Cabinet saws
Glen
is about to give up the ghost. I could get a new motor, I suppose, but
I would really like a better saw. My cash flow is somewhat limited (a
daughter in college and I am 2.5 years from retirement) and as such I am
considering two saws at present. The rec has some of the most
knowledgeable people around, so I thought I would open it up for advice
on these two models, or other suggestions.
Thoughts, anyone?
T21849 W1677 Shop Fox Heavy Duty Tablesaw
http://grizzly.com/products/W1677-Shop-Fox-Heavy-Duty-Tablesaw/T21849
or
G1023SLW 10" Left-Tilt Cabinet Table Saw
http://grizzly.com/outlet/10-Left-Tilt-Cabinet-Table-Saw/G1023SLW
TIA,
Glen
Swingman
> considering two saws at present. The rec has some of the most
> knowledgeable people around, so I thought I would open it up for advice
> on these two models, or other suggestions.
Of the two, I would go with the G1023SLW. It's been a very popular saw
and I was impressed with it the only time I got to use one about five
years ago (I have a Unisaw, so that was the basis for my perception).
Be sure to check Craigslist in your area. I have an icon sitting on my
desktop and check the tool section daily. The past year has been notable
for the number of used cabinet saws for sale in this area, and there
have been two Delta or Rockwells just in the last week.
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)
Robatoy
> My table saw (a used Taiwanese import I bought used about 15 years ago)
> is about to give up the ghost. I could get a new motor, I suppose, but
> I would really like a better saw. My cash flow is somewhat limited (a
> daughter in college and I am 2.5 years from retirement) and as such I am
> considering two saws at present. The rec has some of the most
> knowledgeable people around, so I thought I would open it up for advice
> on these two models, or other suggestions.
>
> Thoughts, anyone?
>
>
> or
>
> G1023SLW 10" Left-Tilt Cabinet Table Sawhttp://grizzly.com/outlet/10-Left-Tilt-Cabinet-Table-Saw/G1023SLW
>
> TIA,
> Glen
I don't know where you are located, Glen, but take a look at these
guys, Many, many happy hybrid saw users.
http://www.general.ca/images/frontpage/flyers/Promo%20fall%20winter%2009-10%20US.pdf
This one with a link-belt upgrade will pass the nickel test no prob.
Dunno how the pricing will work for you.
http://www.general.ca/site_general/g_produits/saw/50-220r.html
Bob La Londe
news:G-qdne2_FYHFJqHW...@earthlink.com...
> My table saw (a used Taiwanese import I bought used about 15 years ago)
I bought a Rigid 110V saw when they first came out I think about tenor
twelve years ago. I basically looked for the most expensive saw I could
find available RIGHT NOW and figured I would have the best chance of getting
a decent saw. I would not call it cabinet grade, but it has been used for
cabinets, window framing, trim, framing, and cutting marine aluminum. The
saw itself still works just fine. I had a couple minor issues with range of
movement when angling the blade, but most of the time I have the blade set
at 90 deg to the table anyway. The only other issue I have is after ten
years some of the leg screws backed out. Probably a result of movement and
abuse as I have had it on several different sites and used it for everything
and it still works perfectly, and rips 3/4 ply with ease if you do not try
to force feed when needed. Its my understanding that Hitachi makes their
motors now, but that's not a bad thing. My Hitachi miter saw is much older
(16-17 years) and been used for much the same kind of work.
I am not a cabinet grade carpenter or even a carpenter, but this saw still
does decent work. If I am doing precise work I always put a tape from the
fence to the blade on both the lead and the following edges. For rough work
I just use the guide scale and go.
I would like to add that my Uncle Paul is a cabinet grade carpenter.
Actually detail quality might be a better description. He has an ancient
220V saw in his work shop with a giant table. When he was asked to spend a
couple years before he retired managing a plant outside of his home town he
decided not to move his entire shop. Instead he setup a smaller shop in his
temporary home and among the things he selected was the same model Rigid saw
as mine. It has a roller base with a step/kick pedal to set it down solid
when working. Mine gets moved constantly. His probably got used as a
stationary tool.
