OT: What's a good house paint for hot climates?

[Joerg]

Hi Folks,

Time to paint the house again but the local brands have changed a lot.
Last time was around 14 years ago, and we used Kelly Moore back then.
First their Elastocote and then Latex paint. It held up good but now
some areas suddenly turned bright white, I guess from the intense sun.

Nowadays the locally available brands are Sherwin Williams and Benjamin
Moore from the local paint store, or Behr from Home Depot. Kelly Moore
would require a trip but that's ok if that paint is still the best. I
think the toughest enemy for paint on our house is the hot summer sun.
Not so much the rain because of the rather large roof overhang.

Any opinions? What say thee?

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

[bloggs.fred...@gmail.com]

Well wathcha painting? Wood, stucco, concrete, brick, synthetic siding?

[Joerg]

Oops, sorry, wood siding. But it wouldn't matter much because there is
already the Elastocote and the old Kelly Moore paint underneath, which
even with serious power-washing effort won't come off.

So in essence we'd be painting paint :-)

[bloggs.fred...@gmail.com]

Sherwin-Williams always works as advertized and it's priced slightly less than Benjamin Moore. They always sell it for less than the list price, will probably let that $55/gal Duration go for $35. I've seen the Behr self-priming in action and am less than impressed with it, you will end up using twice as much and it still looks bad. Actually wouldn't trust any claims of self-priming and prime it anyway whichever paint you use, depends on your standards.I'm pretty sure S-W is the product of choice of the big contractors, they have every imaginable application of paint covered.

[Joerg]

We won't need to prime since there is already paint on the house. It's
not peeling or anything, just sun-bleached.

Our paint store doesn't give discounts but that's ok, I am more
concerned that it's good stuff so it lasts maybe a bit longer than the
14 years the Kelly Moore lasted.

Meantime, the paints my wife found rated as good:

Pittsburgh Manor Hall Timeless
Pittsburgh Sunproof Latex Exterior
Benjamin Moor Aura Waterborne Exterior

But maybe S-W is the way to go and some web links corroborate what you said:

http://www.consumersearch.com/exterior-paint/sherwin-williams-duration

The only thing I don't like is that it's a self-prime thick paint. We
don't need to prime.

[bloggs.fred...@gmail.com]

The Pittsburgh products look good, but I never see them come up in reviews.

[Joerg]

bloggs.fred...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Sunday, March 24, 2013 6:20:03 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
>> bloggs.fred...@gmail.com wrote:

[...]

I haven't either. Meantime I've scoped out S-W Duration a bit and there
seem to be some issues with it, mostly because of its thickness and
quick drying time:

http://jackpauhl.blogspot.com/2007/10/duration-exterior.html

We normally use a roller but this paint doesn't seem to like that
technique. Our siding has these typical vertical recesses that must be
painted by brush and then the other person rolls the surfaces. Afraid
that S-W Duration might be clumping a lot when the roller meets the
brush-painted areas.

[Nico Coesel]

Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>bloggs.fred...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Sunday, March 24, 2013 5:03:41 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
>>> bloggs.fred...@gmail.com wrote:
>> imaginable application of paint covered.
>
>
>We won't need to prime since there is already paint on the house. It's
>not peeling or anything, just sun-bleached.

I'd still give it a very thourough sanding to remove the layer that
got affected by the sun.

>Our paint store doesn't give discounts but that's ok, I am more
>concerned that it's good stuff so it lasts maybe a bit longer than the
>14 years the Kelly Moore lasted.

14 years is very long. Over here the recommendation is to paint every
8 years if you use very good paint.

--
Failure does not prove something is impossible, failure simply
indicates you are not using the right tools...
nico@nctdevpuntnl (punt=.)
--------------------------------------------------------------

[Joerg]

Nico Coesel wrote:
> Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>> bloggs.fred...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Sunday, March 24, 2013 5:03:41 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
>>>> bloggs.fred...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> imaginable application of paint covered.
>>
>> We won't need to prime since there is already paint on the house. It's
>> not peeling or anything, just sun-bleached.
>
> I'd still give it a very thourough sanding to remove the layer that
> got affected by the sun.
>

That would take many weeks. The previous paint is very tough to get off.
We'll pressure-wash it though.

>> Our paint store doesn't give discounts but that's ok, I am more
>> concerned that it's good stuff so it lasts maybe a bit longer than the
>> 14 years the Kelly Moore lasted.
>
> 14 years is very long. Over here the recommendation is to paint every
> 8 years if you use very good paint.
>

In Germany houses weren't painted that often and that's only a few
hundred km from you. Maybe after 20 years or so. But over there I knew
what the good stuff was, paints such as ICI Dulux.

However, in Europe the concern was mostly with harsh weather and cold
winters. What ruins a paint here is the blistering sun. Walls can get so
hot that you can't touch them and then there is the strong UV.

It's amazing. A spot next to the garage has turned from beige to bright
white. When we still had linoleum in our kitchen the sun turned a chunk
of that from grey to purple. Through the window glass! I think if you
leave an EPROM oustide with the glass bare the data content is pretty
much gone an hour later.

