs.com> wrote:
>softsofa wrote:
>> On Thu, 9 Jul 2009 07:42:36 -0700, "Lamont Cranston" wrote:
>>
>>>softsofa wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 09 Jul 2009 01:08:03 GMT,Fredric L. Rice wrote:
>>>>>>[. . .]wind turbines[. . .]
>>>>>Put paddles on them and automatically spank rightards
>>>>>who waste our tax payer money.
>>>> But forget Progressive money-wasters because there
>>>> aren't enough paddles.
>>>90% of the national debt was incurred during Republican
>>>administrations.
>> So you're saying that most of the national debt is a waste
>> of money? "I" agree.
>I didn't say anything remotely close to that. Why are you
>so fucking dishonest?
That is exactly what you said. Let's dissect this toad together.
"I": "But forget Progressive money-wasters because there aren't enough
paddles." (translation: Progressives waste more money than
Republicans)
Lamont Cranston (you): "90% of the national debt was incurred during
Republican administrations."
Now, this is the difficult part, so "I" will go slowly:
1.) You are either agreeing or disagreeing with "I". Conclusion: you
are disagreeing. Therefore:
2.) You are claiming that Republicans waste more.
3.) You believe that your statement supports that conclusion.
4.) Your evidence is that 90% of national debt is tied to
Republicans. Therefore:
5.) You are claiming that there is a correlation between national
debt and waste.
This is true, so "I" agreed. Your claiming "I didn't say anything
remotely close to that." is, therefore, ludicrous.
Ideologues (such as yourself) will always be tripped up by even
elementary tasks as this because your Ideologic A.I. is too simplex.
"I" challenge you to cast off your ideologic chains and unfetter your
higher brain functions, such as they are.
[]softsofa[]
LEROY KNEVIL
Tell your politicions to stop feeding you all the bullshit about
ending
U.S. "dependence on foreign oil."
It ain't gonna happen inside of 30 years -- or until all the oil's
used up .. whichever comes first!
The monetary incentives just aren't there ... yet.
-------------
"Wind Projects at a Standstill"
"Despite Washington's Enthusiasm, Recession and New Regulations Slow
Firms"
By Jonathan Starkey
Washington Post Staff Writer
Saturday, July 11, 2009
THE OBAMA administration has made offshore wind energy a priority and
an important part of its plans to create jobs and combat climate
change, but even such favorable political breezes have not been strong
enough to propel the nation's first projects.
The economy has intervened, and an unfamiliar federal approval process
could hold up leading projects.
Just last month, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar distributed leases to
explore five possible wind farm sites off Delaware and New Jersey on
the outer continental shelf. The leases were the first ever, and
Salazar proclaimed "a new day for energy production in the United
States."
But that day may be years in the dawning.
Developer Bluewater Wind won two of the leases for sites 14 miles off
Delaware and 15 to 18 miles off New Jersey. The company seemed to be
barreling toward being first in the emerging industry, with plans to
plant a wind farm into the seabed at Rehoboth Beach, Del. A year ago,
it had even struck an agreement to sell power from the giant windmills
to Delmarva Power.
But now, its parent company, Australian investment firm Babcock &
Brown, has buckled under the weight of the global economic downturn
and is selling off its assets to reduce debt. Bluewater is looking for
investors to keep its projects moving.
"They're just reapproaching all of the other players out there, hat in
hand," said Brian Yerger, chief executive of Aerca Advisors, a
consulting company focusing on renewable energy. "There are a lot of
balls in the air."
Hundreds of large and small wind farms have been built on U.S. land,
but that sector also is feeling financing frustrations. This week,
oilman T. Boone Pickens backed off of his plans to build the world's
largest wind farm in the Texas Panhandle, citing tight credit markets
and lower natural gas prices.
Pickens could not find financing to pay for the transmission lines
that would hook up his wind farm to the Texas grid. Offshore
developers face a similar problem. They need to find customers to buy
their power and must do so before they can get financing to build.
