why does God allow disease etc.
(David P.)
Subject: Re: why does God allow disease etc.
Date: 1998/04/02
Newsgroups: alt.religion.mormon.fellowship
God for the most part lets nature run its course. This means; because
of the
existence of good germs, there might arise bad germs too.
Allowing them to arise...
In his compassion for us; God gives us instruction from the prophets
to help
the righteous avoid these things. For example, the Word of Wisdom,
Noah
being instructed in a dream to build the Ark, Lehi being instructed
likewise
to leave Jerusalem before it being sacked by the Babylonians...
In his compassion he also delegates His divine authority to us to deal
with
these things. This is called the "Priesthood". If it were not for all
these
illnesses and natural disasters, there would be little opportunity for
us to
use this tool which he has given to us; and we would not grow
spiritually.
If there were not trials and setbacks in this life, there would be
little
need for exercising faith in our God, and it would be no test.
We came to earth to:
(i) Be tested,
(ii) Gain physical bodies,
(iii) Grow spiritually through tests of character; and the inspiration
of
the Holy Ghost.
Those germs are there for our good. Sometimes they overcome us and
even kill
us, but this is only a temporary victory for "Death" - our families
can be
reunited and our bodies will be resurrected without corruption. It is
to
serve our longer term good that He allows these things to happen to
us.
When we go camping in the hills with virtually nothing but ourselves,
a
tent, the sky above us; and then we come home again, we really
appreciate a
nice warm bed, shower, house...
Without the illness; we could never appreciate the blessing of good
health.
Without sadness and pain, ignorance and darkness; there is not
happiness and
comfort, knowledge and light. (See also 2 Nephi 2:)
Eventually the earth will be perfected and there will be no more
disease and
suffering, earthquakes or hurricanes; it will become as heaven. We
should
act as stewards over what God has blessed us with, and He will give us
stewardship in that heaven.
Matthew Slyman
.
.
--
beelzibub
b
ps;
were you born ass first?
habshi
Ken Johnson
> We came to earth to:
> (i) Be tested,
> (ii) Gain physical bodies,
> (iii) Grow spiritually through tests of character; and the
> inspiration of the Holy Ghost.
(iv) carry a dildo and a bottle of baby oil and hang out with boys
Ken Johnson
p.s. What is it that drives Christians to post this sort of tripe?
euclid
> p.s. What is it that drives Christians to post this sort of tripe?
Demonic possession.
euclid
Truly
Les Cargill
That's okay. Pagans are driven by eudaemonic possession.
--
Les Cargill
beelzibub
> euclid wrote:
>> On May 9, 11:59 pm, Ken Johnson <k.r.john...@excite.com> wrote:
>>
>>> p.s. What is it that drives Christians to post this sort of tripe?
... a keyboard and a lot of free time
b
(David P.)
> euclidean geometer wrote:
> > Ken-Jo <ken...@excite.com> wrote:
>
> >> What drives Xtians to post this tripe?
>
> > Demonic possession.
>
> That's ok. Pagans drive by eudaemonic possession.
There Is No Death
There is no death. The stars go down
To rise upon another shore,
And bright in heaven's jeweled crown
They shine forevermore.
There is no death. The forest leaves
Convert to life the viewless air;
The rocks disorganize to feed
The hungry moss they bear.
There is no death. The dust we tread
Shall change beneath the summer showers
To golden grain or mellow fruit,
Or rainbow tinted flowers.
There is no death. The leaves may fall,
The flowers may fade and pass away--
They only wait through wintry hours
The warm, sweet breath of May.
There is no death, although we grieve
When beautiful familiar forms
That we have learned to love are torn
From our embracing arms.
Although with bowed and breaking heart.
With sable garb and silent tread,
We bear their senseless dust to rest,
And say that they are dead--
They are not dead. They have but passed
Beyond the mists that blind us here,
Into the new and larger life
Of that serener sphere.
They have but dropped their robe of clay
To put a shining raiment on;
They have not wandered far away,
They are not "lost" or "gone."
Though unseen to the mortal eye,
They still are here and love us yet;
The dear ones they have left behind
They never do forget.
Sometimes upon our fevered brow
We feel their touch, a breath of balm:
Our spirit sees them, and our hearts
Grow comforted and calm.
Yes, ever near us, though unseen,
Our dear, immortal spirits tread--
For all God's boundless Universe
Is Life--there are no dead.
-- John McCreery
.
.
--
ironjustice
does God allow disease <<
What would be your .. move.
In HIs .. place.
As an analogy.
WHAT would YOU .. do .. ?
Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh
Man Is A Herbivore!
http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3
DEAD PEOPLE WALKING
http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
ironjustice
Is No Death <<
???
Most everyone has witnessed this ..
This is wrong ..
Death .. happens .. in .. I might add .. varying degrees of ..
violence.
