USB charger from car battery inside house when power goes out

[RonTheGuy]

When the electrical power goes out, I have to charge my phone by turning the
car on to the accessory position which isn't likely good for the car's
electronics.

In my spare parts box is a Lorex DVR Model #LH030800 (mfg 3/2015) with no
power cord. The power receptacle at back seems to be the typical round
center positive 12VDC input though, which may work off a spare car battery.

It even has an RS485 in back with the plus and minus well marked.
The DVR has two USB type A receptacles, one in back and one in front.

Do you think if I craft a suitable power cable with clips fitting a 13 to
15VDC (nominally 13.8VDC) car battery that this spare DVR can serve as an
emergency phone charger when the electrical power goes out?

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

[Jeff Liebermann]

It will work with your charger just fine. Just make sure that the
Lorex DVR power supply has the + on the center pin, and the - on outer
sleeve. Acceptable voltage range for automobiles can be anything
between roughly 11 to 16V (or more) so you're not going to blow up the
cigarette igniter to USB adapter.

The problem is how to connect the Lorex power supply plug to the USB
adapter. Several ways:

1. The right way. Purchase a cigarette igniter connector with a
wired pigtail. Something like this:
<https://powerwerx.com/automotive-cigarette-lighter-socket-fused-bare-wire>

2. If you don't have a connector or adapter, wrap a 3/4" dia hose
clamp around the USB adapter. Make sure you have an electrical
connection to the adapter ground connection. Connect a red alligator
clip lead between the center pin of the DVR power supply and the
center pin of the USB adapter. Connect a black alligator clip lead
between the outer ground connection on the USB adapter, to the ground
sleeve on the DVR power supply plug. If the wires move or fall out,
hold them in place with some kind of tape. I've done it this way more
times than I care to admit.

3. Buy a 120V to 5V USB adapter:
<https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=120v+to+5v+usb+adapter>

4. Buy a charging station with USB A connectors and a pile of
charging cables. Since I don't know what type of phone you have, I
can't determine if you need micro-USB, USB-C, Lightning, fast charge,
etc.

5. If your unspecified model phone uses one of the fast charging
options, such as QC-3.0 or Power Delivery 2 or 3, buy a quick charger
and cable. The higher currents these cables use mean that the cables
should be able to work at higher currents. I kinda like Anker power
supplies (because unlike some others, they didn't die after a few
months use).
<https://www.target.com/p/anker-2-port-powerport-25-5w-power-delivery-wall-charger-with-3-39-powerline-select-lightning-to-usb-c-cable-white/-/A-76625604>
(There are smaller cheaper models available).

Note: We went through multiple cycles of power outages in my area
while PG&E repaired the power lines and circuit breakers so that they
would not start another fire. Although I have two gasoline
generators, I prefer not to run them just for low power applications,
like charging batteries. I also don't like the noise. So, I keep
several large 12V AGM stationary batteries on float chargers. When I
need to charge the phones, I take the USB car chargers and cables and
connect them to the batteries with clipleads (method #2). It was
kinda messy, but did the job.


--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

[RonTheGuy]

On Oct 02, 2021, Jeff Liebermann wrote
(in article<news:fjehlgpa32sj6qbqp...@4ax.com>):

> It will work with your charger just fine. Just make sure that the
> Lorex DVR power supply has the + on the center pin, and the - on outer
> sleeve. Acceptable voltage range for automobiles can be anything
> between roughly 11 to 16V (or more) so you're not going to blow up the
> cigarette igniter to USB adapter.

This essentially answers the question but I wasn't clear that I'm not going
to use the car at all once I set this DVR to work off a standalone battery.

I have the 12VDC extra car battery on a table in the garage.

The plan I'm asking if it will work is if I put two big clips on that
battery's terminals and the other end of that cable will be connected to the
Lorex DVR to power it (positive in the center, negative in the sleeve).

The Lorex DVR will output to the two USB A ports to charge my phone.
There is no car involved. Sorry for the confusion. I didn't explain well.

The only question, really, is whether the car battery itself can power the
Lorex DVR Model #LH030800 sufficient for the two USB-A ports to work.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 3 Oct 2021 01:03:29 +0000, RonTheGuy <r...@null.invalid> wrote:

>The only question, really, is whether the car battery itself can power the
>Lorex DVR Model #LH030800 sufficient for the two USB-A ports to work.

