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12V Circuit breakers for auto battery chargers
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hand...@home.com
Jan 9, 2013, 2:58:59 PM1/9/13
to
I have a battery charger that is rated at 2, 15, or 100 amps. It's a
Everstart WM-1510 ma model. (Walmart). I found that Schumacher has an
identical charger model SE-1510 ma. That says these Everstart chargers
are made by Schumacher.
Anyhow, the 12v circuit breaker has died and will not reset. That seems
to be the most common problem on all chargers.
My question is this. The Schumacher replacement breaker is rated at 12V
35A. Since the charger is rated to produce 100A, why are they only
using a 35A breaker?
My next question is this:
I can purchase the identical replacement from Centurytool.net for $15.
While I found a place on ebay that has them for $6 (incl shipping). Of
course I'll go with the cheaper ones, since this charger is old anyhow,
so I dont want to sink a lot of money in it. The only problem is that
the ones on ebay are either 12V 30A, or 12V 40A. (They dont have a
35A). I'm not sure which would be better. A 30A would protect the
components more, but would that breaker trip all the time? A 40A is not
that much higher, and might make the breaker last longer, since these
things seem prone to failure anyhow.
Which would be the better choice, the 30A or the 40A?
Thanks
Everstart WM-1510 ma model. (Walmart). I found that Schumacher has an
identical charger model SE-1510 ma. That says these Everstart chargers
are made by Schumacher.
Anyhow, the 12v circuit breaker has died and will not reset. That seems
to be the most common problem on all chargers.
My question is this. The Schumacher replacement breaker is rated at 12V
35A. Since the charger is rated to produce 100A, why are they only
using a 35A breaker?
My next question is this:
I can purchase the identical replacement from Centurytool.net for $15.
While I found a place on ebay that has them for $6 (incl shipping). Of
course I'll go with the cheaper ones, since this charger is old anyhow,
so I dont want to sink a lot of money in it. The only problem is that
the ones on ebay are either 12V 30A, or 12V 40A. (They dont have a
35A). I'm not sure which would be better. A 30A would protect the
components more, but would that breaker trip all the time? A 40A is not
that much higher, and might make the breaker last longer, since these
things seem prone to failure anyhow.
Which would be the better choice, the 30A or the 40A?
Thanks
mike
Jan 9, 2013, 4:46:22 PM1/9/13
to
On 1/9/2013 11:58 AM, hand...@home.com wrote:
> I have a battery charger that is rated at 2, 15, or 100 amps. It's a
> Everstart WM-1510 ma model. (Walmart). I found that Schumacher has an
> identical charger model SE-1510 ma. That says these Everstart chargers
> are made by Schumacher.
>
> Anyhow, the 12v circuit breaker has died and will not reset. That seems
> to be the most common problem on all chargers.
>
> My question is this. The Schumacher replacement breaker is rated at 12V
> 35A. Since the charger is rated to produce 100A, why are they only
> using a 35A breaker?
It's a safety issue. The charger isn't rated to put out 100A continuously.
> I have a battery charger that is rated at 2, 15, or 100 amps. It's a
> Everstart WM-1510 ma model. (Walmart). I found that Schumacher has an
> identical charger model SE-1510 ma. That says these Everstart chargers
> are made by Schumacher.
>
> Anyhow, the 12v circuit breaker has died and will not reset. That seems
> to be the most common problem on all chargers.
>
> My question is this. The Schumacher replacement breaker is rated at 12V
> 35A. Since the charger is rated to produce 100A, why are they only
> using a 35A breaker?
It's for car starting. If the car starts before the breaker flips,
you're good to go.
You also don't want joe sixpack to put 100A into a battery with a shorted
cell for very long.
>
> My next question is this:
> I can purchase the identical replacement from Centurytool.net for $15.
What's your definition of "identical".
> My next question is this:
> I can purchase the identical replacement from Centurytool.net for $15.
