OT: Plastic Radiator "glueing / melting / welding"
Michael Kennedy
plastic. It has developed a crack over time and now has a small leak. After
reading about melting ABS plastic back togeather with carburator spray and
some spare abs I thought there is some possibilty of doing somethign similar
with this.
First of all I have to identify what kind of black plastic this thing is
made of. Does anyone have any tips on how to do that?
- Mike
do_not_...@my-deja.com
You don't melt ABS plastic to join it; you use solvent, such as
plumbing glue made for ABS, lacquer thinner, MEK, methylene chloride
(paint remover), or even carburetor/throttle body spray. But radiators
aren't made of ABS, probably because it would melt from temperature,
but are instead made of fiberglass-reinforced nylon, which has to be
heat welded to be repaired, and GM dealers sell plastic welding rod for
this. I suggest you use a soldering iron (clean the tip well first, or
cover it with aluminum foil) instead of a torch. Don't use the wrong
type of nylon, like from a plastic wire tie, since it won't stick.
With any plastic repaired with heat welding, first melt a fairly deep
groove into the plastic and then fill it by melting more plastic into
it.
Here's a guide to identifying plastics:
www.modernplastics.com/how_to_identify_plastics.htm
If any of the solvents mentioned above affect the plastic, then it's
almost surely ABS, styrene, PVC (vinyl), acrylic, or polycarbonate and
should be joined with solvent welding, although acrylic needs its own
solvent for good welds, and polycarbonate can't be reglued because
solvent alters its surface (it may need to be held welded instead).
Nylon, polyethylene, derlin, and acetal are among plastics that can't
be repaired well except with heat welding. Epoxy works well only on
polyester and bakelite.
Homer J Simpson
"Michael Kennedy" <Mike...@remthis.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:YMednVkhrN09tG7Z...@comcast.com...
It's unlikely to be anything but ABS. Other materials have properties that
won't work for this app. It might be high impact polystyrene, but the glue
is the same.
But forget carb spray, track down some MEK instead. And give it time to set,
clean and dry.
James Sweet
Don't even bother trying to repair those junk plastic radiator tanks,
I'm not sure who's bright idea they were in the first place but Volvo
used them for a few years as well and when they fail they tend to do so
catastrophically, normally one of the hose necks snaps completely off
and all the coolant drains in moments. I replace them preventively when
they start to age with all-metal aftermarket radiators, surely someone
makes such a thing for an S10 as well.
do_not_...@my-deja.com
Homer J Simpson wrote:
> "Michael Kennedy" <Mike...@remthis.comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:YMednVkhrN09tG7Z...@comcast.com...
>
> > I have a radiator in my truck (chevy s-10) that is partially made of black
> > plastic. It has developed a crack over time and now has a small leak.
> > After reading about melting ABS plastic back togeather with carburator
> > spray and some spare abs I thought there is some possibilty of doing
> > somethign similar with this.
> It's unlikely to be anything but ABS. Other materials have properties that
> won't work for this app. It might be high impact polystyrene, but the glue
> is the same.
>
> But forget carb spray, track down some MEK instead. And give it time to set,
> clean and dry.
I've never heard of radiator tanks being made of ABS, and the one I
sprayed with choke cleaner didn't dissolve at all from it, meaning it
was definitely a different material. Also styrene will melt under the
hood because I've had styrene rulers start to melt even in the
passenger compartment.
Here's a link with information about repair of plastic radiators. It
says the tanks are made of nylon and recommends heat welding for
repair:
Homer J Simpson
<do_not_...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:1156826619....@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> I've never heard of radiator tanks being made of ABS, and the one I
> sprayed with choke cleaner didn't dissolve at all from it, meaning it
> was definitely a different material. Also styrene will melt under the
> hood because I've had styrene rulers start to melt even in the
> passenger compartment.
I'll take your word for it. Nylon would seem unsuitable to me because it
alters its properties with moisture, as your toothbrush tells you! We used
to steam nylon after molding to get it to the desired strength. Even with
fibreglass filling I would have been doubtful of its practicality.
I could consider acetal, as it is hardly affected by moisture, and a lot of
technical parts are made of that. But there is plenty of plastic under the
hood these days, so ABS wouldn't surprise me. The real problem is SOB
molders who run the parts too fast, setting up stresses which eventually
cause failure, which is why dollar store plastic items usually break.
Polypropylene is another tough plastic, but I would expect it to be too
flexible, although it is damn strong.
Michael Kennedy
hmm.. well whatever they made it out of wasn't suitable for the job because
these type of raiators always break.. I think I may just deal with it until
I can afford a good Aluminum radiator.
Thanks for the info eveybody
- Mike
Homer J Simpson
You could try a two part epoxy, but it might fall off. All metal is the way
to go.
--
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| | / _` | '_ ` _ \ | __ |/ _ \| '_ ` _ \ / _ \ '__|
_| |_ | (_| | | | | | | | | | | (_) | | | | | | __/ |
|_____| \__,_|_| |_| |_| |_| |_|\___/|_| |_| |_|\___|_|
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/ _| | _ \
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| (_) | | | |_) | (_) | | | (_| |_
\___/|_| |____/ \___/|_| \__, (_)
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Michael Kennedy
older ones. I think s-10's from 95 and up have plastic radiator tanks. What
were they thinking? Plastic and radiators just don't seem like a good
combination.