[bloggs.fred...@gmail.com]

I don't trust that review. I've used their interior Superpaint which had the same complaints, it's not that thick and it's easy to apply, but it does set up fast, so you don't want to go over anything that's been in place for more than a few minutes, you need to let it completely dry first. Your siding just means you cut-in all the recessed grooves on the first day and hit the flats on the second.

[Joerg]

It's not the only review like that I saw. But for the Pittsburgh
Sunproof I can't find any such detailed reviews.

Doing the recesses one day and the rest the next day is fine, as long as
the Duration exterior paint can be rolled.

[bloggs.fred...@gmail.com]

LOL- those people are exaggerating about it being like mayonnaise. You need to ask yourself how a leading paint manufacturer would make a paint that's tough to roll? The answer is they don't, if it's anything like the Superpaint, it will roll well. As for the prep, you need to get some of those little blocks of 60-grit sanders, they look like sponges, to dull and roughen the surface of the existing paint, it takes only slightly more effort than wiping the walls down with a rag. Check the S-W site about surface prep, if it's hard and smooth the adhesion will not be the best.

[bloggs.fred...@gmail.com]

On Sunday, March 24, 2013 8:21:00 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:

>

> Doing the recesses one day and the rest the next day is fine, as long as
>
> the Duration exterior paint can be rolled.
>

When you're cutting in the recesses on the first day, you need to feather it off like the finished job. When you get the inevitable drops on the flats below, you need to feather them out, same thing with any excess squeezed out next to the recesses, because those drops and ridges will be there to stay when it dries, and your second coat on the flats is not going to dissolve them :-)

[Martin Riddle]

"Joerg" <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:ar96bk...@mid.individual.net...

For Latex, Glidden Endurance
<http://www.glidden.com/products/endurance-exterior-paint-flat.do>

I painted our eves with this and found out that the big box stores don't
carry it. You have to find a Glidden retailer, usually a little hardware
store that is approved by Glidden to sell it. I found out it is a
popular paint used for the houses along the water front, it weathers
very well.

Also get a semi gloss, there are more Akyds in the gloss versions which
make for a harder surface that will be more weather resistant. You can
always do a final coat in satin to cover the shine, wooden floors are
sometimes done this way.

Cheers

[Joerg]

Well, most are folks who professionally paint since decades. They must
know a thing or two.

> You need to ask yourself how a leading paint manufacturer would make
> a paint that's tough to roll? The answer is they don't, if it's
> anything like the Superpaint, it will roll well. As for the prep, you
> need to get some of those little blocks of 60-grit sanders, they look
> like sponges, to dull and roughen the surface of the existing paint,
> it takes only slightly more effort than wiping the walls down with a
> rag. Check the S-W site about surface prep, if it's hard and smooth
> the adhesion will not be the best.

Yep, got those pads in the garage already.

[Joerg]

Good point. Got to do a clean job in that first step. And I don't want
to be sanding down ridges.

[Joerg]

Do you know how that holds up in the blistering sun? Weather isn't a
concern here but heat and UV is.

> Also get a semi gloss, there are more Akyds in the gloss versions which
> make for a harder surface that will be more weather resistant. You can
> always do a final coat in satin to cover the shine, wooden floors are
> sometimes done this way.
>

So far we've always used semi-gloss. It also washes better. Occasionally
we have those turkey vultures and other birds who seem to have no qualms
about "letting go" during final approach. Pretty gross.

[Robert Macy]

you should post this question on
alt.home.repair usenet group

I did. The best, most knowledgeable answer came from 'nestork' who
really knew his chemistry, background etc.

I opted to use Behr from HD, simply due to availablility. Their
masonry and ?? paint is what someone else recommended. After one year
in the blazing Arizona sun and cold driving rains, haven't noticed any
shift in color. Nor, chalkiness I'm used to seeing.

One note, if you're near an airport; be prepared for that chalky look
coming on fast. I've heard that from planes dumping fuel on approach
really takes out your paint. From experience living near a major
airport, seemed true. Every house had chalky paint and even ours after
a coat of EXPENSIVE high quality started going the same way.

[Charlie E.]

On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 17:14:59 -0700 (PDT),

Or, just use a sprayer. We bought one a few years back, and makes a
lot of jobs a lot easier, just noisier!

Charlie

[Joerg]

I tried with a li'l Wagner 15 year ago. What a mess. The results were
good but with thicker paint it plugged up a lot. Plus all the masking
and taping makes that job not so much faster than rolling. And if a
major wind comes up you have to stop so that no spray wafts over to the
neighbors.

[bloggs.fred...@gmail.com]

Another factoid from S-W, and why Duration would be a good choice:
If you need to paint outside with latex paint when temperatures are moving up and down like a yo-yo, I suggest you use one of the latex like Duration, Resilience, or SuperPaint. These products can be applied and will cure at lower temperatures, as low as 35° F. Traditional latex-based paints need temperatures above 60° F to cure properly. Warmer temperatures are needed to allow the latex particles to coalesce, or melt together. That is why the spring and fall can be tricky times to paint outside. A common mistake is to paint when the daytime high temperature gets above 60° F and the nighttime temperatures get much cooler because dew forms on almost everything as soon as the sun goes down. Even though the temperature was OK at the time of application, the paint can stop coalescing. This permits moisture to get into the uncured paint film allowing certain ingredients to come to the surface when the moisture evaporates, causing surface staining and possible adhesion problems.

