Hot melt glue sticks?

[mike]

Back in the day, I had some hot-melt glue sticks
that were low viscosity when hot but rather
hard when cold. Similar to the stuff they use to
tame vibration in big caps on circuit boards.
Worked in a standard "craft" glue gun.

Regular craft glue sticks are too soft for my application.

There are a zillion kinds of glue sticks available,
but the data doesn't give me any clues as to how
hard they are.

Recommendation for cheap glue sticks that can work
in a standard craft glue gun and are somewhat harder
than the typical craft sticks?

[mrob...@att.net]

mike <ham...@netzero.net> wrote:
> Recommendation for cheap glue sticks that can work in a standard craft
> glue gun and are somewhat harder than the typical craft sticks?

A little Googling leads me to
http://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/44021O/scotch-weldtm-hot-melt-bonding-systems-guide.pdf
; the second page gives some recommended 3M part numbers for hot melt
for electronics. Digi-Key seems to stock most of those part numbers in
small quantities; it's up to you to decide if they are cheap. 3M also
has detailed spec sheets on those part numbers, including Shore hardness
values.

Standard disclaimers apply: I don't get money or other consideration
from any companies mentioned.

Matt Roberds

[Trevor Wilson]

**IME, Bostik and 3M make the best glue sticks. The cheap stuff is crap.

--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

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[N_Cook]

I started to make my own harder formulation, then found a couple of Kg
in a surplus store.
I cut up plastic supermarket milk containers, sans labels and caps,
until they would break-up further in a motorised grinder. I would then
have pushed the flakes into a hot-melt glue gun to extrude out string.
Then when cold twist that into "rods".

While on hotmelt. I seem to have broken a glue gun, quite a loud bang. I
wanted to change colour of glue stick , so switched on , but did not
leave warming-up for long enough before extracting the stick. I must
have cracked the ceramic of the wire-wound resistor and a few minutes
later , bang.

[John-Del]

>
> **IME, Bostik and 3M make the best glue sticks. The cheap stuff is crap.
>
> --
> Trevor Wilson
> www.rageaudio.com.au
>

Exactly. The stuff companies like 3M, Bostik, Dow, etc. sell is always more expensive, but they make superior stuff worth the extra cost when performance is the main target.

[mike]

thanks for the inputs.
I really don't need much performance from my glue sticks, just some that
harden slightly harder.

Interesting about the milk cartons. I remember once cutting them into
narrow strips and using a small butane hot air gun to layer them onto
the thing I was fixing. You can do the same thing with the old-school
BIC clear plastic pen housings. I should try that again.

[Bob E.]

> Interesting about the milk cartons.

Do you mean milk "jugs"? Those 1-gallon square-ish containers for milk and
water and such? This is polyethylene, yes?

[mike]

recycle code sez HDPE

[Bob E.]

> recycle code sez HDPE

Yeah, high-density polyethylene.

So more plastic welding than gluing...

Nice alternative. Thanks for the idea.

[N_Cook]

yerp.
The professionals use office-grade paper shredders for the macerating
part of the process.

[Michael Black]

On Thu, 5 Mar 2015, Trevor Wilson wrote:

> On 5/03/2015 1:31 PM, mike wrote:
>> Back in the day, I had some hot-melt glue sticks
>> that were low viscosity when hot but rather
>> hard when cold. Similar to the stuff they use to
>> tame vibration in big caps on circuit boards.
>> Worked in a standard "craft" glue gun.
>>
>> Regular craft glue sticks are too soft for my application.
>>
>> There are a zillion kinds of glue sticks available,
>> but the data doesn't give me any clues as to how
>> hard they are.
>>
>> Recommendation for cheap glue sticks that can work
>> in a standard craft glue gun and are somewhat harder
>> than the typical craft sticks?
>>
>
> **IME, Bostik and 3M make the best glue sticks. The cheap stuff is crap.
>

The cheap stuff seems to work fine.

What it doesn't do is define itself, and of course, it's cheap and readily
available.

Go elsewhere, and you do likely find more details on the package, so then
you can tell this glue stick from that glue stick.

I am amazed by the variety of caulking one can find at a good hardware
store. A wide variety, it would take some time to figure out what's what.

Presumably that sort of thing exists for glue guns, in the right places.

Michael

[Michael Black]

I'm sure's talking about actual jugs, a thin "plastic", rather than a
waxed cardboard that would seem to be what's used in "milk cartons".

I remember DOn Lancaster talking about 3D printing quite some time ago,
except as I was reminded recently, he called it a "Santa Claus Machine".

I'm sure he used a hot glue gun at least for demonstration purposes.

I'm sure there probably are still homemade 3D printers that use them. If
so, that's another place to look. They need the "raw material" for the
feed, what are they using? The process I've read does sound like what was
mentioned earlier about grinding up existing plastic, but I can't remember
what they did with the ground up stuff.

I've also read about melting styrofoam and I think plastic coffee stirrers
with acetone, though I'm not blank about what the point was. But that
might lead somewhere.

Michael

[Michael Black]

On Thu, 5 Mar 2015, Bob E. wrote:

And there's that stuff, I can't remember what, that
"glues" by melting the plastic together, rather than
gluing. I think it had "methyl" in the name.

Michael

[Dave Platt]

In article <alpine.LNX.2.02.1...@darkstar.example.org>,

Michael Black <et...@ncf.ca> wrote:

>And there's that stuff, I can't remember what, that
>"glues" by melting the plastic together, rather than
>gluing. I think it had "methyl" in the name.

Methyl Ethyl Ketone (a.k.a. MEK) perhaps?

In many cases, toluene or acetone can be used in the same way.