Its not super cheap, but its not the price of a big stationary Jet or Delta
either. Its way better than either of the Sears Crapsmen table saws I used
in the past. I have a big 220V Delta 12" radial arm saw that I almost never
use because the Rigid table saw does most things I need, and I can move it
around to wherever is convenient.
RonB
I have owned a Grizzly 1023s for about seven years and couldn't be
more pleased. It is a close cousin to both saws you have linked to;
and both use the Shop Fox heavy duty fence. This fence is a hog that
has received good reviews compared to several aftermarket fences.
When I bought mine Grizzly had just introduced the left tilt version
and I didn't want to be among first-in-line on a totally new upper
trunnion assembly; but it as proven to be a good machine for Grizzly.
Personally, based on similarity, I would have no problem recommending
the Grizzly version; and the Shop Fox is probably close enough to the
Grizzly to make little difference.
BTW - Our son owns a Grizzly G0444Z which is a 2hp/220v contractor's
saw. It has the cast iron tables, good power and the aluminum version
of the Shop Fox Classic fence. I used it extensively for 3-4 weeks
when we were trimming out their new house about three years ago. it
too is a solid saw, for a little less money. As it sits, it won't
collect dust as well as the cabinet versions, but I believe they do
offer a kit to retain much of the debris. He, as I, also used the
Shop Fox mobile base which makes moving it around a smaller shop very
easy.
I share your decision pain. My 1023s was planned to be my retirement
machine too. After comparing it to Unisaw and the Jets it just made
more sense for the money. I also used Grizzly's referral service and
was able to talk to a local guy who had bought THREE of them (his, his
son and son-in-law). That plus a trip to the Springfield store sold
me on the purchase. Seven years of use have convinced me I did OK.
RonB
John Grossbohlin
"Swingman" <k...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:59udnYA1xt3TU6HW...@giganews.com...
I second the Craigs List idea... There has been a large volume of used
tools, ranging from low end home owner tools up to computer controlled
commercial shop tools on Craigs List for many months. I'd estimate that a
shop could have been equipped with commercial duty Delta/Jet/Powermatic
floor model cabinet saw, shaper, thickness planer, large bandsaw, large
jointer, mortiser, and all the tailed and tailless tools you'd need for
$3-4,000 with no problem. There have been good buys on European combination
machines too. Sad times for the commercial shops...
Regarding the two saws listed the Shop Fox is basically the same saw as the
Griz... except for the router table on the right.
John
Larry Blanchard
> My table saw (a used Taiwanese import I bought used about 15 years ago)
> is about to give up the ghost. I could get a new motor, I suppose, but
> I would really like a better saw. My cash flow is somewhat limited (a
> daughter in college and I am 2.5 years from retirement) and as such I am
> considering two saws at present. The rec has some of the most
> knowledgeable people around, so I thought I would open it up for advice
> on these two models, or other suggestions.
>
Steel City has a cabinet saw with riving knife where the motor has been
downsized to 1.75 horsepower so it'll run on 110. If you catch a sale it
should be about $1000.
--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw
Ed Pawlowski
The issue of Woodworker's Journal that just came out has reviews of many
cabinet saws. They may have some comments of interest to you.
Personally, I'd consider this one
http://grizzly.com/products/10-3HP-220V-Cabinet-Table-Saw-with-Riving-Knife/G0690
I'd really prefer the Saw Stop, but it is 3X the price.
Larry C
I do not know where you are located but if near Salem, MA look at one of
these links.
Not my posting, I just search Craigslist as well.
or
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/bfs/1528337223.html
Larry C
Jim Weisgram
[...snip...]
>
>Thoughts, anyone?
>
>T21849 W1677 Shop Fox Heavy Duty Tablesaw
>http://grizzly.com/products/W1677-Shop-Fox-Heavy-Duty-Tablesaw/T21849
>
>or
>
>G1023SLW 10" Left-Tilt Cabinet Table Saw
>http://grizzly.com/outlet/10-Left-Tilt-Cabinet-Table-Saw/G1023SLW
>
>TIA,
>Glen
I have the G1023SL and it has been a very solid performer for me. Mine
is minus the cast iron router table wing extension. I suspect the Shop
Fox is comparable to what I have now; some time ago there was
discussion about a Shop Fox model that came out and was a bit heavier
in the inner workings compared to the G1023 series. This may be that
one, I don't know. I doubt it really matters that much.
