Cleaning-up-an-old-bench-plane questions
John R. Johnson
The old $15 beater plane is probably as good or better than the
new $100 one. Tune it up and KEEP it. You will love it.
On 10 Jan 1996, Braadbaart wrote:
> I have an old jack plane (my first becnh plane, other than my Stanley
> block plane) I picked up for $15, which I'm trying to recondition. It's
> my way of avoiding screwing up a new plane, which I will get to buying
> once I figure out what works on the old beater. I have read numerous
> postings here as well as books on handtools, but I have a few questions
> left. The plane is a metal bodied no-namer, made in usa, w/ wooden
> handels (oh boy) and all the adjustment mechanisms are in good working
> order. To recondition it, I intend to:
> 1: Flatten the sole by mounting sandpaper on 1/4" glass plate and applying
> elbow grease liberally. What grits should I use? Some of the sole is
> slightly (!!!) rusted, notably the front and back ends. (THis led me to
> believe it indeed needs flattening)
Start with 280 or so wet or dry paper. Use a little water on the plate/
paper and plane it. When you do this, retract the blade so it is clear
of the paper, but leave it clamped into the plane. This ensures that
things don't change shape AFTER you flatten it. When the scratches are
all around the mouth and the edges of the sole at least, Then switch to
400 grit paper and go until all the scratches are from the 400 and not
the 280. Then you can go to 600 and 1200. By then it is getting pretty
smooth. If you are a neander perfectionist, then get some honing compound
and use that on the glass plate and polish it. Personally I usually stop
at the 400 grit step.
> 2: Round off corners on blade (to what radius?) on home-made bench grinder
> (or will that be too coarse, and should I use a little sandpaper instead,
> as in step 1?)
Don't round them off much. About a 1/32 inch radius is about right. I do
it while I am sharpening it. I don't use a grinder. I use the same
sandpaper setup I used for the sole. Same procedure, but I will go to
polish with the blade edges. If you are finicky or don't trust yourself
to hold the same angle, get something like the Veritas angle thingy.
Water and wet or dry sandpaper on a glass plate makes a great sharpening
system. You round the corners just enough so you don't get hard edges
between strokes with thin shavings. Makes it easier to get a large
smooth surface. Before I learned that trick I wondered how you could
plane anything wider than the plane!B
> 3: Flatten back of blade, if needed, using method of step 1 (again, what
> grits? No cereal jokes, please)
Flatten the back on the same sandpaper you used for the sole. Do that
before you start work on the bevel or you will have to do the bevel over.
You can take it to polish if you want. I do.
> 4:Sharpen the blade on my oilstones, without sharpening jig, after
> purchasing an angle checker from Woodcraft (or is that not needed?
> Alternative?). Blade doesn't appear to need regrinding. Then, bevel,
> micro bevel, and pico bevel until you can perform rudimentary gene
> splicing operations
You already did this up there on step two, which should really be three.
Angle checker is cute but not needed. Eyeball angle is ok. Compare to
a chisel. Not the most critical thing in the world.
> 5: Grind cap-iron so that it is not rounded over where it meets the blade,
> but flat instead.
Don't grind it. Just flatted it on the same sandpaper just like the sole.
> 6: Clean all fasteners and everything that can come apart. Any lube on
> fasteners would be a no-no to avoid dripping oil on that prized piece of
> CDX plywood, or is a tiny bit a good idea?
Lacquer thinner or alcohol both work pretty well. When I put them back
together I use the block of beeswax that I got from a beekeeping friend.
I use that for lubricating screws before I drive them also. Also rub it
on drawer edges ( what, you don't use ball bearing metal aftermarket
full extension drawer slides/runners/stuff? ) and other things like the
surface of my jointer table and cabinet saw table. Keeps them slippery
and keeps them rust free without putting silicon into my woodwork.
Rub the beeswax on the sole of the plane too.
> 7: Install blade and cap-iron, and experiment with settings until I have
> no more scrap to practice on? What's a good test? Not being the
> square-jawed kind, shaving would be rather painful. Instead, I figured I'd
> start on some 2x4's and try to get the thinnest and longest shavings, and
> work until I can do that with some hard maple or oak?
I usually start with scrap hardwood. Pick a piece where the grain is
reasonably visible and straight. Slowly lower the blade until it goes
sssssssshhhhh when you push it over the wood. When you can read a newspaper
while looking through the shaving we will elevate you to the O'Deen Hall
of Fame.
> 8: What is the fundamental difference between a smooting plane and a jack
> plane? I believe it is the length of the sole, but how does this make a
> difference? Or is it the smoothness of the sole? And, not knowing the
> answer to this question yet, could I recondition this plane so that it
> functions like a smoothing plane?
The only real difference between the planes is in the length of the sole.
The longer the sole the flatter the surface has to be for plane evenly.
