Workbench depth and height?

[-MIKE-]

Workbench against the wall...
Ideal depth from the wall?
Ideal height from the ground?

(Understanding there is no "ideal.")


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
mi...@mikedrumsDOT.com
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

[SonomaProducts.com]

1. Typical counter height is 30 inches.
- If you are tall or short and primary/only user you might want to
adjust that
- The only reason to go much lower than 30" is for a final assembly
or finishing table and only if that is primary or only use.

2. I think wider is better if there is no space issue. You can squeeze
by at 18" deep, do fine with 24" and 36" deep is starting to get too
deep for practical need for an up against the wall setup. 30" might be
ideal if space is no issue.

All opinions coming from experience of at least a dozen variations
I've built and used over the years at differnt locations.

On 26 Okt., 15:08, -MIKE- <m...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote:
> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?
>
> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")
>
> --
>
>   -MIKE-
>
>   "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
>      --Elvin Jones  (1927-2004)
>   --
>  http://mikedrums.com

>   m...@mikedrumsDOT.com

[RP]

On Oct 26, 6:08 pm, -MIKE- <m...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote:
> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?
>
> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")
>
> --
>
>   -MIKE-
>
>   "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
>      --Elvin Jones  (1927-2004)
>   --
>  http://mikedrums.com

>   m...@mikedrumsDOT.com

>   ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

My workbench is 36" or so tall. I like 24" to 30" deep for a wall
bench. My free standing workbench is 36" tall X 38" wide X 84" long. I
do have final assembly saw horses 24" or so tall also.

RP

[Lee Michaels]

"-MIKE-" <mi...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote in message
news:j8a0ce$i3f$2...@dont-email.me...

> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?
>
> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")
>
>

Lee's Golden Rules of Workbench Design

1) Size is determined by how much space you have. Ideally, you can walk
around it. If you have to put it against a wall, you need a side or two of
access to the bench. You should be able to easily reach across the bench.

2) It must have a solid top. It must be able to withstand cuts, holes and
other general abuse. Any bench that is used to any degree has a distressed
top. If it is too pretty, it means it was not used for anything. I have
used various laminated wood tops, layers of plywood and covered tops with
hardboard. They all served their purpose. Remember, no matter how ugly
your bench top gets, you can always refresh or renew it in some fashion.

3) It must be solid and sturdy. If it wobbles or sways, it ain't a bench.
Benches, by definition, are solid, substantial work platforms.

4) It should have some kind of storage underneath. Whether it is drawers,
shelves, cabinets or whatever, under bench real estate is valuable. Put it
to good use.

5) Any woodworking bench should have a vise and bench stop holes. Make sure
the vice has some way of anchoring the wood on one end when using the bench
stops.

6) And bench or work area should have easy access to electricity. I have
screwed a surge protector to benches before. I like outlets wired just
above bench height to plug in tools right at the work surface area. I have
had a couple benches that had electrical outlets installed in the benches
themselves.

7) Lighting is essential. This is an extension of the above rule. One
thing I do is to have some clamp on lights and some elbow lamps. I will
stick the elbow lamps into the bench stop holes. This puts light directly
where I want it. As you get older, your tolerance (or ability) to working
in low light situations decrease.

8) The height should be determined by both your height and your intended
uses. Or perhaps the best height is just what is most comfortable to you.
I have cut the legs off of benches before. I have also put blocks under
benches as well. Find something that works for you. I think in terms of
sanding, drill and planeing wood. An inch or two under my waist height
works for me.

9) Leave a space underneath the top. I saw this idea on a fancy commercial
model and instantly incorporated in into everything I built since. Just
leave a space of about eight inches or so directly underneath the top of the
bench. You can stash all kinds of tool underneath there when working. This
leaves the top free. This actually increases your available workspace.

10) Make the bench fit the space. Both in terms of size and function. We
all do different things in our shops. Make it fit your needs. some people
make the bench the same height as their table saw. I have seen various
stands and tool carts around the bench. This frees up bench top space. A
bench covered with crap is just a junk pile. It ain't a bench. (Wives hate
any kind of clean, horizontal space. They will take any workspace and
convert it into a junk pile.) Make the bench functional. Make it your own.
Remember, nobody can make anything to fit you better than you.

Happy bench building,

Lee

[k-nuttle]

My work bench is on wheels so it can be used as an auxilary bench for
the table saw or as an out feed when ripping on the saw.

