Re: Jason and the Whales

[Jason]

In article <GpOdnUvTjKU86BPS...@giganews.com>, linuxgal
<linu...@cleanposts.com> wrote:

> Jason wrote:
>
> > You are correct. However, I have read the entire Bible. When the Jews went
> > from Egypt to the Holy Land--they encountered evil groups of people.
>
> They weren't Jews, they were Hebrews back then.

OK the Hebrews encountered evil groups of people and God ordered the
Hebrews to go to war with them and kill them.

[linuxgal]

Their "evil" consisted of living in the land that the Hebrews wanted.

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
news:Jason-18041...@67-150-123-126.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

God ordered that his troops engage in abortion.

So how can abortion be wrong?



Hosea 13:16

"The people of Samaria must bear their guilt,
because they have rebelled against their God.
They will fall by the sword; their little ones
will be dashed to the ground, their pregnant
women ripped open."

[Jason]

In article <5qOdncrmlacQ7RLS...@giganews.com>, linuxgal

No--they were evil long before the HEBREWS even came to that part of the world.

[Jason]

In article <XnsA039DB5BDC8C6...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

That is the way wars were fought in those days--and even in WW I and WW 2.

[Wombat]

On Apr 18, 9:58 pm, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article <GpOdnUvTjKU86BPSnZ2dnUVZ_sSdn...@giganews.com>, linuxgal

>
> <linux...@cleanposts.com> wrote:
> > Jason wrote:
>
> > > You are correct. However, I have read the entire Bible. When the Jews went
> > > from Egypt to the Holy Land--they encountered evil groups of people.
>
> > They weren't Jews, they were Hebrews back then.
>
> OK the Hebrews encountered evil groups of people and God ordered the
> Hebrews to go to war with them and kill them.

Except that the Exodus never happened.

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 19, 5:46 am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article <5qOdncrmlacQ7RLSnZ2dnUVZ_t-dn...@giganews.com>, linuxgal
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <linux...@cleanposts.com> wrote:
> > Jason wrote:
> > > In article <GpOdnUvTjKU86BPSnZ2dnUVZ_sSdn...@giganews.com>, linuxgal

> > > <linux...@cleanposts.com> wrote:
>
> > >> Jason wrote:
>
> > >>> You are correct. However, I have read the entire Bible. When the Jews went
> > >>> from Egypt to the Holy Land--they encountered evil groups of people.
> > >> They weren't Jews, they were Hebrews back then.
>
> > > OK the Hebrews encountered evil groups of people and God ordered the
> > > Hebrews to go to war with them and kill them.
>
> > Their "evil" consisted of living in the land that the Hebrews wanted.
>
> No--they were evil long before the HEBREWS even came to that part of the world.

And what evidence do you have for that?

[linuxgal]

That evil consisted of worshiping a different god than the Hebrews did.
Which made ninety-nine percent of the world evil, and makes you evil
too, because no Jew will allow that their god has a son.

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
news:Jason-18041...@67-150-123-14.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

What made them evil?

Besides having a different religion, that is..........

[Tom McDonald]

How?

[Jason]

In article <8oVjr.9292$kb7...@newsfe20.iad>, Tom McDonald

Bowing down to false Gods and not obeying the commandments.

[Jason]

In article <XnsA03A4E7A21367...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

They were not obeying the commandments.

[Tom McDonald]

On 4/19/2012 4:08 PM, Jason wrote:
> In article<8oVjr.9292$kb7...@newsfe20.iad>, Tom McDonald

Interesting. So they were murdered because they were evil because they
didn't know about the Hebrew god, and therefore had no chance to worship
him?

How about the folks just to the north of the Promised Land? How about
Mesopotamia? How about Anatolia? None of the folks in those lands knew
about or worshiped the Hebrew god? Why weren't they exterminated, too?

Why was it only the folks living around the Hebrews in what became the
Holy Land that had to be wiped out? Wouldn't the world have been a
better place had the Hebrews killed everyone who didn't believe and
worship as they did?

Or was it that they were a Canaanite tribe, or group of tribes, that
used the 'god' excuse to conquer their neighbors to get their lands and
towns and fields and flocks? And, some of the time, their women?

[Tom McDonald]

How do you know? Did they have the Hebrew commandments preached to them,
to allow them to obey them, before they were murdered?

Or, like the Spanish in the New World, did the Hebrews whisper a request
for them to convert, from a mile away, and then kill anyone who didn't
convert?

That actually happened, you know. The Pope told the Spanish that they
couldn't conquer a group of Indians by force unless the Indians, after
having been preached to about the Christian God, refused to convert. The
Pope intended a mostly peaceful conquest-by-religion of the New World;
but that was too slow and chancy for the Spanish. Why, the Indians might
have converted, and then the Spanish couldn't kill them, enslave them,
and take their stuff!

So the Conquistadors had a priest, from far away from the Indian
settlement to be attacked, tell the Indians about Jesus and ask them to
convert. When the Spanish didn't hear the Indians say, "Yes, I'll come
to Jesus", they attacked.

Sounds a lot like the Hebrew conquest of the Holy Land, in your telling
of it. Except that the other tribes weren't given any chance to convert
first.

Turns out that Pope was a better soul than your God!

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in news:Jason-1904121409260001@67-150-126-
156.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

Translation - they were occupying land the Hebrews wanted.

[Jason]

In article <9C%jr.111208$s82....@newsfe10.iad>, Tom McDonald

Back in those days--that is the way wars were fought. One of the reasons
was that if they had allowed over half of the people in each city they
beat in battle to live--it would mean they would have to have to fight
another battle against those cities 20 to 40 years later. If they wiped
out everyone in each city--they would never have to go to war against
those cities in the future.

[Jason]

In article <XnsA03AB65D42CFA...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

That was a factor.

[Wombat]

On Apr 20, 9:26 am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article <9C%jr.111208$s82.42...@newsfe10.iad>, Tom McDonald

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> wrote:
> > On 4/19/2012 4:08 PM, Jason wrote:

> > > In article<8oVjr.9292$kb7....@newsfe20.iad>, Tom McDonald
> > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net>  wrote:

>
> > >> On 4/18/2012 11:46 PM, Jason wrote:

> > >>> In article<5qOdncrmlacQ7RLSnZ2dnUVZ_t-dn...@giganews.com>, linuxgal
> > >>> <linux...@cleanposts.com>   wrote:
>
> > >>>> Jason wrote:
> > >>>>> In article<GpOdnUvTjKU86BPSnZ2dnUVZ_sSdn...@giganews.com>, linuxgal

Didn't seem to work with, I think, the Amakelites. Didn't they need
to be exterminate - twice!

[David Fritzinger]

In article
<Jason-20041...@66-53-211-164.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com>,

So, you're OK with genocide then?

Wow! All I can say is Wow!

[Tom McDonald]

Try again.

My point was that, if you are correct and the Hebrews had to kill the
other Canaanites because they were not obeying the commandments (which,
by the way, the Hebrews had themselves just gotten), why wouldn't the
first effort of the Hebrews been to preach to them and attempt to
convert them? Instead, they just killed them.

And if the war was a holy war against non-believers in the brand-new
Hebrew religion (much like the holy war against unbelievers in the
then-brand-new Islamic religion a thousand years later), why stop where
they did? Why not attempt to convert the whole world?

I think you haven't thought this through very well.

[Jason]

In article
<a3acdd0b-e1a6-454a...@v22g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>,
Wombat <tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:

> On Apr 20, 9:26=A0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > In article <9C%jr.111208$s82.42...@newsfe10.iad>, Tom McDonald
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> wrote:
> > > On 4/19/2012 4:08 PM, Jason wrote:
> > > > In article<8oVjr.9292$kb7....@newsfe20.iad>, Tom McDonald

> > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> =A0wrote:

> >
> > > >> On 4/18/2012 11:46 PM, Jason wrote:
> > > >>> In article<5qOdncrmlacQ7RLSnZ2dnUVZ_t-dn...@giganews.com>, linuxgal

> > > >>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =A0 wrote:
> >
> > > >>>> Jason wrote:

> > > >>>>> In article<GpOdnUvTjKU86BPSnZ2dnUVZ_sSdn...@giganews.com>, linuxg=
> al

> > > >>>>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =A0 wrote:
> >
> > > >>>>>> Jason wrote:
> >

> > > >>>>>>> You are correct. However, I have read the entire Bible. When th=
> e
> > > > Jews went
> > > >>>>>>> from Egypt to the Holy Land--they encountered evil groups of pe=

> ople.
> > > >>>>>> They weren't Jews, they were Hebrews back then.
> >

> > > >>>>> OK the Hebrews encountered evil groups of people and God ordered =

> the
> > > >>>>> Hebrews to go to war with them and kill them.
> >

> > > >>>> Their "evil" consisted of living in the land that the Hebrews want=
> ed.
> >
> > > >>> No--they were evil long before the HEBREWS even came to that part o=

> f
> > > > the world.
> >
> > > >> How?
> >
> > > > Bowing down to false Gods and not obeying the commandments.
> >
> > > Interesting. So they were murdered because they were evil because they

> > > didn't know about the Hebrew god, and therefore had no chance to worshi=

> p
> > > him?
> >
> > > How about the folks just to the north of the Promised Land? How about
> > > Mesopotamia? How about Anatolia? None of the folks in those lands knew
> > > about or worshiped the Hebrew god? Why weren't they exterminated, too?
> >
> > > Why was it only the folks living around the Hebrews in what became the
> > > Holy Land that had to be wiped out? Wouldn't the world have been a
> > > better place had the Hebrews killed everyone who didn't believe and
> > > worship as they did?
> >
> > > Or was it that they were a Canaanite tribe, or group of tribes, that
> > > used the 'god' excuse to conquer their neighbors to get their lands and
> > > towns and fields and flocks? And, some of the time, their women?
> >
> > Back in those days--that is the way wars were fought. One of the reasons
> > was that if they had allowed over half of the people in each city they
> > beat in battle to live--it would mean they would have to have to fight
> > another battle against those cities 20 to 40 years later. If they wiped
> > out everyone in each city--they would never have to go to war against
> > those cities in the future.
>
> Didn't seem to work with, I think, the Amakelites. Didn't they need
> to be exterminate - twice!

Yes, they should have killed them all the first time.

[Jason]

In article <l9gkr.9948$VF7....@newsfe02.iad>, Tom McDonald

Yes, I have.

[Jason]

In article <dfritzin-715FDB...@news.eternal-september.org>,

In those cases mentioned in the OT--yes. In regard to dropping two nukes
on Japan--I was also in favor of it.