[Joerg]

Well, I am not going to paint when it's just a few degrees above
freezing :-)

> Traditional latex-based paints need temperatures above 60� F to cure
> properly. Warmer temperatures are needed to allow the latex particles
> to coalesce, or melt together. That is why the spring and fall can be
> tricky times to paint outside. A common mistake is to paint when the
> daytime high temperature gets above 60� F and the nighttime
> temperatures get much cooler because dew forms on almost everything
> as soon as the sun goes down. Even though the temperature was OK at
> the time of application, the paint can stop coalescing. This permits
> moisture to get into the uncured paint film allowing certain
> ingredients to come to the surface when the moisture evaporates,
> causing surface staining and possible adhesion problems.

BT. When we painted 14 years ago I worked long hours, usually came home
at 7:30pm or so. My wife isn't comfortable on high ladders so I did the
gables and such. One night was really cold, condensation, drip, drip
drip. Took me weeks to get those spots cleaned up, the paint clung to
the driveway like glue.

[Joerg]

Robert Macy wrote:
> On Mar 24, 1:34 pm, Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> Hi Folks,
>>
>> Time to paint the house again but the local brands have changed a lot.
>> Last time was around 14 years ago, and we used Kelly Moore back then.
>> First their Elastocote and then Latex paint. It held up good but now
>> some areas suddenly turned bright white, I guess from the intense sun.
>>
>> Nowadays the locally available brands are Sherwin Williams and Benjamin
>> Moore from the local paint store, or Behr from Home Depot. Kelly Moore
>> would require a trip but that's ok if that paint is still the best. I
>> think the toughest enemy for paint on our house is the hot summer sun.
>> Not so much the rain because of the rather large roof overhang.
>>
>> Any opinions? What say thee?
>>
>> --
>> Regards, Joerg
>>
>> http://www.analogconsultants.com/
>
> you should post this question on
> alt.home.repair usenet group
>
> I did. The best, most knowledgeable answer came from 'nestork' who
> really knew his chemistry, background etc.
>

Maybe I should have. I thought that group was almost dead by now.

> I opted to use Behr from HD, simply due to availablility. Their
> masonry and ?? paint is what someone else recommended. After one year
> in the blazing Arizona sun and cold driving rains, haven't noticed any
> shift in color. Nor, chalkiness I'm used to seeing.
>

Well, one year isn't much time. All paint looks like new after that
short time. The discoloration began last year, meaning after 13 years
total. Almost like a digital change .. whambam .. beige -> white. And
only some spots.

> One note, if you're near an airport; be prepared for that chalky look
> coming on fast. I've heard that from planes dumping fuel on approach
> really takes out your paint. From experience living near a major
> airport, seemed true. Every house had chalky paint and even ours after
> a coat of EXPENSIVE high quality started going the same way.

We have a local runway right in town, it's sort of an airpark town.
Occasionally people find motor oil splotches on their homes. But we are
also in the approach path for Mather Field where freighters land. They
usually do not dump, so far no problems. There is some pollution though
because when we get the first rain after several dry months there's some
foam in the water from the downspouts.

[Nico Coesel]

Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>Nico Coesel wrote:
>> Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> bloggs.fred...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> On Sunday, March 24, 2013 5:03:41 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
>>>>> bloggs.fred...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> imaginable application of paint covered.
>>>
>>> We won't need to prime since there is already paint on the house. It's
>>> not peeling or anything, just sun-bleached.
>>
>> I'd still give it a very thourough sanding to remove the layer that
>> got affected by the sun.
>>
>
>That would take many weeks. The previous paint is very tough to get off.
>We'll pressure-wash it though.

You don't have to take everything off. Just a thin layer. An even
surface also gives a much prettyer end result. OTOH a belt sander does
miracles on thick layers of paint.

>>> Our paint store doesn't give discounts but that's ok, I am more
>>> concerned that it's good stuff so it lasts maybe a bit longer than the
>>> 14 years the Kelly Moore lasted.
>>
>> 14 years is very long. Over here the recommendation is to paint every
>> 8 years if you use very good paint.
>>
>
>In Germany houses weren't painted that often and that's only a few
>hundred km from you. Maybe after 20 years or so. But over there I knew
>what the good stuff was, paints such as ICI Dulux.

Well you can always skip a few years but you'll get rotten wood if you
wait to long.