"Homer J Simpson" <nob...@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:Oc8Jg.23125$tP4.9480@clgrps12...
Homer J Simpson
> Yeah I wish they would have just kept making them out of metal like the
> older ones. I think s-10's from 95 and up have plastic radiator tanks.
> What were they thinking? Plastic and radiators just don't seem like a good
> combination.
Not to me - who has soldered a few back together. But they are always
looking to save weight and money. Sometimes they try in very stupid ways.
Jim Land
> What
> were they thinking? Plastic and radiators just don't seem like a good
> combination.
>
I bet the employee who suggested it got a bonus for saving money and
weight. <g>
GregS
If its a narrow crack, I would try silicone rtv since it can stand the heat.
greg
Michael A. Terrell
Michael, check out the link below if you can't repair your radiator.
I bought a new one for my 87 Ranger last year for about 1/3 of what Ford
wanted. I ordered it one day and got it the next. It was an exact
match to the original plastic and aluminum. All i had to do was pop out
the tinnerman nuts and pop them into the new radiator. I was surprised
that it was designed to be replaced from the top, without crawling under
the truck. Of course, some idiot had replaced the lower radiator hose
and turned the clamp the wrong way so I still had to crawl under and
spend two hours getting it loose without damaging the hose. I put the
new one in from the top, and turned the other lower hose clamp so I
could do it all from the top, the next time.
http://www.radiatorbarn.com/ which is in Jacksonville, FL
--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.
Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
Michael A. Terrell
>
> "Michael Kennedy" <Mike...@remthis.comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:LMCdnZOKRJEMi2jZ...@comcast.com...
>
> > Yeah I wish they would have just kept making them out of metal like the
> > older ones. I think s-10's from 95 and up have plastic radiator tanks.
> > What were they thinking? Plastic and radiators just don't seem like a good
> > combination.
>
> Not to me - who has soldered a few back together. But they are always
> looking to save weight and money. Sometimes they try in very stupid ways.
I've watched the pros do it, and it didn't take long with the open
flame heat source. It took longer to cool for the leak test than the
actual soldering. Of course they separated the pieces and cleaned the
crap where it was leaking before putting the caps back on.
> --
> _____ _ _
> |_ _| | | | |
> | | __ _ _ __ ___ | |__| | ___ _ __ ___ ___ _ __
> | | / _` | '_ ` _ \ | __ |/ _ \| '_ ` _ \ / _ \ '__|
> _| |_ | (_| | | | | | | | | | | (_) | | | | | | __/ |
> |_____| \__,_|_| |_| |_| |_| |_|\___/|_| |_| |_|\___|_|
> __ ____
> / _| | _ \
> ___ | |_ | |_) | ___ _ __ __ _
> / _ \| _| | _ < / _ \| '__/ _` |
> | (_) | | | |_) | (_) | | | (_| |_
> \___/|_| |____/ \___/|_| \__, (_)
> __/ |
> |___/
Boy they would really hurt the Borg collective, with them all running
around eating doughnuts and yelling DOH! ;-)
Homer J Simpson
"Michael A. Terrell" <mike.t...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:44F77ED7...@earthlink.net...
> I've watched the pros do it, and it didn't take long with the open
> flame heat source. It took longer to cool for the leak test than the
> actual soldering. Of course they separated the pieces and cleaned the
> crap where it was leaking before putting the caps back on.
I watched a very good tool maker waste an hour trying to solder the neck
back on one - and fail each time. I finally told him to let me do it for
him. I spent 15 minutes cleaning both parts very thoroughly - and 3 seconds
doing a perfect repair first time.
bud
jakdedert
> Michael Kennedy wrote:
>> I have a radiator in my truck (chevy s-10) that is partially made of black
>> plastic. It has developed a crack over time and now has a small leak. After
>> reading about melting ABS plastic back togeather with carburator spray and
>> some spare abs I thought there is some possibilty of doing somethign similar
>> with this.
>>
>> First of all I have to identify what kind of black plastic this thing is
>> made of. Does anyone have any tips on how to do that?
>>
>> - Mike
>
>
> Michael, check out the link below if you can't repair your radiator.
> I bought a new one for my 87 Ranger last year for about 1/3 of what Ford
> wanted. I ordered it one day and got it the next. It was an exact
> match to the original plastic and aluminum. All i had to do was pop out
> the tinnerman nuts and pop them into the new radiator. I was surprised
> that it was designed to be replaced from the top, without crawling under
> the truck. Of course, some idiot had replaced the lower radiator hose
> and turned the clamp the wrong way so I still had to crawl under and
> spend two hours getting it loose without damaging the hose.
Surprised you didn't use new hoses (and clamps for that matter). Never
mind. I've been guilty of the same...still not the best practice.
(Like my uncle Ed use to say: 'Do as I say, not as I do.') <G>
jak
Michael A. Terrell
The hoses looked new. I check them fairly often, because of the
short life of rubber hose in the Florida heat. I had to borrow money to
buy the radiator, I needed it a few weeks before I knew I was going to
be put on disability, so I couldn't have replaced them even if they were
bad. They still look good 18 months later, but I've only put about 5000
miles on the truck in 18 months.