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 21, 7:55 am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article <dfritzin-715FDB.09191420042...@news.eternal-september.org>,
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> David Fritzinger <dfrit...@nospamtome.hotmail.com> wrote:
> > In article
> > <Jason-2004120026150...@66-53-211-164.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com>,

> >  Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
>
> > > In article <9C%jr.111208$s82.42...@newsfe10.iad>, Tom McDonald

> > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> wrote:
>
> > > > On 4/19/2012 4:08 PM, Jason wrote:

> > > > > In article<8oVjr.9292$kb7....@newsfe20.iad>, Tom McDonald

> > > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net>  wrote:

>
> > > > >> On 4/18/2012 11:46 PM, Jason wrote:

> > > > >>> In article<5qOdncrmlacQ7RLSnZ2dnUVZ_t-dn...@giganews.com>, linuxgal
> > > > >>> <linux...@cleanposts.com>   wrote:
>
> > > > >>>> Jason wrote:
> > > > >>>>> In article<GpOdnUvTjKU86BPSnZ2dnUVZ_sSdn...@giganews.com>, linuxgal

Okay then, here's a little scenario for you.

Your god puts in a bona fide appearance.

Seen by thousands of Roman Catholics.

And he tells them in no uncertain terms.

That if the other Christians wont convert to the Roman Catholic way.

That the Roman Catholics must kill them all.

Would you be in favour of that genocidal slaughter?

[David Fritzinger]

In article
<Jason-20041...@67-150-121-168.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com>,

Obviously, your morals are there for your convenience only.

As I said before, Wow...

[Tom McDonald]

On 4/21/2012 1:53 AM, Jason wrote:
> In article<l9gkr.9948$VF7....@newsfe02.iad>, Tom McDonald

Then you can tell me why the Hebrews didn't try to convert the other
tribes before killing them all. What is that reason?

[Jason]

In article
<9f64a0e4-3217-4d56...@u7g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>, Devils
Advocaat <manky...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Apr 21, 7:55=A0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > In article <dfritzin-715FDB.09191420042...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > David Fritzinger <dfrit...@nospamtome.hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > In article
> > > <Jason-2004120026150...@66-53-211-164.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com>,

> > > =A0Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> >
> > > > In article <9C%jr.111208$s82.42...@newsfe10.iad>, Tom McDonald
> > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> wrote:
> >
> > > > > On 4/19/2012 4:08 PM, Jason wrote:
> > > > > > In article<8oVjr.9292$kb7....@newsfe20.iad>, Tom McDonald

> > > > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> =A0wrote:

> >
> > > > > >> On 4/18/2012 11:46 PM, Jason wrote:

> > > > > >>> In article<5qOdncrmlacQ7RLSnZ2dnUVZ_t-dn...@giganews.com>, linu=
> xgal

> > > > > >>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =A0 wrote:
> >
> > > > > >>>> Jason wrote:

> > > > > >>>>> In article<GpOdnUvTjKU86BPSnZ2dnUVZ_sSdn...@giganews.com>, li=
> nuxgal

> > > > > >>>>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =A0 wrote:
> >
> > > > > >>>>>> Jason wrote:
> >

> > > > > >>>>>>> You are correct. However, I have read the entire Bible. Whe=
> n the
> > > > > > Jews went
> > > > > >>>>>>> from Egypt to the Holy Land--they encountered evil groups o=

> f
> > people.
> > > > > >>>>>> They weren't Jews, they were Hebrews back then.
> >

> > > > > >>>>> OK the Hebrews encountered evil groups of people and God orde=

> red the
> > > > > >>>>> Hebrews to go to war with them and kill them.
> >

> > > > > >>>> Their "evil" consisted of living in the land that the Hebrews =
> wanted.
> >
> > > > > >>> No--they were evil long before the HEBREWS even came to that pa=

> rt of
> > > > > > the world.
> >
> > > > > >> How?
> >
> > > > > > Bowing down to false Gods and not obeying the commandments.
> >

> > > > > Interesting. So they were murdered because they were evil because t=
> hey
> > > > > didn't know about the Hebrew god, and therefore had no chance to wo=
> rship
> > > > > him?
> >
> > > > > How about the folks just to the north of the Promised Land? How abo=
> ut
> > > > > Mesopotamia? How about Anatolia? None of the folks in those lands k=
> new
> > > > > about or worshiped the Hebrew god? Why weren't they exterminated, t=
> oo?
> >
> > > > > Why was it only the folks living around the Hebrews in what became =

> the
> > > > > Holy Land that had to be wiped out? Wouldn't the world have been a
> > > > > better place had the Hebrews killed everyone who didn't believe and
> > > > > worship as they did?
> >

> > > > > Or was it that they were a Canaanite tribe, or group of tribes, tha=
> t
> > > > > used the 'god' excuse to conquer their neighbors to get their lands=

> and
> > > > > towns and fields and flocks? And, some of the time, their women?
> >

> > > > Back in those days--that is the way wars were fought. One of the reas=
> ons
> > > > was that if they had allowed over half of the people in each city the=
> y
> > > > beat in battle to live--it would mean they would have to have to figh=
> t
> > > > another battle against those cities 20 to 40 years later. If they wip=

> ed
> > > > out everyone in each city--they would never have to go to war against
> > > > those cities in the future.
> >
> > > So, you're OK with genocide then?
> >
> > > Wow! All I can say is Wow!
> >
> > In those cases mentioned in the OT--yes. In regard to dropping two nukes
> > on Japan--I was also in favor of it.
>
> Okay then, here's a little scenario for you.
>
> Your god puts in a bona fide appearance.
>
> Seen by thousands of Roman Catholics.
>
> And he tells them in no uncertain terms.
>
> That if the other Christians wont convert to the Roman Catholic way.
>
> That the Roman Catholics must kill them all.
>
> Would you be in favour of that genocidal slaughter?

Yes

[Jason]

In article <VNzkr.59153$YM2....@newsfe05.iad>, Tom McDonald

I can guess that God did not trust them--they could say they were Hebrews
but God knew they would go back to being enemies of the Hebrews about a
dozen years later. The best example is Egypt. The Jews made an agreement
with them--but it's possible that if the Muslim Brotherhood gets control
over Egypt that they will restart a war with Israel despite the peace
agreement.

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 22, 7:30 am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article

> <9f64a0e4-3217-4d56-9e84-4cdf5eca4...@u7g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>, Devils

Even if it meant you and your family, friends and loved ones would be
slaughtered without mercy?

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
news:Jason-21041...@66-53-219-87.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

Balderdash. A stable Egyptian government will do
nothing to endanger their stipend from the US, not to
mention their income from tourism. Even an official
Islamic government - like the ones we created in Iraq
and Afghanistan - has nothing to gain from starting a
war.

[Jason]

In article
<7a8a3160-966c-449f...@r32g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>,
Devils Advocaat <manky...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Apr 22, 7:30=A0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > In article

> > <9f64a0e4-3217-4d56-9e84-4cdf5eca4...@u7g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>, Devil=
> s
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > On Apr 21, 7:55=3DA0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > > > In article <dfritzin-715FDB.09191420042...@news.eternal-september.org=

> >,
> >
> > > > David Fritzinger <dfrit...@nospamtome.hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > In article
> > > > > <Jason-2004120026150...@66-53-211-164.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com>,

> > > > > =3DA0Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> >
> > > > > > In article <9C%jr.111208$s82.42...@newsfe10.iad>, Tom McDonald
> > > > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > On 4/19/2012 4:08 PM, Jason wrote:
> > > > > > > > In article<8oVjr.9292$kb7....@newsfe20.iad>, Tom McDonald

> > > > > > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> =3DA0wrote:

> >
> > > > > > > >> On 4/18/2012 11:46 PM, Jason wrote:

> > > > > > > >>> In article<5qOdncrmlacQ7RLSnZ2dnUVZ_t-dn...@giganews.com>, =
> linu=3D
> > > xgal

> > > > > > > >>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =3DA0 wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > >>>> Jason wrote:

> > > > > > > >>>>> In article<GpOdnUvTjKU86BPSnZ2dnUVZ_sSdn...@giganews.com>=
> , li=3D
> > > nuxgal

> > > > > > > >>>>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =3DA0 wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > >>>>>> Jason wrote:
> >

> > > > > > > >>>>>>> You are correct. However, I have read the entire Bible.=
> Whe=3D
> > > n the
> > > > > > > > Jews went
> > > > > > > >>>>>>> from Egypt to the Holy Land--they encountered evil grou=
> ps o=3D

> > > f
> > > > people.
> > > > > > > >>>>>> They weren't Jews, they were Hebrews back then.
> >

> > > > > > > >>>>> OK the Hebrews encountered evil groups of people and God =
> orde=3D

> > > red the
> > > > > > > >>>>> Hebrews to go to war with them and kill them.
> >

> > > > > > > >>>> Their "evil" consisted of living in the land that the Hebr=
> ews =3D
> > > wanted.
> >
> > > > > > > >>> No--they were evil long before the HEBREWS even came to tha=
> t pa=3D

> > > rt of
> > > > > > > > the world.
> >
> > > > > > > >> How?
> >
> > > > > > > > Bowing down to false Gods and not obeying the commandments.
> >

> > > > > > > Interesting. So they were murdered because they were evil becau=
> se t=3D
> > > hey
> > > > > > > didn't know about the Hebrew god, and therefore had no chance t=
> o wo=3D
> > > rship
> > > > > > > him?
> >
> > > > > > > How about the folks just to the north of the Promised Land? How=
> abo=3D
> > > ut
> > > > > > > Mesopotamia? How about Anatolia? None of the folks in those lan=
> ds k=3D
> > > new
> > > > > > > about or worshiped the Hebrew god? Why weren't they exterminate=
> d, t=3D
> > > oo?
> >
> > > > > > > Why was it only the folks living around the Hebrews in what bec=
> ame =3D
> > > the
> > > > > > > Holy Land that had to be wiped out? Wouldn't the world have bee=
> n a
> > > > > > > better place had the Hebrews killed everyone who didn't believe=

> and
> > > > > > > worship as they did?
> >

> > > > > > > Or was it that they were a Canaanite tribe, or group of tribes,=
> tha=3D
> > > t
> > > > > > > used the 'god' excuse to conquer their neighbors to get their l=
> ands=3D
> > > =A0and
> > > > > > > towns and fields and flocks? And, some of the time, their women=
> ?
> >
> > > > > > Back in those days--that is the way wars were fought. One of the =
> reas=3D
> > > ons
> > > > > > was that if they had allowed over half of the people in each city=
> the=3D
> > > y
> > > > > > beat in battle to live--it would mean they would have to have to =
> figh=3D
> > > t
> > > > > > another battle against those cities 20 to 40 years later. If they=
> wip=3D
> > > ed
> > > > > > out everyone in each city--they would never have to go to war aga=

> inst
> > > > > > those cities in the future.
> >
> > > > > So, you're OK with genocide then?
> >
> > > > > Wow! All I can say is Wow!
> >

> > > > In those cases mentioned in the OT--yes. In regard to dropping two nu=

> kes
> > > > on Japan--I was also in favor of it.
> >
> > > Okay then, here's a little scenario for you.
> >
> > > Your god puts in a bona fide appearance.
> >
> > > Seen by thousands of Roman Catholics.
> >
> > > And he tells them in no uncertain terms.
> >
> > > That if the other Christians wont convert to the Roman Catholic way.
> >
> > > That the Roman Catholics must kill them all.
> >
> > > Would you be in favour of that genocidal slaughter?
> >
> > Yes
>
> Even if it meant you and your family, friends and loved ones would be
> slaughtered without mercy?

