Toluene substitute?
Phreddy
and beeswax but I'm having trouble finding toluene. Seems it's used
to make one of the designer drugs so a lot of stores stopped selling
it. What would be the best substitute that won't harm wood?
David Carnell`
Andy Dingley
>What would be the best substitute that won't harm wood?
Turpentine; the real stuff from boiled-up trees, not a substitute made
by Exxon.
Better than toluene or mineral spirits.
--
Smert' Spamionam
Steven D. Russell
Toluene is available at any Home Depot or Lowes. It is labelled as Toluol in
home improvement centres. Here is a bit of info on Toluene from an article I
wrote for "Woodturning" magazine on various solvents used in the home
workshop. Toluene is a bad, bad boy, so be careful when using it, or
products that contain Toluene:
Toluene: (aka: Methylbenzene, Toluol, Methacide, Methylbenzol,
Phenylmethane) Toluene is a colourless, flammable aromatic hydrocarbon
solvent of low viscosity, similar in strength to Turpentine, but with a
faster evaporation rate. Toluene is similar to benzene and has a
benzene-like odour.
The catalytic reforming of refinery streams typically produces toluene. The
resulting crude reformate is extracted with sulfolane or tetrathylene glycol
and a cosolvent to yield a mixture of benzene, toluene, xylenes and C9
aromatics. These are then separated by fractionation. Toluene is used to
thin specialty paints, resins, dyes, coatings and some waxes. It is often
used in cold weather to speed the drying of oil-based coatings.
Health Concerns:
Eye: Vapours and liquid may cause irritation. May cause transient corneal
injury.
Skin: Acute contact with the liquid causes irritation and defatting of the
skin, with the possibility for subsequent dermatitis. May be absorbed
through the skin.
Ingestion: May cause gastrointestinal irritation. Aspiration into the lungs
may cause pneumonitis, which may be fatal. Symptoms may parallel inhalation
exposure.
Inhalation: May cause central nervous system depression, headaches,
dizziness, nausea and coordination difficulties. Exposure to high
concentrations of vapours can cause loss of consciousness, tremors,
restlessness, cardiac dysrhythmia, rapid heartbeat, increased blood
pressure, hallucinations, acidosis, coma, kidney failure and liver damage.
Chronic Exposure: This substance may affect the central nervous system,
causing decreased learning ability and psychological disorders. May cause
reproductive harm, cardiac sensitisation, severe heart abnormalities, liver
and kidney damage.
Toluene vapour retention in the lungs is approximately 50%, which can be
raised by bodily exertion. The half-life for elimination of toluene by
expired air varies between 2 minutes and 3.5 minutes.
The metabolic conversion of toluene occurs primarily in the liver. In
humans, toluene is oxidized to benzoic acid, which reacts with glycine to
form hippuric acid, N-benzoylglycine, which is excreted by the kidneys.
Using toluene exposes you to benzene, which is known to cause cancer, and
toluol, which is known to cause birth defects and other reproductive harm.
Good luck to you and best wishes in all of your woodworking endeavours. Take
care and all the best to you and yours!
--
Better Woodturning and Finishing Through Chemistry...
Steven D. Russell
Eurowood Werks Woodturning Studio
Machinery, Tool and Product Testing for the
Woodworking and Woodturning Industry
The Woodlands, Texas
"Phreddy" <phat_p...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3c5fb784...@news.atl.bellsouth.net...
Phreddy
<ben...@flash.net> wrote:
>Hello Phreddy,
>
>Toluene is available at any Home Depot or Lowes. It is labelled as Toluol in
>home improvement centres. Here is a bit of info on Toluene from an article I
>wrote for "Woodturning" magazine on various solvents used in the home
>workshop. Toluene is a bad, bad boy, so be careful when using it, or
>products that contain Toluene:
I have several Home Depots in my area (it is a Georgia company) and
most have a Lowes nearby. None of them sell Tolulol or any brand of
unmixed Toluene. Trust me, I wouldn't post if it were that easy.
Ditto with Ace Hardware.