> While I found a place on ebay that has them for $6 (incl shipping). Of
> course I'll go with the cheaper ones, since this charger is old anyhow,
> so I dont want to sink a lot of money in it. The only problem is that
> the ones on ebay are either 12V 30A, or 12V 40A. (They dont have a
> 35A). I'm not sure which would be better. A 30A would protect the
> components more, but would that breaker trip all the time? A 40A is not
> that much higher, and might make the breaker last longer, since these
> things seem prone to failure anyhow.
>
> Which would be the better choice, the 30A or the 40A?
be able to determine from a one-line description on an EBAY page.
>
> Thanks
>
Michael A. Terrell
Jan 9, 2013, 5:11:11 PM1/9/13
to
hand...@home.com
Jan 9, 2013, 5:25:09 PM1/9/13
to
On Wed, 09 Jan 2013 13:46:22 -0800, mike <ham...@netzero.net> wrote:
>> My next question is this:
>> I can purchase the identical replacement from Centurytool.net for $15.
>
>What's your definition of "identical".
>
Direct link from manufacture's website, for parts ordering.
>> My next question is this:
>> I can purchase the identical replacement from Centurytool.net for $15.
>
>What's your definition of "identical".
>
hand...@home.com
Jan 9, 2013, 5:28:00 PM1/9/13
to
ask. But I can call and find out....
hand...@home.com
Jan 9, 2013, 7:49:39 PM1/9/13
to
dont have such a thing. One said he could look if I know what make and
model of car has them. A couple of them referred me to a local
rebuilder for starters, alternators, and electric motors. I've dealt
with that place and have never had a good opinion of the place or the
owner. For example, I took in a starter, and he charged me $90 to
rebuild it. (I could have bought a rebuilt starter for $60 at the parts
store). Worse yet, he did not rebuild it properly, because it quit
working a couple days later, leaving me stranded. He made me remove it
from the car, tested it, and said there was nothing wrong with it, and
claimed it was something wrong with my car. I reinstalled it, cleaned
all cables and terminals. A week later it quit again, once again, he
made me remove it. When I took it to him, I told him that I wanted a
completely different starter. He refused, so I phoned my lawyer who
showed up in his shop and threatened him with legal action. He did give
me another starter, and it worked. But that cost me lawyer fees on top
of his ripoff price.
Anyhow, I did call that asshole today, and he said he can get those
parts, When I asked the price, he said he would have to contact
Schumacher and he could order parts for me. But he said that he would
not order any parts until he tested the transformer and rectifiers in my
charger. He said that the transformer is probably shot. I told him
that I already did test everything, and everythin is fine, I just need
the breaker. I went on to tell him it does charge a battery if I jumper
across the breaker.
He clearly told me that unless I'm in his line of business, that I dont
know how to test it properly, but said that he'll be happy to repair the
charger for me........ I wont repeat the words I said before I slammed
down the phone. I can order from Schumacher myself directly. I dont
need that asshole. But I'd prefer to buy the much cheaper parts on
ebay. It's just a fairly cheap battery charger. But hey, I fix what I
can. Money dont grow on trees, and I hate dumping repairable stuff in
landfills. If I had the part, it would already be fixed. It's a 15
minute repair.
Michael A. Terrell
Jan 9, 2013, 7:56:36 PM1/9/13
to
School buses & RVs. Is there an RV dealer near you?
As far as the idiot you talked to, battery chargers aren't rocket
science, and the repair people in that field aren't all that smart.
mike
Jan 9, 2013, 9:17:19 PM1/9/13
to
Martin Riddle
Jan 9, 2013, 10:54:40 PM1/9/13
to
<hand...@home.com> wrote in message
news:pthre8h861f5rk78f...@4ax.com...
or 30A.
I'd order it thru Schumacher. There might be a reason it's 35A and it
may have a special thermal curve.
Cheers
hand...@home.com
Jan 10, 2013, 2:17:03 AM1/10/13
to
On Wed, 09 Jan 2013 19:56:36 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
Ok, I know they are used in vehicles, but I didn't know what for. Now
that you told me, I'll have to chack around for RV dealers.