I would not care. God would send the Christians that were killed to heaven.

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 22, 10:09 pm, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article

> <7a8a3160-966c-449f-b6ad-077c17173...@r32g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>,

You aren't keeping up, are you.

God has ordered the Roman Catholics to slaughter all the Christians
that won't become Roman Catholics.

So he's not going to welcome those dead into heaven.

Why?

Because they didn't convert.

You really must pay attention.

[Jason]

In article <XnsA03D53FD18D3E...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

Let's wait and see. They will probably go about it in such a way that
their actions can NOT be tied to the government of Egypt.

How will they do it? If the members of their military or the police
discover terrorists building tunnels into Israel--they will order the
military or the police to NOT do anything about it.

If a group of terrorist attacks Israel--they will claim the government was
not responsible for those attacks and will promise to keep it from
happening again. However, they will secretly decide to allow it to happen
again without taking any acitons to stop those attacks.

Obama will believe them and keep providing them with money.

If Reagan was still president, he would cut off the money supply in that
same situation.

[Alex W.]

On Sun, 22 Apr 2012 08:20:51 -0500, Mitchell Holman wrote:


> A stable Egyptian government will do
> nothing to endanger their stipend from the US, not to
> mention their income from tourism. Even an official
> Islamic government - like the ones we created in Iraq
> and Afghanistan - has nothing to gain from starting a
> war.

It is interesting to note that the Egyptian government and
security forces have in the past been fully complicit in keeping
a lid on Palestinians in the Gaza Strip. Whatever their personal
and religous sympathies may be, they know full well how
destabilisng and disrupting Hamas and other extremist Palestinian
organisations canbe.

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
news:Jason-22041...@66-53-220-250.stkn.mdsg-pacwest.com:

Saudi Arabia - our "ally" - has been funding terrorism
for years and the US has done nothing about it.

>
> Obama will believe them and keep providing them with money.
>
> If Reagan was still president, he would cut off the money supply in
> that same situation.

Reagan would respond to terrorism in the future
the way he did inthe past - by selling arms to the
terrorists.

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
news:Jason-22041...@66-53-220-250.stkn.mdsg-pacwest.com:

What about innocents killed BY Christians?

Do they go to heaven too?

[Jason]

In article <XnsA03DAA9EC7F99...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

Innocent babies and children--yes.

I learned not to fear about those sorts of things when I was a child
during the incident related to nukes in Cuba. Lots of rich people built
bomb shelters to protect themselves if nuclear missiles were fired from
Cuba to America or Jet Planes from Cuba dropped nuke bombs on America. We
had to get under our desks whenever planes flew over the school. Our
father told us not to worry about it since we would go to heaven if we
were nuked. I have followed his advice. When Mary and I saw a television
show about the world coming to an end at the end of 2012 due to Maya
caledar issue--my comment was---"Let's not worry about it since even if it
happens we will both go to heaven".

[Jason]

In article
<05f12dcf-1fd0-480f...@21g2000vbh.googlegroups.com>, Devils
Advocaat <manky...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Apr 22, 10:09=A0pm, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > In article
> > <7a8a3160-966c-449f-b6ad-077c17173...@r32g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Devils Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > On Apr 22, 7:30=3DA0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > > > In article

> > > > <9f64a0e4-3217-4d56-9e84-4cdf5eca4...@u7g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>, D=
> evil=3D
> > > s
> >
> > > > Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > On Apr 21, 7:55=3D3DA0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > > > > > In article <dfritzin-715FDB.09191420042...@news.eternal-september=
> .org=3D

> > > >,
> >
> > > > > > David Fritzinger <dfrit...@nospamtome.hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > In article
> > > > > > > <Jason-2004120026150...@66-53-211-164.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com>,

> > > > > > > =3D3DA0Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > In article <9C%jr.111208$s82.42...@newsfe10.iad>, Tom McDonal=

> d
> > > > > > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > > On 4/19/2012 4:08 PM, Jason wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > In article<8oVjr.9292$kb7....@newsfe20.iad>, Tom McDonald

> > > > > > > > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> =3D3DA0wrote:

> >
> > > > > > > > > >> On 4/18/2012 11:46 PM, Jason wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >>> In article<5qOdncrmlacQ7RLSnZ2dnUVZ_t-dn...@giganews.co=
> m>, =3D
> > > linu=3D3D
> > > > > xgal

> > > > > > > > > >>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =3D3DA0 wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > > >>>> Jason wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >>>>> In article<GpOdnUvTjKU86BPSnZ2dnUVZ_sSdn...@giganews.=
> com>=3D
> > > , li=3D3D
> > > > > nuxgal

> > > > > > > > > >>>>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =3D3DA0 wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Jason wrote:
> >

> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> You are correct. However, I have read the entire Bi=
> ble.=3D
> > > =A0Whe=3D3D
> > > > > n the
> > > > > > > > > > Jews went
> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> from Egypt to the Holy Land--they encountered evil =
> grou=3D
> > > ps o=3D3D

> > > > > f
> > > > > > people.
> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> They weren't Jews, they were Hebrews back then.
> >

> > > > > > > > > >>>>> OK the Hebrews encountered evil groups of people and =
> God =3D
> > > orde=3D3D

> > > > > red the
> > > > > > > > > >>>>> Hebrews to go to war with them and kill them.
> >

> > > > > > > > > >>>> Their "evil" consisted of living in the land that the =
> Hebr=3D
> > > ews =3D3D
> > > > > wanted.
> >
> > > > > > > > > >>> No--they were evil long before the HEBREWS even came to=
> tha=3D
> > > t pa=3D3D

> > > > > rt of
> > > > > > > > > > the world.
> >
> > > > > > > > > >> How?
> >

> > > > > > > > > > Bowing down to false Gods and not obeying the commandment=
> s.
> >
> > > > > > > > > Interesting. So they were murdered because they were evil b=
> ecau=3D
> > > se t=3D3D
> > > > > hey
> > > > > > > > > didn't know about the Hebrew god, and therefore had no chan=
> ce t=3D
> > > o wo=3D3D
> > > > > rship
> > > > > > > > > him?
> >
> > > > > > > > > How about the folks just to the north of the Promised Land?=
> How=3D
> > > =A0abo=3D3D
> > > > > ut
> > > > > > > > > Mesopotamia? How about Anatolia? None of the folks in those=
> lan=3D
> > > ds k=3D3D
> > > > > new
> > > > > > > > > about or worshiped the Hebrew god? Why weren't they extermi=
> nate=3D
> > > d, t=3D3D
> > > > > oo?
> >
> > > > > > > > > Why was it only the folks living around the Hebrews in what=
> bec=3D
> > > ame =3D3D
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > Holy Land that had to be wiped out? Wouldn't the world have=
> bee=3D
> > > n a
> > > > > > > > > better place had the Hebrews killed everyone who didn't bel=
> ieve=3D
> > > =A0and
> > > > > > > > > worship as they did?
> >
> > > > > > > > > Or was it that they were a Canaanite tribe, or group of tri=
> bes,=3D
> > > =A0tha=3D3D
> > > > > t
> > > > > > > > > used the 'god' excuse to conquer their neighbors to get the=
> ir l=3D
> > > ands=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0and
> > > > > > > > > towns and fields and flocks? And, some of the time, their w=
> omen=3D
> > > ?
> >
> > > > > > > > Back in those days--that is the way wars were fought. One of =
> the =3D
> > > reas=3D3D
> > > > > ons
> > > > > > > > was that if they had allowed over half of the people in each =
> city=3D
> > > =A0the=3D3D
> > > > > y
> > > > > > > > beat in battle to live--it would mean they would have to have=
> to =3D
> > > figh=3D3D
> > > > > t
> > > > > > > > another battle against those cities 20 to 40 years later. If =
> they=3D
> > > =A0wip=3D3D
> > > > > ed
> > > > > > > > out everyone in each city--they would never have to go to war=
> aga=3D

> > > inst
> > > > > > > > those cities in the future.
> >
> > > > > > > So, you're OK with genocide then?
> >
> > > > > > > Wow! All I can say is Wow!
> >

> > > > > > In those cases mentioned in the OT--yes. In regard to dropping tw=
> o nu=3D

> > > kes
> > > > > > on Japan--I was also in favor of it.
> >
> > > > > Okay then, here's a little scenario for you.
> >
> > > > > Your god puts in a bona fide appearance.
> >
> > > > > Seen by thousands of Roman Catholics.
> >
> > > > > And he tells them in no uncertain terms.
> >

> > > > > That if the other Christians wont convert to the Roman Catholic way=

> .
> >
> > > > > That the Roman Catholics must kill them all.
> >
> > > > > Would you be in favour of that genocidal slaughter?
> >
> > > > Yes
> >
> > > Even if it meant you and your family, friends and loved ones would be
> > > slaughtered without mercy?
> >

> > I would not care. God would send the Christians that were killed to heave=

> n.
>
> You aren't keeping up, are you.
>
> God has ordered the Roman Catholics to slaughter all the Christians
> that won't become Roman Catholics.
>
> So he's not going to welcome those dead into heaven.
>
> Why?
>
> Because they didn't convert.
>
> You really must pay attention.

OK--I now get it. Thanks. I still would not become a Catholic. We both
know that God would never do anything like that.

[Jason]

In article <XnsA03DAA3C43C3B...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

LOL

[Jason]

In article <1qcras9qku5fs$.kg8ytxv1wooe$.d...@40tude.net>,

But that gov't is gone. If the Muslim Brotherhood takes over the
gov't--they may have a different point of view.

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in news:Jason-2204121710210001@66-53-214-
238.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

Reagan ADMITTED selling arms to terrorists, Jason.

He also admitted lying about it.


"A few months ago I told the American people I did not
trade arms for hostages. My heart and my best intentions
still tell me that's true, but the facts and the evidence
tell me it is not."
Ronald Reagan, Address to the Nation, Jan 1987

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
news:Jason-22041...@66-53-214-238.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

So native American adults who were rounded
up and killed by Christians go to hell, even if
they led blameless lives?

What a sick religion you follow.

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 23, 1:08 am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article

> <05f12dcf-1fd0-480f-8351-56b7ea80b...@21g2000vbh.googlegroups.com>, Devils

You might want to believe that.

