Re: Citizen 8110 Manual
Peri Alt
Just finishing up the restoration on a 8110-9011 Bullhead (Panda), whereas the movement is in clean, I notice the balance stopping in some positions so I would like to do a strip-down and service. It would be nice to have the full manual with schematics.
The purpose of More than one slot on a screw head is to warn the watchmaker that this is a left-handed thread. So you just have to remember to do the opposites of which you do with a normal screw and everything will be fine.
No need for sorry, this was all my bad. John had responded in plenty of time, the problem was LEFT on the brain. I moved from the keyboard to the ratchet gear and turned to the left to loosen, Wrong!
Hi will, Yes the c-clips, once removed/ replaced get flimsy.. The push buttons too, sometimes wont function as should mostly due to crowns not freely sliding back on stem tube. Stretch the push button springs, strengthens them for better push button returns.
The escape jewel assembly is like any incabloc design, it is just smaller in size. I use tweezers ( fine enough for hairspring manipulation) to unlock the inabloc spring, Other than escape jewel/cab assembly all else on escape bridge has normal size and need no special handling.
It is kickoff day for a new assembly (ASSY) of a Citizen 67- 9011 Chrono Bullhead. Using kickoff loosely as I started some 10-14 days back with disassembly and finding a broken mainspring which took some time to find. I had tried to buy 3-4 of this MS (for future projects) but was told this is the last of a discontinued part of which I received yesterday.
Unlike the Seiko 6139 Cal. where there can be found tons of service documents and manuals. I have had little luck finding Citizen service manuals, other than the part schematic kindly offered by @JohnR725 and kind advise from @Nucejoe. Thankfully we are in the age of the digital camera, of which I have long ago learned to use as an assistant to my lacking skill and crutch to my failing memory.
With 212 disassembly photos in hand (every photo is taken on three side to offset glare), along with the new MS, we start the reverse-disassembly. Thanking in advance for the gracious advise, help and guidance I will undoubtedly fall back on while calling for help along the way.
Hi will, With such a compilation of pix and working with you johnR, geo,Nickelsilver, clockboy and a host of other well experienced folks pouring in advice, not only an excellent outcome is yours,.but this could be a good walkthrough and example of how to go about servicng a complication at first encounter, well almost first encounter.
And on the tip front, here is anther habit of mine. During the teardown I separate the parts in some type of logic (as we all do) but I will take the periodic photo of my parts tray. By photoing the tray I document what parts are where and when. When a part goes missing I find myself going though the photos, finding the part and then following it while trying to nudge a clue to its whereabout (or at least to point of exit).
What I neglected to mention in the video is that I am using D-5 on the lever arms pivots and friction points. As I understand D-5 is good for slow moving, high friction points which I have interpreted levers as being a D-5 application. Alternatively one could use 9501 typically reserved for the keyless works but I have not seen it done. Lastly 9010 on the wheel train pivots.
PS: one area touched on yesterday was the screws and identifying where they go. This assembly really drives home for me the importance of taking a photo of the part along with its respective screws as they are removed. It really saves time when wondering and second guessing your self on what screw goes where.
Hi will, I found several partially stripped down movement in my stuff, good guide so as for as what goes where also on some chrono works. What I can do is to remove parts to get to the ones you like to see function of or parts involved.
What I neglected to mention in the video is that I am using D-5 on the lever arms pivots and friction points. As I understand D-5 is good for slow moving, high friction points which I have interpreted levers as being a D-5 application. Alternatively one could use 9501 typically reserved for the keyless works but I have not seen it done. Lastly 9010 on the wheel train pivots
lubrication always an interesting subject? D5 is a nice lubrication although it's supposedly being replaced by the HP oils I have a link below which talks about the various oils. One of the reasons you probably don't see a lot of 9501 being used is it's expensive and typically at least hobbyists don't like expensive lubrication's. Then the 9010 9020 would be better for the wheel train pivots as it's a little heavier. The trends seems to be for heavier lubricants anyway and 9010 is universally regarded as the balance pivots oil.
lubrication always an interesting subject? D5 is a nice lubrication although it's supposedly being replaced by the HP oils I have a link below which talks about the various oils. One of the reasons you probably don't see a lot of 9501 being used is it's expensive and typically at least hobbyists don't like expensive lubrication's. Then the 9010 9020 would be better for the wheel train pivots as it's a little heavier. The trends seems to be for heavier lubricants anyway and 9010 is universally regarded as the balance pivots oil.