> As far as the idiot you talked to, battery chargers aren't rocket
>science, and the repair people in that field aren't all that smart.
You got that right.... A battery charger is one of the most simple
electric devices I can think of repairing, (except for getting the parts
for some of them). It's just a basic power supply with an amp meter.
That idiot is not smart, he just thinks he is, and does his best to make
everyone look like they know nothing. Almost everyone in town hates the
guy, and they all go to another motor rebuilder in another town about 25
miles away. That includes the auto parts store right across the street.
If the parts store cant get the part, they recommend the repair guy 25
miles away, rather than this idiot who's shop is right across the
street. Even my lawyer has a few choice words to say when he went there
about that starter issue.
The charger does work just fine, except for that breaker. I wired a
regular 30A plug fuse across the breaker, and charged up my car battery
before. At least I can use it till I get the part. I only had it charge
on the 15A setting, so I knew the fuse would hold up, but still be there
in case of a dead short. Most dead shorts are caused because the clips
touch each other when we're hooking them up. It never fails! I always
wondered why they dont put some covering on the clips so only the teeth
are bare. That would not be rocket science either!
that you told me, I'll have to chack around for RV dealers.
> As far as the idiot you talked to, battery chargers aren't rocket
>science, and the repair people in that field aren't all that smart.
electric devices I can think of repairing, (except for getting the parts
for some of them). It's just a basic power supply with an amp meter.
That idiot is not smart, he just thinks he is, and does his best to make
everyone look like they know nothing. Almost everyone in town hates the
guy, and they all go to another motor rebuilder in another town about 25
miles away. That includes the auto parts store right across the street.
If the parts store cant get the part, they recommend the repair guy 25
miles away, rather than this idiot who's shop is right across the
street. Even my lawyer has a few choice words to say when he went there
about that starter issue.
The charger does work just fine, except for that breaker. I wired a
regular 30A plug fuse across the breaker, and charged up my car battery
before. At least I can use it till I get the part. I only had it charge
on the 15A setting, so I knew the fuse would hold up, but still be there
in case of a dead short. Most dead shorts are caused because the clips
touch each other when we're hooking them up. It never fails! I always
wondered why they dont put some covering on the clips so only the teeth
are bare. That would not be rocket science either!
Michael A. Terrell
Jan 10, 2013, 7:16:20 AM1/10/13
to
hand...@home.com wrote:
shows 79 in their inventory. See if any of the local dealers have a
website.
Here are photos of a lot of styles of automotive breakers. They are
also used on boats.
<https://www.google.com/search?q=Automotive+circuit+breakers&num=100&hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&hs=LFI&tbo=d&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=oK7uUM-8J8Wy0AHJ4YGoBQ&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAA&biw=1280&bih=872>
It looks like 35A isn't a common value.
I used to rebuild some vacuum cleaner motors, and sell them back to
the guy who gave them to me as scrap. He was convinced that I had an
armature lathe to clean up the commutators. I used a large ink eraser
to polish the contacts & a modified Exacto knife blade to undercut the
mica. Drop in a new set of brushes, and maybe a new bearing and they
were ready for another 10 years of reliable service.
hand...@home.com
Jan 11, 2013, 7:39:20 PM1/11/13
to
to NAPA and asked to see the auto fuses. They had them right there on
the rack, but not 35A. They had 30A and 40A. I decided to better
protect the charger, I'd go with the 30A. It's installed, the charger
works fine on the 2A and 15A settings. I have not yet tried it on the
100A setting because there are no really discharged batteries at the
moment.
Using your link,
It looks like this one:
http://www.optifuse.com/Images/acb-h.jpg
35A does appear to be an oddball size.
The one thing I found a little puzzling was the silver and copper
colored studs. I didn't know there was a polarity to these, but I
connected it the same way (colors) as the original one.
I still cant understand how they rate this one at 100A when it only had
a 35A breaker, I can only assume it's like they rate audio amps. Rather
than RMS, it's peak. So the charger can put out 100A for a brief amount
of time when the car is being started. (just a guess).