Quite the poem ..
Are you a .. mystic .. ?
Is that what it's supposed to mean .. ?
Give us a bit of your background ..
Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh
Man Is A Herbivore!
http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3
DEAD PEOPLE WALKING
http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
> Clutch Cargo <cca...@cfl.rr.com> wrote:
(David P.)
> "(David P.)" <imb...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> > why does God allow disease <<
>
> What would be your .. move.
> In HIs .. place.
> As an analogy.
> WHAT would YOU .. do .. ?
He allows disease because the big picture
*AIN'T* _JUST US_, _RIGHT NOW_! There are
FUTURE GENERATIONS in the picture, too!
.
.
--
zzbu...@netscape.net
> From: "Matthew Slyman" <ma...@hermes.cam.ac.uk>
> Subject: Re: why does God allow disease etc.
> Date: 1998/04/02
> Newsgroups: alt.religion.mormon.fellowship
>
> God for the most part lets nature run its course. This means; because
> of the
> existence of good germs, there might arise bad germs too.
Germs were created for the ineducable.
For those with higher forms of intelligence, robots were
soon to be developed.
For those with civilizations more advanced than
Noah flood-forecasting, GPS was soon to be.
For those imaginations that transcend sheepdip,,
microwave ovens were soon to be.
And for those with post 3000 BC, articulated verbs,
Lasers were also soon to be.
ironjustice
allows disease because the big picture
*AIN'T* _JUST US_, _RIGHT NOW_! There are
FUTURE GENERATIONS in the picture, too! <<
So it's population control ..?
Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh
Man Is A Herbivore!
http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3
DEAD PEOPLE WALKING
http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
> ironjustice <teamtan...@hotmail.com> wrote:
(David P.)
> "(David P.)" <imb...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> > He allows disease because the big picture
> > *AIN'T* _JUST US_, _RIGHT NOW_! There are
> > FUTURE GENERATIONS in the picture, too!
>
> So it's population control ..?
Limited longevity ..?
.
.
--
ironjustice
Limited longevity ..? <<
I take it then your .. 'take' on .. 'it' / "why disease" .. is .. "I'm
really not sure" ..
Am I right .. ?
How about this scenario.
Two brothers .. fathered by the same man .. loved as much .. no less
than each other BY the .. father.
One decides he is Hannibal Lechter.
He decides to kill and eat his brother.
He has been told repeatedly this is wrong.
He does it anyway.
The problem being this killing and eating of his brother is what
brings disease into the world.
Disease not brought BY the father but by killing and eating your
brother.
Do you DESERVE to have a very painful disease as payment for killing
and eating your brother?
Is it a righteous .. repayment .. for this indiscretion .. ?
Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh
Man Is A Herbivore!
http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3
DEAD PEOPLE WALKING
http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh
Man Is A Herbivore!
http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3
DEAD PEOPLE WALKING
http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
> ironjustice <teamtan...@hotmail.com> wrote:
euclid
> There is no death. The stars go down
> To rise upon another shore,
> And bright in heaven's jeweled crown
> They shine forevermore.
Until they go supernova and leave a blackhole in their place.
euclid
Does it help to think of a blackhole as a zombie star?
ironjustice
a righteous .. repayment .. for this indiscretion .. ? <<
I forgot the amendment ..
Actually not really an amendment .. just forgot the .. disclosure ..
But you have to actually read the whole document and you have to learn
the meaning of many words in order to understand the document to
actually find this disclosure.
Most people hire a lawyer to read this contract because it is really
very hard to understand unless one is well read.
The disclosure being .. "WHEN this indiscretion IS recognized and
corrected the disease will be forgiven."
Now here is where interpretation / meaning of words / lawyer comes in.
I think "forgiven" means the disease will be cured.
In MY hypothesis IS the disease cured .. ?
Yes ..
In anyone elses hypothesis is the disease cured ?
No ..
I rest my case.
Who loves ya.
Tom
> DEAD PEOPLE WALKINGhttp://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
>
> Who loves ya.
> Tom
>
> Jesus Was A Vegetarian!http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh
>
> Man Is A Herbivore!http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3
>
> DEAD PEOPLE WALKINGhttp://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
>
>
>
> > ironjustice <teamtan...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > "(David P.)" <imb...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> > > > He allows disease because the big picture
> > > > *AIN'T* _JUST US_, _RIGHT NOW_! There are
> > > > FUTURE GENERATIONS in the picture, too!
>
> > > So it's population control ..?
>
> > Limited longevity ..?
> > .
> > .
> > --- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
mariposas rand mair fheal
euclid <eucl...@mailandnews.com> wrote:
> On May 12, 2:06 pm, "(David P.)" <imb...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> > There is no death. The stars go down
> > To rise upon another shore,
> > And bright in heaven's jeweled crown
> > They shine forevermore.