However go to your bible.

Read the accounts of god telling his chosen people to slaughter in his
name.

Now tell me you know for sure your alleged god wouldn't do it again.

And think about, wouldn't you want to stay on the right side of your
alleged god?

After all, if you didn't, you'd end up in hell.

[Jason]

In article <XnsA03DD8D69F717...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

Yes, but the reason he done it was to help prevent another nation that are
very near America from becoming another communist nation.

If the liberal democrats in Congress had voted in favor of funding the
Contras--Reagan would not have had to sell arms to terrorists to fund the
contras.

[Jason]

In article <XnsA03DD9D251692...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

If they never ever committed any sins--yes.

[Jason]

In article
<c3eb6372-c27d-4e25...@m18g2000vbl.googlegroups.com>,
Devils Advocaat <manky...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Apr 23, 1:08=A0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > In article

> > <05f12dcf-1fd0-480f-8351-56b7ea80b...@21g2000vbh.googlegroups.com>, Devil=
> s
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > On Apr 22, 10:09=3DA0pm, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > > > In article
> > > > <7a8a3160-966c-449f-b6ad-077c17173...@r32g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>,
> >
> > > > Devils Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > On Apr 22, 7:30=3D3DA0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > > > > > In article

> > > > > > <9f64a0e4-3217-4d56-9e84-4cdf5eca4...@u7g2000yqc.googlegroups.com=
> >, D=3D
> > > evil=3D3D
> > > > > s
> >
> > > > > > Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > On Apr 21, 7:55=3D3D3DA0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > > > > > > > In article <dfritzin-715FDB.09191420042...@news.eternal-septe=
> mber=3D
> > > .org=3D3D

> > > > > >,
> >
> > > > > > > > David Fritzinger <dfrit...@nospamtome.hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > In article

> > > > > > > > > <Jason-2004120026150...@66-53-211-164.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com=
> >,
> > > > > > > > > =3D3D3DA0Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > > > In article <9C%jr.111208$s82.42...@newsfe10.iad>, Tom McD=
> onal=3D

> > > d
> > > > > > > > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > On 4/19/2012 4:08 PM, Jason wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > In article<8oVjr.9292$kb7....@newsfe20.iad>, Tom McDo=
> nald
> > > > > > > > > > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> =3D3D3DA0wrote:

> >
> > > > > > > > > > > >> On 4/18/2012 11:46 PM, Jason wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >>> In article<5qOdncrmlacQ7RLSnZ2dnUVZ_t-dn...@giganew=
> s.co=3D
> > > m>, =3D3D
> > > > > linu=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > xgal

> > > > > > > > > > > >>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =3D3D3DA0 wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Jason wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> In article<GpOdnUvTjKU86BPSnZ2dnUVZ_sSdn...@gigan=
> ews.=3D
> > > com>=3D3D
> > > > > , li=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > nuxgal

> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =3D3D3DA0 wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Jason wrote:
> >

> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> You are correct. However, I have read the entir=
> e Bi=3D
> > > ble.=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0Whe=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > n the
> > > > > > > > > > > > Jews went
> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> from Egypt to the Holy Land--they encountered e=
> vil =3D
> > > grou=3D3D
> > > > > ps o=3D3D3D

> > > > > > > f
> > > > > > > > people.
> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> They weren't Jews, they were Hebrews back then.
> >

> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> OK the Hebrews encountered evil groups of people =
> and =3D
> > > God =3D3D
> > > > > orde=3D3D3D

> > > > > > > red the
> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Hebrews to go to war with them and kill them.
> >

> > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Their "evil" consisted of living in the land that =
> the =3D
> > > Hebr=3D3D
> > > > > ews =3D3D3D
> > > > > > > wanted.
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > >>> No--they were evil long before the HEBREWS even cam=
> e to=3D
> > > =A0tha=3D3D
> > > > > t pa=3D3D3D

> > > > > > > rt of
> > > > > > > > > > > > the world.
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > >> How?
> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Bowing down to false Gods and not obeying the command=
> ment=3D
> > > s.
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > Interesting. So they were murdered because they were ev=
> il b=3D
> > > ecau=3D3D
> > > > > se t=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > hey
> > > > > > > > > > > didn't know about the Hebrew god, and therefore had no =
> chan=3D
> > > ce t=3D3D
> > > > > o wo=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > rship
> > > > > > > > > > > him?
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > How about the folks just to the north of the Promised L=
> and?=3D
> > > =A0How=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0abo=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > ut
> > > > > > > > > > > Mesopotamia? How about Anatolia? None of the folks in t=
> hose=3D
> > > =A0lan=3D3D
> > > > > ds k=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > new
> > > > > > > > > > > about or worshiped the Hebrew god? Why weren't they ext=
> ermi=3D
> > > nate=3D3D
> > > > > d, t=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > oo?
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > Why was it only the folks living around the Hebrews in =
> what=3D
> > > =A0bec=3D3D
> > > > > ame =3D3D3D
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > Holy Land that had to be wiped out? Wouldn't the world =
> have=3D
> > > =A0bee=3D3D
> > > > > n a
> > > > > > > > > > > better place had the Hebrews killed everyone who didn't=
> bel=3D
> > > ieve=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0and
> > > > > > > > > > > worship as they did?
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > Or was it that they were a Canaanite tribe, or group of=
> tri=3D
> > > bes,=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0tha=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > t
> > > > > > > > > > > used the 'god' excuse to conquer their neighbors to get=
> the=3D
> > > ir l=3D3D
> > > > > ands=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > =3D3DA0and
> > > > > > > > > > > towns and fields and flocks? And, some of the time, the=
> ir w=3D
> > > omen=3D3D
> > > > > ?
> >
> > > > > > > > > > Back in those days--that is the way wars were fought. One=
> of =3D
> > > the =3D3D
> > > > > reas=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > ons
> > > > > > > > > > was that if they had allowed over half of the people in e=
> ach =3D
> > > city=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0the=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > y
> > > > > > > > > > beat in battle to live--it would mean they would have to =
> have=3D
> > > =A0to =3D3D
> > > > > figh=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > t
> > > > > > > > > > another battle against those cities 20 to 40 years later.=
> If =3D
> > > they=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0wip=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > ed
> > > > > > > > > > out everyone in each city--they would never have to go to=
> war=3D
> > > =A0aga=3D3D

> > > > > inst
> > > > > > > > > > those cities in the future.
> >
> > > > > > > > > So, you're OK with genocide then?
> >
> > > > > > > > > Wow! All I can say is Wow!
> >

> > > > > > > > In those cases mentioned in the OT--yes. In regard to droppin=
> g tw=3D
> > > o nu=3D3D

> > > > > kes
> > > > > > > > on Japan--I was also in favor of it.
> >
> > > > > > > Okay then, here's a little scenario for you.
> >
> > > > > > > Your god puts in a bona fide appearance.
> >
> > > > > > > Seen by thousands of Roman Catholics.
> >
> > > > > > > And he tells them in no uncertain terms.
> >

> > > > > > > That if the other Christians wont convert to the Roman Catholic=
> way=3D

> > > .
> >
> > > > > > > That the Roman Catholics must kill them all.
> >
> > > > > > > Would you be in favour of that genocidal slaughter?
> >
> > > > > > Yes
> >

> > > > > Even if it meant you and your family, friends and loved ones would =
> be
> > > > > slaughtered without mercy?
> >
> > > > I would not care. God would send the Christians that were killed to h=
> eave=3D

> > > n.
> >
> > > You aren't keeping up, are you.
> >
> > > God has ordered the Roman Catholics to slaughter all the Christians
> > > that won't become Roman Catholics.
> >
> > > So he's not going to welcome those dead into heaven.
> >
> > > Why?
> >
> > > Because they didn't convert.
> >
> > > You really must pay attention.
> >
> > OK--I now get it. Thanks. I still would not become a Catholic. We both
> > know that God would never do anything like that.
>
> You might want to believe that.
>
> However go to your bible.
>
> Read the accounts of god telling his chosen people to slaughter in his
> name.
>
> Now tell me you know for sure your alleged god wouldn't do it again.
>
> And think about, wouldn't you want to stay on the right side of your
> alleged god?
>
> After all, if you didn't, you'd end up in hell.

God knew that those people were evil people.

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 23, 7:40 am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article

> <c3eb6372-c27d-4e25-9aa5-b9ddca5ee...@m18g2000vbl.googlegroups.com>,

Note that these accounts are written by the authors of the Bible.

Note that there is no contemporary account written by the victims.

Why? Because there were no survivors.

So how do you really know they were evil people?

Seems to me these so-called "evil people" did very little to piss your
god off.

Occupying the wrong territory, worshipping the wrong god, and so on.

Now consider my scenario.

Your god has told the Roman Catholics to kill all other Christians
that don't convert.

Obviously this would make them "evil people" according to your god's
commands.

Because they are not obeying him.

[Jeanne Douglas]

Jason wrote:

> Yes, but the reason he done it was to help prevent another nation that are
> very near America from becoming another communist nation.

Wrong. It was done to overthrow a democratically-elected government.

> If the liberal democrats in Congress had voted in favor of funding the
> Contras--Reagan would not have had to sell arms to terrorists to fund the
> contras.

What? Are you serious?

The contras WERE terrorists. Why are you pretending you don't know
this?

JD

[Jason]

In article
<711675f0-6e0a-4d5b...@n22g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>,

They done some bad things but were fighting against communists.