Now I'll have to dig out the other 2 or 3 dead battery chargers I got
laying around, and see if I can fix them. I know for fact that one of
them needed a breaker, but I could not identify the size and the charger
is some generic no name brand. I think it's a 10A charger, so I'd guess
a 10A breaker would work. Since it's winter, now is a good time to fix
items like this. In warm weather I'm too busy with big projects.
That's a great idea how to clean up those motor commutators. I've
rebuilt some motors myself, usually used emory cloth. Motors are not
that complicated, it's just having the right equipment, particularly of
the coils need to be rewound. That local idiot got all the equipment
when another business shut down because the owner retired or died....
That was before I lived here, but I always hear how nice the original
owner was, and what an asshole this new guy is.
Michael A. Terrell
Jan 12, 2013, 12:20:23 AM1/12/13
to
> ?mike.t...@earthlink.net? wrote:
>
> ?
> ?hand...@home.com wrote:
> ??
> ?? Michael A. Terrell wrote:
> ?? ?
> ?? ? I've seen them used in place of fuses for the headlights on cars,
> ?? ?School buses ? RVs. Is there an RV dealer near you?
> ??
> ?? Ok, I know they are used in vehicles, but I didn't know what for. Now
> ?? that you told me, I'll have to chack around for RV dealers.
> ??
> ?? ? As far as the idiot you talked to, battery chargers aren't rocket
> ?? ?science, and the repair people in that field aren't all that smart.
> ??
> ?? You got that right.... A battery charger is one of the most simple
> ?? electric devices I can think of repairing, (except for getting the parts
> ?? for some of them). It's just a basic power supply with an amp meter.
> ??
> ?? That idiot is not smart, he just thinks he is, and does his best to make
> ?? everyone look like they know nothing. Almost everyone in town hates the
> ?? guy, and they all go to another motor rebuilder in another town about 25
> ?? miles away. That includes the auto parts store right across the street.
> ?? If the parts store cant get the part, they recommend the repair guy 25
> ?? miles away, rather than this idiot who's shop is right across the
> ?? street. Even my lawyer has a few choice words to say when he went there
> ?? about that starter issue.
> ??
> ?? The charger does work just fine, except for that breaker. I wired a
> ?? regular 30A plug fuse across the breaker, and charged up my car battery
> ?? before. At least I can use it till I get the part. I only had it charge
> ?? on the 15A setting, so I knew the fuse would hold up, but still be there
> ?? in case of a dead short. Most dead shorts are caused because the clips
> ?? touch each other when we're hooking them up. It never fails! I always
> ?? wondered why they dont put some covering on the clips so only the teeth
> ?? are bare. That would not be rocket science either!
> ?
> ?
> ?http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/search/Circuit+Breaker/N0227/C0335.oap
> ?shows 79 in their inventory. See if any of the local dealers have a
> ?website.
> ?
> ?
> ? Here are photos of a lot of styles of automotive breakers. They are
> ?also used on boats.
> ?
> ??https://www.google.com/search?q=Automotive+circuit+breakers?num=100?hl=en?safe=o
> ff?client=firefox-a?hs=LFI?tbo=d?rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official?source=lnms?tbm=i
> sch?sa=X?ei=oK7uUM-8J8Wy0AHJ4YGoBQ?ved=0CAoQ_AUoAA?biw=1280?bih=872?
> ?
> ? It looks like 35A isn't a common value.
> ?
> ?
> ?
> ? I used to rebuild some vacuum cleaner motors, and sell them back to
> ?the guy who gave them to me as scrap. He was convinced that I had an
> ?armature lathe to clean up the commutators. I used a large ink eraser
> ?to polish the contacts ? a modified Exacto knife blade to undercut the
> ?mica. Drop in a new set of brushes, and maybe a new bearing and they
> ?were ready for another 10 years of reliable service.
for a quick attempt to start a car with a low battery. The starter
should be run for more than a few seconds at a time. By the time a 100A
breaker would trip, the charger would be damaged, possibly beyond
economical repair.
