Boonton 93A True RMS Voltmeter

[amdx]

Hi All,
I bought a Boonton 93A True RMS Voltmeter at a hamfest last weekend.
I paid $5.00, I figured it probably didn't work, but for $5, I'd have a
project. I plugged it in tonight and it works, although it seems to read
about 9% low, or the meter on my signal generator reads high.

Anyway, I'm a little confused about the proper probe.
I assumed a scope probe would be appropriate, but after reading this
from the manual, I don't know.

"The input impedance of the 93A as supplied is
2 Mohms in parallel with 25pf or less; a high impedance
probe (93-1A) is available as an optional accessory.
This probe has an input impedance of 10 Mohms in parallel
with 11.5pf or less."

I'm thinking maybe that's a misprint.

Anyone know?

Thanks, Mikek

[Phil Hobbs]

I have a 93A, but not the external probe. Assuming that it works like
a 10x scope probe, it can easily have less capacitance than the meter
itself. (This isn't mysterious, it's just how voltage dividers act.)

Measurements, aka Boonton, made a lot of good gizmos. I'm a particular
fan of their 72BD digital capacitance meter and their model 59 grid dip
meter. (I have two of each.) I also used one of their Q meters long
ago, but don't have one myself.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs


--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics

160 North State Road #203
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

hobbs at electrooptical dot net
http://electrooptical.net

[Phil Allison]

"Phil Hobbs"

> amdx wrote:
>>
>> I bought a Boonton 93A True RMS Voltmeter at a hamfest last weekend.
>> I paid $5.00, I figured it probably didn't work, but for $5, I'd have a
>> project. I plugged it in tonight and it works, although it seems to read
>> about 9% low, or the meter on my signal generator reads high.
>>
>> Anyway, I'm a little confused about the proper probe.
>> I assumed a scope probe would be appropriate, but after reading this
>> from the manual, I don't know.
>>
>> "The input impedance of the 93A as supplied is
>> 2 Mohms in parallel with 25pf or less; a high impedance
>> probe (93-1A) is available as an optional accessory.
>> This probe has an input impedance of 10 Mohms in parallel
>> with 11.5pf or less."
>>
>> I'm thinking maybe that's a misprint.
>>
>> Anyone know?
>
> I have a 93A, but not the external probe. Assuming that it works like a
> 10x scope probe, it can easily have less capacitance than the meter
> itself. (This isn't mysterious, it's just how voltage dividers act.)

** Whooshhhhh......

That went over his head like a Scud missile.


.... Phil

[Phil Allison]

"amdx"

** You do own a DMM ??

Then use it on the ohms range to verify that 2Mohm figure.

If it is, then add another 2M in parallel to get 1M.

Now you can use any standard 1:1 or 10:1 scope probe.

Shakes head....


.... Phil

[amdx]

I have decided it is not a misprint, because I noticed it says the the
same 2Mohm 25pf at the input connector.
Although I don't know why it measured as close (9%) as it did with
that mismatch.
More checking today.
Mikek

[RobertMacy]

On Thu, 13 Feb 2014 06:57:35 -0700, amdx <noj...@knology.net> wrote:

>> ...snip....

> I have decided it is not a misprint, because I noticed it says the the
> same 2Mohm 25pf at the input connector.
> Although I don't know why it measured as close (9%) as it did with
> that mismatch.
> More checking today.
> Mikek

Mikek, welcome back from the show. Phil, kudos on your suggestion!

that 9% sounds like a 'conversion' error. near to the difference between
AVERAGE and RMS.

take a waveform with a peak of 1.414 and the rms is 1, but the average is
sqrt(2)*2/pi about 0.9; a difference of 9-10%

or, your meter could just be broken.

[Phil Allison]

"amdx"

> Phil Allison wrote:
>> "amdx"
>>>
>>>
>>> I bought a Boonton 93A True RMS Voltmeter at a hamfest last weekend.
>>> I paid $5.00, I figured it probably didn't work, but for $5, I'd have a
>>> project. I plugged it in tonight and it works, although it seems to read
>>> about 9% low, or the meter on my signal generator reads high.
>>>
>>> Anyway, I'm a little confused about the proper probe.
>>> I assumed a scope probe would be appropriate, but after reading this
>>> from
>>> the manual, I don't know.
>>>
>>> "The input impedance of the 93A as supplied is
>>> 2 Mohms in parallel with 25pf or less; a high impedance
>>> probe (93-1A) is available as an optional accessory.
>>> This probe has an input impedance of 10 Mohms in parallel
>>> with 11.5pf or less."
>>>
>>> I'm thinking maybe that's a misprint.
>>>
>>> Anyone know?
>>
>> ** You do own a DMM ??
>>
>> Then use it on the ohms range to verify that 2Mohm figure.
>>
>> If it is, then add another 2M in parallel to get 1M.
>>
>> Now you can use any standard 1:1 or 10:1 scope probe.
>>
>> Shakes head....
>>

>

> I have decided it is not a misprint, because I noticed it says the the
> same 2Mohm 25pf at the input connector.