I couldn't find that model on the Lorex web site to determine the
power drain.
<https://www.lorextechnology.com>
See if you can find the data sheet.

Battery life would depend on the DVR plus the number of cameras in use
and their on/off duty cycle. Probably the easiest thing to do in
insert an ammeter in series with the 12V battery powering the DVR and
measure what it's drawing. A typical car battery is not designed for
stationary use. It's also not intended to be discharged much below
50% of capacity. Find the Amp-Hr capacity of your battery (NOT cold
cranking amps).

For example, if your car battery is typically good for about 80
amp-hrs. 50% capacity would give you 40 amp-hrs. If your DVR draws 2
amps, you will have:
40 amp-hr / 2 amps = 20 hrs of operation before you should turn it
off. That should be plenty of time to charge a smartphone. However,
you can do much better if you simply take the take the DVR out of the
picture, and use a (cheap) 12V to 5V USB cigarette lighter adapter
connected between the battery and the charger cable.

My apologies for providing such vague information, but you haven't
volunteered any model numbers, specification, or measurements for me
to do much more than approximate. Fortunately, the calculation above
is easy enough to modify.

Offhand, I would say charging from the battery powered DVR will work
for maybe 20 hrs, or much longer if you replace the DVR with a 12V to
5V adapter.

[Rich]

Why go to all that trouble.

Get one of these:

1) https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=13412

And one of these:

2) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01MQPQLNM

Connect the battery clips of #1 to the car battery, connect the car charger
(#2) to the cigarette lighter plug on the battery clip cable (#1) and
connect the phone to the USB port of the car charger (#1) using a
suitable USB to phone charging cable.

[RonTheGuy]

On Oct 03, 2021, Jeff Liebermann wrote
(in article<news:5m2ilghnt0fb0udgn...@4ax.com>):

> My apologies for providing such vague information, but you haven't
> volunteered any model numbers, specification, or measurements for me
> to do much more than approximate. Fortunately, the calculation above
> is easy enough to modify.

My apologies. Here is a photo of the insides and the model number plate.
https://i.postimg.cc/pVgpNhY1/inside.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/9f8QLrQb/outside.jpg

[Peter W.]

A bunch of stuff:

a) It is never a good idea to use a standard lead-acid car battery inside a house or other enclosed area. Writing for myself, I would not even charge such a battery in a closed garage.
b) A phone charger draws only a tiny bit of current relative to a standard car battery in otherwise good condition.
c) Eschew needless complexity. Rich nailed it - get a simple clip-on device to a standard OTC charger device, and have-at.

Or, if a belt, suspenders and Velcro is required, get a charging station/jump-starter (US$60 - $100) and be ready for a long black-out.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

[Jeff Liebermann]

I have an old DVR (buried somewhere) that looks similar to the one in
your photo. I can't see a tiny fan in your photo, but if it's like
mine, the fan burns out every year and has to be replaced.
Fortunately, I have a large number of fans.

The power supply connector inside is a SATA power connector that's
intended to only power a single SATA hard disk drive. In other words,
I have no idea how much power can be provided by the 5V line or USB
port. I assume the USB port will do at least 0.5A charge current,
which will work with most phones, but will be depressingly slow.

The label is marked "Output 12V 2A". I can't tell what they mean by
that. Is that actually the input from the external AC power supply
"brick" that you haven't mentioned? Or is it the power supply voltage
needed to power the various external cameras? My guess it's the
"brick" output voltage and current, but I'm not sure.

Rather than try to figure it out, I again suggest that you give up on
the idea of using the DVR or its power supply, and connect a USB
cigarette lighter adapter to your 12V battery. That's roughly how I
made it through the latest PG&E power outages. Want me to post a
photo of my messy setup?

[Ralph Phillips]

On 10/2/2021 8:03 PM, RonTheGuy wrote:
>
> The Lorex DVR will output to the two USB A ports to charge my phone.
> There is no car involved. Sorry for the confusion. I didn't explain well.
>
> The only question, really, is whether the car battery itself can power the
> Lorex DVR Model #LH030800 sufficient for the two USB-A ports to work.
>
> Ron, the humblest guy in town.
>

That sounds like Rube Goldberging it.

I'd suggest, instead, something like
https://smile.amazon.com/StickyDeal-2-Pack-Converter-Adapter-Step-Down/dp/B09B2Y71F7/
.