[lang...@fonz.dk]

On Mar 25, 8:50 pm, n...@puntnl.niks (Nico Coesel) wrote:

> Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >Nico Coesel wrote:

> >> Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>
> >>> bloggs.fredbloggs.f...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>> On Sunday, March 24, 2013 5:03:41 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:

> >>>>> bloggs.fredbloggs.f...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>> imaginable application of paint covered.
>
> >>> We won't need to prime since there is already paint on the house. It's
> >>> not peeling or anything, just sun-bleached.
>
> >> I'd still give it a very thourough sanding to remove the layer that
> >> got affected by the sun.
>
> >That would take many weeks. The previous paint is very tough to get off.
> >We'll pressure-wash it though.
>
> You don't have to take everything off. Just a thin layer. An even
> surface also gives a much prettyer end result. OTOH a belt sander does
> miracles on thick layers of paint.
>
> >>> Our paint store doesn't give discounts but that's ok, I am more
> >>> concerned that it's good stuff so it lasts maybe a bit longer than the
> >>> 14 years the Kelly Moore lasted.
>
> >> 14 years is very long. Over here the recommendation is to paint every
> >> 8 years if you use very good paint.
>
> >In Germany houses weren't painted that often and that's only a few
> >hundred km from you. Maybe after 20 years or so. But over there I knew
> >what the good stuff was, paints such as ICI Dulux.
>
> Well you can always skip a few years but you'll get rotten wood if you
> wait to long.
>

I believe it was in Sweden where they tried building a whole bunch of
identical
barracks but only painted half of them.

Turned out to be no significant difference when the construction was
done
right


-Lasse

[Martin Riddle]

"Joerg" <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message

news:arb62c...@mid.individual.net...

It works in NY weather. I couldn�t say what the surface temps would be
in 98 degree weather along the shore. But it is perfered, and it does
seem to old up very well. Its not cheap either, I think it was $35/gal.

Cheers

[John Larkin]

On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 13:34:49 -0700, Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

>Hi Folks,
>
>Time to paint the house again but the local brands have changed a lot.
>Last time was around 14 years ago, and we used Kelly Moore back then.
>First their Elastocote and then Latex paint. It held up good but now
>some areas suddenly turned bright white, I guess from the intense sun.
>
>Nowadays the locally available brands are Sherwin Williams and Benjamin
>Moore from the local paint store, or Behr from Home Depot. Kelly Moore
>would require a trip but that's ok if that paint is still the best. I
>think the toughest enemy for paint on our house is the hot summer sun.
>Not so much the rain because of the rather large roof overhang.
>
>Any opinions? What say thee?

Paints change more often than the expected lifetime of the paint. So
how can anybody tell what's good?


--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

Precision electronic instrumentation
Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators
Custom laser drivers and controllers
Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links
VME thermocouple, LVDT, synchro acquisition and simulation

[Nico Coesel]

"lang...@fonz.dk" <lang...@fonz.dk> wrote:

>On Mar 25, 8:50=A0pm, n...@puntnl.niks (Nico Coesel) wrote:
>> Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> >Nico Coesel wrote:
>> >> Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>> >>> bloggs.fredbloggs.f...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >>>> On Sunday, March 24, 2013 5:03:41 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
>> >>>>> bloggs.fredbloggs.f...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >>>> imaginable application of paint covered.
>>

>> >>> We won't need to prime since there is already paint on the house. It'=

>s
>> >>> not peeling or anything, just sun-bleached.
>>
>> >> I'd still give it a very thourough sanding to remove the layer that
>> >> got affected by the sun.
>>
>> >That would take many weeks. The previous paint is very tough to get off.
>> >We'll pressure-wash it though.
>>
>> You don't have to take everything off. Just a thin layer. An even
>> surface also gives a much prettyer end result. OTOH a belt sander does
>> miracles on thick layers of paint.
>>
>> >>> Our paint store doesn't give discounts but that's ok, I am more

>> >>> concerned that it's good stuff so it lasts maybe a bit longer than th=

>e
>> >>> 14 years the Kelly Moore lasted.
>>
>> >> 14 years is very long. Over here the recommendation is to paint every
>> >> 8 years if you use very good paint.
>>
>> >In Germany houses weren't painted that often and that's only a few
>> >hundred km from you. Maybe after 20 years or so. But over there I knew
>> >what the good stuff was, paints such as ICI Dulux.
>>
>> Well you can always skip a few years but you'll get rotten wood if you
>> wait to long.
>>
>
>I believe it was in Sweden where they tried building a whole bunch of
>identical
>barracks but only painted half of them.
>
>Turned out to be no significant difference when the construction was
>done
>right

It depends on the climate and conditions. Half of the country I live
in is basically a big swamp turned.

