PC boards made by APCircuits
rei...@mpi.com
Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
having boards made by APCircuits in Alberta
Canada. I've seen them advertise in several
places and they seem to have very good prices.
Frank Miles
We have had a number of boards made by them. Almost all were perfect.
The only time we had any trouble was when we sent a single ZIP file
containing several different panelized "boards": a combo-A, a combo-B,
a combo-C,... Each combo was itself a set of boards, and smaller than
their panel size. We thought everything was settled, but the final
product had some wrong hole sizes (fortunately recoverable).
The lesson: one ZIP file per panel. They tell us now that you can
include more than one ZIP file together for a single order, and there
will be just one shipping charge.
We are now working on another layout, which we'll have them fab...
-frank
Ross L
On Tue, 24 Jun 1997 11:03:09 -0400, rei...@mpi.com wrote:
> Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
> having boards made by APCircuits in Alberta
> Canada. I've seen them advertise in several
> places and they seem to have very good prices.
I've used their proto-1 service twice. They delivered what
was advertised. No complaints here.
Ysbinns
You wrote:
<Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
having boards made by APCircuits in Alberta
Canada. I've seen them advertise in several
places and they seem to have very good prices.>
Yes, we have used APCircuits for their Proto 1 process. As long as you
read and understand their instructions then you will be satisfied,
especially for the price. Don't send any drawings or special notes cuz
it's not included in the pricing. Make sure all mounting holes are in your
drill table. Don't expect any solder mask. Also, if you include crop marks
they will cut to the outside, not the inside. And make sure you use their
"free drill sizes" as found on their website.
Our double-sided plated thru boards were fine and very useable. The boards
consist of RF, analog, digital, thru-hole and SMD.
Yvonne and Steve
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Y&S PCB Designs YESPCB...@usa.net
Williamston, Mi http://members.aol.com/ysbinns
****** Over 25 years experience in Printed Circuit Board Design ******
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Richard Gaupsas
Joel W. Kolstad
>[Someone wrote]:
> <Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
> <having boards made by APCircuits in Alberta
> <Canada. I've seen them advertise in several
> <places and they seem to have very good prices.>
>
boards
> consist of RF, analog, digital, thru-hole and SMD.
I second Y&S's recommendation; we've used APC several times and the boards
turned out just fine. I feel a little odd never actually having talked to
a human being up there, but what the hey... you send them the files, you
get a FedEx envelope back three days later.
We tend to use APC for, uh... "patch" boards :-) (as they don't need
silkscreens and soldermasks, etc. since patching is a manual process
anyway).
---Joel Kolstad
Marshall Jose
Ysbinns wrote:
>
>
>> Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
>
> Yes, we have used APCircuits for their Proto 1 process. As long as you
> read and understand their instructions then you will be satisfied,
> especially for the price.
Agreed. APC delivers what they claim for a very good price. However,
they have gone to a lot of trouble to provide instructions and help, and
you will likely be disappointed or delayed if you ignore it.
Anyone who's had a PCB made will tell you how difficult it is getting
things "done right the first time". Apparently, APC is able to pull it
off with regularity.
--
Marshall Jose, WA3VPZ
Johns Hopkins Univ. Applied Physics Lab. 301-953-5000 X4367
Tom Loredo
Hi-
I've used them twice, and the boards were excellent. One order
was 3 or 4 boards, panelized, and there was no problem; but I
sent it as a GCPREVUE file with all the offsets already
set. My version of ULTIboard even had the drill files somewhat
screwed up (different offset from the boards), but I specified
the offset via GCPREVUE, and the boards came out fine.
My only gripe is that the times given on their web site are
slightly deceptive if you submit your projects via ftp. They
give a deadline, but it's the deadline for them to receive
the boards, not the deadline for you to ftp them. Their
ISP sends them the downloads at regular intervals. My boards
didn't show up at AP until several hours after I uploaded them.
Thus they were delayed, one of them over a weekend. This
really screwed me because of an impending deadline, and I wish
they had more detailed info on this at the web site. If you
really need the board fast, make sure you upload it at least
an hour or two before their stated deadline.
If you use a modem and send them the file directly, I don't
think you'll have this problem.