I have several that are shaped into a accessory-jack sized housing wired
into my dash; and a couple of flat buck converter boards around for
extra USB ports in my truck. Same thing will work for your charging at
the house.

THESE are encapsulated to keep any short damage out.

And avoids the load of that DVR on the battery while charging the phone.

RwP

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 3 Oct 2021 21:50:05 -0500, Ralph Phillips <ral...@philent.biz>
wrote:

I agree. Much better. I just ordered two of them on eBay:
<https://www.ebay.com/itm/321645899181>
Time to get rid of the cigarette igniter to USB adapter, hose clamp,
and clip lead abomination. I was going to build my own from one of
the buck inverter boards found on eBay, but this looks better. Thanks.

Also, I forgot to mumble that I have several large "USB power bank"
devices made to power smartphones. Something like these:
<https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=usb+battery+power+bank>
<https://www.google.com/search?q=usb+power+bank&tbm=isch>
I bought most of mine at a garage sale, where the former owner somehow
killed most of the 18650 LiIon cells. They were moderately easy to
replace with a (borrowed) spot welder and some nickel flat wire.

While USB power banks do not have the capacity of a lead-acid car
battery, they also don't have the potential to make a giant mess. I've
charged various lead acid and AGM batteries on my Formica workbench,
Formica computer desk, and oak kitchen table. I ruined them all with
acid burns. I've never had a hydrogen explosion indoors, but have
seen two in various automobiles (not mine). I now do all my storage
battery charging outdoors:
<http://www.learnbydestroying.com/jeffl/crud/DuroMax%20XP4400E.jpg>
<http://www.dekabatteries.com/assets/base/0008DekaLG.pdf>
Note the lack of battery fill plugs and vents. If a spark gets into
that battery, it's likely to blow the top or a side off the battery.
Best to be very careful, very safe, and charge hydrogen gas belching
batteries outdoors.

[Rich]

One of "Amazon's" suggestions to Ralph's suggestion was this:

https://smile.amazon.com/StickyDeal-2-Pack-Converter-Adapter-Step-Down/dp/B09B2Y71F7/

which matches the OP's original use perfectly. Battery clips for
attaching to the battery and four usb charge output ports for charging
"phones".

[Peter W.]

We need to understand the purpose of this group - which is to give the most complicated and unsuitable possible solution to the simplest request entirely without reference to common sense, life-safety or cost.

[Michael Terrell]

On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 12:15:29 PM UTC-4, Peter W. wrote:
> We need to understand the purpose of this group - which is to give the most complicated and unsuitable possible solution to the simplest request entirely without reference to common sense, life-safety or cost.
>

Peter, I've noticed that Jeff Angus hasn't posted lately. Any idea why?

[Peter W.]

> Peter, I've noticed that Jeff Angus hasn't posted lately. Any idea why?

Alive and well, still in Ranger, TX.

[Michael Terrell]

On Wednesday, October 6, 2021 at 4:21:31 PM UTC-4, Peter W. wrote:
> > Peter, I've noticed that Jeff Angus hasn't posted lately. Any idea why?
> Alive and well, still in Ranger, TX.

Thanks, I was getting a bit concerned about him. He stopped replying to me when Hillary lost the election, so it wasn't worth the time for me to try to contact him.

[Bob F]

On 10/3/2021 8:50 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
....

> Also, I forgot to mumble that I have several large "USB power bank"
> devices made to power smartphones. Something like these:
> <https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=usb+battery+power+bank>
> <https://www.google.com/search?q=usb+power+bank&tbm=isch>
> I bought most of mine at a garage sale, where the former owner somehow
> killed most of the 18650 LiIon cells. They were moderately easy to
> replace with a (borrowed) spot welder and some nickel flat wire.