They must also navigate an untested federal permit process that was
scheduled to take effect late last month, putting projects many years
away from completion. Construction on even the most promising projects
in Rhode Island, along with those in Delaware and New Jersey, won't
begin for at least four years.
"I guess I would say there's a lot of uncertainty out there in the
industry," said Matthew Kaplan, a senior wind analyst at Emerging
Energy Research.
Ed Feo, a partner specializing in renewable energy projects at law
firm Milbank, Tweed, Hadley & McLoy, said the fact that offshore
developers are entering uncharted waters inevitably increases the
level of uncertainty.
"This is relatively high on the difficulty scale," said Feo, who said
he is working with a pair of companies developing offshore wind
projects. "Five years from now, it will be a lot easier. But right
now, every issue requires a lot of thought and discussion. There's
just not a policy manual to pull off the shelf."
Yet there have been strong signals of support from Washington. In
April, the Interior Department broke through a regulatory logjam and
issued rules governing how to gain federal approval to build wind
farms offshore. The stimulus plan included a cash grant program and
federal loan guarantees meant to spur investment in renewable energy
projects. The Treasury said Thursday that it expects to hand out $3
billion in direct payments.
Additionally, federal legislation making its way through Congress
would cap greenhouse gas emissions and establish a nationwide
renewable electricity standard, requiring utilities to meet a certain
percentage of energy needs with renewable sources. Theoretically, that
would make traditional sources of energy more expensive and open up
markets for companies developing renewable energy projects, including
offshore wind. Individual states already have similar measures in
place mandating the use of renewable energy.
How that will ultimately speed offshore development is uncertain.
Fierce opposition has all but consumed a plan to build a wind farm in
Nantucket Sound that was proposed in 2001 and has since become the
subject of legal challenges and a multimillion-dollar lobbying
campaign.
Cape Wind Associates is still awaiting federal approval to move
forward with its $1 billion-plus plan to build 130 turbines -- each as
high as 440 feet from sea level -- six miles off Cape Cod, Mass.
Renewed legal challenges, however, could further delay the project.
Kaplan said Cape Wind's troubles send bad signals to an industry
attempting to grow out of infancy.
"That in itself makes investors cringe, when they see the first
offshore wind project has taken this long and is still not over the
hurdles," Kaplan said.
Other projects continue to inch forward in New Jersey and Rhode
Island, some also dependent on critical negotiations to sell power.
As for Bluewater, President Peter Mandelstam said the company is
moving forward and has identified interest among investors. Its two
meteorological towers -- each costing $6 million -- will be built by
next summer, he said. Necessary data should be in hand by the end of
2011, at which time the company would be ready to secure more than $2
billion needed to build its projects off Delaware and New Jersey.
Under the company's current plans, construction would begin by the
spring of 2013, and the windmills would be in the seabed sending power
inland through undersea cables by that fall. Mandelstam said the
company's financing situation should not delay progress.
"I've been in business long enough to understand that sometimes
companies fail," Mandelstam said. "I'm not disappointed, it's simply
business. One meets a new challenge, and one overcomes it. I've raised
capital before, and I'm raising capital again."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/11/AR2009071100148.html?hpid=artslot
habshi
that is 27 nuclear reactors worth and its going to be even more this
year
Neo
Fortunately, I'm already using wind power
electricity to run my home. Last month I changed
my electricity (generation only) provider from PEPCO
to 100% windpower from Washington Gas Energy
Services/ Clean Currents. Because PEPCO cost of generating
electricity lag behind market prices - the cost of Wind
powered electricity from Clean Current is about two
cents less per kilowatt hour than if I remained with
PEPCO ( for the next 10 months because PEPCO
raised its rates to about 13 cents/kwh. The wind power
rate is about 11 cents/kwh ).