Otherwise, highly recommended.
Followup question: You've got the prototype working, and now
want to produce ~100 boards to sell in kits. Who do you use
for *this*?
Peace,
-Tom Loredo
Carlos Hidalgo
>In article <33AFE1AD.34BE#mpi.com>, <rei...@mpi.com> wrote:
>Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
>Canada. I've seen them advertise in several
>places and they seem to have very good prices.
I have had 6 or 7 sets of boards done by them over the last 4 years or
so. They have consistently reduced their turn-around time (and prices,
I think), and the boards I have received back have been very well made.
Some of the boards had surface mount parts on them, as well as through
hole. Of course without solder mask per their proto1 service, but great
for hand assembled prototypes. I haven't used their more complete
proto2 service complete with solder mask, silk screen, etc., but it's
hard to beat their 2-day turn for about $100 US or whatever the current
price is. I just sent a board to them yesterday evening - I expect to
have them here on Friday.
By the way, they'll be closed from Sat 6/28 through 7/6 I think.
---
ş OLXWin 1.00a ş
_ _
|_|_| PC-OHIO Interactive * 216-381-3320 * telnet://bbs.pcohio.net
|_|_| Combining The Best BBS & The Web at http://www.pcohio.com
Frank Bures
On Tue, 24 Jun 1997 11:03:09 -0400, rei...@mpi.com wrote:
>Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
>having boards made by APCircuits in Alberta
>Canada. I've seen them advertise in several
>places and they seem to have very good prices.
I have used them for more than a year. Received more than 20 different boards -
prototype style (no silkscreens). Excellent job. Absolutely no complaints.
Frank Bures, Dept. of Chemistry, University of Toronto, M5S 3H6
fbu...@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (use this address for replies)
Roger Arrick
In <beamvlgoma...@frank.chem.utoronto.ca> "Frank Bures"
<fbures@alchemy_chem~utoronto~ca> writes:
>
>On Tue, 24 Jun 1997 11:03:09 -0400, rei...@mpi.com wrote:
>
>>Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
>>having boards made by APCircuits in Alberta
>>Canada. I've seen them advertise in several
>>places and they seem to have very good prices.
>
>I have used them for more than a year. Received more than 20 different
boards -
>prototype style (no silkscreens). Excellent job. Absolutely no
complaints.
Does APC pay for these comments? Where do I sign up? :)
Roger.
--
/--------------------------/---------------------------/
/ Roger Arrick / Arrick Robotics /
/ ro...@robotics.com / P.O. Box 1574 /
/ Ph: (817) 571-4528 / Hurst, Texas 76053 USA /
/ fax: (817) 571-2317 / http://www.robotics.com /
/--------------------------/---------------------------/
"Talk" is inversely proportional to "do"
Frank Bures
On 26 Jun 1997 03:15:58 GMT, Roger Arrick wrote:
In <beamvlgoma...@frank.chem.utoronto.ca> "Frank Bures"
<fbures@alchemy_chem~utoronto~ca> writes:
>
>On Tue, 24 Jun 1997 11:03:09 -0400, rei...@mpi.com wrote:
>
>>Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
>>having boards made by APCircuits in Alberta
>>Canada. I've seen them advertise in several
>>places and they seem to have very good prices.
>
>I have used them for more than a year. Received more than 20 different
boards -
>prototype style (no silkscreens). Excellent job. Absolutely no
complaints.
Does APC pay for these comments? Where do I sign up? :)
Yeap, they've paid by doing good job. Something, that's becoming scarcer each
day...
R. Christopher Lott
>Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
>having boards made by APCircuits in Alberta
>Canada. I've seen them advertise in several
>places and they seem to have very good prices.
We have had mostly good experiences with them, so I must echo the sentiments of
the previous responses. However, we had one board recently where the exact size
of the hole was critical, as it was used for some press-fit pins. It took us
about three iterations to get it right, even though we followed the rules in
the instructions to the letter. The crux of the problem was that we selected
the drill size from the table he provides, and added the plating thickness
he specifies to obtain the finished hole diameter. For whatever reason, he
decided to arbitrarily go up to the next drill size, which made our holes
useless, and thus we had to scrap the board. This went on for a couple of
iterations before we got it right. In our conversations with them, we were
astonished that they didn't seem to grasp the concept of hole size tolerances.