If I was buying today I'd spend a bit more and get one with a riving
knife, such as this Grizzly model (someone already referenced this in
a previous post):
http://grizzly.com/products/10-3HP-220V-Cabinet-Table-Saw-with-Riving-Knife/G0690
The blade guard / splitter on the G1023 is typical of what was
available on table saws when that model came out. In other words, not
very good. But other more expensive saws had the same problem.
Also, make sure you really want a left tilt. There are pros and cons
for left vs. right tilt. I like the left tilt fine, but there are
inconveniences. Theres are very thorough post that you can google
search (groups.google.com) about the subject.
Steve Turner
That's a nice looking machine at a reasonable price.
--
See Nad. See Nad go. Go Nad!
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/
Sonny
http://www.govliquidation.com/ - Type in your state and go. I
bought one of my Unisaws from
Fort Polk for $150.
http://irsauctions.com/?flash=9 - Check for a listing near you.
Also, check your state government's surplus auction site.
Sonny
Lee Michaels
quality has gone up in recent years and they are a good value.
Just a side note. I saw the new Rigid granite top saw the other day for the
first time. A store employee was polishing the top. It wa so shiny and
smooth! I am not sure how that translate into tablesaw function, but it was
interesting.
RonB
> My table saw (a used Taiwanese import I bought used about 15 years ago)
> is about to give up the ghost. I could get a new motor, I suppose, but
> I would really like a better saw. My cash flow is somewhat limited (a
> daughter in college and I am 2.5 years from retirement) and as such I am
> considering two saws at present. The rec has some of the most
> knowledgeable people around, so I thought I would open it up for advice
> on these two models, or other suggestions.
>
> Thoughts, anyone?
>
>
> or
>
> G1023SLW 10" Left-Tilt Cabinet Table Sawhttp://grizzly.com/outlet/10-Left-Tilt-Cabinet-Table-Saw/G1023SLW
>
> TIA,
I don't want to be an alarmist, but a couple of developments:
1) I have been looking at the G0453 surface planer for some
time.....too long as it turns out. I called Grizzly earlier today to
see if the price would be stable after the end of the year. The young
lady on the phone would not commit, other than to say that the new
catalog would be out next week and to watch the web site after the 4th
of January. Well, the mail came an hour ago with a NEW GRIZZLY
CATALOG!! But the price on the %$@&^ G0453 has gone up $45!
2) The Grizzly catalog does not list many Shop Fox items, so the
T21849 is not there; and there is no sign of a G1023SLW. However the
G1023RL series are still there. It appears as though the old baseline
1023S is gonzo too. No real surprise because they appear to be moving
toward riving knife saws.
It looks like the G1023RL is priced at $1,125, a little more than the
one you linked.
Don't know how close you are to ordering but a quick internet order
might save you a few bucks.
RonB
RonB
<dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca> wrote:
> In article <009b5a74$0$16921$c3e8...@news.astraweb.com>, Lee Michaels
> feel about it. The way I use my shop, I have a feeling there would be
> chips out of it within a week, and I don't like the idea of
> tippy-toeing around my tools.
>
> Does anybody here have experience with the granite-top saurs?
Nope but an acquaintance has experience with granite cabinet tops. I
think Dave's concern is valid because theirs didn't respond well to a
dropped cast iron skillet.
Let's see..... skillet --- hammer !!!!
Lee Michaels
"RonB" <rnrb...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:5746995f-5674-47bc...@j4g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
================================
Not to worry, the only time I ever dropped a hammer, it always fell on my
toes!
Swingman
There is a new Delta Unisaw sitting at the local Rockler. It sure LOOKS
like a massively built beast.
Then again ... 21st century, MBA run Delta, China in the mix ... ??