[-MIKE-]

On 10/26/11 6:33 PM, Lee Michaels wrote:
> "-MIKE-" <mi...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote in message
> news:j8a0ce$i3f$2...@dont-email.me...
>> Workbench against the wall...
>> Ideal depth from the wall?
>> Ideal height from the ground?
>>
>> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")
>>
>

> 1) You should be able to easily reach across the
> bench.
>

> 8) The height should be determined by both your height and your intended
> uses. Or perhaps the best height is just what is most comfortable to
> you.
>

> Lee

There.
That would've kept me from reading that book about stuff I didn't ask. :-p

[Jack]

On 10/26/2011 6:08 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?

> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")

My bench top is 30" deep and 37" high. I'm 6'2" and the size has been
ideal for me for 36 years. I guess the height could be adjusted some
depending on your height.



--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

[Swingman]

Ditto ... you need to join us on G+

--
www.eWoodShop.com
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)
http://gplus.to/eWoodShop

[Lobby Dosser]

"-MIKE-" <mi...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote in message
news:j8a0ce$i3f$2...@dont-email.me...

> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?
>
> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")

If you are going to do a lot of hand tool work - planing, chiseling, etc,
consider making just a bit higher than the height of the palm of your hand
parallel to the floor with your arm at rest by your side. For planing in
particular that height allows you to "get your back into it".

[dadiOH]

-MIKE- wrote:
> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?
>
> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")

Height: standing? sitting? For standing, sufficient to work at without
bending more than minimally

Depth: as deep as possible and still let you reach stuff. The higher the
counter, the less depth; for example, if a bench/counter were chest high the
depth couldn't be much more than the length of your arm from armpit to
wrist.

Conventions:
kitchen counter, 36" high, 25" wide
lavatory, 30-32" high, 16-24" wide
desk, 28-30" high, 24-36" wide

My experiences

I find 36" too low for kitchen counters, made all of ours 37 1/2. I'm
5'8", wife is 5'2" and that height is good for both of us.

Lavatories of 30-32" high are an abomination IMO, made ours 37 1/2 too.
We no longer have to bend but the bowl needs to be as far forward as
possible.

All my shop work tables/benches are also 37 1/2. Like you, I have a
table against a wall; it is 24" deep, 72" wide and has 3 tiers of drawers;
all drawers on the same level are the same height so I can pull out drawers
and stash stuff on them temporarily...freshly painted boards, for example.

I also have two tables that are 37 1/2 x 48 x 12. Each has provision
for storing clamps. I do most of my work on them, all my assembly. Each is
on casters so I can move them to have a 12 x 96 or 48 x 48 contiguous
surface. I can also move them to use them in conjunction with other
tables/benches.

Next time I make a pair, I'm going to rig a way to vary the height of the
working surface...perhaps just by flopping the table 90 degrees, perhaps by
having the tops adjustable vertically. Probably the latter. In either
case, I'll have to build something else for clamps, been meaning to do it
anyway :)

I have a couple of pieces of low loop commercial carpet that I put on the
tables when sanding; helps keep stuff from slipping and also from being
dented by a wood chip or any other way. The next tables will also
incorporate a roller under the top to store the pieces of carpet. There
will also be rollers for pieces of visqueen so I can cover the laminate tops
when gluing.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

[EXT]

"-MIKE-" <mi...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote in message
news:j8a0ce$i3f$2...@dont-email.me...

My workbench is based on an idea in Popular Science or maybe Popular
Mechanics from the early 60s. It is 37" high, and 48 inches square, unusual
I know, but it gives me 4 sides that I can work on, and a lot of bench room
for bulky stuff. Under it are 2 banks of drawers and 2 cupboards with 4 sets
of shelves between the drawers and cupboards. There is also 4 electric
outlets, one on each side. It has worked well for me for 35 years. It knocks
down for moving so it will fit through a door.

[Stuart]

In article <j8a0ce$i3f$2...@dont-email.me>,

-MIKE- <mi...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote:
> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?

> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")

In "Record's" book on planes etc., (I wish I had the original but it was
borrowed from the library and bits photocopied) it recomends a height of
2'6" to 2'8" depending on the worker. It really depends on what you find
comfortable. I am 5'8" and my bench is 2'8", I find it a comfortable
working height.