[Jason]

In article
<42d49c5f-c37e-49c7...@p6g2000yqi.googlegroups.com>, Devils
Advocaat <manky...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Apr 23, 7:40=A0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > In article
> > <c3eb6372-c27d-4e25-9aa5-b9ddca5ee...@m18g2000vbl.googlegroups.com>,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Devils Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > On Apr 23, 1:08=3DA0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > > > In article

> > > > <05f12dcf-1fd0-480f-8351-56b7ea80b...@21g2000vbh.googlegroups.com>, D=
> evil=3D
> > > s
> >
> > > > Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > On Apr 22, 10:09=3D3DA0pm, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > > > > > In article

> > > > > > <7a8a3160-966c-449f-b6ad-077c17173...@r32g2000yqj.googlegroups.co=

> m>,
> >
> > > > > > Devils Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > On Apr 22, 7:30=3D3D3DA0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > > > > > > > In article

> > > > > > > > <9f64a0e4-3217-4d56-9e84-4cdf5eca4...@u7g2000yqc.googlegroups=
> .com=3D
> > > >, D=3D3D
> > > > > evil=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > s
> >
> > > > > > > > Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Apr 21, 7:55=3D3D3D3DA0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrot=
> e:
> > > > > > > > > > In article <dfritzin-715FDB.09191420042...@news.eternal-s=
> epte=3D
> > > mber=3D3D
> > > > > .org=3D3D3D

> > > > > > > >,
> >
> > > > > > > > > > David Fritzinger <dfrit...@nospamtome.hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > In article

> > > > > > > > > > > <Jason-2004120026150...@66-53-211-164.lsan.mdsg-pacwest=
> .com=3D
> > > >,
> > > > > > > > > > > =3D3D3D3DA0Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > In article <9C%jr.111208$s82.42...@newsfe10.iad>, Tom=
> McD=3D
> > > onal=3D3D

> > > > > d
> > > > > > > > > > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > On 4/19/2012 4:08 PM, Jason wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > In article<8oVjr.9292$kb7....@newsfe20.iad>, Tom =
> McDo=3D
> > > nald
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> =3D3D3D3DA0wrote:

> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> On 4/18/2012 11:46 PM, Jason wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>> In article<5qOdncrmlacQ7RLSnZ2dnUVZ_t-dn...@gig=
> anew=3D
> > > s.co=3D3D
> > > > > m>, =3D3D3D
> > > > > > > linu=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > xgal

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =3D3D3D3DA0 wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Jason wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> In article<GpOdnUvTjKU86BPSnZ2dnUVZ_sSdn...@g=
> igan=3D
> > > ews.=3D3D
> > > > > com>=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > , li=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > nuxgal

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> <linux...@cleanposts.com> =3D3D3D3DA0 wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Jason wrote:
> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> You are correct. However, I have read the e=
> ntir=3D
> > > e Bi=3D3D
> > > > > ble.=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > =3D3DA0Whe=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > n the
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jews went
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> from Egypt to the Holy Land--they encounter=
> ed e=3D
> > > vil =3D3D
> > > > > grou=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > ps o=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > f
> > > > > > > > > > people.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> They weren't Jews, they were Hebrews back th=
> en.
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> OK the Hebrews encountered evil groups of peo=
> ple =3D
> > > and =3D3D
> > > > > God =3D3D3D
> > > > > > > orde=3D3D3D3D

> > > > > > > > > red the
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Hebrews to go to war with them and kill them.
> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Their "evil" consisted of living in the land t=
> hat =3D
> > > the =3D3D
> > > > > Hebr=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > ews =3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > wanted.
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>> No--they were evil long before the HEBREWS even=
> cam=3D
> > > e to=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0tha=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > t pa=3D3D3D3D

> > > > > > > > > rt of
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > the world.
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> How?
> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bowing down to false Gods and not obeying the com=
> mand=3D
> > > ment=3D3D
> > > > > s.
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Interesting. So they were murdered because they wer=
> e ev=3D
> > > il b=3D3D
> > > > > ecau=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > se t=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > hey
> > > > > > > > > > > > > didn't know about the Hebrew god, and therefore had=
> no =3D
> > > chan=3D3D
> > > > > ce t=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > o wo=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > rship
> > > > > > > > > > > > > him?
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > How about the folks just to the north of the Promis=
> ed L=3D
> > > and?=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0How=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > =3D3DA0abo=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > ut
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mesopotamia? How about Anatolia? None of the folks =
> in t=3D
> > > hose=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0lan=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > ds k=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > new
> > > > > > > > > > > > > about or worshiped the Hebrew god? Why weren't they=
> ext=3D
> > > ermi=3D3D
> > > > > nate=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > d, t=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > oo?
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Why was it only the folks living around the Hebrews=
> in =3D
> > > what=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0bec=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > ame =3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Holy Land that had to be wiped out? Wouldn't the wo=
> rld =3D
> > > have=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0bee=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > n a
> > > > > > > > > > > > > better place had the Hebrews killed everyone who di=
> dn't=3D
> > > =A0bel=3D3D
> > > > > ieve=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > =3D3DA0and
> > > > > > > > > > > > > worship as they did?
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Or was it that they were a Canaanite tribe, or grou=
> p of=3D
> > > =A0tri=3D3D
> > > > > bes,=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > =3D3DA0tha=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > t
> > > > > > > > > > > > > used the 'god' excuse to conquer their neighbors to=
> get=3D
> > > =A0the=3D3D
> > > > > ir l=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > ands=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > =3D3D3DA0and
> > > > > > > > > > > > > towns and fields and flocks? And, some of the time,=
> the=3D
> > > ir w=3D3D
> > > > > omen=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > ?
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Back in those days--that is the way wars were fought.=
> One=3D
> > > =A0of =3D3D
> > > > > the =3D3D3D
> > > > > > > reas=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > ons
> > > > > > > > > > > > was that if they had allowed over half of the people =
> in e=3D
> > > ach =3D3D
> > > > > city=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > =3D3DA0the=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > y
> > > > > > > > > > > > beat in battle to live--it would mean they would have=
> to =3D
> > > have=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0to =3D3D3D
> > > > > > > figh=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > t
> > > > > > > > > > > > another battle against those cities 20 to 40 years la=
> ter.=3D
> > > =A0If =3D3D
> > > > > they=3D3D3D
> > > > > > > =3D3DA0wip=3D3D3D3D
> > > > > > > > > ed
> > > > > > > > > > > > out everyone in each city--they would never have to g=
> o to=3D
> > > =A0war=3D3D
> > > > > =3DA0aga=3D3D3D

> > > > > > > inst
> > > > > > > > > > > > those cities in the future.
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > So, you're OK with genocide then?
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > Wow! All I can say is Wow!
> >

> > > > > > > > > > In those cases mentioned in the OT--yes. In regard to dro=
> ppin=3D
> > > g tw=3D3D
> > > > > o nu=3D3D3D

> > > > > > > kes
> > > > > > > > > > on Japan--I was also in favor of it.
> >
> > > > > > > > > Okay then, here's a little scenario for you.
> >
> > > > > > > > > Your god puts in a bona fide appearance.
> >
> > > > > > > > > Seen by thousands of Roman Catholics.
> >
> > > > > > > > > And he tells them in no uncertain terms.
> >

> > > > > > > > > That if the other Christians wont convert to the Roman Cath=
> olic=3D
> > > =A0way=3D3D

> > > > > .
> >
> > > > > > > > > That the Roman Catholics must kill them all.
> >
> > > > > > > > > Would you be in favour of that genocidal slaughter?
> >
> > > > > > > > Yes
> >

> > > > > > > Even if it meant you and your family, friends and loved ones wo=
> uld =3D
> > > be
> > > > > > > slaughtered without mercy?
> >
> > > > > > I would not care. God would send the Christians that were killed =
> to h=3D
> > > eave=3D3D

> > > > > n.
> >
> > > > > You aren't keeping up, are you.
> >
> > > > > God has ordered the Roman Catholics to slaughter all the Christians
> > > > > that won't become Roman Catholics.
> >
> > > > > So he's not going to welcome those dead into heaven.
> >
> > > > > Why?
> >
> > > > > Because they didn't convert.
> >
> > > > > You really must pay attention.
> >

> > > > OK--I now get it. Thanks. I still would not become a Catholic. We bot=

> h
> > > > know that God would never do anything like that.
> >
> > > You might want to believe that.
> >
> > > However go to your bible.
> >
> > > Read the accounts of god telling his chosen people to slaughter in his
> > > name.
> >
> > > Now tell me you know for sure your alleged god wouldn't do it again.
> >
> > > And think about, wouldn't you want to stay on the right side of your
> > > alleged god?
> >
> > > After all, if you didn't, you'd end up in hell.
> >
> > God knew that those people were evil people.
>
> Note that these accounts are written by the authors of the Bible.
>
> Note that there is no contemporary account written by the victims.
>
> Why? Because there were no survivors.
>
> So how do you really know they were evil people?
>
> Seems to me these so-called "evil people" did very little to piss your
> god off.
>
> Occupying the wrong territory, worshipping the wrong god, and so on.
>
> Now consider my scenario.
>
> Your god has told the Roman Catholics to kill all other Christians
> that don't convert.
>
> Obviously this would make them "evil people" according to your god's
> commands.
>
> Because they are not obeying him.

God would not do it.

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 23, 9:14 am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article

> <711675f0-6e0a-4d5b-915a-1d205cd87...@n22g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>,

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Jeanne Douglas <hlwdj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Jason wrote:
>
> > > Yes, but the reason he done it was to help prevent another nation that are
> > > very near America from becoming another communist nation.
>
> > Wrong. It was done to overthrow a democratically-elected government.
>
> > > If the liberal democrats in Congress had voted in favor of funding the
> > > Contras--Reagan would not have had to sell arms to terrorists to fund the
> > > contras.
>
> > What? Are you serious?
>
> > The contras WERE terrorists. Why are you pretending you don't know
> > this?
>
> > JD
>
> They done some bad things but were fighting against communists.

So a bunch of terrorists do bad things to some communists, and that's
okay is it?

Your moral compass seems to be all over the place.

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 23, 9:15 am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:

[snipped for brevity]

Your god has done it before according to the Bible.

So what's to stop your god doing the same thing again?

You really aren't keeping up with the scenario, are you?

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
news:Jason-23041...@66-53-216-70.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

Big deal.

Hitler was fighting against the communists too.

Does that mean the Nazi atrocities committed
in his invasion of Russia were justified?

[David Fritzinger]

In article <Jason-22041...@66-53-216-70.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com>,

The Contras were terrorists. I have provided documentation of this
before. You are nothing but a liar.

"Contra militants based in Honduras waged a guerilla war to topple the
government of Nicaragua.[14][15] The Contras' form of warfare was "one
of consistent and bloody abuse of human rights, of murder, torture,
mutilation, rape, arson, destruction and kidnapping."[16][17] The
"Contras systematically engage in violent abuses... so prevalent that
these may be said to be their principal means of waging war."[18] A
Human Rights Watch report found that the Contras were guilty of
targeting health care clinics and health care workers for assassination;
kidnapping civilians; torturing and executing civilians, including
children, who were captured in combat; raping women; indiscriminately
attacking civilians and civilian homes; seizing civilian property; and
burning civilian houses in captured towns.[19]"
From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran耶ontra_affair

[Tom McDonald]

On 4/23/2012 3:15 AM, Jason wrote:
> In article
> <42d49c5f-c37e-49c7...@p6g2000yqi.googlegroups.com>, Devils
> Advocaat<manky...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Apr 23, 7:40=A0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
>>> In article
>>> <c3eb6372-c27d-4e25-9aa5-b9ddca5ee...@m18g2000vbl.googlegroups.com>,
>>> Devils Advocaat<mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Apr 23, 1:08=3DA0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
>>>>> In article
>>>>> <05f12dcf-1fd0-480f-8351-56b7ea80b...@21g2000vbh.googlegroups.com>, D=
>> evil=3D
>>>> s
>>>
>>>>> Advocaat<mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:

<snip>

But God *did* do it. That's the premise. Would you put your own personal
pride in your chosen religion over the commandment of God to convert to
Roman Catholicism?

Then you would surely die the second death, because you refused to
believe in the One True God and His Word.

