indelible dye to catch a thief
John Savage
so I'm now trying wider afield. The local pharmacist has been
no help. As a last resort, I'd try silver nitrate or KI-I soln,
if my memory of junior high chem is correct; but there must
be more penetrative finger stains than those, perhaps some of
those used in microbiology?
An acquaintance is having trouble with a light-fingered employee.
We have examined the situation, and decided that the best way of
determining which staff member is helping himself to stock is to
dust some of the targetted item with indelible dye--if we can get
some. The substance that banks use in the dye bomb they sometimes
pop into a thief's bag along with the money would be what we need,
as the stock item that is disappearing is something that general
staff have no call to be handling. Ever.
Can someone nominate the name of a suitable stain? I imagine that
we would need no more than 1/4 of a teaspoonful, as a little bit
goes such a loooooooooooooooooooooong way.
BTW, I knew of a bank employee who had the misfortune to be holding
a dye bomb when it went off. For weeks after, he was a vivid purple
colour, ended up having a nervous breakdown and never worked again.
--
John Savage (for email, replace "ks" with "k" and delete "n")
Marvin Margoshes
possiblity is the fluorescent dye, fluorescein. One use for it is for
tracing water links, so you may be able to get it at a plumbing supply
store. You'll also want a blacklight fluorescent lamp to make it glow.
John Savage wrote in message
<990203000060431.03Feb99$rook...@suburbian.com>...
DAT
where you would find it, possibly a local school or university.
<snip>
> >An acquaintance is having trouble with a light-fingered employee.
> >We have examined the situation, and decided that the best way of
> >determining which staff member is helping himself to stock is to
> >dust some of the targetted item with indelible dye--if we can get
> >some. The substance that banks use in the dye bomb they sometimes
> >pop into a thief's bag along with the money would be what we need,
> >as the stock item that is disappearing is something that general
> >staff have no call to be handling. Ever.
<snip>
luke
pixie dust (really thats the name) or check the Internet under spy shops
Marvin Margoshes wrote in message
<797io1$mr5$1...@birch.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...
>I think you want something that won't be noticed by the thief. One
>possiblity is the fluorescent dye, fluorescein. One use for it is for
>tracing water links, so you may be able to get it at a plumbing supply
>store. You'll also want a blacklight fluorescent lamp to make it glow.
>
>John Savage wrote in message
><990203000060431.03Feb99$rook...@suburbian.com>...
>> Earlier I posted this to a local group, but had no response,
>> so I'm now trying wider afield. The local pharmacist has been
>> no help. As a last resort, I'd try silver nitrate or KI-I soln,
>> if my memory of junior high chem is correct; but there must
>> be more penetrative finger stains than those, perhaps some of
>> those used in microbiology?
>>
>>
>>We have examined the situation, and decided that the best way of
>>determining which staff member is helping himself to stock is to
>>dust some of the targetted item with indelible dye--if we can get
>>some. The substance that banks use in the dye bomb they sometimes
>>pop into a thief's bag along with the money would be what we need,
>>as the stock item that is disappearing is something that general
>>staff have no call to be handling. Ever.
>>
Rich Lemert
>
> Earlier I posted this to a local group, but had no response,
> so I'm now trying wider afield. The local pharmacist has been
> no help. As a last resort, I'd try silver nitrate or KI-I soln,
> if my memory of junior high chem is correct; but there must
> be more penetrative finger stains than those, perhaps some of
> those used in microbiology?
>
> An acquaintance is having trouble with a light-fingered employee.
> We have examined the situation, and decided that the best way of
> determining which staff member is helping himself to stock is to
> dust some of the targetted item with indelible dye--if we can get
> some. The substance that banks use in the dye bomb they sometimes
> pop into a thief's bag along with the money would be what we need,
> as the stock item that is disappearing is something that general
> staff have no call to be handling. Ever.
>
> Can someone nominate the name of a suitable stain? I imagine that
> we would need no more than 1/4 of a teaspoonful, as a little bit
> goes such a loooooooooooooooooooooong way.