Front to back they recomend 2' minimum, 2'9" a "useful" width.

The front board of the top should be of 2 to 2.1/2" well seasoned Birch or
Beech, 12" or so wide. The back part of the top, which forms the well, can
be of red deal 1" thick.

--
Stuart Winsor

Only plain text for emails
http://www.asciiribbon.org

[Puckdropper at dot]

-MIKE- <mi...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote in news:j8a0ce$i3f$2...@dont-email.me:

> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?
>
> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")
>
>

I've found my table saw height to be quite effective for a bench (it's
really an infeed table that gets used as a bench...)

Reach in distance should be no more than 30". If you've got an old door
available, you could mock up a bench using that.

Puckdropper

[Scott Lurndal]

-MIKE- <mi...@mikedrumsDOT.com> writes:
>Workbench against the wall...

Really depends on what you're going to do with it. If used for gluing
or assembly of furniture, place it in the center of the shop.

>Ideal depth from the wall?

Center of room, or at least 3' from wall.

>Ideal height from the ground?

From standing height, you should be able to place your flat palm
on the bench. For planing, make it a bit higher, for assembly,
a bit lower.

[-MIKE-]

On 10/27/11 7:17 AM, dadiOH wrote:
> -MIKE- wrote:
>> Workbench against the wall...
>> Ideal depth from the wall?
>> Ideal height from the ground?
>>
>> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")
>
> Height: standing? sitting?

What about lying on the ground. I think we need to cover that. :-p

Thanks... I'm leaning towards higher than lower.
And I agree with you about vanities.

[russell...@yahoo.com]

I'll tell you what I have. Free standing bench, access from all
sides, can walk completely around it. 2 feet and one half inch wide.
7 feet and two inches long. 38 inches high. Bit high for hand
planing. Good for power tool work since the work is up in the air.
Haven't put the drawers underneath yet.

On Oct 26, 5:08 pm, -MIKE- <m...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote:
> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?
>
> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")
>
> --
>
>   -MIKE-
>
>   "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
>      --Elvin Jones  (1927-2004)
>   --
>  http://mikedrums.com

>   m...@mikedrumsDOT.com

[Larry Jaques]

On Thu, 27 Oct 2011 15:46:36 +0100, Stuart <Spa...@argonet.co.uk>
wrote:

What is "red deal", Stuart?

--
Learning to ignore things is one of the great paths to inner peace.
-- Robert J. Sawyer

[Larry Jaques]

On Thu, 27 Oct 2011 21:39:52 +0100, Stuart <Spa...@argonet.co.uk>
wrote:

>In article <9ibja7h7e5q9fn8sv...@4ax.com>,

> Larry Jaques <lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:
>> >The front board of the top should be of 2 to 2.1/2" well seasoned Birch
>> >or Beech, 12" or so wide. The back part of the top, which forms the
>> >well, can be of red deal 1" thick.
>
>> What is "red deal", Stuart?
>

>I am quoting from the book but I believe it is also known as Scots pine
>
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scots_Pine

Huh! I've heard the term before, once or twice, but never found out
what it is until now. Thanks.

Pineywood is pineywood to me.

[Father Haskell]

On Oct 26, 6:08 pm, -MIKE- <m...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote:
> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?
>
> (Understanding there is no "ideal.")

Indeed. Japanese workbench = pair of 6 x 6's.
Appropriate "vise" = the carpenter's feet.

[Hoosierpopi]

On Oct 26, 6:08 pm, -MIKE- <m...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote:

> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?

I let my table saw guide me as to the height and my "chop saw"
determine the depth (I built-in an area to hold the 12" Miter/Chop
Saw). The height allows me to use the bench and table saw top to
support longer / wide items from time to time.

The idea, elsewhere of leaving a space below the top to store
miscellaneous tools and such is a good one - improved by fixing
drawers in the space so you can store stuff the full depth of the
bench and still retrieve them. Taking this a step further, the space
under the bench is best fitted with deep and wide drawers for the same
reasons.

Design for a vise - retrofitting a vise is a royal pita and at least
one vice is a great idea that wll get lots of use. The top of the vise
jaws in the same plane as the bench top (or slightly 1/32-1/16" below)
and at the right or left hand corner depending on your preference.

I built mine with a quarter-inch sheet of Masonite over top of the
structural top material with the idea of replacing the top if/when
needed.

