Gybing in harsh chop ?
Steve Joures
other day.
I was sailing in the most bouncy chop I have sailed in, which was quite fun
in a straight line, but when it came to turning round I found it very
difficult.
The board bounced during the carve either throwing me in forwards, or just
shifting my foot and spoiling it.
When I tried to commit more weight to the rail and to the mast foot, it
just seemed more likely that I went over forwards on the bounce.
What can I try to improve in these conditions ?
Steve Joures
Mike F
If you are looking above rather than below your booms, your knees are not
bent enough. You should feel like you are squatting down.
Or just buy a Bonzer. Even WS Mag concurs with that.
I've also e-mailed you my jibe tips, which may help. One recipient said thay
raised his completion rate from 2-3 per session to 25 in his very next
session ... before he quit counting.
Mike \m/
To reply directly, remove the SpamDam.
"Steve Joures" <st...@joures.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:01c02ac4$df1dc280$0e54883e@linuxip...
Craig gsogh Goudie
"Steve Joures" <st...@joures.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
> I'm can do 50% of gybes on a good day, but managed a resounding 0% the
> other day.
> I was sailing in the most bouncy chop I have sailed in, which was
quite fun
> in a straight line, but when it came to turning round I found it very
> difficult.
> The board bounced during the carve either throwing me in forwards, or
just
> shifting my foot and spoiling it.
> When I tried to commit more weight to the rail and to the mast foot,
it
> just seemed more likely that I went over forwards on the bounce.
> What can I try to improve in these conditions ?
>
> Steve Joures
>
>
Hi Steve,
Aside from Mike's Tips which I'm sure are excellent, a timid long
radius jibe in harsh chop is tough to complete. Set a rail and be
agressive with holding an arc (with your feet) and leaning into (
to the inside of) the turn. There are about 10,000 other tips, but
the above (along with the bent shock absorber knees), should keep
you from bouncing.
Good luck!
--
Craig (Go Short or Go Home!) Goudie
Sailing the high desert lakes of Utah on my:
RRD 298, Starboard 272 and Bailey 8'6" with
Naish Sails and Rec Composites Fins
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
spoo...@maclaunch.com
F" <iso...@earthSpamDamlink.net> wrote:
> *** ___ B E N D Z E E K N E E S ___ ***
>
> If you are looking above rather than below your booms, your knees are not
> bent enough. You should feel like you are squatting down.
>
> Or just buy a Bonzer. Even WS Mag concurs with that.
>
> I've also e-mailed you my jibe tips, which may help. One recipient said thay
> raised his completion rate from 2-3 per session to 25 in his very next
> session ... before he quit counting.
>
> Mike \m/
> To reply directly, remove the SpamDam.
> "Steve Joures" <st...@joures.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:01c02ac4$df1dc280$0e54883e@linuxip...
> > I'm can do 50% of gybes on a good day, but managed a resounding 0% the
> > other day.
> > I was sailing in the most bouncy chop I have sailed in, which was quite
> fun
> > in a straight line, but when it came to turning round I found it very
> > difficult.
> > The board bounced during the carve either throwing me in forwards, or just
> > shifting my foot and spoiling it.
> > When I tried to commit more weight to the rail and to the mast foot, it
> > just seemed more likely that I went over forwards on the bounce.
> > What can I try to improve in these conditions ?
> >
> > Steve Joures
> >
> >
Could you post those jibe tips here (uh oh. That may upset WS Magazine!)
or send them my way?
Thanks!!
RMoore 41
"properly powered" from the setup of your turn thru the carve. If you ease off
the power by sheeting out the sail (even a little) you take the pressure off
the mast foot and lose some downward force. Your board will bounce. Most often
this will happen when you unhook from the harness before you make your step.
The key is to maintain power by keeping the sail locked in with your arms and
lower your butt. This should allow you to start your carve with your board
under control.
>> other day.
>> I was sailing in the most bouncy chop I have sailed in, which was
>quite fun
>> in a straight line, but when it came to turning round I found it very
>> difficult.
>> The board bounced during the carve either throwing me in forwards, or
>just
>> shifting my foot and spoiling it.
>> When I tried to commit more weight to the rail and to the mast foot,
>it
>> just seemed more likely that I went over forwards on the bounce.