See
Turned on, but tuned out
- Consumers have energy options, but little awareness
Sean R Sedam. The Gazette of Politics and business
Friday July 10th, 2009
http://www.gazette.net/stories/07102009/polinew195210_32528.shtml
On Jul 8, 11:32 am, John Fartlington Poopnagle
Neo
> That's mighty bad turn of events for Mr Pickens.
>
> Fortunately, I'm already using wind power
> electricity to run my home. Last month I changed
> my electricity (generation only) provider from PEPCO
> to 100% windpower from Washington Gas Energy
> Services/ Clean Currents. Because PEPCO cost of generating
> electricity lag behind market prices - the cost of Wind
> powered electricity from Clean Current is about two
> cents less per kilowatt hour than if I remained with
> PEPCO ( for the next 10 months because PEPCO
> raised its rates to about 13 cents/kwh. The wind power
> rate is about 11 cents/kwh ).
I found out later today that WGES/Clean Currents has
sinced raised their rates to match PEPCO's rates
(as to not undersell PEPCO). I had signed my contract
with Clean Current before PEPCO officially raised
their rates I was able to lock onto a lower rate when
I had switched over with WGES/Clean Current. .
>
> See
> Turned on, but tuned out
> - Consumers have energy options, but little awareness
> Sean R Sedam. The Gazette of Politics and business
> Friday July 10th, 2009http://www.gazette.net/stories/07102009/polinew195210_32528.shtml
>
> On Jul 8, 11:32 am, John Fartlington Poopnagle
>
>
>
> <perryneh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > "Pickens Calls Off Plans For Vast Texas Wind Farm"
>
> > By Steven Mufson
> > Washington Post Staff Writer
> > Wednesday, July 8, 2009
>
> > T. Boone Pickens has temporarily shelved plans to build the world's
> > biggest wind farm in the Texas Panhandle because of tight credit
> > markets and low natural gas prices, and his company Mesa Power is
> > looking for other projects that could use the $2 billion worth of wind
> > turbines already on order.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Rob Dekker
"." <bo...@boran.net> wrote in message news:MPG.24c0a363d...@news.x-privat.org...
> softsofa wrote
>> So you're saying that most of the national debt is a waste of money?
>> "I" agree.
>>
>> However, the majority of unfunded liabilities were incurred by
>> programs started during Democratic administrations (eg.
>> Medicare/Social Security currently $44 Trillion, 4 times the national
>> debt) In any case, Obama is going for the record.
>>
>> The proper response is not "Republicans/Democrats waste more", it's
>> "Stop spending money like you're on a crack binge, you pee-brain
>> morons!"
>>
>
> We need to keep with the 2004 idea of spending big money on corn for methanol
> fuel, Congress and Bush said that it was a good idea.
That would be ethanol. Not methanol.
>
> If not, importing our energy from other countries isn't a bad idea. We've
> done it before and continue to do so, and being a conservative, I don't like
> change.
>
> What's wrong with importing what we need? Everyone worships the almighty
> American buck.
>
Until they don't any more.
There was also a time that we did not import energy.
That was the time that we built up (economic) strength, and that was the time that the dollar was almighty.
When we are importing (and not exporting as much) the dollar becomes weaker.
Any way, what are these foreigners doing with these dollars ?
How do they come back to the USA ?
They are buying up our country, bit by bit. That's how.
So importing without exporting is selling off your country.
So this is harvesting from our parents' work.
We borrow from our children, and we harvest from our parents.
Is that the new conservative economic policy ?
> Shit! The last TV set made in North America was an Electrohome in Kitchener
> Ontario Canada, in 1985, but we have plenty of television sets!
Other countries are getting better at things that we used to be the best in.
When are we going to do something ourselves again, and do it better than anyone else ?
>
> What's the problem?
>
If we just sit on our behind and tell ourselves that there is nothing wrong with importing and not exporting, then we are seriously
dillusional.
>
John Fartlington Poopnagle
them big ol' windmills ...