>
> Until they go supernova and leave a blackhole in their place.
only for massive stars
main sequence starts like ours usually become white dwarfs
> Does it help to think of a blackhole as a zombie star?
sucking brains out of the universe
arf meow arf - everything thing i know i learned
from the collective unconscience of odd bodkins
sacramento - political pigsty of the western world
or a babys arm holding an apple
ironj...@aol.com
hypothesis IS the disease cured .. ? Yes .. <<
"NAFLD may be present to some extent in just about everybody and
phlebotomy offers a safe and efficient therapy"
American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, Vol. 87, No. 5, 1374-1383,
May
2008
© 2008 American Society for Nutrition
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ORIGINAL RESEARCH COMMUNICATION
Pathways underlying iron accumulation in human nonalcoholic fatty
liver disease1,2,3
Elmar Aigner, Igor Theurl, Milan Theurl, Dieter Lederer, Heike Haufe,
Otto Dietze, Michael Strasser, Christian Datz and Guenter Weiss
1 From the Department of Internal Medicine, General Hospital
Oberndorf, Oberndorf, Austria (EA, DL, and CD); the Department of
General Internal Medicine, Department of Immunology and Infectious
Diseases, Medical University of Innsbruck, Austria (IT, MT, and GW);
the Department of Pathology (HH and OD) and the First Department of
Medicine (MS), Paracelsus Private Medical University Salzburg,
Austria
Background: Mild iron overload is frequently observed in nonalcoholic
fatty liver disease (NAFLD).
Objective: We aimed to study putative pathways underlying iron
accumulation in NAFLD.
Design: Hepatic and duodenal expression of critical iron molecules in
NAFLD patients with (n = 32) and without (n = 29) iron overload,
hereditary hemochromatosis (n = 10), and controls (n = 20) were
investigated. Phlebotomy treatment was performed in 14 NAFLD
patients.
Results: The hepatic expressions of the iron-export protein
ferroportin-1 (FP-1) and of the iron-sensing molecule hemojuvelin
(HJV) were significantly lower in NAFLD patients. The mRNA expression
of the iron-regulatory peptide hepcidin was increased in NAFLD
patients with iron overload, which was paralleled by low duodenal
FP-1
expression. Hepatic mRNA and serum protein concentrations of tumor
necrosis factor- (TNF-) were increased in NAFLD patients and were
inversely correlated with both liver FP-1 and HJV mRNA and positively
associated with body mass index and hepatic hepcidin mRNA.
Accordingly, TNF- inhibited the FP-1 and HJV mRNA formation in HepG2
cells. Phlebotomy treatment of NALFD patients reduced serum ferritin,
transferrin saturation, and TNF- concentrations and improved liver
function tests.
Conclusions: Iron accumulation in NAFLD may result from an impaired
iron export due to down-regulation of FP1 and ineffective hepatic
iron
sensing, as indicated by low HJV expression. TNF- appears to play a
role in exerting these regulatory changes. Increased hepcidin
formation in iron-overloaded NAFLD patients, however, results in
decreased duodenal FP-1 expression, whereas a reduction in liver FP-1
may perpetuate hepatic iron retention. Phlebotomy offers a safe and
efficient therapy for these metabolic disturbances.
-----------
NAFLD may be present to some extent in "just about everybody."
http://care.diabetesjournals.org/cgi/content/full/26/4/1297
Who loves ya.
Tom
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
euclid
wrote:
> In article <c56bec0e-2de7-4748-9ce7-d1ce1cd10...@a23g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>,
>
> euclid <eucli...@mailandnews.com> wrote:
> > Until they go supernova and leave a blackhole in their place.
>
> only for massive stars
> main sequence starts like ours usually become white dwarfs
I know. But then even white dwarfs eventually stop radiating even
thermal energy, apparently.
http://www.enchantedlearning.com/subjects/astronomy/stars/lifecycle/sunlike.shtml
euclid
mariposas rand mair fheal
euclid <eucl...@mailandnews.com> wrote:
> On May 13, 10:47 am, mariposas rand mair fheal <mair_fh...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
> > In article
> > <c56bec0e-2de7-4748-9ce7-d1ce1cd10...@a23g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>,
> >
> > euclid <eucli...@mailandnews.com> wrote:
>
> > > Until they go supernova and leave a blackhole in their place.
> >
> > only for massive stars
> > main sequence starts like ours usually become white dwarfs
>
> I know. But then even white dwarfs eventually stop radiating even
> thermal energy, apparently.
it depends if the universe is open or closed
if it is closed the universe will collapse before they cool down
if it open eventually all black holes evaporate
and all neutron stars and dwarves go black as the universe freezes up
euclid
wrote:
> In article <7a0b9eb5-0113-49a6-aaa4-70e5ddd66...@d1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>,
>
> euclid <eucli...@mailandnews.com> wrote:
> > I know. But then even white dwarfs eventually stop radiating even
> > thermal energy, apparently.