** Duh .....

> Although I don't know why it measured as close (9%) as it did with that
> mismatch.

** FFS - say what you actually mean !!!!

Paying guessing games with fucking idiots like you is very boring.



... Phil

[Phil Allison]

"RobertMacy"

>
> Mikek, welcome back from the show. Phil, kudos on your suggestion!
>
> that 9% sounds like a 'conversion' error. near to the difference between
> AVERAGE and RMS.

** It's a fucking thermal RMS meter.

Does 20MHz bandwidth mean anything ??

> or, your meter could just be broken.

** Or the needle is bent..


.... Phil

[RobertMacy]

My reply was meant more as just an observation of numbers, as in, error is
similar to..., Didn't mean to imply a definitive identification of an
error source. Although I worded my reply poorly making it sound like such.
English IS my first language although Ms. Macy will tell you it is NOT!


You bring up something here that I don't understand.

Assuming Mikek addded the 2M resistor in parallel and then used a 10x
probe which had 11pF:

At low frequency the 'divider' network is 1/10, so just multiply the
reading by 10.

But, at higher frequency, the 'divider' network becomes the ratio of
capacitors. so unless the probe's capacitance is 'matched' to the input
capacitance of 25pF, approx 2.78pF, to maintain that 10x scale, exactly
WHAT does one multiply times the reading?

Not familiar with that Probe listed in the manual, must have a proper
divider capacitance ratio plus some parasitic capacitance to GND,
accounting for why it's so high.

[amdx]

On 2/13/2014 8:25 AM, RobertMacy wrote:
> On Thu, 13 Feb 2014 06:57:35 -0700, amdx <noj...@knology.net> wrote:
>
>>> ...snip....
>> I have decided it is not a misprint, because I noticed it says the
>> the same 2Mohm 25pf at the input connector.
>> Although I don't know why it measured as close (9%) as it did with
>> that mismatch.
>> More checking today.
>> Mikek
>
>
> Mikek, welcome back from the show.

The show was a bit of a bust, it rained Fri. and Saturday, I only got
about 6 hrs of total sell time. Sunday was nice, but the crowd was thin
and most vendors packed up by 1pm.
I didn't sell my two scopes and spectrum analyzer. I don't really want
to ship those but I might try Ebay.

Phil, kudos on your suggestion!

Except it has a 0.033uf input capacitor. And I see on the schematic,
depending on the scale, either two 1 Meg series resistors or a 1.98 Meg
and some parallel capacitance across the input.
So, the 2Meg question is answered.

>
> that 9% sounds like a 'conversion' error. near to the difference between
> AVERAGE and RMS.
>
> take a waveform with a peak of 1.414 and the rms is 1, but the average
> is sqrt(2)*2/pi about 0.9; a difference of 9-10%
>
> or, your meter could just be broken.

I don't have a reference voltage so I'm comparing my signal generator
meter reading with the 93A meter. Measurements were made with a 50 ohm
termination at 6 MHz.

I measured on 6 different ranges and got 11% to 12% error vs the
signal generator, using a 10 to 1 probe.
With the 1 to 1 probe it consistently read 42% low over 8 ranges.

I would think with a 10 to 1 probe designed for a 1M input the 93A would
read almost 2 x high with its 2M input.

Can anyone help me decide if my 93A reads 50% low accounting for the
probe mismatch or is the probe ok and the meter just reads 12% low.

I have a higher quality Tek probe, I'll go try it and see if it reads
different than my $13 Chinese probe.

Thanks, Mikek

-------------
Just to add to my confusion checking with a scope and dividing the
pp scope reading by 2.828, the scope reads about 4% low compared
to the Signal generator.