Why would anyone propose any other solution when that ebay url points
you straight to a 2000 amp hour solar usb charger for $17.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/224104772302?_trkparms=ispr%3D1&hash=item342daf72ce:g:kFgAAOSwVe5fKHqU&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAACoPYe5NmHp%252B2JMhMi7yxGiTJkPrKr5t53CooMSQt2orsSvtkx670Z0mbyfWqmxLFLYZu8mkqWS37d7xCC4Rrv3jesxSBWWk%252FwIv3bQIjqLn9G07VEBc73LRdrUnrFiFtTwii70%252B36nJHnAzK0%252FK3rEjEmMaE8CAxUBEV7k2QgSxZ5Z3FsR7QKR9EjGNt6Qq%252BseJzW%252Bs5rEZiA8bezG4Ai43qgvJfEVBj%252FgEGnByb6hUsl13LIfl26uylGPEe01Mn7TVG4oJMiwEo97gDv0voW40eDfc2ifzAAO71UjP0yNoLNugd3DkjVGLabEZPIWl1YWUe6edo7p03obQbQzUWGjq8KYgCR4oxHrEjiOlzSzTeYR51jRiqguDe%252BREd1TWnimnr6ddo7sticIkFyhPgJGjuIWsEoH4w3Of828aJXcAhHjVoyeh9B05PRqeKctEqauJA6mQMUuPv%252FHJkUOwOjfPqogY29kx%252B07nysQvSPHhAalVtjpgn%252BFUpoiY3bWROGAewrlzkhBmNbJg8DcuQTACaUM63q2%252Fje%252BxvRZXzTGo%252BEOs43guxLDwkHsAgOQ9hTztaN%252Bx2LeLG9tzb90J9dxfxgaRAAfPn3NVHNGjQShV0biqejWJnb4Qmf%252B5OnoCoU0vPwxmTs8XpsvssZezERrOL0ikErQSqWX5XY0pKywGzZ07qfL2qYRYIfYAePyLC4vQWPj8%252Bs7xJLnIabxFZevzDFE1oA6fZvtxI6JCU0RkQDwSPqPBc8W36gYfnRWI9fezPtLoFPrqHuOUqScluS9kXvjwsROHJ1lP7yAXeE11GoMLmMTgmxynHHAyB%252F11mJ3IJ5qS7yeALXaq6Yr8mzYE7phkP6gUM6BSMrVxYstJu7Z5rPPVbODvGUmY%252FXdCLgwg%253D%253D%7Campid%3APL_CLK%7Cclp%3A2334524

[Peter W.]

> Why would anyone propose any other solution when that ebay url points
> you straight to a 2000 amp hour solar usb charger for $17.

Because the sun is not always readily available.

2,000 amp-hours. Really?

The typical solar panel (good utility-grade devices) make roughly 300 watts at very roughly 37.8 volts and is a bit under two square meters. That is just under eight (8) amps. To create 2,000 amp-hours of capacity at cell-charger voltages (say, 6 volts), you would need in excess of 12,000 watts in total. Making 40 panels. All that for $17.00. And from Brooklyn, NY, no less.
Now, the typical LiPo 1,200 MaH battery @ ~8VDC weighs a few ounces. A mere 1,666 of these would get you there as well.

Does anyone read for content?

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 10 Oct 2021 12:07:53 -0700, Bob F <bobn...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On 10/3/2021 8:50 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
>....
>
>> Also, I forgot to mumble that I have several large "USB power bank"
>> devices made to power smartphones. Something like these:
>> <https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=usb+battery+power+bank>
>> <https://www.google.com/search?q=usb+power+bank&tbm=isch>
>> I bought most of mine at a garage sale, where the former owner somehow
>> killed most of the 18650 LiIon cells. They were moderately easy to
>> replace with a (borrowed) spot welder and some nickel flat wire.

>Why would anyone propose any other solution when that ebay url points
>you straight to a 2000 amp hour solar usb charger for $17.
>

>https://www.ebay.com/itm/224104772302 (Tracking junk removed from URL)

2,000,000 milli-amp-hr solar charger? It might work if it were a
2,000,000 micro-amp-hour charger (same as a 2 Amp-hr charger). What's
a few decimal points anyway? Inflation must really be getting out of
control. The eBay page says that 6,165 customers bought one. Looks
like it's already obsolete. Here is the 30,000,000 ma-hr version:
<https://www.ebay.com/itm/401747105665>
More zeros are better for sales. 10,282 sold.

Incidentally, the 12V to 5V(USB) adapter gizmos arrived and were
immediately put into service when the local power died for about 4
hrs.
<https://www.ebay.com/itm/321645899181>
It doesn't work any better than my tangle of gel cell battery,
cigarette igniter to USB adapter, hose clamp, and clip lead kludge,
but is much neater and less prone to falling apart. The phone display
says "charging rapidly" which is what I would expect from a 10 watt
charger. This might be a problem if I wanted a Quick Charge or Power
Deliver fast charge that I was getting from my cigarette lighter to
USB adapter.