A smoothing plane is usually shorter so it will follow gentle waves in
the surface and get it all smooth. A jointing plane is real long so it
will make the edge real straight. A jack plane is a little longer than
a smoothing plane and is used for an "all purpose" plane. A fore plane
is longer than a jack and is used for flattening surfaces rather than
straightening edges. A block plane is real short and is used for trimming
and fitting joints.
There are a bunch of special purpose planes that ARE wierd for cutting
rabbets, dados, grooves, reeds, moldings and so on. There are some that
curve for planing surfaces that aren't supposed to be FLAT. Most are used
for only one job. When you really get into this Neander thing you can
keep buying important new planes for your collection forever.
> 9: Finish all the projects that require some planing.
Then look around for some more when you get your head into this "making
neat shavings instead of sawdust" trip. Sounds like you are on your way
to becoming a Woodworker. ( Notice the Capital W )
John
> Thank you for your patience and comments/suggestions/feedback. If these
> questions are in a FAQ, then my apologies. I am temporarily FTP-less. And
> the latest FAQs posted here have disappeared.
> Marijn B.
>
>
Braadbaart
block plane) I picked up for $15, which I'm trying to recondition. It's
my way of avoiding screwing up a new plane, which I will get to buying
once I figure out what works on the old beater. I have read numerous
postings here as well as books on handtools, but I have a few questions
left. The plane is a metal bodied no-namer, made in usa, w/ wooden
handels (oh boy) and all the adjustment mechanisms are in good working
order. To recondition it, I intend to:
1: Flatten the sole by mounting sandpaper on 1/4" glass plate and applying
elbow grease liberally. What grits should I use? Some of the sole is
slightly (!!!) rusted, notably the front and back ends. (THis led me to
believe it indeed needs flattening)
(or will that be too coarse, and should I use a little sandpaper instead,
as in step 1?)
grits? No cereal jokes, please)
purchasing an angle checker from Woodcraft (or is that not needed?
Alternative?). Blade doesn't appear to need regrinding. Then, bevel,
micro bevel, and pico bevel until you can perform rudimentary gene
splicing operations
but flat instead.
fasteners would be a no-no to avoid dripping oil on that prized piece of
CDX plywood, or is a tiny bit a good idea?
no more scrap to practice on? What's a good test? Not being the
square-jawed kind, shaving would be rather painful. Instead, I figured I'd
start on some 2x4's and try to get the thinnest and longest shavings, and
work until I can do that with some hard maple or oak?
plane? I believe it is the length of the sole, but how does this make a
difference? Or is it the smoothness of the sole? And, not knowing the
answer to this question yet, could I recondition this plane so that it
functions like a smoothing plane?
John DeLapp
1. Flattening
I have a sheet of 3/8" plate glass measuring 12x36". I spray adhesive on
both the glass and the back of the sandpaper, give the glue a few
minutes to get tacky, and then stick it down. I use 3 sheets at a time
unless I'm just doing a block plane.
I always start with 80 grit. The scratches caused come out very easily
with the next grit.
Although it seems logical to keep the blade in place, this doesn't make
much difference. What DOES make a difference is to hold the plane down
absolutely flat.
The first few strokes will tell you what is going on. It usually only
takes about ten minutes to get a plane flat.
When you do the sides: You are trying to get the plane to lie 90 degrees
to the bottom so that you can SHOOT with it. Just lay the plane on its
side, on the sandpaper, and lay a square against it. Take a couple of
strokes and check it again. You will probably find that the plane goes
square pretty quickly. Wken you look at it though the tops of the wings
probably won't be done. Don't worry about this now.
For an inexpensive jack plane, I think you'll find that finishing with
180 grit will probably be fine. Lay a straight stick down on the
sandpaper and run the plane alongside it. This gets the sanding marks
running the same direction as the sole and makes everything look right.
After this you can take a scrap of 180 grit in a block and touch up the
wings.
Sharpening:
The grinder sounds perfect, Coarse is good. You want to get rid of
everything that doesn't look like a cutting edge without burning the
blade. Just take your time, keep a pail of water handy and practise.
It only takes a minute to hone the edge after. You don't have to worry
about a curved edge yet, Square and straight is enough of a challenge.
Back of blade
I start with 220 grit wet and dry on the glass plate with WD40 sprayed
on. At this point put the spray adhesive away, or you'll probably find
out, like I did, about getting them mixed up. Just hold the iron down
flat and have at it.
I generally finish blades at 400 grit on the glass, and polish on a
stone.
Fitting the chip breaker is fairly straightforward, Check it for square
though. Set it 1/16" away to start.
It's primary purpose is to defeat chatter. Having the lever cap snapped
down on top of it is Leonard Baileys great invention.