[amdx]

Please be bored and don't respond to this obviously stupid post.
I don't know why you have this compulsion to respond or even read
and the to follow up on a post that makes you so mad.
What is wrong with you?
Everyone else is asked to help me figure this out.
Thanks, Mikek

[RobertMacy]

On Thu, 13 Feb 2014 09:12:11 -0700, amdx <noj...@knology.net> wrote:

>> ...snip....
>

> Can anyone help me decide if my 93A reads 50% low accounting for the
> probe mismatch or is the probe ok and the meter just reads 12% low.
>
> I have a higher quality Tek probe, I'll go try it and see if it reads
> different than my $13 Chinese probe.
>
> Thanks, Mikek
>
> -------------
> Just to add to my confusion checking with a scope and dividing the
> pp scope reading by 2.828, the scope reads about 4% low compared
> to the Signal generator.
>
>

check your scope spec, they're usually 3% instruements. great for
'relative' measurements, though.

if you use a 10x probe designed for 25pF or a 10x probe designed for 40pF
you'll see a big difference.

What is the break point? something as low as 16kHz, or such. hwhen the
probe goes from looking like a resistor to looking like a capacitor.

[Phil Hobbs]

Unless your generator is something beautiful like a HP 3325, its
amplitude calibration is suspect. (Signal generator folks seem to think
that +-0.25 dB is a good accuracy spec.)

The 93A is specified at 2% relative or 1% FS. I'd set the generator to
some frequency where the 93A and a nice shiny true-RMS DVM both work
well (e.g. 100 Hz), or just use a transformer on the AC line, where you
know that the DVM will do its thing properly. The 93A is fully
specified down to 10 Hz.

[amdx]

On 2/13/2014 10:25 AM, RobertMacy wrote:
> On Thu, 13 Feb 2014 09:12:11 -0700, amdx <noj...@knology.net> wrote:
>
>>> ...snip....
>>
>> Can anyone help me decide if my 93A reads 50% low accounting for the
>> probe mismatch or is the probe ok and the meter just reads 12% low.
>>
>> I have a higher quality Tek probe, I'll go try it and see if it reads
>> different than my $13 Chinese probe.
>>
>> Thanks, Mikek
>>
>> -------------
>> Just to add to my confusion checking with a scope and dividing the
>> pp scope reading by 2.828, the scope reads about 4% low compared
>> to the Signal generator.
>>
>>
>
> check your scope spec, they're usually 3% instruements. great for
> 'relative' measurements, though.
>
> if you use a 10x probe designed for 25pF or a 10x probe designed for
> 40pF you'll see a big difference.

I have adjusted the probe cap just to see if it would make up for the
error, it does affect the reading, but not 11%. But maybe my probe
capacitance adjustment doesn't go high enough for the input of the 93A.

>
> What is the break point? something as low as 16kHz, or such. when the

> probe goes from looking like a resistor to looking like a capacitor.
>

Yes, I understand that, it was added just as another reference, which
may or not be as good as the sig gen meter.

Thanks, Mikek

[amdx]

On 2/13/2014 10:34 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> On 2/13/2014 11:25 AM, RobertMacy wrote:
>> On Thu, 13 Feb 2014 09:12:11 -0700, amdx <noj...@knology.net> wrote:
>>
>>>> ...snip....
>>>
>>> Can anyone help me decide if my 93A reads 50% low accounting for the
>>> probe mismatch or is the probe ok and the meter just reads 12% low.
>>>
>>> I have a higher quality Tek probe, I'll go try it and see if it reads
>>> different than my $13 Chinese probe.
>>>
>>> Thanks, Mikek
>>>
>>> -------------
>>> Just to add to my confusion checking with a scope and dividing the
>>> pp scope reading by 2.828, the scope reads about 4% low compared
>>> to the Signal generator.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> check your scope spec, they're usually 3% instruements. great for
>> 'relative' measurements, though.
>>
>> if you use a 10x probe designed for 25pF or a 10x probe designed for
>> 40pF you'll see a big difference.
>>

>> What is the break point? something as low as 16kHz, or such. when the

>> probe goes from looking like a resistor to looking like a capacitor.
>>
>
> Unless your generator is something beautiful like a HP 3325, its
> amplitude calibration is suspect. (Signal generator folks seem to think
> that +-0.25 dB is a good accuracy spec.)
>
> The 93A is specified at 2% relative or 1% FS. I'd set the generator to
> some frequency where the 93A and a nice shiny true-RMS DVM both work
> well (e.g. 100 Hz), or just use a transformer on the AC line, where you
> know that the DVM will do its thing properly. The 93A is fully
> specified down to 10 Hz.
>
> Cheers
>
> Phil Hobbs
>

I did some more manual reading :-0. The >optional< probe
is for high impedance measurements. So, the 93A was designed for
a direct input connection. I did that, now I'm down to a 5.4% to 6%
error over 8 ranges vs the (unknown calibration) of the signal generator.