>Toluene: (aka: Methylbenzene, Toluol, Methacide, Methylbenzol,
>Phenylmethane) Toluene is a colourless, flammable aromatic hydrocarbon
>solvent of low viscosity, similar in strength to Turpentine, but with a
>faster evaporation rate. Toluene is similar to benzene and has a
>benzene-like odour.
I plan on melting the carnauba and beeswax in a double boiler then
taking it outside to add my solvent. Doing it indoors is not an
option, even with ventilation.
>Good luck to you and best wishes in all of your woodworking endeavours. Take
>care and all the best to you and yours!
Thank you. It would be easy to go out and buy the wax but this is
much more satisfying.
Steven D. Russell
Well, both the Home Depot and Lowes near me (Houston, Texas) sell Toluol
(Toluene), so perhaps they maintain different inventories. In fact, just
this past summer I purchased a few cans of Toluol at Home Depot, (all they
had) and got the rest that I needed across the street at Lowes. So, they
have it in Houston anyway.
You might also try a professional finishing, or paint store. These sell to
the trade, mostly wholesale, but some will also sell a small quantity at
retail to consumers. Good luck and best wishes in all of your woodworking
endeavours!
--
Better Woodturning and Finishing Through Chemistry...
Steven D. Russell
Eurowood Werks Woodturning Studio
Machinery, Tool and Product Testing for the
Woodworking and Woodturning Industry
The Woodlands, Texas
"Phreddy" <phat_p...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3c605ded...@news.atl.bellsouth.net...
Steven D. Russell
On the other end of the bad boy spectrum, IMHO, are solvents like White
Spirit, Naphtha and Odourless Mineral Spirits, although you still must use
these solvents with caution. Toluene, Xylene, MEK and numerous other
solvents are bad boys in my book, even though I use them all frequently.
My distinction between "bad boys" and other solvents is directly related to
the toxic properties of the solvents and their effects on the human body.
These solvents and chemicals can range from somewhat benign compounds, to
highly toxic compounds with known carcinogenic (cancer causing), mutagenic
(damage to DNA that is heritable), teratogenic (causing structural or
functional abnormalities in the fetus or embryo), or neurotoxic effects.
The toxic effects of solvents vary between human, animal and plant
organisms. Many factors can influence the nature, severity and probability
of toxic injury. These include, but are not limited to, the number of
exposures, magnitude of exposure, route of exposure, time of dosing,
formulation and impurities present in the toxic substance, as well as
individual metabolic differences.
Acute damage may result from short-term exposure to high solvent doses,
whereas the absorption of smaller doses over longer periods can lead to
chronic damage and sensitisation. Chronic damage is often accompanied by an
acquired tolerance for the solvent, which can lead to late detection of the
damaging effects of the solvent. Most cases of solvent poisoning are related
to inhalation of solvent fumes. Inhaled vapours pass via the lungs and
blood, where they accumulate in high lipid content tissues like brain,
nerve, bone marrow, liver and kidney tissues.
The damage may occur in two forms. The cells can be damaged directly by the
solvents, or indirectly by their decomposition products. In addition to
inhalation, solvents may enter the body through cutaneous, or
gastrointestinal absorption. Symptoms of acute solvent poisoning may include
dizziness, drowsiness, severe headache, loss of consciousness and other
narcotic effects on the central nervous system.
Chronic poisoning symptoms may be initially undetectable, but subsequently
cause significant organ damage according to the particular solvent involved.
Chronic exposure to organic solvents has been associated with numerous
neurotoxic effects, including permanent brain and nervous system damage in
some studies.
In my studio, I wear proper chemical resistant gloves for the specific
solvent used, a full face respirator with the proper organic vapour
cartridge, arm covers, overgloves, chest protector and legs/feet covers at
times when mixing solvents. Even with this level of protection, there is
still risk in working with or mixing these solvents. My comment was only
meant to make the other poster aware that Toluene was a solvent that demands
proper protection and safeguards. I hope I have not put you to sleep with
this reply. Take care and all the best to you and yours!
--
Better Woodturning and Finishing Through Chemistry...
Steven D. Russell
Eurowood Werks Woodturning Studio
Machinery, Tool and Product Testing for the
Woodworking and Woodturning Industry
The Woodlands, Texas
"Jimchip" <jim...@nothere.net.invalid> wrote in message
news:Xns91ACBEE7F4E...@127.0.0.1...
