Roman coins in Venezuela?
mid...@world.std.com
Roman coins were found somewhere in Venezuela. Does anyone know anything
of this. I nearly fell off my chair when I read it. The source (I'll
verify the source and quote if asked) suggested something along the lines
that it was probably a Roman ship blown horribly off course and
discovered by the costal inhabitants. There was no suggestion, by the
way, that the Romans themselves had any commerce across the Atlantic.
Jason Gregoricus
Mason P. McDaniel
There are Roman coins found all over the place; the reason being that
ballast from ships from the 1500s through the 20th century contained crap
from all over the place, and they dumped it all over the place. Not a
complex problem. We have actually found Roman stuff in ballast piles from
Spanish ships. Now show me a Roman ship...
--
Mason P. McDaniel
Nautical Archaeology Program
Texas A&M University
stgg...@bureau.ucc.ie
->I read recently, I believe it was in Boorstin's "The Discoverers," that
->Roman coins were found somewhere in Venezuela. Does anyone know anything
->of this. I nearly fell off my chair when I read it. The source (I'll
->verify the source and quote if asked) suggested something along the lines
->that it was probably a Roman ship blown horribly off course and
->discovered by the costal inhabitants. There was no suggestion, by the
->way, that the Romans themselves had any commerce across the Atlantic.
->
->Jason Gregoricus
I don't know about Roman coins in Venezuela, but about ten years ago I did
hear that a team of archaeologists (from Edinburgh University, I believe)
were working on a dig at a cave site in north-west Australia, and found a
coin of Ptolomy the Great. I was told this by a "usually reliable source"
(my Masters' Thesis supervisor :-) but didn't even think of looking to verify
this.
Again, there is no suggestion that the coin arrived due to Egyptian-Australian
trade... in fact one of the difficulties with coins is that they can move by
very distinctly "fractal" routes, stopping here for a few centuries and then
moving on.... perhaps in the case of the Australian one, some Arab - or even
Chinese? - traders may have got blown off course? We can only speculate, but
I bet there is a story there if only we could uncover it!
Darius Bartlett
Dept. of Geography (okay so I'm not an Archaeologist...:-)
University College Cork, Ireland
D...@UCC.IE
Roger Weld
>
I've heard of a Roman ship found underwater in the port at Rio de Janeiro
that was destroyed or buried by some political intrigue or another.
Personally, I'm of the opinion that there was contact in those days.
There is a nonprofit group currently undertaken a seven year expedition
to prove this theory. The Andean Explorers Foundation & Ocean Sailing
Club has announced it is about to undertake its long-planned sea
voyage, a round-the-world expedition that will take all of seven
seasons.
They have been diligently planning this expediton for
ten years. Once their twin-hulled research vessel is completed,
the seven-year voyage will commence. In fact, at the time of
this writing, construction of the vessel is underway in Peru.
Completion of the 75-foot ship, based on ancient Peruvian and
Polynesian designs, is expected in six to eight months.
After months of work with the Peruvian government, it
has been resolved through the Institute of Culture that the
proposed sea expedition of the AEF&OSC is of national interest
to Peru. This means that they have complete and full
collaboration of government institutions, which is essential to
the expedition's success.
In actuality, the sea expedition is an extension of their
many land explorations in Peru. As you may know from previous
reports, the glyph-signs they uncovered in the large metropolis
of Gran Vilaya, Peru, indicate that contact by means of the sea
in ancient times among cultures of the Old and New Worlds was
possible -- cultures that would include those of Egypt, Israel,
India, Japan, Oceania and China, among others.
Not only will they be able to study old sea routes, but
once in port, they will undertake comprehensive studies by which
to increase our knowledge of social, economic and religious
endeavors of ancient cultures. Naturally, they are on the track
of information which has been lost down through the centuries.
They feel this newfound knowledge will throw light upon the
concepts of cultrual exchange between the Old and New Worlds.
The sea expedition was announced at the Annual Awards
Dinner of the AEF&OSC this past OCtober 12th, and was approved
by the Board of Directors with unanimous consent of all members
in attendance. They are currently seeking sponsors who would like
to participate in the journey.
If you are interested in participating in this once-in-a-
lifetime opportunity please contact Belinda Chauvin at
(702)348-1818 or fax to (702)853-0858. E-mail inquires to me at
icc...@sierra.net will be forwarded.
Al Wesolowsky
: > I read recently, I believe it was in Boorstin's "The Discoverers," that
: > Roman coins were found somewhere in Venezuela. Does anyone know anything
: There are Roman coins found all over the place; the reason being that
: ballast from ships from the 1500s through the 20th century contained crap
: from all over the place, and they dumped it all over the place. Not a
In the late 1970s Jeremiah Epstein, an archaeology prof at the
University of Texas, had a late Imperial coin brought to his attention;
some amateur arachaeologists reported that it had been found in a
prehistoric archaeological site in Central Texas, in a context that
could be dated to a period that was not inconsistent with the minting
of the coin.
Intrigued by the discovery, Jerry researched other such claims of
discovery of Classical-period coins and objects of similar antiquity in
North America. His article appeared in "Current Anthroplogy" ca. 1979
(apologies for not having the citation handy); memory is rusty, but I
believe that none of discoveries were products of a professional
archaeological excavation---they were from digging for utility lines or
from plowzone or the like. So, we have no reliable accounts of discovery
from a prehistoric context.