Now, given that, would you become Roman Catholic if God ordered it?

[Jason]

In article
<a46600d8-5144-4ab8...@d4g2000vbn.googlegroups.com>, Devils
Advocaat <manky...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Apr 23, 9:14=A0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > In article
> > <711675f0-6e0a-4d5b-915a-1d205cd87...@n22g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Jeanne Douglas <hlwdj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Jason wrote:
> >

> > > > Yes, but the reason he done it was to help prevent another nation tha=

> t are
> > > > very near America from becoming another communist nation.
> >
> > > Wrong. It was done to overthrow a democratically-elected government.
> >

> > > > If the liberal democrats in Congress had voted in favor of funding th=
> e
> > > > Contras--Reagan would not have had to sell arms to terrorists to fund=

> the
> > > > contras.
> >
> > > What? Are you serious?
> >
> > > The contras WERE terrorists. Why are you pretending you don't know
> > > this?
> >
> > > JD
> >
> > They done some bad things but were fighting against communists.
>
> So a bunch of terrorists do bad things to some communists, and that's
> okay is it?
>
> Your moral compass seems to be all over the place.

Our soldiers and the NATO soldiers have also been known to have done some
bad things--even our Secret Service agents were recently caught having sex
with prostitutes and in one case even refused to pay one of them.

[Jason]

In article <XnsA03E4FC332942...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

Good point--in that case it was bad--since if he had beaten the
comminists--he would eventually have gone after America.

[Jason]

In article
<249e164e-c385-457e...@b2g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>, Devils
Advocaat <manky...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Apr 23, 9:15=A0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
>
> [snipped for brevity]
>
> > > > > > > You aren't keeping up, are you.
> >

> > > > > > > God has ordered the Roman Catholics to slaughter all the Christ=

> ians
> > > > > > > that won't become Roman Catholics.
> >
> > > > > > > So he's not going to welcome those dead into heaven.
> >
> > > > > > > Why?
> >
> > > > > > > Because they didn't convert.
> >
> > > > > > > You really must pay attention.
> >

> > > > > > OK--I now get it. Thanks. I still would not become a Catholic. We=
> bot=3D

> > > h
> > > > > > know that God would never do anything like that.
> >
> > > > > You might want to believe that.
> >
> > > > > However go to your bible.
> >

> > > > > Read the accounts of god telling his chosen people to slaughter in =
> his
> > > > > name.
> >
> > > > > Now tell me you know for sure your alleged god wouldn't do it again=
> .
> >
> > > > > And think about, wouldn't you want to stay on the right side of you=

> r
> > > > > alleged god?
> >
> > > > > After all, if you didn't, you'd end up in hell.
> >
> > > > God knew that those people were evil people.
> >
> > > Note that these accounts are written by the authors of the Bible.
> >
> > > Note that there is no contemporary account written by the victims.
> >
> > > Why? Because there were no survivors.
> >
> > > So how do you really know they were evil people?
> >
> > > Seems to me these so-called "evil people" did very little to piss your
> > > god off.
> >
> > > Occupying the wrong territory, worshipping the wrong god, and so on.
> >
> > > Now consider my scenario.
> >
> > > Your god has told the Roman Catholics to kill all other Christians
> > > that don't convert.
> >
> > > Obviously this would make them "evil people" according to your god's
> > > commands.
> >
> > > Because they are not obeying him.
> >
> > God would not do it.
>
> Your god has done it before according to the Bible.
>
> So what's to stop your god doing the same thing again?
>
> You really aren't keeping up with the scenario, are you?

Yes, but Christians in America are not evil people.

[Tom McDonald]

Many are, and all are sinners. Many do evil every day of their lives,
and still consider themselves saved.

And, in the above scenario, it's not a matter of being good or evil;
it's a matter of believing the 'right' things. If you are wrong, you
will go to hell; in the above scenario, you could be killed, justly, if
*you* refused to convert to Catholicism. And God would approve

BTW, how many Christians in America have sold all they have, given the
proceeds to the poor, and followed Jesus? Any who have not done so are
evil, and deserve Hell.

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 23, 7:32 pm, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article

> <249e164e-c385-457e-9926-a5d297462...@b2g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>, Devils

Have you lost track of this line of debate so soon?

[Jason]

In article
<db6931cb-4b0f-47f5...@h9g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>, Devils
Advocaat <manky...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Apr 23, 7:32=A0pm, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > In article

> > <249e164e-c385-457e-9926-a5d297462...@b2g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>, Devil=
> s
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > On Apr 23, 9:15=3DA0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> >
> > > [snipped for brevity]
> >
> > > > > > > > > You aren't keeping up, are you.
> >

> > > > > > > > > God has ordered the Roman Catholics to slaughter all the Ch=
> rist=3D

> > > ians
> > > > > > > > > that won't become Roman Catholics.
> >
> > > > > > > > > So he's not going to welcome those dead into heaven.
> >
> > > > > > > > > Why?
> >
> > > > > > > > > Because they didn't convert.
> >
> > > > > > > > > You really must pay attention.
> >

> > > > > > > > OK--I now get it. Thanks. I still would not become a Catholic=
> . We=3D
> > > =A0bot=3D3D

> > > > > h
> > > > > > > > know that God would never do anything like that.
> >
> > > > > > > You might want to believe that.
> >
> > > > > > > However go to your bible.
> >

> > > > > > > Read the accounts of god telling his chosen people to slaughter=
> in =3D
> > > his
> > > > > > > name.
> >
> > > > > > > Now tell me you know for sure your alleged god wouldn't do it a=
> gain=3D
> > > .
> >
> > > > > > > And think about, wouldn't you want to stay on the right side of=
> you=3D

> > > r
> > > > > > > alleged god?
> >
> > > > > > > After all, if you didn't, you'd end up in hell.
> >
> > > > > > God knew that those people were evil people.
> >
> > > > > Note that these accounts are written by the authors of the Bible.
> >
> > > > > Note that there is no contemporary account written by the victims.
> >
> > > > > Why? Because there were no survivors.
> >
> > > > > So how do you really know they were evil people?
> >

> > > > > Seems to me these so-called "evil people" did very little to piss y=
> our
> > > > > god off.
> >
> > > > > Occupying the wrong territory, worshipping the wrong god, and so on=

> .
> >
> > > > > Now consider my scenario.
> >
> > > > > Your god has told the Roman Catholics to kill all other Christians
> > > > > that don't convert.
> >

> > > > > Obviously this would make them "evil people" according to your god'=

> s
> > > > > commands.
> >
> > > > > Because they are not obeying him.
> >
> > > > God would not do it.
> >
> > > Your god has done it before according to the Bible.
> >
> > > So what's to stop your god doing the same thing again?
> >
> > > You really aren't keeping up with the scenario, are you?
> >
> > Yes, but Christians in America are not evil people.
>
> Have you lost track of this line of debate so soon?

I figured out the road that you were traveling on. I chose a different
road in my last response. I am not going down your road.

[Jason]

In article <0fhlr.24713$Ex1....@newsfe18.iad>, Tom McDonald

You are correct. If god killed every sinner in America--most everyone
except for small children and babies would be killed. Perhaps several
thousand really great people may be spared.

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in news:Jason-2304121131560001@66-53-209-
117.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

So you agree your "but they were fighting communists"
is NO excuse for the Contras and their terrorism?

[Jason]

In article <XnsA03EAA71C6FDF...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

Nothing is simple. The contras would not have attacked us if they had won
that war. The Nazis would have attacked us if they won that war against
the communists.

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
news:Jason-23041...@67-150-123-246.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

They would have set up a dictatorship just like
the thug Somoza that the Sandinstas overthrew. And the
US would have supported him, as we did with all dictators
who waved the "anticommunist" flag.

> The Nazis would have attacked us if they won that war
> against the communists.

Nope. Hitler had no designs on the US, much
less the power to occupy it.

The contras were terrorist thugs and the Democrats
were right to refuse aid to them. Reagan sold arms to
one group of terrorists in order to aid another group
of terrorists, illegally. Can you imagine the rightwing
outrage if a Democrat did that?

[Jason]

In article <XnsA03F47802AF52...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

I disagree--I believe Hitler's end goal was to take over the world. I seem
to remember learning that from a history professor.

Believe it or not--the end goal of the Muslims is to take over the world.
They are trying to take over Spain without starting a war. The way they
plan to do it by sending about 100,000 or more Muslim couples per year to
Spain. After more than 55% of the people in Spain are Muslims--they will
vote in Muslims to take over the government and establish Shariah law.

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
news:Jason-25041...@67-150-126-160.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

Wrong. Read Mein Kampf.

>
> Believe it or not--the end goal of the Muslims is to take over the
> world.

As opposed to Christianity?

> They are trying to take over Spain without starting a war. The
> way they plan to do it by sending about 100,000 or more Muslim couples
> per year to Spain. After more than 55% of the people in Spain are
> Muslims--they will vote in Muslims to take over the government and
> establish Shariah law.

Your paranoia knows no bounds.

[Jason]

In article <XnsA040DAD2B1D14...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

OK--How many Muslims are there in Spain at this point in time?

Or what percentage of the population of Spain are Muslims?

A quick google search reveals that Wikipedia (see below) is reporting that
"As of 2007, it is estimated that over 1 million Muslims live in
Spain...."

Why do you believe that is true--it is just by chance that at least a
million Muslims are living in Spain?



