Applegate Open 2022

[Rick Ray]

I propose that there be no AO during 2022 for the following reasons:

1. There are three other competitive  events for 2022 during  the available  time block allowed by our primary landowner, any event must be after June 14th so as to not conflict with calving season. With the other events, the AO is unnecessary for the purposes of a national championship. 

2. The AO , and ,formerly the Rat Race , are too large for safety sake. Former safety director, Hayden Glatte, and myself, were opposed to the event having more than 75 pilots. The event has consistently surpassed this since 2008. The event facilitators have done this by first introducing a Sprint group in addition to the Race group , and then, later adding a SuperClinic. This allowed the organizers to argue that no one event had more than 75; thereby, completely ignoring and subvert the safety emphasis of having fewer pilots in the air. The larger numbers were consistently pushed on the local club in a high handed fashion ; being justify as to being necessary for the maintenance of a reasonable profit margin.

3. The SuperClinic is a good idea but very poorly, from a safety aspect, enacted due to the newer P2 and P3 pilots being encouraged  to launch in full-on, midday thermic conditions at WR. This is because the better time slots are given to the Race and Sprint races. Basically, we have been so lucky that we have not had a fatality or multiple serious injuries.  We cannot continue to gamble with their safety.

4. Some have made the argument that we have an obligation for continued instruction and offering a venue for a comp. I would think that 19 consecutive years probably would indicate that the local club and site have sufficiently paid their dues as far as this obligation goes. 

5. There has been a financial argument made that the event helps the larger community. That it does. In the period 2002-2013, before the requirement for membership became active, the local club shared with local community the resources that were available, irrespective of any largesse accrued to the club via the Rat Race. Since 2013 and the implementation of membership, there has been a yearly escalation of the cost of the event in order to main a profit margin for the organizers.  During this period, the club has benefited  in accumulating funds for a potential landing zone. But, the benefit to the local community , specifically from the club,  has not really increased.

6. This year, the club realized about  $6K from the event. This was due in part by too much overhead management  costs. 

Instead of an AO 2022, I suggest either  a sabbatical, no event at all, or, a radically revised event that only has a Superclinic or a Sprint  race with no more than 75 total attendees that are to be launched at reasonable times. 

[bowliosis]

Well said Rick.  The AO is running three events at the same time.  No other event even attempts to do that.  I personally don't think 75 pilots should be the limit, but rather one event at a time would make more sense as far as a safety perspective is concerned.

I also don't think that taking a season off from having an event would jeopardize the future possibilities.  Chelan and Pemberton used to alternate every other year.

With the possibility of four US National Competitions in 2022, I personally would not plan to fly in them all.  Only two US Competitions in two years are required for National Team Selection Points.  It is based on your best four results in the last two years, two of which need to be domestic (North American).

Respectfully, 

Jay Cady

Progression...@gmail.com

SundogParagliding.com

RVHPA Safety Director

+1(406)451-6895

[Norm Young]

How about some slimmed down version of the  Open, more safety minded, more oriented towards fun, and maybe without the competition? Seems like there is a valid argument to be made that if we stop doing it completely for one year we're going to lose our volunteers/team and they may not come back when we try to restart.  And we can't ignore the financials; the event is a big money spinner for the club.

Cheers,

Norm

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[Patrick Bovine]

6K!? A complete takeover of the site, potentially destroying landowner relationships, and kicking P2’s off the top that have no business flying mid-day because they paid an entry fee….Somebody is benefiting from the event, but I can guarantee it’s not the club! 6K….. I thought this was paragliding, not ponzigliding.

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[Dan Wells]

I look forward to a good discussion tonight at the board meeting.  I can address Rick’s points at the meeting.   Attached is the email I wrote to the board members supporting doing the event this year.

 

Dan

Dan Wells

Treasurer, RVHPA

503 804-1077

treasu...@rvhpa.org

[Rich Stewart]

I know the timeline is short for USHPA filings and we need to keep this in mind.

Dan has been the primary force behind the AO, but he was trying to bring new leader ship into the event. The addition costs in overhead were his attempt to hand the event off. I’m not sure the club benefited and there may be other pathways to consider in the future leadership. Perhaps Rick is correct, maybe we need to reevaluate the event and what sustainable leadership looks like.

I know there are other qualified pilots that would have an interest in a leadership position.

Rs

[Rich Stewart]

[Rich Stewart]

Do we have the zoom meeting link?

On Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 6:16 PM VP 2020 WillTaylor <vp2...@rvhpa.org> wrote:

🤣

Keyboard warrior and club comedian Mr Bovine strikes again! With such strong feelings you better come to the meeting and liven up the conversation!

[Patrick Bovine]

How the heck did Hangies get pulled into this lol

[Sam Crocker]

I never got one..