A lot of the glues for acrylic, polystyrene, etc. are just this sort
of solvent, in which is dissolved some amount of the base plastic
(thickens the glue, improves the ability to fill small gaps which is
pretty much nil in a pure-solvent "glue").

Some people make up their own "goopy" glue for acrylic by simply
dumping a bunch of plexiglas chips, shards, shavings, and dust into a
clean jar, pouring in enough of the appropriate solvent to cover, and
letting the acrylic dissolve.

[Fred McKenzie]

In article <alpine.LNX.2.02.1...@darkstar.example.org>,
Michael Black <et...@ncf.ca> wrote:

> I've also read about melting styrofoam and I think plastic coffee stirrers
> with acetone, though I'm not blank about what the point was. But that
> might lead somewhere.

Michael-

Could you be thinking of homemade coil dope?
<http://www.instructables.com/id/Homemade-Coil-Dope/>

I'm not sure what the hardness of the resulting material would be, but
certainly harder than a styrofoam coffee cup or packing peanuts!

Fred

[Michael Black]

On Fri, 6 Mar 2015, Fred McKenzie wrote:

> In article <alpine.LNX.2.02.1...@darkstar.example.org>,
> Michael Black <et...@ncf.ca> wrote:
>
>> I've also read about melting styrofoam and I think plastic coffee stirrers
>> with acetone, though I'm not blank about what the point was. But that
>> might lead somewhere.
>
> Michael-
>
> Could you be thinking of homemade coil dope?
> <http://www.instructables.com/id/Homemade-Coil-Dope/>
>

Yes. Though when I read about it, it was decades ago, and in a magazine.

Michael

[whit3rd]

On Thursday, March 5, 2015 at 12:37:26 PM UTC-8, Michael Black wrote:
> On Thu, 5 Mar 2015, Bob E. wrote:
>
> >> recycle code sez HDPE
> >
> > Yeah, high-density polyethylene.
> >
> > So more plastic welding than gluing...

> And there's that stuff, I can't remember what, that
> "glues" by melting the plastic together, rather than
> gluing. I think it had "methyl" in the name.

Lots of cold-weld 'glue' for plastics (acrylic and polycarbonate, and
maybe others) is based on methylene chloride. That is also sold
(or used to be) in paint remover and carburetor cleaner. It's
best used with ventilation (outdoors), and isn't generally recommended
for home use.

[Chris Jones]

I found this recently:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0zpqhhcmp4

[captainvi...@gmail.com]

With plexiglass for instance what would be an appropriate solvent? Lenny

[whit3rd]

On Sunday, March 8, 2015 at 4:16:32 PM UTC-7, captainvi...@gmail.com wrote:

> With plexiglass for instance what would be an appropriate solvent? Lenny

Plexiglas is the Rohm and Haas trademark for acrylic (methyl methacrylate) plastic.
It cold-welds with methylene chloride, and there are some reports that acetone (methyl hydrate)
also works.

Here's a good commercial methylene chloride product...

<http://www.tapplastics.com/product/repair_products/plastic_adhesives/tap_acrylic_cement/130>

[Cydrome Leader]

I just ordered some yesterday. Weld-on is the major brand in the US. I was
told by a plastic working pro that Weld-on #4 is the best for generic use
if you're workign with acrylic the first time. Different plastics will
require different solvents.

There are modifiers in plastic welding solvents to change drying time,
viscosity etc.

[Phil Hobbs]

The stuff I've used is called Harvasolv, and is guaranteed to give you a
horrible headache in 3 minutes of use.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics

160 North State Road #203
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

hobbs at electrooptical dot net
http://electrooptical.net

[Cydrome Leader]

Phil Hobbs <ho...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
> On 3/18/2015 9:05 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:
>> whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Thursday, March 5, 2015 at 12:37:26 PM UTC-8, Michael Black wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 5 Mar 2015, Bob E. wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> recycle code sez HDPE
>>>>>
>>>>> Yeah, high-density polyethylene.
>>>>>
>>>>> So more plastic welding than gluing...
>>>
>>>> And there's that stuff, I can't remember what, that
>>>> "glues" by melting the plastic together, rather than
>>>> gluing. I think it had "methyl" in the name.
>>>
>>> Lots of cold-weld 'glue' for plastics (acrylic and polycarbonate, and
>>> maybe others) is based on methylene chloride. That is also sold
>>> (or used to be) in paint remover and carburetor cleaner. It's
>>> best used with ventilation (outdoors), and isn't generally recommended
>>> for home use.
>>
>> I just ordered some yesterday. Weld-on is the major brand in the US. I was
>> told by a plastic working pro that Weld-on #4 is the best for generic use
>> if you're workign with acrylic the first time. Different plastics will
>> require different solvents.
>>
>> There are modifiers in plastic welding solvents to change drying time,
>> viscosity etc.
>>
>>
> The stuff I've used is called Harvasolv, and is guaranteed to give you a
> horrible headache in 3 minutes of use.

I had the same issue just cutting acrylic plastic. It gives off a
superglue type smell. The solvents are even worse.

[Michael Black]

In that case, isn't it because the heat from the saw tends to melt the
plastic (or at least the debris from the cutting of the plastic, and then
it fuses back together when cooled off.

I know there are tricks to cutting plastic like that, even if I can't
remember them.

Michael

[Mike]

On Fri, 20 Mar 2015 14:13:05 -0400, Michael Black wrote:

> In that case, isn't it because the heat from the saw tends to melt the
> plastic (or at least the debris from the cutting of the plastic, and
> then it fuses back together when cooled off.
>
> I know there are tricks to cutting plastic like that, even if I can't
> remember them.
>
> Michael

Doing it under water, perhaps?

Mike.