Muslims Reconquer Spain as al Andalus II | Islam vs the West ...
Feb 7, 2012 ... The fear is growing in towns like Salt, where the
political takeover by Muslims is within view. A pro-Spain party, Platform
for Catalonia, ...
www.limitstogrowth.org/.../muslims-reconquer-spain-as-al-andalus-ii/ - 61k
- Cached - Similar pages


Islam in Spain - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
For key historical dates, see Timeline of the Muslim presence in the Iberian
peninsula. As of 2007, it is estimated that over 1 million Muslims live in
Spain,
most of ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Spain - 97k - Cached - Similar pages

Why did the Muslims conquer Spain? - Yahoo! Answers
Why did the Muslims conquer Spain? ... Muslims are aggressive and want to
impose their theology on everyone and anyone they can ...
answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20120130171249AAu0yBj - 50k - Cached
- Similar pages



CSMH History / Medieval Africa- Muslims conquer Spain 7-1
This page is about the Muslims conquering Spain. This page will also ... They
wanted to conquer Ghana first before they conquered spain. They finally
reach ...
csmhhistory.pbworks.com/.../Medieval%20Africa-
%20Muslims%20conquer%20Spain%207-1 - 26k - Cached - Similar pages

FC46B: Muslim civilization in Spain (711-1492) - The Flow of History
Several factors aided the rapid Muslim conquest of Spain. First ... class
citizens,
taking the best lands and lions' share of the plunder for themselves. ...
and still
harbors designs for political independence, much like the Basques do in the
north-west. ... over the frontiers and presided over the height of Muslim
power in
Spain.
www.flowofhistory.com/units/asia/6/fc46b - 35k - Cached - Similar pages

Muslims Reconquer Spain as al Andalus II | VDARE.com
Feb 7, 2012 ... The fear is growing in towns like Salt, where the
political takeover by Muslims is
within view. A pro-Spain party, Platform for Catalonia, ...
www.vdare.com/posts/muslims-reconquer-spain-as-al-andalus-ii - 66k - Cached -

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 26, 1:30 am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article <XnsA03F47802AF52nomailcomcast...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Holman <nomailcomcast.net> wrote:
> > Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
> >news:Jason-23041...@67-150-123-246.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:
>

> > > In article <XnsA03EAA71C6FDFnomailcomcast...@216.196.121.131>,

> > > Mitchell Holman <nomailcomcast.net> wrote:
>
> > >> Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in

> > >>news:Jason-23041...@66-53-209-117.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:
>
> > >> > In article <XnsA03E4FC332942nomailcomcast...@216.196.121.131>,

> > >> > Mitchell Holman <nomailcomcast.net> wrote:
>
> > >> >> Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
> > >> >>news:Jason-23041...@66-53-216-70.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:
>
> > >> >> > In article

> > >> >> > <711675f0-6e0a-4d5b-915a-1d205cd87...@n22g2000yqb.googlegroups.co

Before the Christians started expanding their Iberian territories the
bulk of he Iberian Pennisula was occupied by the Moors, who were
Muslims. So if what you claim is true, which I doubt, they would only
be trying to reclaim what had been theirs before.

[Jason]

In article
<2dc99fe6-2dc1-4e27...@dc2g2000vbb.googlegroups.com>,
Devils Advocaat <manky...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Apr 26, 1:30=A0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > In article <XnsA03F47802AF52nomailcomcast...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Holman <nomailcomcast.net> wrote:
> > > Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
> > >news:Jason-23041...@67-150-123-246.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:
> >
> > > > In article <XnsA03EAA71C6FDFnomailcomcast...@216.196.121.131>,
> > > > Mitchell Holman <nomailcomcast.net> wrote:
> >
> > > >> Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
> > > >>news:Jason-23041...@66-53-209-117.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:
> >
> > > >> > In article <XnsA03E4FC332942nomailcomcast...@216.196.121.131>,
> > > >> > Mitchell Holman <nomailcomcast.net> wrote:
> >
> > > >> >> Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
> > > >> >>news:Jason-23041...@66-53-216-70.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:
> >
> > > >> >> > In article

> > > >> >> > <711675f0-6e0a-4d5b-915a-1d205cd87...@n22g2000yqb.googlegroups.=

> co
> > > >> >> > m>, Jeanne Douglas <hlwdj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > >> >> >> Jason wrote:
> >
> > > >> >> >> > Yes, but the reason he done it was to help prevent another
> > > >> >> >> > nation that are very near America from becoming another
> > > >> >> >> > communist
> > > >> nation.
> >
> > > >> >> >> Wrong. It was done to overthrow a democratically-elected
> > > >> government.
> >
> > > >> >> >> > If the liberal democrats in Congress had voted in favor of
> > > >> funding
> > > >> >> >> > the Contras--Reagan would not have had to sell arms to
> > > >> >> >> > terrorists to fund the contras.
> >
> > > >> >> >> What? Are you serious?
> >
> > > >> >> >> The contras WERE terrorists. Why are you pretending you don't
> > > >> >> >> know this?
> >
> > > >> >> >> JD
> >
> > > >> >> > They done some bad things but were fighting against communists.
> >

> > > >> >> =A0 =A0 Big deal.
> >
> > > >> >> =A0 =A0 Hitler was fighting against the communists too.
> >
> > > >> >> =A0 =A0 Does that mean the Nazi atrocities committed

> > > >> >> in his invasion of Russia were justified?
> >
> > > >> > Good point--in that case it was bad--since if he had beaten the
> > > >> > comminists--he would eventually have gone after America.
> >

> > > >> =A0 =A0 So you agree your "but they were fighting communists"

> > > >> is NO excuse for the Contras and their terrorism?
> >
> > > > Nothing is simple. The contras would not have attacked us if they had
> > > > won that war.
> >

> > > =A0 =A0 =A0They would have set up a dictatorship just like

> > > the thug Somoza that the Sandinstas overthrew. And the
> > > US would have supported him, as we did with all dictators
> > > who waved the "anticommunist" flag.
> >
> > > > The Nazis would have attacked us if they won that war
> > > > against the communists.
> >

> > > =A0 =A0 =A0Nope. Hitler had no designs on the US, much

> > > less the power to occupy it.
> >

> > > =A0 =A0 =A0The contras were terrorist thugs and the Democrats

> > > were right to refuse aid to them. Reagan sold arms to
> > > one group of terrorists in order to aid another group
> > > of terrorists, illegally. Can you imagine the rightwing
> > > outrage if a Democrat did that?
> >

> > I disagree--I believe Hitler's end goal was to take over the world. I see=

> m
> > to remember learning that from a history professor.
> >
> > Believe it or not--the end goal of the Muslims is to take over the world.
> > They are trying to take over Spain without starting a war. The way they
> > plan to do it by sending about 100,000 or more Muslim couples per year to
> > Spain. After more than 55% of the people in Spain are Muslims--they will
> > vote in Muslims to take over the government and establish Shariah law.
>
> Before the Christians started expanding their Iberian territories the
> bulk of he Iberian Pennisula was occupied by the Moors, who were
> Muslims. So if what you claim is true, which I doubt, they would only
> be trying to reclaim what had been theirs before.

Yes, that is the main reason they have focused on Spain. One website
states that over a million Muslims have already been moved into Spain so
they off to a good start on re-taking Spain. They don't have short-term
goals like America. Instead, they have long term goals. It may take
another 50 or more years before over 50% of the population of Spain are
Muslims. At that point in time, they will vote in Muslims to take over the
government of Spain. Most people in America and in Europe don't understand
long-term goals so don't understand that a million Muslims in Spain are a
problem. After 10 thousand Muslims are in Spain, the officials in Spain
may suddenly realize that "Houston, we have a problem".

[Wombat]

The Moors invaded and conquered Spain in the 8th century, IIRC.
Before that it had been Christian, I believe.

[Devils Advocaat]

Does anyone know what it was before it was Christian though?

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 26, 8:18 am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> In article

> <2dc99fe6-2dc1-4e27-9074-710718b32...@dc2g2000vbb.googlegroups.com>,

I don't need you to parrot once again the waffle from some anti-Muslim
website which you have already parroted before. And may I suggest that
you don't presume that the people of Europe are as ignorant of what is
going on in their own backyard in the way that many Americans are
ignorant of what is going on in theirs.

[Wombat]

http://libro.uca.edu/mckenna/paganconc.htm does give some hints.

[Mitchell Holman]

Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
news:Jason-26041...@66-53-213-145.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

The old "Democraphics Is Destiny" argument. Last
time I heard that one it was being used in Northern
Ireland, where Catholics decided since they were
out-breeding the Protestants by a major factor all
the had to do was to wait a few generations and the
province would be theirs and Irish unity could begin.

[Alex W.]

Jason thinks that all Muslims are alike.
Jason does not realise that this is like saying all Christians
are alike, that a Baptist is the same as a Catholic is the same
as a Unitarian is the same as a Pentecostalist is the same as a
Mormon.

Jason also thinks that all Muslims are religious fanatics and
extremists. He is unaware of the fact that the vast majority of
Muslims are normal people who want only what we all want: a job,
a home, access to schools and doctors, a chance to bring up the
family in peace and security. maybe a few bob in the pocket to
splurge on a holiday or consumer goods.

Jason also does not know his history, or he would realise that
under Muslim rule, Spain was a beacon of religious freedom where
Muslims, Jews and Christians were free to live and worship as
they liked. He is ignorant of the fact that this rare golden age
of religious harmony and cultural flowering was ended by the
blood-drenched tyranny of Christian conquest.

[Tom McDonald]

On 4/26/2012 4:20 AM, Devils Advocaat wrote:
> On Apr 26, 8:31 am, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
>> On Apr 26, 7:06 am, Devils Advocaat<mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:

<snip>

>>> Before the Christians started expanding their Iberian territories the
>>> bulk of he Iberian Pennisula was occupied by the Moors, who were
>>> Muslims. So if what you claim is true, which I doubt, they would only
>>> be trying to reclaim what had been theirs before.
>>
>> The Moors invaded and conquered Spain in the 8th century, IIRC.
>> Before that it had been Christian, I believe.
>
> Does anyone know what it was before it was Christian though?

It was a province of Rome for a long time, so I'd think it'd have
worshiped the Roman gods along with any local gods they had had before
the Romans came.

[Devils Advocaat]

Many thanks for the input my tunnel digging marsupial. :)

[David Fritzinger]

In article <pZbmr.20163$FQ1...@newsfe12.iad>,

I believe also that Spain was still a Roman colony after Christianity
became the official religion of Rome, meaning that Christianity may also
have had a significant influence in Spain between the fall of the Roman
Empire and their conquering by the Moors.

[Tom McDonald]

On 4/25/2012 11:49 PM, Jason wrote:
> In article<XnsA040DAD2B1D14...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell
> Holman<nomailcomcast.net> wrote:
>
>> Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
>> news:Jason-25041...@67-150-126-160.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:

<snip>

>>> Believe it or not--the end goal of the Muslims is to take over the
>>> world.
>> As opposed to Christianity?
>>
>>> They are trying to take over Spain without starting a war. The
>>> way they plan to do it by sending about 100,000 or more Muslim couples
>>> per year to Spain. After more than 55% of the people in Spain are
>>> Muslims--they will vote in Muslims to take over the government and
>>> establish Shariah law.
>>
>> Your paranoia knows no bounds.
>
> OK--How many Muslims are there in Spain at this point in time?
>
> Or what percentage of the population of Spain are Muslims?
>
> A quick google search reveals that Wikipedia (see below) is reporting that
> "As of 2007, it is estimated that over 1 million Muslims live in
> Spain...."
>
> Why do you believe that is true--it is just by chance that at least a
> million Muslims are living in Spain?
>
> Muslims Reconquer Spain as al Andalus II | Islam vs the West ...
> Feb 7, 2012 ... The fear is growing in towns like Salt, where the
> political takeover by Muslims is within view. A pro-Spain party, Platform
> for Catalonia, ...
> www.limitstogrowth.org/.../muslims-reconquer-spain-as-al-andalus-ii/ - 61k
> - Cached - Similar pages

"Platform for Catalonia" is a racist party. It's not shocking that you
would use this to smear Muslims in Spain.