In the end, he still didn't use the drill we specified, but instead went out
and purchased a special millimeter sized bit. But it worked, so we didn't
complain further. Just be careful if you have press-fit pins, and need a tight
tolerance on your pins. Specifying the finished hole size doesn't seem to do
the trick like it would at a regualr PWB shop - you have to consider his drill
sizes and his plating process.
Regarding the comment on cropping the boards, I noticed they leave a liberal
amount of excess board, even in excess of the outside of the crop marks. We
typically have to mill or sand down the edges of the boards to their desired
dimensions.
Aside from these comments, we haven't had any trouble with the boards we have
bought from them, and would recommend them as a good quick proto shop.
Greg Raley
rei...@mpi.com wrote:
>
> Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
> having boards made by APCircuits in Alberta
> Canada. I've seen them advertise in several
> places and they seem to have very good prices.
From previous posts and my limited contact with APCircuits, it seems they do a good job
at a very good price by following a rigid process. If that works for you, then great.
But it's not necessarily the best choice for everyone.
When I was a designer, I used prototypes to try to find all sorts of problems.
(Including assembly and marking errors, so I always used soldermask and silkscreen on
prototypes.) I found it was worthwhile to use what I would call a full-service board
house. They did a great job inspecting the artwork, drill files, and drawings for
inconsistencies, fabrication problems, and anything that looked funny. On several
occasions they found errors before the prototypes were even fabricated. Well worth the
money from my perspective.
Sincerely,
Greg Raley
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voice: (301) 540-6280 fax: (301) 540-6281
toll-free in USA: (888) sage-eda (888-724-3332)
Boris Mohar
On Tue, 24 Jun 1997 11:03:09 -0400, rei...@mpi.com wrote:
>Has anyone had either good or bad experiences
>having boards made by APCircuits in Alberta
>Canada. I've seen them advertise in several
>places and they seem to have very good prices.
Look up some recent threads on this NG
Regards
Boris Mohar
VIATRACK printed circuit designs
AbdulraHman Lomax
rcl...@ro.com (R. Christopher Lott) wrote:
>We have had mostly good experiences with them, so I must echo the sentiments of
>the previous responses. However, we had one board recently where the exact size
>of the hole was critical, as it was used for some press-fit pins. It took us
>about three iterations to get it right, even though we followed the rules in
>the instructions to the letter. The crux of the problem was that we selected
>the drill size from the table he provides, and added the plating thickness
>he specifies to obtain the finished hole diameter. For whatever reason, he
>decided to arbitrarily go up to the next drill size, which made our holes
>useless, and thus we had to scrap the board.
This sounds to me like the sizes that they suggest as their standard
holes are "finished" sizes, not "drill" sizes. Easy to get confused
about that if it is not clearly specified. The difference is, of
course, that the drill sizes are larger than the finished sizes by
twice the thickness of the hole plating. For 1 oz plate-up, that would
be about 3 mils.
>This went on for a couple of
>iterations before we got it right. In our conversations with them, we were
>astonished that they didn't seem to grasp the concept of hole size tolerances.
>In the end, he still didn't use the drill we specified, but instead went out
>and purchased a special millimeter sized bit. But it worked, so we didn't
>complain further. Just be careful if you have press-fit pins, and need a tight
>tolerance on your pins. Specifying the finished hole size doesn't seem to do
>the trick like it would at a regualr PWB shop - you have to consider his drill
>sizes and his plating process.
I have not seen the AP specifications and limitations on drill sizes.
I would hope that they specify *finished* sizes, which is what nearly
everone deals with on fab drawings. If so, we should not have to think
about drill sizes unless we want some special size, and in that case
we should *still* specify finished size and let the fabricator pick
the drill. If we know the process, we might make it easy by picking a
finished size that is easy to fab....
On the other hand, I would not expect a proto shop to be all that
ready to deal with special considerations.
AbdulraHman Lomax
abdul...@worldnet.att.net
P.O. Box 10316
San Rafael, CA 94912