[Nico Coesel]

"lang...@fonz.dk" <lang...@fonz.dk> wrote:

>On Mar 25, 8:50=A0pm, n...@puntnl.niks (Nico Coesel) wrote:
>> Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> >Nico Coesel wrote:
>> >> Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>> >>> bloggs.fredbloggs.f...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >>>> On Sunday, March 24, 2013 5:03:41 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
>> >>>>> bloggs.fredbloggs.f...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >>>> imaginable application of paint covered.
>>

>> >>> We won't need to prime since there is already paint on the house. It'=

>s
>> >>> not peeling or anything, just sun-bleached.
>>
>> >> I'd still give it a very thourough sanding to remove the layer that
>> >> got affected by the sun.
>>
>> >That would take many weeks. The previous paint is very tough to get off.
>> >We'll pressure-wash it though.
>>
>> You don't have to take everything off. Just a thin layer. An even
>> surface also gives a much prettyer end result. OTOH a belt sander does
>> miracles on thick layers of paint.
>>
>> >>> Our paint store doesn't give discounts but that's ok, I am more

>> >>> concerned that it's good stuff so it lasts maybe a bit longer than th=

>e
>> >>> 14 years the Kelly Moore lasted.
>>
>> >> 14 years is very long. Over here the recommendation is to paint every
>> >> 8 years if you use very good paint.
>>
>> >In Germany houses weren't painted that often and that's only a few
>> >hundred km from you. Maybe after 20 years or so. But over there I knew
>> >what the good stuff was, paints such as ICI Dulux.
>>
>> Well you can always skip a few years but you'll get rotten wood if you
>> wait to long.
>>
>
>I believe it was in Sweden where they tried building a whole bunch of
>identical
>barracks but only painted half of them.
>
>Turned out to be no significant difference when the construction was
>done
>right

It depends on the climate and conditions. Half of the country I live

in is basically a big swamp turned into land. Its very warm and humid
in the summer.

[Joerg]

Martin Riddle wrote:
> "Joerg" <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message

> news:arb62c...@mid.individual.net...
>> Martin Riddle wrote:

[...]

>>> I painted our eves with this and found out that the big box stores
>>> don't
>>> carry it. You have to find a Glidden retailer, usually a little
>>> hardware
>>> store that is approved by Glidden to sell it. I found out it is a
>>> popular paint used for the houses along the water front, it weathers
>>> very well.
>>>
>> Do you know how that holds up in the blistering sun? Weather isn't a
>> concern here but heat and UV is.
>>
>>
>>> Also get a semi gloss, there are more Akyds in the gloss versions
>>> which
>>> make for a harder surface that will be more weather resistant. You
>>> can
>>> always do a final coat in satin to cover the shine, wooden floors
>>> are
>>> sometimes done this way.
>>>
>> So far we've always used semi-gloss. It also washes better.
>> Occasionally
>> we have those turkey vultures and other birds who seem to have no
>> qualms
>> about "letting go" during final approach. Pretty gross.
>>
>> --
>> Regards, Joerg
>>
>> http://www.analogconsultants.com/
>

> It works in NY weather. ...


That's like Siberia :-)


> ... I couldn’t say what the surface temps would be

> in 98 degree weather along the shore. But it is perfered, and it does
> seem to old up very well. Its not cheap either, I think it was $35/gal.
>

$35 would be ok, quality is what matters.

[Joerg]

John Larkin wrote:
> On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 13:34:49 -0700, Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi Folks,
>>
>> Time to paint the house again but the local brands have changed a lot.
>> Last time was around 14 years ago, and we used Kelly Moore back then.
>> First their Elastocote and then Latex paint. It held up good but now
>> some areas suddenly turned bright white, I guess from the intense sun.
>>
>> Nowadays the locally available brands are Sherwin Williams and Benjamin
>> Moore from the local paint store, or Behr from Home Depot. Kelly Moore
>> would require a trip but that's ok if that paint is still the best. I
>> think the toughest enemy for paint on our house is the hot summer sun.
>> Not so much the rain because of the rather large roof overhang.
>>
>> Any opinions? What say thee?
>
> Paints change more often than the expected lifetime of the paint. So
> how can anybody tell what's good?
>

Sure, but brands change less often. Unless one gets bought out.

I was hoping it's like with cars, where certain brands need to be
avoided and others last a long time. My first two belonged to categroy
#1, the latter two to category #2. The difference is HUGE, for a rather
modest price difference.

[k...@attt.bizz]

On Mon, 25 Mar 2013 07:37:53 -0700, Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid>

Latex paint (all I suspect) is, by design, a non-Newtonian fluid. It's
intended to be "heavy" so it doesn't run off the wall onto the floor
(and off the brush onto your shoe). When you apply pressure from the
brush or roller the molecules "shear" causing it to go on smoothly.
The better the paint the more non-Newtonian.

One vote for Benjamin Moore. Duration, if you can afford it.

[Joerg]

Price is not so important. So if you guys say that Duration can be
rolled without smearing, clumping or streaking then that may be the
ticket here. Having to pre-paint the recesses will be a pain because
some of it must be done on a ladder that is sort of difficult to
position. Which I'll then have to do twice.

[bloggs.fred...@gmail.com]

On Sunday, March 24, 2013 6:48:30 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:

> We normally use a roller but this paint doesn't seem to like that
>
> technique. Our siding has these typical vertical recesses that must be
>
> painted by brush and then the other person rolls the surfaces. Afraid
>
> that S-W Duration might be clumping a lot when the roller meets the
>
> brush-painted areas.
>
>
>
> --
>
> Regards, Joerg
>
>
>
> http://www.analogconsultants.com/

The S-W dealer will sell you a pint you can take home and test in place. They do it all the time, but it's usually for people who have to have just the right color so the pint let's them paint a little test patch to see how it looks.