I also built-in a power strip at the front edge of the bench so I
don't have cables running over the bench top. Mine was a steel strip
that allowed me to recess it into the front apron a few inches below
the top. The cord for it ran underneath the top to the wall outlet
behind the bench. (Actually, I have three of these on the apron -
Left, Middle & Right because you can never have enough outlets.

If you're into hydraulics, you can do as a fellow I met in Florida and
build a bench that can be raised or lowered - it was really cool. He
could lower it so it was comfortable to sit and work or raise it when
standing and working on a project! He also had re-worked his floor
mounted drill press to oscillate the quill so he could use sanding
drums with it.

...........

[Hoosierpopi]

On Oct 26, 6:08 pm, -MIKE- <m...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote:

> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?

[-MIKE-]

Wow, didn't answer either question.

[Josepi]

Typical kitchen counter, standing work surface height, is 36".

Fake what you want to do on your kitchen counter and decide from there.

----------

"-MIKE-" wrote in message news:j8a0ce$i3f$2...@dont-email.me...

[-MIKE-]

On 10/27/11 5:57 PM, Hoosierpopi wrote:
> On Oct 26, 6:08 pm, -MIKE-<m...@mikedrumsDOT.com> wrote:
>> Workbench against the wall...
>> Ideal depth from the wall?
>> Ideal height from the ground?
>
> I let my table saw guide me as to the height and my "chop saw"
> determine the depth (I built-in an area to hold the 12" Miter/Chop
> Saw). The height allows me to use the bench and table saw top to
> support longer / wide items from time to time.
>

This is one of the main reason I'm building it. I haven't had the miter
saw incorporated with a permanent spot in the shop. I wrote "against the
wall" with the intent to avoid the dozen or so replies about a
middle-of-the-shop bench. It didn't work. :-) This is a one-car garage
that would barely hold one car.

I have several tools along that wall and want to clean it up and have
them on the bench, able to evenly support longs boards at each tool.
I also want to ability to quickly move a tool not often used up to the
bench, then out of the way to use the bench for working.

I'm going to have at least a portion of the underneath area that will
run the entire length (12') of the bench, because I've never had an area
to store longer boards until use. I have tool storage in other areas, so
even though I may incorporate a drawer or two, I'm more interested in
being able to have that long lumber slot and the ability to store
bigger, seldom used tools (grinder, planer, etc.) and have a parking
spot for the shop vac.

[-MIKE-]

On 10/27/11 6:35 PM, Josepi wrote:
> Typical kitchen counter, standing work surface height, is 36".
>
> Fake what you want to do on your kitchen counter and decide from there.
>

In my research I'm finding that the conventional wisdom is if you're
using hand tool, you want it low so you can get your back into it. If
you're using power tools, high than lower is better. Since I'm using
mostly power tools and my back gets sore easily, I'm going for higher.

Also, it's a garage with a sloped floor so it will be both higher and
lower. :-)

[Josepi]

Parallelogram top part for height adjustment?


-----------
"-MIKE-" wrote in message news:j8cqod$1pe$2...@dont-email.me...

[k-nuttle]

On 10/27/2011 7:47 PM, -MIKE- wrote:

> This is a one-car garage that would barely hold one car.

This is precisely why I took the route that I did. I had a two car
garage, in an area where the winter temps were normally in the 20's.

I tried to make all of the bench fixtures in my "shop" mobile. My work
bench, table saw. etc are all on wheels and the work areas are all the
same height. I have a large piece of plywood that covers the table saw
which has wings on each side so it can be used as a work surface for
gluing, assembly, etc.

The work bench has end storage units where I keep small tools, like my
dremmel, jig saw, electric sander, etc. and shelves between for storage
of frequently used tools. The table saw has a storage shelf under it.

When in use the mobile units can be arranged in the configuration that
provides the best work flow for the project that I am working on.
Sometime the work bench is an out feed table, some time the cutting area
is the workbench and the table saw is the assembly table, sometime the
work bench is a staging area for pieces I am cutting on the table saw.
Units are moved around to minimize walking and so every thing I am
working with is conveniently with in reach.

When not in use each of the mobile units has its place along the garage
wall so the garage can perform it intended use, protect the cars from
the elements.