>
> Islam in Spain - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> For key historical dates, see Timeline of the Muslim presence in the Iberian
> peninsula. As of 2007, it is estimated that over 1 million Muslims live in
> Spain,
> most of ...
> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Spain - 97k - Cached - Similar pages

Historical information, which we all know. Or at least those of us not
you know.

> Why did the Muslims conquer Spain? - Yahoo! Answers
> Why did the Muslims conquer Spain? ... Muslims are aggressive and want to
> impose their theology on everyone and anyone they can ...
> answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20120130171249AAu0yBj - 50k - Cached
> - Similar pages

An answer to a question from some random dude does not equate to useful
information on this supposed Islamic invasion.

> CSMH History / Medieval Africa- Muslims conquer Spain 7-1
> This page is about the Muslims conquering Spain. This page will also ... They
> wanted to conquer Ghana first before they conquered spain. They finally
> reach ...
> csmhhistory.pbworks.com/.../Medieval%20Africa-
> %20Muslims%20conquer%20Spain%207-1 - 26k - Cached - Similar pages

More historical information. Interestingly, the Muslims who governed
Spain from ca. 700 to 1492 AD were tolerant of Christians and Jews;
while the Christians who ousted them were not tolerant of anyone,
including other Christians.

> FC46B: Muslim civilization in Spain (711-1492) - The Flow of History
> Several factors aided the rapid Muslim conquest of Spain. First ... class
> citizens,
> taking the best lands and lions' share of the plunder for themselves. ...
> and still
> harbors designs for political independence, much like the Basques do in the
> north-west. ... over the frontiers and presided over the height of Muslim
> power in
> Spain.
> www.flowofhistory.com/units/asia/6/fc46b - 35k - Cached - Similar pages

Ditto.

> Muslims Reconquer Spain as al Andalus II | VDARE.com
> Feb 7, 2012 ... The fear is growing in towns like Salt, where the
> political takeover by Muslims is
> within view. A pro-Spain party, Platform for Catalonia, ...
> www.vdare.com/posts/muslims-reconquer-spain-as-al-andalus-ii - 66k - Cached -
>

vdare.com is a racist, anti-immigrant fringe organization that wants to
keep American majority white.

Sorry, none of this supports your claim, unless you share the racism of
the Platform for Catalonia and vdare.com.

And just for shits and giggles, I looked up vdare.com. As I thought, it
was named after Virginia Dare, the first white child born to English
settlers in North America. IOW, they take their name from an illegal
immigrant's child. Now *that's* comedy!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VDARE

[Tom McDonald]

Spain was fully conquered under Augustus, and was Christianized when
Constantine converted the empire. So it was pagan early, and then
Christian after the early 4th century. After the fall of Rome, it
appears to have remained Christianized. It certainly was Christian at
the time of the Moorish invasion, and continued to have a large
Christian population even during the rule of the Moors.

This is the Wiki article on the Roman province(s) of Spain:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hispania

[David Fritzinger]

In article <WMgmr.415$tH5...@newsfe11.iad>,

Thanks for the information. I admit I was being lazy, but I'm happy
that, unlike Jason, my educated guess proved to be correct.

[Jason]

In article
<fc93d6bb-f0fb-4cf9...@s7g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>, Devils
Advocaat <manky...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Apr 26, 8:18=A0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > In article
> > <2dc99fe6-2dc1-4e27-9074-710718b32...@dc2g2000vbb.googlegroups.com>,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Devils Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > On Apr 26, 1:30=3DA0am, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
> > > > In article <XnsA03F47802AF52nomailcomcast...@216.196.121.131>, Mitche=

> ll
> >
> > > > Holman <nomailcomcast.net> wrote:
> > > > > Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
> > > > >news:Jason-23041...@67-150-123-246.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:
> >
> > > > > > In article <XnsA03EAA71C6FDFnomailcomcast...@216.196.121.131>,
> > > > > > Mitchell Holman <nomailcomcast.net> wrote:
> >
> > > > > >> Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in
> > > > > >>news:Jason-23041...@66-53-209-117.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com:
> >
> > > > > >> > In article <XnsA03E4FC332942nomailcomcast...@216.196.121.131>,
> > > > > >> > Mitchell Holman <nomailcomcast.net> wrote:
> >
> > > > > >> >> Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in

> > > > > >> >>news:Jason-23041...@66-53-216-70.lsan.mdsg-pacwest.com=
> :
> >
> > > > > >> >> > In article
> > > > > >> >> > <711675f0-6e0a-4d5b-915a-1d205cd87...@n22g2000yqb.googlegro=
> ups.=3D

> > > co
> > > > > >> >> > m>, Jeanne Douglas <hlwdj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > > > >> >> >> Jason wrote:
> >

> > > > > >> >> >> > Yes, but the reason he done it was to help prevent anoth=

> er
> > > > > >> >> >> > nation that are very near America from becoming another
> > > > > >> >> >> > communist
> > > > > >> nation.
> >
> > > > > >> >> >> Wrong. It was done to overthrow a democratically-elected
> > > > > >> government.
> >

> > > > > >> >> >> > If the liberal democrats in Congress had voted in favor =

> of
> > > > > >> funding
> > > > > >> >> >> > the Contras--Reagan would not have had to sell arms to
> > > > > >> >> >> > terrorists to fund the contras.
> >
> > > > > >> >> >> What? Are you serious?
> >

> > > > > >> >> >> The contras WERE terrorists. Why are you pretending you do=

> n't
> > > > > >> >> >> know this?
> >
> > > > > >> >> >> JD
> >

> > > > > >> >> > They done some bad things but were fighting against communi=
> sts.
> >
> > > > > >> >> =3DA0 =3DA0 Big deal.
> >
> > > > > >> >> =3DA0 =3DA0 Hitler was fighting against the communists too.
> >
> > > > > >> >> =3DA0 =3DA0 Does that mean the Nazi atrocities committed

> > > > > >> >> in his invasion of Russia were justified?
> >

> > > > > >> > Good point--in that case it was bad--since if he had beaten th=

> e
> > > > > >> > comminists--he would eventually have gone after America.
> >

> > > > > >> =3DA0 =3DA0 So you agree your "but they were fighting communists=

> "
> > > > > >> is NO excuse for the Contras and their terrorism?
> >

> > > > > > Nothing is simple. The contras would not have attacked us if they=
> had
> > > > > > won that war.
> >
> > > > > =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0They would have set up a dictatorship just like

> > > > > the thug Somoza that the Sandinstas overthrew. And the
> > > > > US would have supported him, as we did with all dictators
> > > > > who waved the "anticommunist" flag.
> >
> > > > > > The Nazis would have attacked us if they won that war
> > > > > > against the communists.
> >

> > > > > =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0Nope. Hitler had no designs on the US, much

> > > > > less the power to occupy it.
> >

> > > > > =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0The contras were terrorist thugs and the Democrats

> > > > > were right to refuse aid to them. Reagan sold arms to
> > > > > one group of terrorists in order to aid another group
> > > > > of terrorists, illegally. Can you imagine the rightwing
> > > > > outrage if a Democrat did that?
> >

> > > > I disagree--I believe Hitler's end goal was to take over the world. I=
> see=3D

> > > m
> > > > to remember learning that from a history professor.
> >

> > > > Believe it or not--the end goal of the Muslims is to take over the wo=
> rld.
> > > > They are trying to take over Spain without starting a war. The way th=
> ey
> > > > plan to do it by sending about 100,000 or more Muslim couples per yea=
> r to
> > > > Spain. After more than 55% of the people in Spain are Muslims--they w=
> ill
> > > > vote in Muslims to take over the government and establish Shariah law=

> .
> >
> > > Before the Christians started expanding their Iberian territories the
> > > bulk of he Iberian Pennisula was occupied by the Moors, who were
> > > Muslims. So if what you claim is true, which I doubt, they would only
> > > be trying to reclaim what had been theirs before.
> >
> > Yes, that is the main reason they have focused on Spain. One website
> > states that over a million Muslims have already been moved into Spain so
> > they off to a good start on re-taking Spain. They don't have short-term
> > goals like America. Instead, they have long term goals. It may take
> > another 50 or more years before over 50% of the population of Spain are

> > Muslims. At that point in time, they will vote in Muslims to take over th=
> e
> > government of Spain. Most people in America and in Europe don't understan=

> d
> > long-term goals so don't understand that a million Muslims in Spain are a
> > problem. After 10 thousand Muslims are in Spain, the officials in Spain
> > may suddenly realize that "Houston, we have a problem".
>
> I don't need you to parrot once again the waffle from some anti-Muslim
> website which you have already parroted before. And may I suggest that
> you don't presume that the people of Europe are as ignorant of what is
> going on in their own backyard in the way that many Americans are
> ignorant of what is going on in theirs.

You are correct. Some of the conservatives in Europe are sounding the
alarm about what the Muslims are up to. They interviewed one such person
on Fox News. The Muslims put out death threats against him. It was last
year so I don't remember the details of what he said. I believe he wrote a
book and was promoting the book when he was interviewed. The Muslims
murdered a famous person several years ago for speaking out against the
Muslims. I don't remember his name. The story made it into the local news
paper.

[Jason]

In article <smrutm3b1fnp$.151qchb5...@40tude.net>,

You are correct and I agree with what you wrote above.

The point is that Muslims living today are very different than the Muslims
mentioned in your last paragraph.

They may be peaceful people but usually do whatever their leaders tell
them to do--to keep from losing their heads. For example, if the mullahs
tell them to vote for a Muslim candidate running for office--they will do
it--even if they are peace-loving Muslims.

[Jason]

In article <XnsA0414BDC85CA6...@216.196.121.131>, Mitchell

Well, it is working in Spain and eventually 50% of the population of Spain
will be Muslims and as a result will be able to vote in Muslim candidates
to take over the government of Spain without the loss of any lives.

In the case that you mentioned--they tried to out-breed the Protestants.
The Muslims are trying to out-breed the native citizens of Spain. They
have taken it to a higher level by the use of immigration. The Muslims are
sending about 100,000 Muslim immigrants to Spain from Muslim countries.
They do it every year--they already have about 1 million muslims in Spain
so are off to a good start. Some of the conservatives in Europe are
sounding the alarm. When they do it, they receive death threats from
Muslims to shut them up.

jason

[Devils Advocaat]

On Apr 26, 7:53 pm, David Fritzinger <dfrit...@nospamtome.hotmail.com>
wrote:
> In article <WMgmr.415$tH5...@newsfe11.iad>,

>  Tom McDonald <tmcdonald2...@charter.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 4/26/2012 10:28 AM, David Fritzinger wrote:

> > > In article<pZbmr.20163$FQ1....@newsfe12.iad>,
> > >   Tom McDonald<tmcdonald2...@charter.net>  wrote:

And I have to admit I too have learnt a lot from the recent input.

Thanks to all who contributed.