[Joerg]

That is a great idea!

[Robert Macy]

On Mar 26, 7:52 am, Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

If you plan on changing color, I HIGHLY recommend painting a test
patch! We decided on a color. Put a test patch on, and WOW!!!
Absolutely the WRONG color! Did that for three more test patches
until finally got the exact one we wanted. We used HD gallons, with
the leftover being relegated to primer somewhere only.

[bloggs.fred...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, March 26, 2013 12:58:33 PM UTC-4, Robert Macy wrote:

> If you plan on changing color, I HIGHLY recommend painting a test
>
> patch! We decided on a color. Put a test patch on, and WOW!!!
>
> Absolutely the WRONG color! Did that for three more test patches
>
> until finally got the exact one we wanted. We used HD gallons, with
>
> the leftover being relegated to primer somewhere only.

If color is a major concern, be aware that you might have to let it sit upwards of week to see how it fully develops, initially it almost always looks faded compared to the final development for at least 24-48 hours. The final color will be exactly as displayed on the product palette eventually.

[Joerg]

In our case we want to paint the same color as before. When I replaced
the window trim on the south side I kept some chunks which we can take
to the paint store for mixing. Then they'll try to match that. If the
match ain't 100% poifect that would be ok, we'll write down the ratio
numbers from their machine so we can always go back when we need more paint.

[Charlie E.]

On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 10:38:34 -0700, Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

A few years ago when we painted our house (which was just two years
old at the time...) we decided to change the colors. We wanted a
white house, with a terra-cotta red trim to match the tinted concrete
on our new front patio. We looked at a bunch of paint swatches, and
choose the one that matched it best.

Two weeks later, we look at the final paint color, and it is bright
red! Seems the color we had picked was a SW color, but the paint the
contractor used was Frazee. When they did whatever color matching to
that chip, they really messed up. Our neighbors were furious! With
that clean white and bright red, we stood out in a neighborhood of
neutral beiges and grays. On the other hand, when we saw it, we
really, really liked it!

[Joerg]

Blame it on your electronic color reader :-)

When we painted our house 14 years ago we tried green as trim for the
gable boards and stuff. Looked at it ... *YUCK* ... got rid of that real
quick.

[bloggs.fred...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, March 26, 2013 4:23:15 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:

>
> Blame it on your electronic color reader :-)
>
>
>
> When we painted our house 14 years ago we tried green as trim for the
>
> gable boards and stuff. Looked at it ... *YUCK* ... got rid of that real
>
> quick.
>
>
>
> --
>
> Regards, Joerg
>
>
>
> http://www.analogconsultants.com/

S-W has a visualizer https://www.sherwin-williams.com/visualizer/# where you can mix and match up siding and trim color schemes on something maybe close to the architectural style of house, it's self-explanatory.

[Charlie E.]

On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 13:23:15 -0700, Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

Actually, after having this color for five years, the only thing I
would change would be to paint the eaves red as well!

[Joerg]

Charlie E. wrote:
> On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 13:23:15 -0700, Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid>
> wrote:
>
>> Charlie E. wrote:

[...]

>>> A few years ago when we painted our house (which was just two years
>>> old at the time...) we decided to change the colors. We wanted a
>>> white house, with a terra-cotta red trim to match the tinted concrete
>>> on our new front patio. We looked at a bunch of paint swatches, and
>>> choose the one that matched it best.
>>>
>>> Two weeks later, we look at the final paint color, and it is bright
>>> red! Seems the color we had picked was a SW color, but the paint the
>>> contractor used was Frazee. When they did whatever color matching to
>>> that chip, they really messed up. Our neighbors were furious! With
>>> that clean white and bright red, we stood out in a neighborhood of
>>> neutral beiges and grays. On the other hand, when we saw it, we
>>> really, really liked it!
>>
>> Blame it on your electronic color reader :-)
>>
>> When we painted our house 14 years ago we tried green as trim for the
>> gable boards and stuff. Looked at it ... *YUCK* ... got rid of that real
>> quick.
>
> Actually, after having this color for five years, the only thing I
> would change would be to paint the eaves red as well!
>

The wrath of the whole neighborhood will come upon you if you do that :-)

[Charlie E.]

On Wed, 27 Mar 2013 09:57:32 -0700, Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid>

They tried that last time! We don't actually have an HOA, but the
builder (and the community was still under construction then) did have
a sorta HOA written into the contracts. They sent him several
complaints, and because he was in the middle of a fight with the
planning commision at the time, he actually listened to him. However,
we supported him in his fight (and had some clout with the city that
made this useful) while the complaintants were all fighting him on
that front as well, so he supported us!

Of course, he never did get to build any more houses, even with the
updated plans. The market was just too bad then. I keep expecting
him to start back up any time now...