Michael Coburn
> Y'know, I never could figure out how a car could be fueled by one o'
> them big ol' windmills ...
According to T. Boone we were going to make electricity with the
windmills and use the natural gas that would have been used to make the
electricity to then run the cars.
--
"Those are my opinions and you can't have em" -- Bart Simpson
harry
> "." <bo...@boran.net> wrote in messagenews:MPG.24c0a363d...@news.x-privat.org...
You are exactly right. What's needed is a new angle, new products and
ideas.
ghio
> "." <bo...@boran.net> wrote in messagenews:MPG.24c0a363d...@news.x-privat.org...
> > softsofa wrote
> Any way, what are these foreigners doing with these dollars ?
> How do they come back to the USA ?
> They are buying up our country, bit by bit. That's how.
Sorry, the truth is that you have been sold out by yourselves. China
did not buy American companies. American companies moved their
business to China to pander to Americans desire for ever cheaper
consumer goods. But it's ok, it doesn't matter that China has lent
America more than the country is worth, you don't have to pay it back.
Just elect Jeb Bush as pres next time around and have another war,
this time with China. Of course you will have to buy the weapons from
China because America no longer has the manufacturing capacity to make
enough weapons, but, hey, I'm sure that America could get China to
lend you the money for the weapons.
The biggest enemy of America is .... Americans. You couldn't wait to
get rid of those commie unionists who were always trying to keep
manufacturing jobs in America. Well you got your wish.
Neo
> On Jul 14, 6:05 am, "Rob Dekker" <r...@verific.com> wrote:
>
> > "." <bo...@boran.net> wrote in messagenews:MPG.24c0a363d...@news.x-privat.org...
> > > softsofa wrote
> snip
> > Any way, what are these foreigners doing with these dollars ?
> > How do they come back to the USA ?
> > They are buying up our country, bit by bit. That's how.
>
> Sorry, the truth is that you have been sold out by yourselves. China
> did not buy American companies.
Not True in that there are contradictions to the above statement.
Recently, a chinese company did by GM's hummer division
and another chinese company did by IBM's Thinkpad division
However, in the case of IBM's thinkpad division - IBM had move
most of its operations oversea by the time it sold its interest
to Leenvo - the chinese company.
.
The USA does restrict what any Chinese company can purchase
as well so China is never going to be able to purchase a
company like Genetech, Lockheed Martin or Texas Instruments..
However, in the future I expect that the USA will
be able to mass produce ethanol via some form
of synthetic bio mass ( using synthetically engineered
bacteria to create ethanol from grass and weed
clippings ). However, imported oil is a more
significan challenge because we need it to make
jet fuel which unlike diesel fuel or gasoline has
not bio-fuel alternative at this time. If oil prices
get really bad - maybe we could replace jets
airliners with turbo prop airliners running on
bio diesel or ethanol might work?
In europe, there are three cylinder diesel 4 passenger
cars that get up to 61 miles per gallon; however,
they are not speed demons and they take up to
20 seconds to go from 0 mph to 60 mph. A 2010
Prius which takes about 10 seconds to go from
0 mph to 60mph - looks like a hotrod comparedly.
Yet, a three cylinder diesel is a cheaper and
simplier alternative to a hybrid gas-electric car.
While all electric cars like the Tesla Roadster can
go from 0 mph to 60 mph in about 4 seconds -
their max range per charge is under 300 miles,
takes hours to recharge, and their cost is high
(and the cost of replacing the batteries are high
as well).
ghio
> On Jul 14, 10:04 pm, ghio <beal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Jul 14, 6:05 am, "Rob Dekker" <r...@verific.com> wrote:
>
> > > "." <bo...@boran.net> wrote in messagenews:MPG.24c0a363d...@news.x-privat.org...
> > > > softsofa wrote
> > snip
> > > Any way, what are these foreigners doing with these dollars ?
> > > How do they come back to the USA ?