I'll check my DMM for its frequency range and try that check at 60hz
or higher if my DMM is up to it.
With a good reference and a little calibration, I think I got my $5.00
worth. Very surprised it even worked.
Now, the Ballantine 323 repair. :-)
Thanks guys, Mikek

[josephkk]

Phil Allison is just a nasty snot. I put him in my bozo box a long time
ago.

?-)

[Phil Allison]

"RobertMacy"

>
> You bring up something here that I don't understand.
>
> Assuming Mikek addded the 2M resistor in parallel and then used a 10x
> probe which had 11pF:
>
> At low frequency the 'divider' network is 1/10, so just multiply the
> reading by 10.
>
> But, at higher frequency, the 'divider' network becomes the ratio of
> capacitors. so unless the probe's capacitance is 'matched' to the input
> capacitance of 25pF, approx 2.78pF, to maintain that 10x scale, exactly
> WHAT does one multiply times the reading?

** Funny how one can use nearly any 10:1 probe with nearly any scope.

> Not familiar with that Probe listed in the manual, must have a proper
> divider capacitance ratio plus some parasitic capacitance to GND,
> accounting for why it's so high.

** Ever notice that lumpy thing attached to the BNC plug on 10:1 probes ?

See that screw head thingy ??

Ever read the instruction sheet ??

You have hours of fun just waiting.


.... Phil

[Phil Allison]

"amdx"

>>
>> **

>>
>>>
>>
> Please be bored and don't respond to this obviously stupid post.
> I don't know why you have this compulsion to respond or even read
> and the to follow up on a post that makes you so mad.
> What is wrong with you?

** My god you are one stubborn PITA shit.

YOU did NOT say your ACTUAL problem was the 2M input.

I had to guess it.

Phil Hobbs guessed it wrong.

There is NO mismatch with a standard BNC lead or 1:1 probe.

YOU have never said what YOU are using.

FFS - WAKE UP !!

SAY what you actually mean !!!!

Paying guessing games with fucking idiots like you is very boring.

.... Phil

[amdx]

Do you feel better now?
Mikek

[RobertMacy]

On Fri, 14 Feb 2014 02:34:45 -0700, Phil Allison <phi...@tpg.com.au> wrote:

>
>> ...snip....

> ** Ever notice that lumpy thing attached to the BNC plug on 10:1 probes
> ?
>
> See that screw head thingy ??
>
> Ever read the instruction sheet ??
>
> You have hours of fun just waiting.
>
>
> .... Phil
>
>

arrrggg! forgot all about that thingy!

great for scope, but wonder how to do that adjustment on a meter, guess
could use a 'known' square wave and adjust for appropriate reading. never
mind.

[David Eather]

That is the closest definition to what is wrong with Phil that has yet
been posted.

Actually Phil has enough symptoms to be diagnosed as having severe
narcissistic personality disorder

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder.

I would further state that Phil is a 'malignant narcissist' as evidenced
by his behavior to newbies and the most brutal abuse is reserved for those
who tentatively ask a question.

Also how his narcissistic rage expresses itself is a dead giveaway - no
matter how small, how obvious, how rare or how stupid the mistake he
defends it and attacks anyone pointing it out as if it is a matter of life
or death.

Phil is actually bereft of any significant achievements, so he inflates
his own importance while denigrating everyone else. By bulling and hurting
others he can feel powerful and superior

For example he claims he started his life at uni enrolled in a special
honors program at uni. As was pointed out by others honors are only
offered to students after they graduate (or very near to graduation with a
nudge and a wink). I have spent almost my entire working life in
Australian tertiary education and I can confirm the situation was exactly
the same in Australia as everywhere else in the world. Honors are only
offered to students who have *proved* there ability to study at a high
level by actually graduating - that has actually changed a little in the
last couple of years but was not the case when Phil was studying. But Phil
simultaneously insults and denigrates everyone who is better qualified
that him - "All Phd's are autistic" for example. What Phill strove for
but failed to achieve are now objects of his derision. Thinking of it
logically then and using Phil's own statements as fact Phil strove to be
mentally defective (from Phil's attempts to use 'autism' as an insult) but
he couldn't even rise to that occasion. Poor, pathetic Phil.