Charlie

[George Herold]

On Mar 24, 4:34 pm, Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> Hi Folks,
>
> Time to paint the house again but the local brands have changed a lot.
> Last time was around 14 years ago, and we used Kelly Moore back then.
> First their Elastocote and then Latex paint. It held up good but now
> some areas suddenly turned bright white, I guess from the intense sun.
>
> Nowadays the locally available brands are Sherwin Williams and Benjamin
> Moore from the local paint store, or Behr from Home Depot. Kelly Moore
> would require a trip but that's ok if that paint is still the best. I
> think the toughest enemy for paint on our house is the hot summer sun.
> Not so much the rain because of the rather large roof overhang.
>
> Any opinions? What say thee?
>

> --
> Regards, Joerg
>
> http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Joerg I'm late to this thread, and I don't live in a hot climate.
But I've been using stains, rather than paints on my wood structures,
and so far I'm very pleased. The barn soaked up many gallons of stain
10+ years ago, and still looks OK. The garage got stained. The house
is (mostly) covered in plastic. There's some pealing latex covered
woodwork here and there, and I'm thinking about staining it :^)
(I get my stain in 5 gal. buckets.)

George H.




George H.

[Joerg]

Ah, the good old political game. Just like it plays out over and over
here in Sacramento :-)

> Of course, he never did get to build any more houses, even with the
> updated plans. The market was just too bad then. I keep expecting
> him to start back up any time now...
>

Yup. We now have the sequel, housing bubble #2 is coming up. It is now
rather clear that people in government neither understanding nor willing
to learn these things.

[Joerg]

Yeah, stain holds up a lot better than paint but often has the downside
of being quite flammable. Which is a concern in this area.

Also, once something is painted you cannot stain. I did sand down the
whole big deck here in order to get the dreaded paint of and be able to
stain it. Took me three weeks. I don't want to ever do that again in
this earthly life.

[George Herold]

I used a Behr wood stain that I got at HD. Water clean-up which is a
plus.
So not flammable. If it didn't say stain on the can I would have had
a hard time telling it from a paint.

>
> Also, once something is painted you cannot stain. I did sand down the
> whole big deck here in order to get the dreaded paint of and be able to
> stain it. Took me three weeks. I don't want to ever do that again in
> this earthly life.

Grin, I guess I let 'things' get a bit seedier before painting, so
mother nature has done most of the 'scraping' for me.

George H.
>
> --
> Regards, Joerg
>
> http://www.analogconsultants.com/- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[T]

In article <dh82l8pumtjt5e0dv...@4ax.com>, k...@attt.bizz
says...

One thing I learned long ago is that when you paint, prepare the surface
first. Rough up or remove old paint. Use a primer if you're not sure.

[josephkk]

On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 13:34:49 -0700, Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>Hi Folks,
>
>Time to paint the house again but the local brands have changed a lot.
>Last time was around 14 years ago, and we used Kelly Moore back then.
>First their Elastocote and then Latex paint. It held up good but now
>some areas suddenly turned bright white, I guess from the intense sun.
>
>Nowadays the locally available brands are Sherwin Williams and Benjamin
>Moore from the local paint store, or Behr from Home Depot. Kelly Moore
>would require a trip but that's ok if that paint is still the best. I
>think the toughest enemy for paint on our house is the hot summer sun.
>Not so much the rain because of the rather large roof overhang.
>
>Any opinions? What say thee?

My next door neighbor uses Glidden. He goes about 10 years per exterior
paint job in Rancho Cordova. So i tried it, about 3 years and it still
looks fresh.

?-)

[josephkk]

On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 15:20:03 -0700, Joerg <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>bloggs.fred...@gmail.com wrote:

>> On Sunday, March 24, 2013 5:03:41 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
>>> bloggs.fred...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>

>>>> On Sunday, March 24, 2013 4:34:49 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
>>>>> Hi Folks, Time to paint the house again but the local brands
>>>>> have changed a lot. Last time was around 14 years ago, and we
>>>>> used Kelly Moore back then. First their Elastocote and then
>>>>> Latex paint. It held up good but now some areas suddenly turned
>>>>> bright white, I guess from the intense sun. Nowadays the
>>>>> locally available brands are Sherwin Williams and Benjamin
>>>>> Moore from the local paint store, or Behr from Home Depot.
>>>>> Kelly Moore would require a trip but that's ok if that paint is
>>>>> still the best. I think the toughest enemy for paint on our
>>>>> house is the hot summer sun. Not so much the rain because of
>>>>> the rather large roof overhang. Any opinions? What say thee?

>>>> Well wathcha painting? Wood, stucco, concrete, brick, synthetic
>>>> siding?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Oops, sorry, wood siding. But it wouldn't matter much because there
>>> is
>>>
>>> already the Elastocote and the old Kelly Moore paint underneath,
>>> which
>>>
>>> even with serious power-washing effort won't come off.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> So in essence we'd be painting paint :-)