Others with a stronger biochem background can probably correct
me or point out hazards of which I am unaware, but I seem to
remember that ninhydrin could be used for this. It's used to analyze
amino acids colorimetrically, and my understanding is that it starts
out colorless on your fingers, but the reaction "self-develops" from
your body heat to give an indelible (since it's reacting with the
proteins in your skin), vividly colored stain. However, don't take
my suggestion without contacting those more expert in the field.
Rich Lemert
Uncle Al
>
> Earlier I posted this to a local group, but had no response,
> so I'm now trying wider afield. The local pharmacist has been
> no help. As a last resort, I'd try silver nitrate or KI-I soln,
> if my memory of junior high chem is correct; but there must
> be more penetrative finger stains than those, perhaps some of
> those used in microbiology?
>
> An acquaintance is having trouble with a light-fingered employee.
> We have examined the situation, and decided that the best way of
> determining which staff member is helping himself to stock is to
> dust some of the targetted item with indelible dye--if we can get
> some. The substance that banks use in the dye bomb they sometimes
> pop into a thief's bag along with the money would be what we need,
> as the stock item that is disappearing is something that general
> staff have no call to be handling. Ever.
>
> Can someone nominate the name of a suitable stain? I imagine that
> we would need no more than 1/4 of a teaspoonful, as a little bit
> goes such a loooooooooooooooooooooong way.
>
> a dye bomb when it went off. For weeks after, he was a vivid purple
> colour, ended up having a nervous breakdown and never worked again.
> --
> John Savage (for email, replace "ks" with "k" and delete "n")
The problem with a visible dye is that it is visible. Something
colorless like silver nitrate will contaminate everything it touches,
leading to very unhappy customers.
Subtlety, my boy, subtlety. Your average TLC plate is silica gel, a bit
of plaster of Paris to bind it, and some copper-doped ZnS to glow green
under 254 nm UV irradiation. Laundry brightners are white and glow
violently under blacklight (354 nm). Anthracene, pyrene, stilbene,
fluoranthene, PPO (2,5-diphenyloxazole), POPOP
(1,4-bis(5-phenyloxazole-2-yl)benzene)... are all innocuous mostly white
powders that violently fluoresce under blacklight.
Procion, Remazol, and Cibacron (reactive) dyes are indelible short of
wearing away the skin they bond to. Also fluorescein isothiocyanate or
Lucifer Yellow VS. http://www.probes.com/
Indanetrione hydrate (ninhydrin) - goes on white, turns blue.
Go natural: macerated henna (mehndi; lawsone, requires pH 5.5 and
moisture; 24 hours to develop). Powdered indigo (requires local
reducing agent; devlopment is by oxidation). Powdered madder toot
(alizarin; which made the British such splended targets for American
squirrel hunters). Raw walnut husks (juglone; also requires slightly
acidic buffering).
Crystal Violet. That will make a mess to remember.
--
Uncle Al Schwartz
NEW!!! Uncl...@earthlink.net ("zero" before @)
http://uncleal.within.net/
http://pages.hotbot.com/humor/uncleal/
http://home.earthlink.net/~uncleal0/uncleal.htm
http://www.ultra.net.au/~wisby/uncleal.htm
http://www.guyy.demon.co.uk/uncleal/uncleal.htm
(Toxic URLs! Unsafe for children, Democrats, and most mammals)
"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?" The Net!
gmacbeth
> Earlier I posted this to a local group, but had no response,
> so I'm now trying wider afield. The local pharmacist has been
> no help. As a last resort, I'd try silver nitrate or KI-I soln,
> if my memory of junior high chem is correct; but there must
> be more penetrative finger stains than those, perhaps some of
> those used in microbiology?
>An acquaintance is having trouble with a light-fingered employee.
>We have examined the situation, and decided that the best way of
>determining which staff member is helping himself to stock is to
>dust some of the targetted item with indelible dye--if we can get
>some. The substance that banks use in the dye bomb they sometimes
>pop into a thief's bag along with the money would be what we need,
>as the stock item that is disappearing is something that general
>staff have no call to be handling. Ever.
>Can someone nominate the name of a suitable stain? I imagine that
>we would need no more than 1/4 of a teaspoonful, as a little bit
>goes such a loooooooooooooooooooooong way.