Smooth planes and jacks are, except for length, the same, and pretty
much interchangeable. Guys use the Lie Nielsen #62 copy, which is jack
sized, for finishing.
Best of luck
John
Paul Grun
|> I have an old jack plane (my first becnh plane, other than my Stanley
|> block plane) I picked up for $15, which I'm trying to recondition. It's
|> my way of avoiding screwing up a new plane,
IMHO: you've got your priorities backwards here. Obviously, I can't see your
"old beater", but there's a reasonable chance that it is a better (_much_ better)
plane than what you buy new.
I'd recommend buying a new plane, practicing on that, then go to work on the
old beater.
The new planes really aren't that nice these days. The castings aren't
as nice, the adjustments don't work as well, the totes and knobs aren't
as nice to hold, and, worst of all, the steel in the blades is nowhere near
as nice. Unless you go out and buy a Hock blade or something.
Here's a question for you: How do you know it's a jack plane?
|> which I will get to buying
|> once I figure out what works on the old beater. I have read numerous
|> postings here as well as books on handtools, but I have a few questions
|> left. The plane is a metal bodied no-namer, made in usa, w/ wooden
|> handels (oh boy) and all the adjustment mechanisms are in good working
|> order. To recondition it, I intend to:
|> 1: Flatten the sole by mounting sandpaper on 1/4" glass plate and applying
|> elbow grease liberally. What grits should I use? Some of the sole is
|> slightly (!!!) rusted, notably the front and back ends. (THis led me to
|> believe it indeed needs flattening)
Before you get too far with this sole flattening business, ask yourself:
are you sure the sole needs flattening? There's a sizable contingent of folks
out here who question the wisdom or necessity of micrometer flat plane soles.
At most, I'd recommend some very fine silicon carbide (wet or dry), say in
the 1200 range on the plate glass, just to get a feeling for if the sole is
really out of whack or not. Just take a couple of swipes, then take a look
at the scratch pattern on the bottom of the plane.
If it's badly twisted or _way_ out of whack, you'll need to take more
aggressive measures. But barring that, I'd proceed with learning more about
planes and planing before I hacked up the bottom of a good user plane.
BTW: the important thing is that the area at the toe (front end) of the
plane be in the same plane as the (relatively) narrow strip right in front
of the mouth, and the area all the way at the heel of the plane. If you've
got this, you're in business.
|> 2: Round off corners on blade (to what radius?) on home-made bench grinder
|> (or will that be too coarse, and should I use a little sandpaper instead,
|> as in step 1?)
Please, please, pretty please, stay away from the bench grinder, at least until
your educational level improves a bit. IMHO, this is overkill and carries
much too great a risk of ruining the temper of the blade. For reference,
I don't even own a bench grinder and yet have no trouble keeping my edge
tools quite sharp.
OTOH, some folks like to put a hollow grind on planes and chisels. You pays
your money and takes your choices.
Again, I'd go slow, were I you. Try sharpening up the blade and using it. If
you have problems with the edge of the blade digging into the work, you can
always go back and round the corners if you need to. I wouldn't recommend
rounding the corners just because somebody told you to. If you need to, you'll
find out soon enough.
It is true that lots of guys do _slightly_ radius their jack planes to
improve the aggressiveness of the cut. In your shoes, I'd go with what I
had for a while, then re-evaluate later.
|> 3: Flatten back of blade, if needed, using method of step 1 (again, what
|> grits? No cereal jokes, please)
This one has some merit to it. Try silicon carbide sandpaper in 1000, 1200,
1500 and 2000 grits. This shouldn't take long. You can go to finer grits if
you're really into counting your nose hairs in the reflection of the blade.
You don't need to make the entire back perfectly flat. Settle for a shiny
area about 1/8 - 1/4" wide right at the business end of the blade.
|> 4:Sharpen the blade on my oilstones, without sharpening jig, after
|> purchasing an angle checker from Woodcraft (or is that not needed?
|> Alternative?). Blade doesn't appear to need regrinding. Then, bevel,
|> micro bevel, and pico bevel until you can perform rudimentary gene
|> splicing operations
I don't understand oilstones very well, so I use waterstones. My complement
consists of 800, 1200, 6000 (S-1) stones, then onto the silicon carbide
sandpaper. In some circles, the use of SC paper is warmly referred to as
the "ScarySharp" system. It works.
I go up to 2000 grit on the SC paper, but some guys go higher. You find this
stuff in auto parts stores, of all places.
Note that SC 2000 grit is much finer than a waterstone 6000 grit. Some folks
are skipping the waterstones altogether these days in favor of just the SC
paper.
As for sharpening jigs. Some do it by hand without a jig. Me personally,
I get better results (MUCH better) using a jig. I don't want to invest the
apprenticeship time involved in honing by hand without a jig. I can see
little or no downside to using the jig.