> Now I'll have to dig out the other 2 or 3 dead battery chargers I got
> laying around, and see if I can fix them. I know for fact that one of
> them needed a breaker, but I could not identify the size and the charger
> is some generic no name brand. I think it's a 10A charger, so I'd guess
> a 10A breaker would work. Since it's winter, now is a good time to fix
> items like this. In warm weather I'm too busy with big projects.
Winter? I had to fire up the A/C yesterday. :(
> That's a great idea how to clean up those motor commutators. I've
> rebuilt some motors myself, usually used emory cloth. Motors are not
> that complicated, it's just having the right equipment, particularly of
> the coils need to be rewound. That local idiot got all the equipment
> when another business shut down because the owner retired or died....
> That was before I lived here, but I always hear how nice the original
> owner was, and what an asshole this new guy is.
I run the motors on an isolated, variable DC power supply & polish
the armature while it's running at a low speed. I junked the burnt
windings, since I gota lot more motors in than I could ever sell. I
would strip a pile of the same type, and put together as many as I could
with the good parts. My favorites were the 'Lamb Electric' single &
double stage. Very common, and easy to repair. The motors for the
Rainbow paid the best. New motors were $125 so I cound get $50 for a
rebuild that took 15 minutes. Sometimes I rebuilt the one they dropped
off, and I always quotes two hours time to fiux one so they didn't get
too pushy. That way I could do my electronics work, and still have time
to fix one on time. :)
>
> ?
> ?hand...@home.com wrote:
> ??
> ?? Michael A. Terrell wrote:
> ?? ?
> ?? ? I've seen them used in place of fuses for the headlights on cars,
> ?? ?School buses ? RVs. Is there an RV dealer near you?
> ??
> ?? Ok, I know they are used in vehicles, but I didn't know what for. Now
> ?? that you told me, I'll have to chack around for RV dealers.
> ??
> ?? ? As far as the idiot you talked to, battery chargers aren't rocket
> ?? ?science, and the repair people in that field aren't all that smart.
> ??
> ?? You got that right.... A battery charger is one of the most simple
> ?? electric devices I can think of repairing, (except for getting the parts
> ?? for some of them). It's just a basic power supply with an amp meter.
> ??
> ?? That idiot is not smart, he just thinks he is, and does his best to make
> ?? everyone look like they know nothing. Almost everyone in town hates the
> ?? guy, and they all go to another motor rebuilder in another town about 25
> ?? miles away. That includes the auto parts store right across the street.
> ?? If the parts store cant get the part, they recommend the repair guy 25
> ?? miles away, rather than this idiot who's shop is right across the
> ?? street. Even my lawyer has a few choice words to say when he went there
> ?? about that starter issue.
> ??
> ?? The charger does work just fine, except for that breaker. I wired a
> ?? regular 30A plug fuse across the breaker, and charged up my car battery
> ?? before. At least I can use it till I get the part. I only had it charge
> ?? on the 15A setting, so I knew the fuse would hold up, but still be there
> ?? in case of a dead short. Most dead shorts are caused because the clips
> ?? touch each other when we're hooking them up. It never fails! I always
> ?? wondered why they dont put some covering on the clips so only the teeth
> ?? are bare. That would not be rocket science either!
> ?
> ?
> ?http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/search/Circuit+Breaker/N0227/C0335.oap
> ?shows 79 in their inventory. See if any of the local dealers have a
> ?website.
> ?
> ?
> ? Here are photos of a lot of styles of automotive breakers. They are
> ?also used on boats.
> ?
> ??https://www.google.com/search?q=Automotive+circuit+breakers?num=100?hl=en?safe=o
> ff?client=firefox-a?hs=LFI?tbo=d?rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official?source=lnms?tbm=i
> sch?sa=X?ei=oK7uUM-8J8Wy0AHJ4YGoBQ?ved=0CAoQ_AUoAA?biw=1280?bih=872?