My vice, manual miter box, bench grinder, router table, etc. are mounted
on 2X10, 12' etc. and stored in a shelf unit until needed. When in
use, I clamp the 2x to the top of the workbench. (The work bench to is
half lapped 2X4 rabbeted to accept a piece of plywood so it is flush
with the 2X4)

While I have had this set up for years, there is a video of someone's
shop who took this concept to the extreme. It can be found by googling.

[-MIKE-]

All my large power tools are currently on wheels and while it's a nice
concept, it simply doesn't work well in a single car garage. Your two
car might as well be a warehouse compared to mine. I get very sick of
having to roll out commonly used tools and support tables, which don't
always (read: rarely) meet up correctly with the tool height. My table
saw has a fold up out-feed table that suits 95% of its needs.

[dadiOH]

-MIKE- wrote:
> On 10/27/11 6:35 PM, Josepi wrote:
>> Typical kitchen counter, standing work surface height, is 36".
>>
>> Fake what you want to do on your kitchen counter and decide from
>> there.
>
> In my research I'm finding that the conventional wisdom is if you're
> using hand tool, you want it low so you can get your back into it. If
> you're using power tools, high than lower is better. Since I'm using
> mostly power tools and my back gets sore easily, I'm going for higher.



> Also, it's a garage with a sloped floor so it will be both higher and
> lower. :-)

*VERY* handy for bevels :)

[m II]

Does this mean your car will stay outside from now on?

Mine both park in the driveway for the summer. When it gets much below
freezing they come in and only get bounced out when warmer days and
woodworking goes on. Sawdust is a problem for other equipment though.


-----------------
"-MIKE-" wrote in message news:j8d0va$1md$2...@dont-email.me...

[Dave]

On Fri, 28 Oct 2011 09:33:32 -0400, "m II" <C...@in.the.hat> wrote:
>Does this mean your car will stay outside from now on?
>
>Mine both park in the driveway for the summer. When it gets much below
>freezing they come in and only get bounced out when warmer days and
>woodworking goes on. Sawdust is a problem for other equipment though.

What? What? Just generally pleasant commentry? No Bullshit or Fuck
Off? You sick boy? Your mom kick you out of the basement or something
else equally terrifying?

You're not allowed to be just a regular person here. We need more than
just Twayne to call an asshole.

[m II]

Chris Caputo

------------

"Dave" wrote in message
news:4icla79klfdoibe51...@4ax.com...

[Eric]

Keep up the good work, trollboi!
I have lots more.

------------
"m II" wrote in message news:lxyqq.8354$v_4....@newsfe21.iad...

Chris Caputo

------------
"Dave" wrote in message
news:4icla79klfdoibe51...@4ax.com...

[Leon]

I had just about forgotten about Lyl'wayne. Is he still here. LOL

[Eric]

Keep up the good work, trollboi!
I have lots more.

------------
"m II" wrote in message news:lxyqq.8354$v_4....@newsfe21.iad...

Chris Caputo

------------
"Dave" wrote in message
news:4icla79klfdoibe51...@4ax.com...

[Dave]

On Sat, 29 Oct 2011 20:55:05 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
wrote:

>I had just about forgotten about Lyl'wayne. Is he still here. LOL

Not as often, but he looks in with a comment now and then. But, Josepi
is still here. Between Twayne, Josepi and m II, we have a perfect trio
of twits. All that any self respecting newsgroup ask for.

(It's Saturday night and I'm bored. What else can I say?)

[whit3rd]

On Wednesday, October 26, 2011 3:08:14 PM UTC-7, -MIKE- wrote:
> Workbench against the wall...
> Ideal depth from the wall?
> Ideal height from the ground?

Height from ground is based on elbow height; you want your
elbow above the work for planing, sawing, and the like.
For me, five to ten inches below the elbow seems about right.

[m II]

Sounds like the distance from your elbow to your groin minus a few
inches.


--------------
"whit3rd" wrote in message
news:4163835.643.1320012998870.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@yqan20...

[Andrew Barss]

Hoosierpopi <gooeyt...@gmail.com> wrote:

: If you're into hydraulics, you can do as a fellow I met in Florida and

: build a bench that can be raised or lowered - it was really cool. He
: could lower it so it was comfortable to sit and work or raise it when
: standing and working on a project!

Do you have any details? I'm building height-adjustable bench with an
electric base I got from surplus, but would ideally like another, and
hadn't considered hydraulics.

-- Andy Barss