Chisels, BTW, may be a different story. This is because the bevel on the
chisel is significantly wider than on a plane, so it's easier to
follow the existing bevel. Not so for planes, where the bevel isn't very wide.
Furthermore, the bevel on the "old beater" may well be all goofed up, angle-wise.
Net net, I'd recommend the jig. They're cheap, and they work.
There's also some professional support for this position. Leonard Lee, in
his landmark book on sharpening (no kidding), recommends the use of guide
for sharpening plane irons.
|> 5: Grind cap-iron so that it is not rounded over where it meets the blade,
|> but flat instead.
Once again - be careful and go slow. The whole point here is to make sure that
the cap iron bears uniformly across the blade. As long as you have a single
line of contact between the capiron and the blade, you're ok. One of the
purposes of the capiron is to curl the shavings back. If shavings are getting
caught under the cap iron, you may need to hone it a bit.
|> 6: Clean all fasteners and everything that can come apart. Any lube on
|> fasteners would be a no-no to avoid dripping oil on that prized piece of
|> CDX plywood, or is a tiny bit a good idea?
I've never needed to lube anything. But I can't see how a teeny bit on the
blade adjustment knob would hurt anything.
|> 7: Install blade and cap-iron, and experiment with settings until I have
|> no more scrap to practice on? What's a good test? Not being the
|> square-jawed kind, shaving would be rather painful. Instead, I figured I'd
|> start on some 2x4's and try to get the thinnest and longest shavings, and
|> work until I can do that with some hard maple or oak?
This is reasonable. Be aware, though, that you will get the best results
with regular grain, harder woods. That isn't exactly the definition of a 2x4.
You'll be challenged to turn out long, thin shavings of 2x4 construction
lumber. Remember, the basic jack plane isn't meant to do the absolute best
job on weird and figured wood; it's forte is to do an adequate to superior
job on _most_ wood.
As for initial settings: try putting the capiron on the blade about 1/16"
or so back from the edge. Don't measure, just do it. Assemble the
capiron/blade into the plane with the lever cap and see how much daylight is
showing between the blade and the front edge of the mouth. If necessary,
remove the blade and all, loosen the frog screws, and slide the frog
forward or backward until "not much daylight shows between the blade and
the front of the mouth. I don't know anyway to describe the ideal setting
without getting retentive about it other than to say, as you get better
with it, you'll find out that the smaller the mouth the finer the shaving
will be. On _really_ nice planes, this distance is measured in thousandths
of an inch.
Another variable affecting the mouth opening is the wood being planed. Wider
mouth for softer woods, narrower mouth for harder woods.
|> 8: What is the fundamental difference between a smooting plane and a jack
|> plane? I believe it is the length of the sole, but how does this make a
|> difference? Or is it the smoothness of the sole? And, not knowing the
|> answer to this question yet, could I recondition this plane so that it
|> functions like a smoothing plane?
A jack plane and smooth plane vary only in the length of the sole. In
Stanley terms, a Stanley #4 smooth plane is 9" long on the sole, and 2"wide
blade. A Stanley #5 jack plane is 14" long on the sole and 2" wide
blade. The condition of the sole is not the issue.
You could make it function like a smooth plane by hacking 5" off the heel,
I guess. But I don't suppose it'd smooth very well afterwards if you did.
|> 9: Finish all the projects that require some planing.
|> Thank you for your patience and comments/suggestions/feedback. If these
|> questions are in a FAQ, then my apologies. I am temporarily FTP-less. And
|> the latest FAQs posted here have disappeared.
|> Marijn B.
--
Paul Grun paul...@mentorg.com Mentor Graphics Corp. (503) 685-4855
Goes to show, you don't ever know...
Mark Kepke
> In article <4d0o5l$2...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, braad...@aol.com
(Braadbaart) writes:
> |> I have an old jack plane (my first becnh plane, other than my Stanley
> |> block plane) I picked up for $15, which I'm trying to recondition. It's
> |> my way of avoiding screwing up a new plane,
>
> IMHO: you've got your priorities backwards here. Obviously, I can't see your
> "old beater", but there's a reasonable chance that it is a better
(_much_ >better) plane than what you buy new.
>
> I'd recommend buying a new plane, practicing on that, then go to work on the
> old beater.
Depends what you have more of - money or a sense of nostalgia. Old planes
can be picked up *much* cheaper than new ones. So how's this for a
suggestion: buy a beater plane or two to practice reconditioning, then
recondition some "good" old planes, i.e. don't buy a Norris infill to
practice on.
<snip>
> As for sharpening jigs.
As for jigs - as Paul said some like 'em, some don't. I only use my for
heavy duty sharpening or re-shaping, or small chisels.
I do find it tricky to put cut even secondary bevel with my (Veritas) jig,
but this is the first time I've used it.
--
-Mark
My opinions, etc.