If cost is the reason, we not seeing more 9501 used, I may start substituting 9510 for D-5 in some of the lever pivots (non-rotating higher-pressure points) where common since tells you that a grease type of viscosity and/or product may be better suited then an oil.
PS: For anyone familiar with the Citizen 8110A movement, I will be posting some questions on an assembly I am having problems with. The balance complete stopping and not perpetually running after rebuilding.
And as I'm sure everyone agrees , you can never take too many pics on strip down for reassembly . Sometimes on a complicated or busy movement that I am not used to , I will take pics before disassembly . then practice the reassembly right then just to reinforce my memory .
I also draw pics with my own hieroglyphics and use ice cube trays to hold my parts with their respective screws . This also helps to reverse engineer , or re-assemble the parts in the order you removed them .
I'd like to propose that all names, in all languages, are given as [Family name] [comma] [Given name] in article titles (as, for example: Parker, Sarah Jessica). This would solve a lot of problems related to name orders which contradict the common English order of [Given name] [Family name]. Exploding Boy 21:43, Sep 15, 2004 (UTC)
Exploding Boy might try looking up Family name and see what a mess his system would create. To begin with, not everyone has a family name. There are numerous incompatible systems of nomenclature, present and past. What benefit if the article on Hamlet were renamed to , Hamlet and the article on Henry VIII was renamed to Tudor, Henry, VIII or something similar and the article on Bjrk was renamed to , Bjrk, Gumundsdttir or something similar? Jallan 21:33, 16 Sep 2004 (UTC)
Just one comment: people with a patronymic but without a family name are normally sorted on their first name, thus Bjrk Gumundsdttir, not Gumundsdttir, Bjrk, even in cases where other names are sorted with family name first. (As a matter of fact, the entire Icelandic phonebook is sorted according to first name.) However, I wouldn't trust most contemporary, Anglophone contributors on Wikipedia to recognize the difference between a patronymic and a family name, and if the unnecessarily complicated way of writing "last name" first would be implemented, names with a patronymic will no doubt often be written in the wrong order. //Tupsharru 06:07, 18 Sep 2004 (UTC)
It appears that Exploding Boy really wants to go with standard bibliographic style. That is somewhat more complex than always putting the family surname first. General bibliographic usage as been to generally list names by surname, followed by a comma, then by the other names, when the names are post-medieval names and when they are of European origin or names of those who have adopted European conventions or when the names have been adapted to fit European conventions. These modern surnames are sometimes patrynomics rather than family surnames. Names not fitting this convention are generally not re-ordered. Classical Roman names, for example, are not reordered. One normally does not see "Antonius Creticus, Marcus" rather than "Marcus Antonius Creticus" in an index. Where in modern usage surnames seldom appear, as with royal families of Europe, the names generally don't appear ordered by surname in indexes. It would be extraordinary to find a book referring to Queen Elizabeth II of the UK and find her listed in its index under something like "Windsor, Elizabeth, Queen of the United Kingdom, II".
An advantage of the traditional system is that it clarifies whether a surname is a modern family surname or a descriptive surname. If we come across "Marie d'Anjou" in an index, the reference is almost certainly to some pre-modern personage connected with the territory of Anjou, likely a member of its ruling family. If we come across "D'Anjou, Marie", the reference is almost certainly to a more modern person who happens to have the hereditary surname "D'Anjou". There is some small value in such a distinction, though it annoys indexers of books dealing with periods when hereditary family surnames were first coming into vogue.
But adopting the normal bibliographical system in Wikipedia would not at all solve a dispute over order of Chinese names. Under the traditional system someone knows immediately, by the presence of a comma, that in the case of "Dickens, Charles", for example, that "Dickens" is a surname and that in normal use the two elements are reversed. But coming across references like Hrlf Kraki, Vlad Tepe, Mao Zedong, Ho Chi Minh, Mark Antony, Julius Caesar, Antiochus IV Epiphanes, a reader unfamiliar with the name style or the persons knows nothing other than that, if there is a family name within any of these combinations, it is not marked by a comma. The only one of the above where we could reasonably make this clear though a comma is Mark Antony which we might reverse as Antony, Mark. For the rest, there is nothing to indicate whether "Hrlf", "Vlad", "Ho", "Julius", "Antiochus", and "Mao" are family names or not. In fact, of these, only "Mao" is a pure family name, "Julius" comes very close though the full family name was "Julius Caesar" (the given name "Gaius" being usually dropped in references to this particular personage).
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