Mark & Juanita
That's only because you didn't have anything else valuable nearby. In
this case, the hammer knows your toes will heal, but the granite top chip
won't.
--
There is never a situation where having more rounds is a disadvantage
Rob Leatham
Steve Turner
> On Dec 31, 8:56 am, Glen<gNOSPAMkr...@ix.netcomNOSPAM.com> wrote:
>> My table saw (a used Taiwanese import I bought used about 15 years ago)
>> is about to give up the ghost. I could get a new motor, I suppose, but
>> I would really like a better saw. My cash flow is somewhat limited (a
>> daughter in college and I am 2.5 years from retirement) and as such I am
>> considering two saws at present. The rec has some of the most
>> knowledgeable people around, so I thought I would open it up for advice
>> on these two models, or other suggestions.
>>
>> Thoughts, anyone?
>>
>> T21849 W1677 Shop Fox Heavy Duty Tablesawhttp://grizzly.com/products/W1677-Shop-Fox-Heavy-Duty-Tablesaw/T21849
>>
>> or
>>
>> G1023SLW 10" Left-Tilt Cabinet Table Sawhttp://grizzly.com/outlet/10-Left-Tilt-Cabinet-Table-Saw/G1023SLW
>>
>> TIA,
>
> I don't want to be an alarmist, but a couple of developments:
>
> 1) I have been looking at the G0453 surface planer for some
> time.....too long as it turns out. I called Grizzly earlier today to
> see if the price would be stable after the end of the year. The young
> lady on the phone would not commit, other than to say that the new
> catalog would be out next week and to watch the web site after the 4th
> of January. Well, the mail came an hour ago with a NEW GRIZZLY
> CATALOG!! But the price on the %$@&^ G0453 has gone up $45!
Bummer dude! Free shipping is gone too. I tried to convince as many of youse
guys as I could to bite the bullet on that baby... Sorry you missed the sweet
deal.
RonB
wrote:
Yeah.
I know.
%$@&^ anyway!
At least I can skirt the shipping by driving over to get one.
RonB
Glen
excellent. I will check Craig's List before making any decision. That
was a great piece of advice.
This is, without a doubt, the most helpful group on the web.
Larry Jaques
<lbl...@fastmail.fm> scrawled the following:
If I'm blowin' a grand, I'm getting 3hp and 240v, TYVM.
--
Sex is Evil, Evil is Sin, Sin is Forgiven.
Gee, ain't religion GREAT?
Robatoy
> Lee Michaels wrote:
>
> > "RonB" <rnrbro...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
A chip fills nicely with epoxy and a sharp razor blade. Most new
granite countertops have already been filled in many spots.
Lee Michaels
"Larry Jaques" wrote
>
> If I'm blowin' a grand, I'm getting 3hp and 240v, TYVM.
>
> --
grand".
We think of it as making a prudent investment in machining capacity.
A word to the wise. ;-)
Oh yeah that's right , you aren't married. Never mind.
Swingman
> This is, without a doubt, the most helpful group on the web.
Well, now ... let's not get too gushing on that count. Observably, what
we'd really like to do is waste each other at the first opportunity ...
RonB
>
> This is, without a doubt, the most helpful group on the web.
>
Yes.
we know that.
And we are extraordinarily modest too!
RonB
Phisherman
<gNOSPA...@ix.netcomNOSPAM.com> wrote:
>My table saw (a used Taiwanese import I bought used about 15 years ago)
>is about to give up the ghost. I could get a new motor, I suppose, but
>I would really like a better saw. My cash flow is somewhat limited (a
>daughter in college and I am 2.5 years from retirement) and as such I am
>considering two saws at present. The rec has some of the most
>knowledgeable people around, so I thought I would open it up for advice
>on these two models, or other suggestions.
>
>Thoughts, anyone?
>
>T21849 W1677 Shop Fox Heavy Duty Tablesaw
>http://grizzly.com/products/W1677-Shop-Fox-Heavy-Duty-Tablesaw/T21849
>
>or
>
>G1023SLW 10" Left-Tilt Cabinet Table Saw
>http://grizzly.com/outlet/10-Left-Tilt-Cabinet-Table-Saw/G1023SLW
>
>TIA,
>Glen
I favor the G1023, maybe the best value cabinet saw.