> "Steven D. Russell" <ben...@flash.net> wrote
>
> > Hello Phreddy,
> >
> > Toluene is available at any Home Depot or Lowes. It is labelled as
> > Toluol in home improvement centres. Here is a bit of info on Toluene
> > from an article I wrote for "Woodturning" magazine on various solvents
> > used in the home workshop. Toluene is a bad, bad boy, so be careful when
> > using it, or products that contain Toluene:
> >
> <snip>
> Agreed that one should be careful with any organic solvent. But if
"toluene
> is a bad, bad boy" what would be a "good boy"?
>
> IMO, one must be careful, avoid fumes, check ventilation but I think
almost
> any solvent is going to have similar specs.
>
>
> --
> Jim jimchip 'at' spamcop.net
> At first there was nothing. Then God said 'Let there be light!'
> Then there was still nothing. But you could see it.
Elmar
the pros go to buy their stuff...
We used to use acetone and toluene along with some other additive to
soften racing tires....Yes you do get funny looks when you go buy this
stuff!!!
I believe it's used in manufacturing crack.
Phreddy
<ben...@flash.net> wrote:
>Hello Jimchip,
>
>On the other end of the bad boy spectrum, IMHO, are solvents like White
>Spirit, Naphtha and Odourless Mineral Spirits, although you still must use
>these solvents with caution. Toluene, Xylene, MEK and numerous other
>solvents are bad boys in my book, even though I use them all frequently.
Wise words that can't be repeated often enough. I do a lot of work
with hydroflouric acid so I'm used to being super cautious around
chemicals.
NOSPAMBOB
In article <Hrc88.30026$%U6.325...@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com>, "Steven D.
Russell" <ben...@flash.net> writes:
>In my studio, I wear proper chemical resistant gloves for the specific
>solvent used, a full face respirator with the proper organic vapour
>cartridge, arm covers, overgloves, chest protector and legs/feet covers at
>times when mixing solvents.
Name works for E-mail
Steven D. Russell
Good question, but very easy to answer mate. You will not find very good
chemical resistant gloves at local home centres, you MUST go to a
professional chemical resistant elastomer glove manufacturer, or supplier.
Choosing the right glove to wear can be a difficult, if not daunting task.
There are numerous types, styles and brands of protective gloves on the
market. Whilst a particular glove might give excellent protection against
Turpentine, it will dissolve in Xylene.
Some gloves may be resistant to the liquid chemical, but allow permeation of
the vapour. Common dishwashing and surgical gloves are poor choices for many
of the chemicals, solvents and driers found in typical wood finishes. To
protect yourself properly, you must match the appropriate glove material
with the chemicals present in the products you will be using and the length
of time you will be exposed to the chemicals.
The dizzying array of available elastomers include Chloroprene Rubber
(Neoprene), Natural and Pure Gum Rubber, Nitrile Butadiene Rubber (Buna N /
Nitrile), Chloro-Isobutylene Isoprene Rubber (Chlorobutyl), Chloro-Sulfonyl
Polyethlene (Hypalon), Ethylene Propylene Diene Monomer (Ethylene Propylene
Rubber, Nordel, Royalene), Fluorocarbon Elastomer (Viton, Fluorel)
Tetrafluoro-ethylene Resin (Teflon) and Dimethyl Polysiloxane (Silicone).
Common names for protective glove materials include: 4H (Polyethylene and
Ethylene Vinyl Alcohol) and Barricade which are state-of-the-art laminated
films, Butyl Rubber, Neoprene, Nitrile Rubber, Natural Rubber, Polyethylene,
Polyvinyl Alcohol and Polyvinyl Chloride to name a few. Unfortunately, there
is no "universal" glove that can be used for every situation, with every
chemical.
Many factors will influence your decision on the best glove to use for
applying, or working with common solvents and finishes. These include the
physical conditions like temperature, abrasion, cuts and puncturing. Also,
the specific chemical involved, or combination of chemicals present in the s
olvent or finish, as well as the estimated contact time with the chemical
should be considered. Heavy or prolonged exposures will require different
types and thicknesses of elastomers, than those suitable for brief duration
exposures.