Jerry also noted that the discoveries proliferated during the last half
of the 19th century, a period when travel by North Americans to the
Mediterranean area became easier with the advent of steamships and more
regular passenger service across the Atlantic. He suggested that many of
the North American discoveries could the result of trinkets acquired
abroad being salted as pranks or genuinely lost.
--
Al B. Wesolowsky o Unlike J. W. Hardin, my foolish moves
a...@crsa.bu.edu o have been many.
Boston University o ---Michael Murphey
Eric Brunner Contra
: In article <DIsCs...@world.std.com>, mid...@world.std.com ( ) wrote:
: >I read recently, I believe it was in Boorstin's "The Discoverers," that
: >Roman coins were found somewhere in Venezuela. Does anyone know anything
: >that it was probably a Roman ship blown horribly off course and
: >discovered by the costal inhabitants. There was no suggestion, by the
: >way, that the Romans themselves had any commerce across the Atlantic.
: >
: >Jason Gregoricus
:
:
: I've heard of a Roman ship found underwater in the port at Rio de Janeiro
: that was destroyed or buried by some political intrigue or another.
This item of persiphlage has as its origins the simply loony junk Ben B has
bought, lock, stock and barrel. See "In Search of the White Gods" for this
little bit of multi-national conspiratorial plonk. Ben actually faxed this
trash to me last year thinking that this level of "scholarship" was just
compelling (of something other than the mental states of its authors and
delighted readers). This particular "work" makes travel writing found in
daily newspapers appear quite sophisticated, in comparison.
: Personally, I'm of the opinion that there was contact in those days.
Opinions are cheap. Have you worked out some of the consequences and any
of the preconditions of such an opinion?
: There is a nonprofit group currently undertaken a seven year expedition
: to prove this theory. The Andean Explorers Foundation & Ocean Sailing
: Club has announced it is about to undertake its long-planned sea
: voyage, a round-the-world expedition that will take all of seven
: seasons.
Umm, recall this group, which has zippo connection to the South American
Explorers Club, is, umm, loony in the large.
: They have been diligently planning this expediton for
...
: in attendance. They are currently seeking sponsors who would like
: to participate in the journey.
I'll get a sharp letter off to the SAEC requesting they keep several
thousand yards away from any Peruvian official daft enough to be in
on this act, as well as the boatloons themselves.
: If you are interested in participating in this once-in-a-
: lifetime opportunity please contact Belinda Chauvin at
: (702)348-1818 or fax to (702)853-0858. E-mail inquires to me at
: icc...@sierra.net will be forwarded.
A bloody add for these money grubbers! The cheek of these check cashers!
--
Kitakitamatsinopowaw (I'll see you again)
-- Eric Brunner
Paulo da Costa
[...]
> As interesting was the report of a Phoenician inscription found
>in Brazil in the last century. The address of the man who reported it was
>lost and the name of the town he wrote from is one of the most common
>town names in Brazil. However, it has been examined by scholars more
>recently and they now incline to believe in its genuineness for it
>contains features of Phoenician writing which were unknown in the 19th
>century and would not have been used by a forger.
Of course, it could also be a genuine inscription _not_ found in
Brazil, or copied directly from an original by a Brazilian forger.
The phoenicians would never have come far from the coast in Brazil (as
I seem to remember the claim was), there is a steep barrier on most of
the coast and the rivers run inland on the other side of it. If
something was there to be found, it would be on the northeastern coast,
not inland in the southeast.
--
Paulo M. C(astello) da Costa /\/\/\ Minha terra tem palmeiras /\/\/\
dac...@natlab.research.philips.com \/\/\/ Onde canta o sabia'... \/\/\/
Philips Research Labs, bldg WY8.011, / Tel +31 40 2744281 Fax +31 40 2744675 \
Prof Holstln 4, 5656 AA Eindhoven NL \__ http://www.iaehv.nl/users/dacosta/ __/
Jim Collier
>In article <DIsCs...@world.std.com>, mid...@world.std.com ( ) wrote:
>> I read recently, I believe it was in Boorstin's "The Discoverers," that
>> Roman coins were found somewhere in Venezuela. Does anyone know anything
>> of this. I nearly fell off my chair when I read it. The source (I'll
>> verify the source and quote if asked) suggested something along the lines
>> that it was probably a Roman ship blown horribly off course and
>> discovered by the costal inhabitants. There was no suggestion, by the
>> way, that the Romans themselves had any commerce across the Atlantic.
>>
>> Jason Gregoricus
>There are Roman coins found all over the place; the reason being that
>ballast from ships from the 1500s through the 20th century contained crap
>from all over the place, and they dumped it all over the place. Not a
>complex problem. We have actually found Roman stuff in ballast piles from
>Spanish ships. Now show me a Roman ship...
Seafaring Romans in Venezuela, Phoenicians in Alabama. This and the
Meso-American Archaeology newsgroup are excellent fodder for urban
legends. One of the objectors to my skepticism about 'Bama-nicians
suggested that I tell him where Phoenicia was. (Still is! Ask any
Lebanese.) It's easier to use Internet than it is to consult an
encyclopedia.
-----
Spanish coins in the New World were inscribed in Latin with
"HISP ET IND". They were used in Mexico for instance until
independence. I guess they look sort of Roman. Indeed those
beautiful viaducts in central Mexico could only have been designed by
a race of opera-lovers. And the Colorado Blvd. bridge in Pasadena,
over the Arroyo Seco.
Jim Collier
Costa Mesa, Calif.