> > > They are buying up our country, bit by bit. That's how.
>
> > Sorry, the truth is that you have been sold out by yourselves. China
> > did not buy American companies.
>
> Not True in that there are contradictions to the above statement.
>
> Recently, a chinese company did by GM's hummer division
> and another chinese company did by IBM's Thinkpad division
> However, in the case of IBM's thinkpad division - IBM had move
> most of its operations oversea by the time it sold its interest
> to Leenvo - the chinese company.
The point is "Who sold the companies?" No Chinese company could buy
unless someone was willing to sell.
> .
> The USA does restrict what any Chinese company can purchase
> as well so China is never going to be able to purchase a
> company like Genetech, Lockheed Martin or Texas Instruments.
Well, at least not until it happens.
>
> However, in the future I expect that the USA will
> be able to mass produce ethanol via some form
> of synthetic bio mass ( using synthetically engineered
> bacteria to create ethanol from grass and weed
> clippings ). However, imported oil is a more
> significan challenge because we need it to make
> jet fuel which unlike diesel fuel or gasoline has
> not bio-fuel alternative at this time. If oil prices
> get really bad - maybe we could replace jets
> airliners with turbo prop airliners running on
> bio diesel or ethanol might work?
Might work? Germany used two stroke diesel engines on aircraft during
the second world war.
>
> In europe, there are three cylinder diesel 4 passenger
> cars that get up to 61 miles per gallon; however,
> they are not speed demons and they take up to
> 20 seconds to go from 0 mph to 60 mph. A 2010
> Prius which takes about 10 seconds to go from
> 0 mph to 60mph - looks like a hotrod comparedly.
> Yet, a three cylinder diesel is a cheaper and
> simplier alternative to a hybrid gas-electric car.
> While all electric cars like the Tesla Roadster can
> go from 0 mph to 60 mph in about 4 seconds -
> their max range per charge is under 300 miles,
> takes hours to recharge, and their cost is high
> (and the cost of replacing the batteries are high
> as well).
Well, America just might wake up to themselves one day. I'm not
holding my breath. I left when Nixon was re-elected and have yet to
see any reason to go back.
Neo
> On Jul 15, 10:33 pm, Neo <residualselfimage1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Jul 14, 10:04 pm, ghio <beal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Jul 14, 6:05 am, "Rob Dekker" <r...@verific.com> wrote:
>
> > > > "." <bo...@boran.net> wrote in messagenews:MPG.24c0a363d...@news.x-privat.org...
> > > > > softsofa wrote
> > > snip
> > > > Any way, what are these foreigners doing with these dollars ?
> > > > How do they come back to the USA ?
> > > > They are buying up our country, bit by bit. That's how.
>
> > > Sorry, the truth is that you have been sold out by yourselves. China
> > > did not buy American companies.
>
> > Not True in that there are contradictions to the above statement.
>
> > Recently, a chinese company did by GM's hummer division
> > and another chinese company did by IBM's Thinkpad division
> > However, in the case of IBM's thinkpad division - IBM had move
> > most of its operations oversea by the time it sold its interest
> > to Leenvo - the chinese company.
>
> The point is "Who sold the companies?" No Chinese company could buy
> unless someone was willing to sell.
IBM and the firm handlding GM's bankruptcy ( cant quite
remember but that firm is associated with the ex-obama
admininstration car czar guy). ...
>
> > .
> > The USA does restrict what any Chinese company can purchase
> > as well so China is never going to be able to purchase a
> > company like Genetech, Lockheed Martin or Texas Instruments.
>
> Well, at least not until it happens.
The restriction on sale of dual use technologies would
have to be lifted first.
>
> > However, in the future I expect that the USA will
> > be able to mass produce ethanol via some form
> > of synthetic bio mass ( using synthetically engineered
> > bacteria to create ethanol from grass and weed
> > clippings ). However, imported oil is a more
> > significan challenge because we need it to make
> > jet fuel which unlike diesel fuel or gasoline has
> > not bio-fuel alternative at this time. If oil prices
> > get really bad - maybe we could replace jets
> > airliners with turbo prop airliners running on
> > bio diesel or ethanol might work?