>> What can I try to improve in these conditions ?
>>
>> Steve Joures
>>
>>
>
gar...@my-deja.com
"Steve Joures" <st...@joures.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
> other day.
> I was sailing in the most bouncy chop I have sailed in, which was
quite fun
> in a straight line, but when it came to turning round I found it very
> difficult.
> The board bounced during the carve either throwing me in forwards, or
just
> shifting my foot and spoiling it.
> When I tried to commit more weight to the rail and to the mast foot,
it
> just seemed more likely that I went over forwards on the bounce.
> What can I try to improve in these conditions ?
>
> Steve Joures
and sailing was to buy a used Tiga 263 bump & jump. Plastic, heavy,
slow but what a ride & so easy to turn through rough water-like the
chop isn't there. Nose is turned up, thin, thin rails, still a modern
shape (ahead of it's time?) after 4 years.Sail range for me at 170 is
3.5 to 6.3! Should be able to find one cheap at swaps,etc.
Jeff Bilyeu
slow down
a little which will help maintain control. In Extreme chop slowing down is
usually mandatory
Jeff
Sharkie
"Mike F" <iso...@earthSpamDamlink.net> wrote:
> *** ___ B E N D Z E E K N E E S ___ ***
said thay
> raised his completion rate from 2-3 per session to 25 in his very next
> session ... before he quit counting.
Can you email them to me too? I have similar problems, although
not only in chop... :)
shar...@my-deja.com
--
If the human brain were so simple
that we could understand it,
we would be so simple we couldn't.
-Makes Sense... don't it?
Mike F
Hate to burden the bandwidth with them unless lots of people want 'em.
Mike \m/
To reply directly, remove the SpamDam.
<spoo...@maclaunch.com> wrote in > Could you post those jibe tips here (uh
Mike F
ago, but now we know (and that same mag says) we should shut the power off
by oversheeting when we enter the jibe. But sheeting out -- even a LITTLE
bit -- when jibing is a very effective way to spin out.
Mike \m/
To reply directly, remove the SpamDam.
"RMoore 41" <rmoo...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000930131400...@ng-cp1.aol.com...
Mike F
head and in radar gun tests, according to ... our favorite magazine. It only
FELT slow because of its super smooth ride ... which is one reason it is so
fast. But no need to apologize for thinking it is slow ..... our favorite
mag also thought so ... until it started passing most other boards in their
annual test fleet.
Mike \m/
To reply directly, remove the SpamDam.
<gar...@my-deja.com> wrote > > Steve; The best thing I ever did for my high
Mike F
Mike \m/
To reply directly, remove the SpamDam.
"Jeff Bilyeu" <bil...@nospam.aci.net> wrote
Louis
to be found. If you have the room, wait to find one to jibe in.
That being said, you should not get into the habit of always jibing in
the calmer sections. How often do you see people who will only jibe
within 100 feet of the shore, either because it is calm, or shallow, or
both? Like almost everything else in windsurfing, jibing in chop has as
much to do about confidence as it does with technique.
Just like in skiing, you should lower your COG by bending the knees, and
maybe your could exit the jibe with the sail in a clew-first position,
just so that the sail flip does not destabilize you in the middle of the
mogul field. But even more important is to go into the jibe with a
positive attitude. As you get better, launch your jibes in steeper and
steeper chop.
Cheers,
Louis
RMoore 41
>ago, but now we know (and that same mag says) we should shut the power off
>by oversheeting when we enter the jibe. But sheeting out -- even a LITTLE
>bit -- when jibing is a very effective way to spin out.
>
>Mike \m/
The amount of oversheeting and how long you keep the sail oversheeted is very
dependent on the conditions and how powered up you are. . That can be from
power off to some power on. You need the right amount of power (and momentum)
jibing in "harsh " chop as you will be hitting the backsides of the chop. I
guess the point I was trying to make is that if you ease the pressure off the
mast foot by sheeting out your board will start to pound and you will lose your
smooth carve.
gar...@my-deja.com
"Mike F" <iso...@earthSpamDamlink.net> wrote:
> Slow? It is a ROCKETSHIP in chop, easily beating most race boards
head to
> head and in radar gun tests, according to ... our favorite magazine.