> ?
> ? It looks like 35A isn't a common value.
> ?
> ?
> ?
> ? I used to rebuild some vacuum cleaner motors, and sell them back to
> ?the guy who gave them to me as scrap. He was convinced that I had an
> ?armature lathe to clean up the commutators. I used a large ink eraser
> ?to polish the contacts ? a modified Exacto knife blade to undercut the
> ?mica. Drop in a new set of brushes, and maybe a new bearing and they
> ?were ready for another 10 years of reliable service.
>
> Although the local auto parts stores said they did not have them, I went
> to NAPA and asked to see the auto fuses. They had them right there on
> the rack, but not 35A. They had 30A and 40A. I decided to better
> protect the charger, I'd go with the 30A. It's installed, the charger
> works fine on the 2A and 15A settings. I have not yet tried it on the
> 100A setting because there are no really discharged batteries at the
> moment.
>
> Using your link,
> It looks like this one:
> http://www.optifuse.com/Images/acb-h.jpg
>
> 35A does appear to be an oddball size.
>
> The one thing I found a little puzzling was the silver and copper
> colored studs. I didn't know there was a polarity to these, but I
> connected it the same way (colors) as the original one.
>
> I still cant understand how they rate this one at 100A when it only had
> a 35A breaker, I can only assume it's like they rate audio amps. Rather
> than RMS, it's peak. So the charger can put out 100A for a brief amount
> of time when the car is being started. (just a guess).
They are thermal breakers, with a time constant. The 100A mode is
> Although the local auto parts stores said they did not have them, I went
> to NAPA and asked to see the auto fuses. They had them right there on
> the rack, but not 35A. They had 30A and 40A. I decided to better
> protect the charger, I'd go with the 30A. It's installed, the charger
> works fine on the 2A and 15A settings. I have not yet tried it on the
> 100A setting because there are no really discharged batteries at the
> moment.
>
> Using your link,
> It looks like this one:
> http://www.optifuse.com/Images/acb-h.jpg
>
> 35A does appear to be an oddball size.
>
> The one thing I found a little puzzling was the silver and copper
> colored studs. I didn't know there was a polarity to these, but I
> connected it the same way (colors) as the original one.
>
> I still cant understand how they rate this one at 100A when it only had
> a 35A breaker, I can only assume it's like they rate audio amps. Rather
> than RMS, it's peak. So the charger can put out 100A for a brief amount
> of time when the car is being started. (just a guess).
for a quick attempt to start a car with a low battery. The starter
should be run for more than a few seconds at a time. By the time a 100A
breaker would trip, the charger would be damaged, possibly beyond
economical repair.
> Now I'll have to dig out the other 2 or 3 dead battery chargers I got
> laying around, and see if I can fix them. I know for fact that one of
> them needed a breaker, but I could not identify the size and the charger
> is some generic no name brand. I think it's a 10A charger, so I'd guess
> a 10A breaker would work. Since it's winter, now is a good time to fix
> items like this. In warm weather I'm too busy with big projects.
> That's a great idea how to clean up those motor commutators. I've
> rebuilt some motors myself, usually used emory cloth. Motors are not
> that complicated, it's just having the right equipment, particularly of
> the coils need to be rewound. That local idiot got all the equipment
> when another business shut down because the owner retired or died....
> That was before I lived here, but I always hear how nice the original
> owner was, and what an asshole this new guy is.
the armature while it's running at a low speed. I junked the burnt
windings, since I gota lot more motors in than I could ever sell. I
would strip a pile of the same type, and put together as many as I could
with the good parts. My favorites were the 'Lamb Electric' single &
double stage. Very common, and easy to repair. The motors for the
Rainbow paid the best. New motors were $125 so I cound get $50 for a
rebuild that took 15 minutes. Sometimes I rebuilt the one they dropped
off, and I always quotes two hours time to fiux one so they didn't get
too pushy. That way I could do my electronics work, and still have time
to fix one on time. :)
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