Crystal violet - stains beautifully - and permanantly (skin has to wear off).
Only catch - it's not all that staining in it's powdered form, as I recall.
Can the item in question be slightly damp? I doubt if this stuff is at your
local drug store, though. Maybe fabric dye as an alternative?
>BTW, I knew of a bank employee who had the misfortune to be holding
>a dye bomb when it went off. For weeks after, he was a vivid purple
>colour, ended up having a nervous breakdown and never worked again.
Yup - sounds like crystal violet. It's one of the dyes (the key one) used in
the Gram stain for bacteria. Eukaryotic cells (including ours) stain purple.
Cheap, fairly harmless (used to dye first year engineers around here) and
irreversible. Wear gloves. If your thief is smart enough to wear them too,
none of this will work.
Fluorescent stains would also work well, but it's in too many things -
the employee could simply say that they were working with a leaky highlighter
pen. Same things can apply to iodine or silver nitrate. As it is, I doubt that
the dye will stand up to a defense lawyer - videotape is better evidence and
works even if the employee wears gloves (or is innocent and is taking a
microbiology lab. Or has a thing for purple Kool-aid. Or picked the item up
by mistake then put it back. It's probably cheaper to hire a security company
to tape the thief than it is to deal with a wrongful dismissal suit). JMHO
"GM"
Chri...@mithrandir.demon.co.uk
wrote:
> Earlier I posted this to a local group, but had no response,
> so I'm now trying wider afield. The local pharmacist has been
> no help. As a last resort, I'd try silver nitrate or KI-I soln,
> if my memory of junior high chem is correct; but there must
> be more penetrative finger stains than those, perhaps some of
> those used in microbiology?
>
>
>An acquaintance is having trouble with a light-fingered employee.
>We have examined the situation, and decided that the best way of
>determining which staff member is helping himself to stock is to
>dust some of the targetted item with indelible dye
This might sound really daft, but how about a video camera?? you can
get exceedingly small ones, hide inside a clock etc which would be
just as good for evidence surely??
As regards a dye, you can get a paint on liquid from many "spy-shops"
that dries colourless, once on the skin it is activated and turns the
skin itself a deep purple. It needs moisture to work - assumes the
guilty party is nervous and hence hands and fingers are sweating.
David Hemmings
to do is hold a low power UV lamp up to the suspects.
luke <lu...@starwars.com> wrote in article <36b74...@news.fullnet.com>...
> check your local police department they use a theft detection powder
called
> pixie dust (really thats the name) or check the Internet under spy shops
> Marvin Margoshes wrote in message
> <797io1$mr5$1...@birch.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...
> >I think you want something that won't be noticed by the thief. One
> >possiblity is the fluorescent dye, fluorescein. One use for it is for
> >tracing water links, so you may be able to get it at a plumbing supply
> >store. You'll also want a blacklight fluorescent lamp to make it glow.
> >
> >John Savage wrote in message
> ><990203000060431.03Feb99$rook...@suburbian.com>...
> >> Earlier I posted this to a local group, but had no response,
> >> so I'm now trying wider afield. The local pharmacist has been
> >> no help. As a last resort, I'd try silver nitrate or KI-I soln,
> >> if my memory of junior high chem is correct; but there must
> >> be more penetrative finger stains than those, perhaps some of
> >> those used in microbiology?
> >>
> >>
> >>An acquaintance is having trouble with a light-fingered employee.
> >>We have examined the situation, and decided that the best way of
> >>determining which staff member is helping himself to stock is to
> >>dust some of the targetted item with indelible dye--if we can get
> >>some. The substance that banks use in the dye bomb they sometimes
> >>pop into a thief's bag along with the money would be what we need,
> >>as the stock item that is disappearing is something that general
> >>staff have no call to be handling. Ever.
> >>
> >>Can someone nominate the name of a suitable stain? I imagine that
> >>we would need no more than 1/4 of a teaspoonful, as a little bit
> >>goes such a loooooooooooooooooooooong way.
> >>
> >>BTW, I knew of a bank employee who had the misfortune to be holding
> >>a dye bomb when it went off. For weeks after, he was a vivid purple
> >>colour, ended up having a nervous breakdown and never worked again.