It only
> FELT slow because of its super smooth ride ... which is one reason it
is so
> fast. But no need to apologize for thinking it is slow ..... our
favorite
> mag also thought so ... until it started passing most other boards in
their
> annual test fleet.
the conditions as opposed to merely surviving them. What a shame such
good design & product has been discontinued. I hope mine lasts forever!
> Mike \m/
> To reply directly, remove the SpamDam.
> <gar...@my-deja.com> wrote > > Steve; The best thing I ever did for
my high
> wind rough water jibing
> > and sailing was to buy a used Tiga 263 bump & jump. Plastic, heavy,
> > slow but what a ride & so easy to turn through rough water-like the
> > chop isn't there. Nose is turned up, thin, thin rails, still a
modern
> > shape (ahead of it's time?) after 4 years.Sail range for me at 170
is
> > 3.5 to 6.3! Should be able to find one cheap at swaps,etc.
>
>
Endo
http://www.windsport.com/windsport/gybeschool.htm
Endo
On Sun, 01 Oct 2000 04:37:12 GMT, Sharkie <shar...@my-deja.com>
wrote:
Jeff Bilyeu
When your going so fast that your in the air off the lee wave.......a little
air is okay
too much and it becomes tougher. Back in my younger days...( I wonder if I
could do it now?)
I was at the Hatch on the south end screaming where the waves are smaller,
and intiated my turn at warp speed.......needless to say after going over
about 3 to 4 waves, I would lose more control on each successive wave, until
the crash. I found once I slowed down, I was able to make the turns. It took
some of the fun out of it though.
Jeff
Mike F
2. If you bend your knees enough to keep driving the board into the water
you won't be gettin' air off the chop on the "flat" side of the Hatch while
jibing .. save the air for the return trip, where there are often big, long
jumps to be had because of the big speeds attainable and the angle of the
chop relative to the wind.
3. What the $%^!** you doin' sailin' in Oregon at the Hatch anyway? 8<)
That's some RUFF STUFF, and, I agree, a bear to jibe in, especially the
nearer to land you get, because what looks smoother ...**__ A I N ' T ___
**. If I don't feel my heels tickling my buns (well, almost) there, and bury
the lee rail really hard, I bounce out there, too. And EVERY time I find
myself in that voodoo crap, I ask my myself, "What the $%^!** am I doin'
saiin' in Oregon at the Hatch?"
Mike \m/
To reply directly, remove the SpamDam.
"Jeff Bilyeu" <bil...@nospam.aci.net> wrote in message
news:8r7s1i$5pd$0...@209.151.208.57...
>
> When your going so fast that your in the air off the lee wave.......a
little
> air is okay
> too much and it becomes tougher. Back in my younger days...( I wonder if I
> could do it now?)
> I was at the Hatch on the south end screaming where the waves are
smaller,
> and intiated my turn at warp speed.......needless to say after going over
> about 3 to 4 waves, I would lose more control on each successive wave,
until
> the crash. I found once I slowed down, I was able to make the turns. It
took
> some of the fun out of it though.
>
> Jeff
>
MTVNewsGuy
Try to bend you knees too far. Try and jibe while sitting on your heels.
As Peter Hart says "bend them about as far as you feel is right, and then go
down a foot lower."
Michael
US5613
Benjamin Kaufman
at dejanews.com. Using the power search option you can find almost anything put
out over the last few years.
Ben
On Sun, 01 Oct 2000 04:37:12 GMT, Sharkie <shar...@my-deja.com> wrote:
RMoore 41
>That's some RUFF STUFF,
Jeff must be remembering (if he can still remember) the distant past when he
was learning. He is one of the best pure jibers I ve seen, especially in rough
water.
Mark
forever. You can really beat on those old buggers, with NO adverse
effects.
Leo Mckibbins
Sorry to be a pain but I too would be very grateful if you could send me
your gybing tips too (at the moment I've just got copies of all kinds of
incoplete odds and sods and bits of postings that I've copied off this site
over the past few months...).
Thanks,
Leo.