Larry Jaques
<counte...@gmail.com> scrawled the following:
>A chip fills nicely with epoxy and a sharp razor blade. Most new
>granite countertops have already been filled in many spots.
When I saw "granite" and chip" in the same post, I knew you wouldn't
be too far behind, Toy. Har!
Larry Jaques
<leemichaels*nadaspam*@comcast.net> scrawled the following:
Rightio. I don't have to lie to myself. Besides, tools are my
living. If I'm not collecting 'em, I'm using 'em to put bread on the
table.
charlie b
motors are also good to have.
charliel b
Larry Jaques
<char...@accesscom.com> scrawled the following:
>Riving knife & left tilt are two features I'd look for. Leeson
>motors are also good to have.
My last birthday wishlist contained a request, which was fulfilled,
for Paul Anthony's book, _Taunton's Complete Illustrated Guide to
Tablesaws_. I received it and it refreshed what I'd learned here over
the course of a decade. It's basic, but it's all good info.
Recommended.
Q for Left-tilters: Is LT really that much more beneficial than a RT
blade, or is it just a tad more safe?
--
We rightly care about the environment. But our neurotic obsession
with carbon betrays an inability to distinguish between pollution
and the stuff of life itself. --Bret Stephens, WSJ 1/5/10
Swingman
> Q for Left-tilters: Is LT really that much more beneficial than a RT
> blade, or is it just a tad more safe?
Safer on one just one cut IME (narrow angled rip), but then you can
effectively do the same on many RT/fence combo's by moving the fence to
the left side of the blade.
Other than that it is more of a personal preference ... strictly my
opinion having used both.
Howsoever, it is easier to clean my LT out because the cover is on the
left outside and not under the extension table.
Doug Winterburn
> Riving knife& left tilt are two features I'd look for. Leeson
> motors are also good to have.
>
> charliel b
Check out page 21 of the new Griz catalogue - G0690
Chris Friesen
> Q for Left-tilters: Is LT really that much more beneficial than a RT
> blade, or is it just a tad more safe?
Swingman's got it.
It's safer on a beveled rip cut. The primary benefit is that the offcut
is not trapped between the blade and the fence. If you put the fence to
the left of the blade you can get he same effect with a right tilt saw.
This is an unusual configuration with tablesaws for some reason,
although it's common with bandsaws. Go figure.
Chris
Larry Jaques
<k...@nospam.com> scrawled the following:
>On 1/6/2010 7:19 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
>
>> Q for Left-tilters: Is LT really that much more beneficial than a RT
>> blade, or is it just a tad more safe?
>
>Safer on one just one cut IME (narrow angled rip), but then you can
>effectively do the same on many RT/fence combo's by moving the fence to
>the left side of the blade.
>
>Other than that it is more of a personal preference ... strictly my
>opinion having used both.
Great, thanks. LTs generally cost a couple hundred bucks more.
>Howsoever, it is easier to clean my LT out because the cover is on the
>left outside and not under the extension table.
What? Pop the ol' blow gun under the hood with the DC on and you're
done in 30 seconds. Drill a 3/4" hole in the panel, wherever
convenient, and tape it over in between blowjobs, eh? No worries!
Swingman
> What? Pop the ol' blow gun under the hood with the DC on and you're
> done in 30 seconds. Drill a 3/4" hole in the panel, wherever
> convenient, and tape it over in between blowjobs, eh? No worries!
Can I make that hole big enough to get my arm in so I can reach the
dropped arbor nut?
:)
Actually, I have a magnet on a string for that, but ....
keit...@gmail.com
> On 1/6/2010 12:28 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
>
> > What? Pop the ol' blow gun under the hood with the DC on and you're
> > done in 30 seconds. Drill a 3/4" hole in the panel, wherever
> > convenient, and tape it over in between blowjobs, eh? No worries!