>
> it depends if the universe is open or closed
>
> if it is closed the universe will collapse before they cool down
In which case *everything* qualifies as having died at that point.
> if it open eventually all black holes evaporate
> and all neutron stars and dwarves go black as the universe freezes up
Cite your source, please.
euclid
beelzibub
b
this post sponsore by the koalas of new zealand
(David P.)
>
> then your 'take' is "I'm really not sure"?
It would be more equitable having each
individual fight the flu, rather than
having armies fight each other over land,
food, fuel, clean air & clean water.
By stopping the suppression of influenza,
everyone would be on the front lines,
instead of just a few good men!
.
.
--
euclid
> ... heaven is full. you're going straight to hell
Birrrrrd!
euclid
ironj...@aol.com
would be more equitable having each individual fight the flu, rather
than having armies fight <<
I kinda wonder whether a person either having a disease or they "will
go to war" .. is kinda a roll of the dice .. ?
You have alot more options than going to war.
On May 13, 8:44 pm, "(David P.)" <imb...@mindspring.com> wrote: armies
fight each other over land, food, fuel, clean air & clean water <<
I might be tempted to go to war over all of the above .. too.
I've seen the other side .. and it is not easy .. it is very .. hard.
On May 13, 8:44 pm, "(David P.)" <imb...@mindspring.com> wrote: By
stopping the suppression of influenza, everyone would be on the front
lines, instead of just a few good men! <<
Again .. there are more options IF a person is not sick than just
going to war ..
Sick encompasses alot more than a simple heavy cold .. too.
What about .. those .. ?
Remember YOU are the .. dad.
EVERYONE on Earth is supposed to be His .. **only** .. child.
Now as a .. dad .. WHAT could your son or daughter have .. done .. to
**deserve** .. to die in some ditch like some piece of trash .. of a
disease ..
Would have to be something pretty .. bad ..
Don't you think .. ?
Deserves to die like a slug because other people dig going to war .. ?
Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh
Man Is A Herbivore!
http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3
DEAD PEOPLE WALKING
http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
Ken Johnson
> ... heaven is full. you're going straight to hell
>
> b
> this post sponsore by the koalas of new zealand
Things could be worse. See http://handcartride.blogspot.com/2007/12/hell-and-highwater.html
Ken Johnson
beelzibub
... this here's a story bout a man named jed, poor mountaineer, barely
kept his family fed. then onw day he was shooting at some food and up
frum the ground cum a bubblin' crude ...
b
ironjustice
DESERVE to have a very painful disease as payment for killing
and eating your brother? <<
How about shortening the life of those that .. kill .. ?
"Restriction of iron may have positive effects on health in general
and aging in particular"
Galaris D, Mantzaris M, Amorgianiotis C
Oxidative stress and aging: the potential role of iron. [Journal
Article]
Hormones (Athens) 2008 Apr-Jun; 7(2):114-22.
According to the free radical theory of aging proposed by Denham
Harman more than 50 years ago, oxidatively modified cellular
components accumulate continuously in the cells during the organism's
lifespan leading to progressive decline of cellular functions. Since
then, it has been shown that proteins, lipids, nucleic acids and
other
cell components undergo reversible and/or irreversible oxidative
modifications during aging. Moreover, oxidized cell components can
undergo further oxidative modifications leading to formation of
products that cell degradation systems are incapable of removing.
Accumulation of such non-degradable aggregates further inhibits the
functionality of degradation systems, thus aggravating the effects
and
leading to a vicious cycle. In this presentation, we propose that the
availability of intracellular iron in its redox active form (labile
iron) represents the main catalyst that mediates extensive oxidative
modifications of cellular components and ultimately leads to their
accumulation and consequent cellular dysfunction. It is tempting to
speculate that regulated restriction of labile iron may have positive
effects on health in general and aging in particular.
Hormones (Athens, Greece) [Hormones (Athens)]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Who loves ya.
Tom
> Jesus Was A Vegetarian!http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh
>
> Man Is A Herbivore!http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3
>
> DEAD PEOPLE WALKINGhttp://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
>
> Who loves ya.
> Tom
>
> Jesus Was A Vegetarian!http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh
>
> Man Is A Herbivore!http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3
>
> DEAD PEOPLE WALKINGhttp://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
>
>
>
> > ironjustice <teamtan...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > "(David P.)" <imb...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> > > > He allows disease because the big picture
> > > > *AIN'T* _JUST US_, _RIGHT NOW_! There are
> > > > FUTURE GENERATIONS in the picture, too!
>
> > > So it's population control ..?
>
> > Limited longevity ..?
> > .
> > .