Also his claim of superior technical excellence? If he actually had them
he wouldn't have been fired but he was because he was replaceable with
people just as good technically and far superior socially. The truth is
Phil is no better than many good, experienced TV repair men. There would
be a few thousand of them in Australia and probably tens of thousands or
more in the US.

And his threat to sabotage the news group if a few individuals kept
posting. Well they are still posting and the news group is still
operating. Makes me wonder why Phil is still posting. Maybe Phil has
destroyed the news group and his postings and all our posting are just
part of Phil's greater delusion.

Phil tries to appear smart by only ever dropping in on the few subjects he
knows about, so he makes very few mistakes, but he also does a great deal
of harm to others. His original contributions are virtually nonexistent
unless you count the minutia about leaving soft-drink in the freezer but
even that was poorly investigated (for example what if the drink wasn't
"diet" since sugar also absorbs microwave even in the solid state).

It is not acceptable for Phil (or anyone) to act on desires of abusing and
bulling others and for nothing more than his own personnel enjoyment and
sense of power. Not one of you reading this would accept Phil's behavior
if it was directed at your child, so why is it acceptable for it to be
directed against someone else? You don't know who that new poster is, it
could be a 9 year old taking his first steeps into electronics.

I am doing all this because I will inform anyone - especially newbies -
who Phil tries to abuse with accurate information about what Phil really
is. It is no effort at all, if I had to trawl though every thread to check
it would be a pain but my browser can flag him and I just have to check
the level of abuse. Phil is not in anyway important to me, but the people
he abuses are.

[Phil Allison]

"RobertMacy"
Phil Allison

>
>>> ...snip....
>
>> ** Ever notice that lumpy thing attached to the BNC plug on 10:1 probes
>> ?
>>
>> See that screw head thingy ??
>>
>> Ever read the instruction sheet ??
>>
>> You have hours of fun just waiting.
>>
>
>
>

> arrrggg! forgot all about that thingy!
>
> great for scope, but wonder how to do that adjustment on a meter, guess
> could use a 'known' square wave and adjust for appropriate reading.

** Just get your scope and the RMS meter to agree over a range of sine wave
frequencies - say 100, 1k 10k and 100kHz.


.... Phil

[Phil Allison]

"amdx"

** My god you are one stubborn PITA shit.

YOU did NOT say your ACTUAL problem was the 2M input.

I had to guess it.

Phil Hobbs guessed it wrong.

There is NO mismatch with a standard BNC lead or 1:1 probe.

YOU have never said what YOU are using.

FFS - WAKE UP !!

SAY what you actually mean !!!!

Paying guessing games with fucking idiots like you is very boring.

BTW: Fuck you.


.... Phil

[Maynard A. Philbrook Jr.]

In article <op.xa9yhjlg2cx0wh@ajm>, robert...@gmail.com says...

>
>
> arrrggg! forgot all about that thingy!
>
> great for scope, but wonder how to do that adjustment on a meter, guess
> could use a 'known' square wave and adjust for appropriate reading. never
> mind.
>
>

I still use an "OLD" HP with tubes and chopper motor in the back for
an RF millivolt meter!

Have two of them, both work great, that was after I did some retooling
in there! :)

Jamie

[RobertMacy]

On Fri, 14 Feb 2014 18:39:57 -0700, Phil Allison <phi...@tpg.com.au> wrote:

>
> "RobertMacy"
>>> ...snip....

>> arrrggg! forgot all about that thingy!
>>
>> great for scope, but wonder how to do that adjustment on a meter, guess
>> could use a 'known' square wave and adjust for appropriate reading.
>
> ** Just get your scope and the RMS meter to agree over a range of sine
> wave
> frequencies - say 100, 1k 10k and 100kHz.
>
>
> .... Phil
>

DUH! I seem to be DOUBLE brain dead today!

[amdx]

You must be feeling really good about yourself now.
Mikek

[Phil Allison]

[amdx]

I think you repeated yourself.
Mikek

[Phil Allison]

"amdx" <

[amdx]

On 2/16/2014 6:18 PM, Phil Allison wrote:
> "amdx" <
>

> Paying guessing games with fucking idiots like you is very boring.
>
>
> BTW: Fuck you.
>
>
> .... Phil
>

I think you meant to write Playing.
But that's ok, I can see you're so mad you
can hardly feel the keyboard. :-)
Mikek

[Jim Thompson]

Yep. Phil is starting to act like Larkin.

