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That would be great. I'm still trying to figure out if I could run chilled water through the underfloor system to get at least some cooling during the summer, but I do plan on mini splits as the backup for both heating and cooling. The trick with the cooling will be whether I can work in components that will cooperate with switching over to chilled water, and also whether I can keep the chilled water above dewpoint using the right sensors. The high-desert dry air would work to my advantage for once in that calculation :) I know there are companies that make panels for that exact purpose, but they are crazy expensive. What do you think? Chilled water in regular hydronic underfloor Uponor tubing?
I would go about it the other way: figure out how much minisplit you need for your cooling, then how much underfloor you need to supplement that with to reach your whole-house goal. Then decide on the areas where the underfloor will have the most impact, like bathrooms. You can do a little more but there's no point in doing the whole house in underfloor.
Hey Paul, Ok thanks I'll check that out. You asked why not use ducted. The answer is that if I use hydronic, I can heat the water using PV when the sun is out (300+ days of sun a year), and use it for heating at night/morning. That will give me free, clean heat for 30 years (I should say: it'll be free after about 8 year break-even, if I do the labor). In the summer the PV can help run the mini split ACs. In the high desert it's rare to run the heat during the day if a house has decent passive solar gain.
On my local Craigslist I can get solar hot water collectors for free. The reason people are giving away is that they don't work well. In particular, they don't produce much when you need heat and when they do produce you don't need much heat. In most cases, if people had modeled their performance before installing them they would have seen that they don't pencil out.
Hey Paul, Budget is what I'm working on now. That's why I'm asking about Xpress-Trak, which is much cheaper than most other options. I'm trying to determine whether I can make the system I want for a reasonable cost. Once I get the Manual J done, I'll see if the system will work for those numbers. Trying to do as much research as possible before I start spending money on engineers, filing for permits (with expiration dates), and trying to source materials in our new supply-chain reality.
Hey DC, I'm definitely not interested in solar hot water collectors. I agree PV is far superior these days. I haven't run the numbers yet but I'm thinking an option is PV powered heat pump water heater and buffer tank for the hydronic. They can store water hot for a long time, with no new energy input. Depends on a bunch of factors- I'm trying to figure it out one step at a time. Before I get to that I need to figure out the hydronic system requirements.
If you are concerned about latent loads or the floor not keeping up, pre-provision piping, condensate drain, and control wire where fan coils would make sense. We did this during our build, but have never needed it.
The video shows a fan coil unit (FCU), which is what you're going to want for cooling. It's basically analogous to a mini-split head, the one shown is analogous to a ducted mini-split. The difference is that it's pumping water into the coil instead of refrigerant. I feel there is a big technical benefit to doing that, because you can serve very low loads with no penalty. You can get hydronic FCU's that are as small as 3000 BTU/hr, I'm not aware of any minisplit heads that small. A 3000 BTU/hr head in a bedroom works really well. Hydronics also scale a lot better than minisplits, you can put a head in every room and run them all off of one heat pump no problem.
The Warmboard product is interesting because the big issue with FCU's is that there aren't a lot of choices available in the US right now, and the ones that are available aren't the most aesthetically pleasing. Which frankly, is a problem that minisplits have as well. The other issue is cost, I don't know what the Warmboard product costs but hydronics typically costs at least twice what comparable minisplits cost for the equipment.
Buying from Alibaba feels like buying a pig in a poke, and there were a couple of things I had to work around. Hydronics are much more popular in other parts of the world so it's wired for 220V and the plumbing uses British fittings. But adapters are readily available on Amazon.
Let's talk about what that means. It took me years to realize this, which is why I consider it an important realization, but the heat output of a floor -- or any surface -- is entirely determined by the temperature difference between that surface and the surrounding air. With floors, you care about more than just heat output, you want them comfortable underfoot, which means you don't want hot spots and you don't want cold spots, you want an even temperature. Since the need for heat can change quickly, you want a surface that is capable of changing temperature quickly so it can respond to changes in the demand for heat.
So what you want is something with high heat conductivity -- so the heat is spread evenly -- and low heat capacity, so that changes in the heat flow quickly result in changes in temperature, which will result in changes in output. Low heat capacity is particularly important in houses with high solar gain.
What Warmboard prides itself on is that it achieves those two things. I've seen videos on their website where they show side-by-side IR images of their product with a competing product. Both products start out cold and then heat is applied, and the Warmboard reaches stable temperature much more quickly, and at temperature the surface has a more even distribution of heat.
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