>
> Can I make that hole big enough to get my arm in so I can reach the
> dropped arbor nut?
>
> :)
Mine slides down next to the DC port, which is big enough to get my
arm in. ;-)
> Actually, I have a magnet on a string for that, but ....
Thought of that too. I have bench brushes and the DC remote clipped
to magnets hanging from the fence rail. A string on one of them would
work. It's easy enough to disconnect the DC and reach in, though.
keit...@gmail.com
Which leads be to ask, why are miter gauges normally set up for the
left side of the fence?
The extension table is on the right, so...
Larry Jaques
<k...@nospam.com> scrawled the following:
>On 1/6/2010 12:28 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
>
>
>> What? Pop the ol' blow gun under the hood with the DC on and you're
>> done in 30 seconds. Drill a 3/4" hole in the panel, wherever
>> convenient, and tape it over in between blowjobs, eh? No worries!
>
>Can I make that hole big enough to get my arm in so I can reach the
>dropped arbor nut?
>
>:)
>
>Actually, I have a magnet on a string for that, but ....
Why not cut a door into one outer panel? A good cleanout of the saw,
then a $3 HF carbide bit on a Skil saur will fix you up right now!
Wear muffies. DAMHIKT.
StephenM
>> blade, or is it just a tad more safe?
>
> Swingman's got it.
>
> It's safer on a beveled rip cut. The primary benefit is that the offcut
> is not trapped between the blade and the fence. If you put the fence to
> the left of the blade you can get he same effect with a right tilt saw.
The beveled rip operation on an RT should be performed with the fence to
the left of the blade. Period.
There is no safy tradeoff if you put the fence in the correct position.
Therefore, the downside to RT is that bevel rip operations have less
capacity. Also, I find that ripping in this configuration is less eronomic
for me as a right-handed person; YMMV.
The upside to RT is that your fence scale will read accurately even with a
dado set loaded.
I have an RT and If I had to buy again, RT vs. LT would be pretty far down
on priority list for selecting a saw.
-Steve
Jim Weisgram
There's no reason you have to use it on the left side (of the blade).
I'm not sure why "left side of the fence" is relevant anyway, since
I'll often remove the fence from the table when the crosscut is large.
In fact I heard a fellow named Hendrick Varju, who has been writing
articles for Fine Woodworking and making "how to woodwork" DVD's, say
on a podcast that he uses his miter guage on the right side whenever
he can.
I doubt he is the only one.
keit...@gmail.com
wrote:
> On Wed, 6 Jan 2010 12:06:58 -0800 (PST), "keith...@gmail.com"
>
>
>
> <keith...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >On Jan 6, 11:25 am, Chris Friesen <cbf...@mail.usask.ca> wrote:
> >> On 01/06/2010 07:19 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
>
> >> > Q for Left-tilters: Is LT really that much more beneficial than a RT
> >> > blade, or is it just a tad more safe?
>
> >> Swingman's got it.
>
> >> It's safer on a beveled rip cut. The primary benefit is that the offcut
> >> is not trapped between the blade and the fence. If you put the fence to
> >> the left of the blade you can get he same effect with a right tilt saw.
>
> >> This is an unusual configuration with tablesaws for some reason,
> >> although it's common with bandsaws. Go figure.
>
> >Which leads be to ask, why are miter gauges normally set up for the
> >left side of the fence?
> >The extension table is on the right, so...
>
> There's no reason you have to use it on the left side (of the blade).
> I'm not sure why "left side of the fence" is relevant anyway, since
> I'll often remove the fence from the table when the crosscut is large.
Sorry, I meant "left side of the blade".
> In fact I heard a fellow named Hendrick Varju, who has been writing
> articles for Fine Woodworking and making "how to woodwork" DVD's, say
> on a podcast that he uses his miter guage on the right side whenever
> he can.
> I doubt he is the only one.
I thought it easier on the left too, given that there is a lot of
table on that side, but I had to pick which way to set up the gauge,
so chose the "standard". I may change it back (but that'll require a
new tape measure sticker) because I don't like reaching across the
blade and I usually stand to the right of the blade.