>
> Might work? Germany used two stroke diesel engines on aircraft during
> the second world war.
If Airliners switch back to turbo propeller they could
not only use diesel but possibly a form of bio-diesel.
So far ,the only alternative to regular oil based Jet fuel
is shale oil derived Jet Fuel ( DARPA) however I am
not sure such an alternative would ever make civilian
production. In addition to jets airliners, today's
helicopters use Jet fuel too - so a shortage of civilian
jet fuel would put medical emergency operations
at risk as well.
us...@domain.invalid
It was my understanding that jet fuel is basically kerosene
zzbu...@netscape.net
<perryneh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "Pickens Calls Off Plans For Vast Texas Wind Farm"
>
> By Steven Mufson
> Washington Post Staff Writer
> Wednesday, July 8, 2009
>
> T. Boone Pickens has temporarily shelved plans to build the world's
> biggest wind farm in the Texas Panhandle because of tight credit
> markets and low natural gas prices, and his company Mesa Power is
> looking for other projects that could use the $2 billion worth of wind
Well, that's an inherit problem with Texas energy, it's always too
big for
anybody other than GE to do it. So, that's also why the 21st
Century Energy,
people work on the GPS, Weather Satellites, Optical Computers,
Microcomputers,
Holographics, Electronic Books, Distibuted Processing Software, Pv
Cells,
Solar Energy, Biodiesel, HDTV, Blue Ray, On-Line Bankling, On-Line
Publishing,
Atomic Clock Wristwatches, Cyber Batteries, Compact Flourescent
Lighting,
Thermo-Electric Cooling, Autonomous Vehicles, Self-Assembling
Robots,
and Self-Replicating Machines,
>
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/07/AR200...
harry
You are entirely correct. They just make sure there's no water in it
and it's formulated to remain liquid at very low temperatures.
Day Brown
> On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:18:04 -0700, John Fartlington Poopnagle wrote:
>
>> Y'know, I never could figure out how a car could be fueled by one o'
>> them big ol' windmills ...
>
> According to T. Boone we were going to make electricity with the
> windmills and use the natural gas that would have been used to make the
> electricity to then run the cars.
>
need at the time to smelt bauxite. Which is abundant, far beyond global
demand, and found with traces of gallium in it.
what they've been doing is smelting it get the gallium out, butcha dont
need to do that; leave it in, for a gallium/aluminum alloy. Surf the net
on that. lotsa hits. When sheets of this kind of aluminum foil are
exposed to water, it gives off hydrogen. Which can fuel an engine. IIRC,
an alloy canister the size of a car battery, and 20 gallons in the 'gas'
tank, will power the car for 300 miles.
But then, when you get home, you can plug it in, and electricity will
'charge' it back up again. During the nighttime low power consumption
hours. So far the reports are it dont wear out like a battery.
So- unused windpower on the high plains can be used to make the alloy,
which then can be shipped to 'gas' stations for longer trips.
Day Brown
> You are exactly right. What's needed is a new angle, new products and
> ideas.
effect whatever that I can see. what we need, is not what we will get.
Now, I can see how economic crisis will wake people up and get them off
the couch to support innovation. But- by the time that happens, I can
the slide to economic collapse would be unstoppable.
From Jared Diamond's "Collapse" I see that when a resource base is
maxed, the power elite, rather than cutting back to buy time to develop
new systems, simply increases their exploitation of all lower classes.
This keeps the level of their perks increasing, which gives them the
illusion that 'progress' continues.
Until they get dragged out to be shot. I see all these calls for
revolution posted, and while I'm sure revenge tastes sweet, its not
nutritious, and I dont see reasonable resource management systems
outlined to replace the corruption now in place.