Mike F
I'm a world-class expert at jibes. Missing them, that is. I failed 10,392
carving jibe attempts (i.e., planing all the way from one beam reach to the
next) before a friend gave me THE jibing tip that became crucial to my
jibing and thus changed my life. I added another tip of my own that
significantly helps my board carve and sail jibe timing. Both are in this
jibe procedure that works for me in every type of carved (planing) jibe and
even in many subplaning jibes. Done right, this sequence lets me exit a
carved jibe going at least as fast as I entered it. It doesn't require
memorizing a repertoire of handwork and footwork, because the same simple
handwork and footwork works from mundane to monster winds.
1. Sail "faster than you've ever sailed", 'til your eyes bleed, you pee your
pants, and your shadow is two seconds behind you. (If you don't at least
feel like you're going that fast, you don't have time to bobble and recover
before you coast to a halt. Recovering from bobbles to complete a jibe is a
good sign that you're developing a feel for jibes, rather than just
memorizing the steps.)
2. Bear off, still sheeted in, to gain even more speed and to steer from a
beam reach into a very broad reach. (A jibe is a 90-degree turn; you SAIL
through the first and last 45-degree segments of the total 180-degree turn.)
3. Move your back hand about a foot farther back on the boom, switch your
front grip to palm-up to greatly aid the second THROW you’ll see below,
unhook without disturbing the sail, and set your back foot on the rail
behind the front strap. You are still sheeted in, sailing in a broad reach
with your sail foot near the back of your board. (Some expert jibers bear
off still hooked in, letting the harness pull them forward into the correct
weight-forward position. The few times I’ve tried it felt good and worked
well, but it has obvious hazards.)
4. Now all in the space of about one or two heartbeats -- virtually
simultaneously when possible -- point your knees and chest further downwind
and into your turn, curtsey (you never bow; you CURTSEY, dropping your butt
towards your toes until your knees are bent 90 degrees and you're looking
forward from BELOW the booms), aggressively move (or let the sail pull) your
weight forward towards your toes, thrust and lock your front elbow out
straight as though you were stiff-arming a tackler, tip that front hand (and
the mast) downwind as you bend your back elbow hard to sheet in until your
sail foot hits your back leg (this is oversheeting, to switch the power
off), look at the water maybe 50-100 feet out in front of you where you will
exit your jibe (I look at some distant landmark downwind to gauge my
progress in my turn and time my sail jibe), and lift your front heel to
force its arch into its strap. Your weight is riding evenly on the ball of
your front foot and your flat back foot, so you’re not carving the turn yet.
You're still on a broad reach, ready to jibe your board, sail, and feet to
the new tack).
If you were unable to oversheet because of too much backhand sail pressure,
you (a) waited too late to oversheet and/or (b) did not thrust the front
hand forward and into the turn. To correct this error, straighten that front
elbow and tip the mast into the turn dramatically at the same time you
oversheet. This shuts off the power in the sail like a kill switch and puts
you back in control. The only time you don't want to oversheet is when
you're not planing and need to use the sail to push your board through the
turn.
So far this is all just normal, textbook, powered-up carved jibing. But here
is where my friend's tip and my own addition helped my jibing in several
ways.
FREEZE FRAME: Notice your arm'n'hand position; they're cocked as though to
fire a bow and arrow at a target downwind of your present path (inside your
turn). Your back hand is cocked near your downwind shoulder as though it
were holding the bowstring and arrow feathers, your front hand is way out
there holding your bow and supporting the arrow. Both arms are cocked to
fire the arrow (spin the sail), but … WHEN should we jibe the sail?
My own modification helped me time the sail jibe. I began shoving my hips
sideways into the turn HARD -- as though trying to bump the car door closed
while standing beside it with my arms full. This carves a very tight, smooth
turn and puts my body into an excellent position to exit the turn with full
power on the new broad reach, maybe even automatically hooked and sheeted in
if everything falls into place well. This hip swing weights the leeward rail
to initiate and maintain the carve, and times the sail jibe (flip). Your
body should be arced into a pronounced C, with your hips leading the convex
side of the C into the turn.
Because your front hand is as far in front of you as you can reach, yet you’
re thrusting your hips towards the new direction, you will feel like you’re
trying to surf your board in the opposite direction from where the sail is
going. The sail’s still heading west but your board is starting to head
east, so to speak. The cure, of course, is to jibe the sail and take it
along with you.