Soft Landings,

Sam Crocker

Tandem Flights and Instruction

Medford, OR

www.sundogparagliding.com

s...@sundogparagliding.com

503 781 1795

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From: rv...@googlegroups.com <rv...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Rich Stewart <n45...@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 6:32 PM
To: VP 2020 WillTaylor <vp2...@rvhpa.org>
Cc: 2019 RVHPA President Terri Eubanks <presid...@rvhpa.org>; Bon Stewart <stewa...@yahoo.com>; Dan Wells <pdx...@gmail.com>; Don Fitch <donfit...@yahoo.com>; Jay Cady <bowl...@yahoo.com>; Kevin Lee/Thermal Tracker <ke...@thermaltracker.com>; Norm Young <norm.clou...@gmail.com>; Patrick Bovine <patrick...@gmail.com>; Rick Ray <rick...@gmail.com>; mary beth wells <pdxw...@gmail.com>; nathan ghish <ghis...@gmail.com>; rv...@googlegroups.com <rv...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: Re: {RVHPA} Applegate Open 2022

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rvhpa/CANDuZ9VvrxdObd4Rkx5omtmzKqes1dX2zaCNR7RFRj1NEodbBw%40mail.gmail.com.

[Sam Crocker]

Was there a meeting tonight? Never saw any zoom info sent out...

Soft Landings,

Sam Crocker

Tandem Flights and Instruction

Medford, OR

www.sundogparagliding.com

s...@sundogparagliding.com

503 781 1795

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From: rv...@googlegroups.com <rv...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Dan Wells <pdx...@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 6:11 PM
To: 'Patrick Bovine' <patrick...@gmail.com>; 'Rick Ray' <rick...@gmail.com>
Cc: '2019 RVHPA President Terri Eubanks' <presid...@rvhpa.org>; 'Bon Stewart' <stewa...@yahoo.com>; 'Don Fitch' <donfit...@yahoo.com>; 'Jay Cady' <bowl...@yahoo.com>; 'Kevin Lee/Thermal Tracker' <ke...@thermaltracker.com>; 'Norm Young' <norm.clou...@gmail.com>; 'Rich Stewart' <n45...@gmail.com>; 'VP 2020 WillTaylor' <vp2...@rvhpa.org>; 'mary beth wells' <pdxw...@gmail.com>; 'nathan ghish' <ghis...@gmail.com>; rv...@googlegroups.com <rv...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: RE: {RVHPA} Applegate Open 2022

 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rvhpa/004e01d7bfcf%244d6f1520%24e84d3f60%24%40gmail.com.

[Norm Young]

I strongly recommend that we put a link up at least the day before on Telegram. Anything in email just gets buried after a couple days. I got a link but it was a week ago, and it just got lost in the mess of email.

Cheers,

Norm

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[Norm Young]

No...

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[Sam Crocker]

Norm I know your a big fan of Telegram, however I hardly ever use it!! 

  Somehow I missed the e mail sent out on the 2nd that Rick just foreworded to me, after seeing Dan post the treasurers report where he wrote that the zoom info would be forth coming I continued to look for it to no avail. Volunteers do the best they can and are appreciated! Oh well life goes on and I missed another opportunity to converse with my fellow pilots about the issues at hand but I think I will survive. Hope good things have prevailed in the discussions.

Soft Landings,

Sam Crocker

Tandem Flights and Instruction

Medford, OR

www.sundogparagliding.com

s...@sundogparagliding.com

503 781 1795

---

From: Norm Young <norm.clou...@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 9:24 PM
To: Sam Crocker <samw...@hotmail.com>
Cc: Rich Stewart <n45...@gmail.com>; VP 2020 WillTaylor <vp2...@rvhpa.org>; 2019 RVHPA President Terri Eubanks <presid...@rvhpa.org>; Bon Stewart <stewa...@yahoo.com>; Dan Wells <pdx...@gmail.com>; Don Fitch <donfit...@yahoo.com>; Jay Cady <bowl...@yahoo.com>; Kevin Lee/Thermal Tracker <ke...@thermaltracker.com>; Patrick Bovine <patrick...@gmail.com>; Rick Ray <rick...@gmail.com>; mary beth wells <pdxw...@gmail.com>; nathan ghish <ghis...@gmail.com>; rv...@googlegroups.com <rv...@googlegroups.com>

[Norm Young]

How about a post of the meeting link in both Telegram and via email just before the meeting as our new standard operating procedure. I understand that this was a close vote, and two of the members that were interested in this weren't able to attend, me because it fell through the cracks, and Jay because he was traveling. Seems like there's a fair amount of energy around this issue, and the appearance of undemocratic behavior is not going to help things.

Norm

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[Rich Stewart]

I think the leadership of the club has a responsibility to inform all members of meetings. Unfortunately this meeting was not only postponed until a hard stop date filing USHPA but the  Zoom link was at the bottom of a text message and easy to miss.

 This was a board meeting and although any member can speak only board members could vote.  So only having your voice on the matter would have counted, no general membership vote was taken.

The motion that Dan Wells put forth was passed by the board present.

Rs 

[Dan Wells]

Norm,

There was nothing undemocratic about this.  We requested board approval with oversight just like we have done the four years previous. This year some members had concerns and we debated for an hour and a half.  There is no provision in our bylaws for proxy voting. We didn’t set the meeting up to intentionally exclude any of the board members. Jay happened to be traveling and you couldn’t find the link.  I wish I had called you but was too caught up in answering questions and listening to the debate.  Steven has the provisional meeting minutes up on the share drive and will be sending out a link to all the members soon.

 

And yes, Terri and or Steven should send a reminder and link out the day of the meeting.   Telegram, carrier pigeon or direct email.

 

Dan

[Norm Young]

No there wasn't. Note that I said appearance of...

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