What type of specific features you will need?
· Smooth, or textured glove surface?
· Length - above the wrist, or to the elbow?
· Supported or unsupported?
· Insulation, dexterity and tactile needs?
· Cuffs, or no cuffs?
· Do you want a single use disposable glove, or a reusable glove?
Manufacturers' have many different types of gloves available, including
supported and unsupported styles. Supported gloves are manufactured by
dipping a woven or knitted cloth liner into a liquid glove compound, like
neoprene or nitrile. The inner liner "supports" the outer coating and adds
strength to the glove. However, supported gloves generally offer less
tactile feedback than unsupported styles.
Unsupported gloves are manufactured by dipping Porcelain hand forms into a
liquid glove compound, without any liner material to support the compound.
Upon drying, the film is removed from the form, leaving a moulded glove. A
typical latex glove would be an example of this type of "unsupported" glove.
Some unsupported gloves feature a "flocked" inner coating, or powder that
increases user comfort by absorbing perspiration.
Thinner, unsupported gloves allow greater dexterity and tactile feedback
than the thicker and heavier supported gloves. However, the thicker
supported styles offer greater protection against chemicals and wear, like
abrasion, cuts and puncture resistance.
Have a go at any of these suppliers. If you are not in one of the countries
shown, go to the manufacturers website and search for a manufacturer or
distributor near your home. There is a link to a website that provides
recommendations to proper selection of chemical resistant gloves at the
bottom of the list. Most manufacturers also offer online elastomer selection
guides, or offer a tech support line.
Best Manufacturing Company - U.S.A.
Website: http://www.bestglove.com
Edison Street
Menlo, GA 30731
Phone (800) 241-0323
Email: U...@bestglove.com
Best Manufacturing Company U.K.
Covering Northern United Kingdom, Ireland, Scandinavia, & Finland
Graham Ayers
Email: gay...@bestglove.com
Covering Southern United Kingdom
Jeff McKenzie
38 Mossfield Road
Kings Heath
Birmingham, B14 7JB
England
Phone & Fax: (44) 121 444 7456
Email: jmck...@bestglove.com
Ansell Protective Products
Website: http://ansell-edmont.com
1300 Walnut Street
P.O. Box: 6000
Coshocton, OH 43812-6000
USA Phone (800) 800-0444
MAPA Professional U.S.A.
Website: http://www.mapaglove.com
512 E. Tiffin Street
Willard, OH 44890
Phone (800) 537-2897
Email: sa...@mapaglove.com
MAPA (U.K.) Ltd.
Halesfield 23
TELFORD, SHROPSHIRE, TF7 4NY.
UNITED-KINGDOM
Tel: 00 44 1952684487
Email: su...@mapa.co.uk
North Hand Protection
Website: http://www.safety4.com
4090 Azalea Drive
P.O. Box 70729
Charleston, SC 29405
Phone: (843) 745-5900
Email: julie....@northsafety.com
Internet Resources:
MSDS and COSHH Safety Data Sheets
http://www.orcbs.msu.edu/pat/msdslinkmain.html Links to numerous MSDS/COSHH
websites and other related information
http://www.chm.bris.ac.uk/safety/coshh.htm COSHH information and related
safety information
Chemical Resistant Glove Selection Guide:
http://www.chemrest.com - Excellent online catalogue for chemical resistant
gloves from Best Manufacturing. Other glove guides are located on the
specific manufacturer websites.
Good luck to you and best wishes in all of your woodturing endeavours!
--
Better Woodturning and Finishing Through Chemistry...
Steven D. Russell
Eurowood Werks Woodturning Studio
Machinery, Tool and Product Testing for the
Woodworking and Woodturning Industry
The Woodlands, Texas
"NOSPAMBOB" <nosp...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020207082704...@mb-fz.aol.com...
Lew Hodgett
>Where does one go to find 'proper' gloves then where are the gloves found?
Personal safety equipment suppliers.
--
Lew
S/A: Challenge, The Bullet Proof Boat, (Under Construction in the Southland)
Visit: <http://home.earthlink.net/~lewhodgett> for Pictures