>>>
>>
>> Sherwin-Williams always works as advertized and it's priced slightly
>> less than Benjamin Moore. They always sell it for less than the list
>> price, will probably let that $55/gal Duration go for $35. I've seen
>> the Behr self-priming in action and am less than impressed with it,
>> you will end up using twice as much and it still looks bad. Actually
>> wouldn't trust any claims of self-priming and prime it anyway
>> whichever paint you use, depends on your standards.I'm pretty sure
>> S-W is the product of choice of the big contractors, they have every
>> imaginable application of paint covered.
>
>
>We won't need to prime since there is already paint on the house. It's
>not peeling or anything, just sun-bleached.
>
>Our paint store doesn't give discounts but that's ok, I am more
>concerned that it's good stuff so it lasts maybe a bit longer than the
>14 years the Kelly Moore lasted.
>
>Meantime, the paints my wife found rated as good:
>
>Pittsburgh Manor Hall Timeless
>Pittsburgh Sunproof Latex Exterior
>Benjamin Moor Aura Waterborne Exterior
>
>But maybe S-W is the way to go and some web links corroborate what you said:
>
>http://www.consumersearch.com/exterior-paint/sherwin-williams-duration
>
>The only thing I don't like is that it's a self-prime thick paint. We
>don't need to prime.

All that said, Caltrans prefers Dunn-Edwards (Would you like to talk with
one of their experts?). In all cases pressure wash (or have it done) your
walls first.

?-)

[Joerg]

> one of their experts?). ...


As long as it doesn't pop like the bolts on the Bay Bridge :-)

I guess Caltrans uses them also because they are local. Some people give
it mixed opinions though:

http://www.contractortalk.com/f8/ever-heard-dunn-edwards-paint-6835/

What I see over and over is that contractors favor Benjamin Moore. Much
more so than SW. And not so much Kelly Moore either for some reason
(that used to be the real favorite 15 years ago and it's what we bought
back then).


> ... In all cases pressure wash (or have it done) your
> walls first.
>

Oh, we'll definitely do that. Those are the days when I shower in the
evening instead of the morning :-)

[bobsher...@gmail.com]

On Sunday, March 24, 2013 at 4:34:49 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
> Hi Folks,

> should ai

> Time to paint the house again but the local brands have changed a lot.
> Last time was around 14 years ago, and we used Kelly Moore back then.
> First their Elastocote and then Latex paint. It held up good but now
> some areas suddenly turned bright white, I guess from the intense sun.
>
> Nowadays the locally available brands are Sherwin Williams and Benjamin
> Moore from the local paint store, or Behr from Home Depot. Kelly Moore
> would require a trip but that's ok if that paint is still the best. I
> think the toughest enemy for paint on our house is the hot summer sun.
> Not so much the rain because of the rather large roof overhang.
>
> Any opinions? What say thee?
>

[bobsher...@gmail.com]

On Sunday, March 24, 2013 at 4:34:49 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
> Hi Folks,
>

> Time to paint the house again but the local brands have changed a lot.
> Last time was around 14 years ago, and we used Kelly Moore back then.
> First their Elastocote and then Latex paint. It held up good but now
> some areas suddenly turned bright white, I guess from the intense sun.
>
> Nowadays the locally available brands are Sherwin Williams and Benjamin
> Moore from the local paint store, or Behr from Home Depot. Kelly Moore
> would require a trip but that's ok if that paint is still the best. I
> think the toughest enemy for paint on our house is the hot summer sun.
> Not so much the rain because of the rather large roof overhang.
>
> Any opinions? What say thee?
>
> --
> Regards, Joerg
>
> http://www.analogconsultants.com/

paint or stain for florida

[Buzz McCool]

On 5/4/20 11:12 AM, bobsher...@gmail.com wrote:
>> some areas suddenly turned bright white, I guess from the intense sun.

Sherwin-Williams was offering at one time a "Loxon IR reflective
coating" paint. Not sure if it still exists.

[John Robertson]

Considering the OP asked this back in 2013 I am sure Joerg has long
since gone on to other issues in his life...

John ;-#)#

[RheillyPhoull]

Gets ya every time !!

[Rich S]

On Sunday, March 24, 2013 at 8:34:49 PM UTC, Joerg wrote:
> Hi Folks,
>
> Time to paint the house again but the local brands have changed a lot.
> Last time was around 14 years ago, and we used Kelly Moore back then.
> First their Elastocote and then Latex paint. It held up good but now

> some areas suddenly turned bright white, I guess from the intense sun.
>

> Nowadays the locally available brands are Sherwin Williams and Benjamin
> Moore from the local paint store, or Behr from Home Depot. Kelly Moore
> would require a trip but that's ok if that paint is still the best. I
> think the toughest enemy for paint on our house is the hot summer sun.
> Not so much the rain because of the rather large roof overhang.
>
> Any opinions? What say thee?
>
> --
> Regards, Joerg
>
> http://www.analogconsultants.com/

the top 5 models per my co's testers..

Exterior Paints (Completed the equivalent of 9 years’ exposure)

Behr Premium Plus Ultra Exterior (Home Depot)
Price:
$42.00


Clark + Kensington Exterior (Ace)
Price:
$35.00


Sherwin-Williams Emerald Exterior
Price:
$72.00


Behr Premium Plus Exterior (Home Depot)
Price:
$31.00


Valspar DuraMax Exterior (Lowe’s)
Price:
$39.00

cheers, Rich S.