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

[Phil Allison]

"amdx" <
"amdx"

** My god you are one stubborn PITA shit.

YOU did NOT say your ACTUAL problem was the 2M input.

I had to guess it.

Phil Hobbs guessed it wrong.

There is NO mismatch with a standard BNC lead or 1:1 probe.

YOU have never said what YOU are using.

FFS - WAKE UP !!

SAY what you actually mean !!!!

[David Eather]

On Mon, 17 Feb 2014 11:14:49 +1000, Jim Thompson
<To-Email-Use-Th...@on-my-web-site.com> wrote:

> On Sun, 16 Feb 2014 18:51:18 -0600, amdx <noj...@knology.net> wrote:
>
>> On 2/16/2014 6:18 PM, Phil Allison wrote:
>>> "amdx" <
>>>
>>> Paying guessing games with fucking idiots like you is very boring.
>>>
>>>
>>> BTW: Fuck you.
>>>
>>>
>>> .... Phil
>>>
>>
>>
>> I think you meant to write Playing.
>> But that's ok, I can see you're so mad you
>> can hardly feel the keyboard. :-)
>> Mikek
>>
>
> Yep. Phil is starting to act like Larkin.
>
> ...Jim Thompson

Jim,

And your starting to act like Phil. Let it go for goodness sake. Phil is
a certifiable lunatic with an identifiable anti-social defect (malignant
narcissistic personality disorder). Please aim for something higher.

[amdx]

On 2/16/2014 7:15 PM, Phil Allison wrote:
> "amdx" <
> "amdx"
>
> ** My god you are one stubborn PITA shit.
>
> YOU did NOT say your ACTUAL problem was the 2M input.
>
> I had to guess it.
>
> Phil Hobbs guessed it wrong.
>
> There is NO mismatch with a standard BNC lead or 1:1 probe.
>
> YOU have never said what YOU are using.
>
> FFS - WAKE UP !!
>
> SAY what you actually mean !!!!
>

> Playing guessing games with fucking idiots like you is very boring.

>
>
> BTW: Fuck you.
>
>
> .... Phil
>

I fixed your mistake so you won't keep repeating it.
And have a great day. :-)
Mikek

[Jim Thompson]

On Mon, 17 Feb 2014 11:34:07 +1000, "David Eather" <eat...@tpg.com.au>
wrote:

Larkin is every bit as insane as Phil. It's Larkin who keeps up with
the cheap shots. He just won't stop.

[David Eather]

On Mon, 17 Feb 2014 11:52:32 +1000, Jim Thompson

YOU took that cheap shot Jim - no JL involved.
JL should also stop with the cheap shots.
You're both old enough to know that you don't want your legacies to
contain an episode of petty hatred.

[Jim Thompson]

On Mon, 17 Feb 2014 11:57:30 +1000, "David Eather" <eat...@tpg.com.au>

Actually, the tortious interference is going to pay off... German
river trips for me >:-}

[Ralph Barone]

Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-Th...@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Feb 2014 11:34:07 +1000, "David Eather" <eat...@tpg.com.au>
> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 17 Feb 2014 11:14:49 +1000, Jim Thompson
>> <To-Email-Use-Th...@on-my-web-site.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 16 Feb 2014 18:51:18 -0600, amdx <noj...@knology.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2/16/2014 6:18 PM, Phil Allison wrote:
>>>>> "amdx" <
>>>>>
>>>>> Paying guessing games with fucking idiots like you is very boring.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> BTW: Fuck you.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> .... Phil
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I think you meant to write Playing.
>>>> But that's ok, I can see you're so mad you
>>>> can hardly feel the keyboard. :-)
>>>> Mikek
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yep. Phil is starting to act like Larkin.
>>>
>>> ...Jim Thompson
>>
>> Jim,
>>
>> And your starting to act like Phil. Let it go for goodness sake. Phil is
>> a certifiable lunatic with an identifiable anti-social defect (malignant
>> narcissistic personality disorder). Please aim for something higher.
>
> Larkin is every bit as insane as Phil. It's Larkin who keeps up with
> the cheap shots. He just won't stop.
>
> ...Jim Thompson

OK, so assuming that that's reality, why are YOU playing along?

[hamilton]

We all now that Phil is a 14 year old JD.

Maybe he will learn something before he becomes an adult and has to pay
for his remarks.