Try it, but be forewarned; before you even have time to THINK about jibing
the sail, you will whip through the full 180 degrees in two heartbeats, get
backwinded, and crash. That's a big improvement, because at least now you
carved (jibed) the board all the way through the turn. Now all you have to
do is jibe (flip) your sail and jibe (switch) your feet within that same
couple of heartbeats, and you're jibin'! This is partly an issue of timing
the sail jibe somewhere within the board jibe.
Piece 'o cake:
5. Back to our sequence: at the same time you shove your hips into the turn,
before you're pointing downwind, the pressure will leave your sail. NOW fire
the arrow [i.e., jibe (flip) the sail]. Just as the step jibe technique
calls for us to step forward at the same time we release the back hand, this
technique works best if we jibe the sail as we thrust the hip.
Right here is where millions of carved jibe attempts fail. The magazines
once told us to release the back hand, grasp the mast, let the wind blow the
sail around the mast like a barn door blowing around its hinges as you coast
to a slog, and when the sail wanders around far enough you take the new side
of the boom and sail away.
BS!
That has a MAJOR, fatal, flaw: If you outrun the true wind throughout your
jibe, as you should, there won't BE any tailwind to push the sail around.
You feel tailwind only after you drop below the true wind speed, well on
your way to dropping off a plane, at which point you're standing there at
zero speed holding a fully powered-up sail. In the 15th century this
position was known as a loaded catapult.
The sailor, not the wind, should jibe the sail. We should SPIN that sucker
around its center of gravity like a top, not wait until we slow down so much
the tailwind pushes the sail around the mast like a $1,500 barn door. A jibe
is a very aggressive mindset and process which WE, not the wind, should
control.
This is where Monte changed my life, when he said, "THROW, THROW, GRAB,
and GO!"
Only the sailor can spin the sail inside its boom length; the wind’s surely
not going to do it. At the hip thrust, just as you feel you and the sail are
heading in opposite directions, you THROW the back of the boom away like a
hot shot-putt. A millisecond later -- way before you complete that first
THROW -- you THROW the front of the boom way across your face and past your
downwind ear, right into the new broad reach. Your mast hand motion is much
like throwing a pass to a receiver running right along your new broad reach
(your jibe exit path). (This is why you inverted the front-hand grip; this
second throw is much easier with your palm up.) The sail spins untouched
before your heart beats again, leaving the new side of the boom floating in
the air in front of you. GRAB it with both hands and GO (i.e., sheet in and
sail away on a screaming broad reach, often sailing faster that you were
going before you jibed). With luck and practice, you will switch your feet
simultaneously within or immediately after the second in which the sail
rotates, and will exit accelerating hard in the new broad reach. You should
lose no perceptible speed in the whole process because a) it’s all off the
wind and b) you’re coasting unpowered for only a second or two.
As soon as or before I shove my hip into the turn, I stare at a spot on the
horizon just past downwind. If I haven’t spun the sail by then, I’m late and
must stop the carve and spin the sail NOW, or I’m going to be on the new
beam reach before I’ve jibed the sail, and grabbing a sail at full power on
a beam reach before getting that back foot strapped in is asking for a
catapult.
Jibing quickly like this doesn’t give you TIME to lose speed, hit three rows
of swell, and lose your balance or crash. I don't think my sail flip, from
throwing the back hand away to sheeting in on the new tack, takes a full
second when I do it right. The whole Throw/Throw/Grab/Go business is just
one continuous, fluid two-handed sweep of my hands and forearms, as much
like a Kung Fu move as I can make it. The same process works for 3.0s and
for 6.8s; the 6.8 just takes harder THROWS and takes two heartbeats rather
than one.
The first one of those I tried was the greatest revelation and revolution in
my windsurfing life. No more barn doors eating up precious seconds, mph, and
two boom-lengths of space while I fight for balance over three row of chop!
This is partly why leading ABK instructors have begun teaching this
boom-to-boom approach to jibing.
Oh, yeah -- the feet. My feet are too far from my brain to access all them
complicated textbook footwork options, let alone select a method in
mid-jibe. The step jibe, for example, requires we pull the front foot out of
its strap until its heel crosses the board centerline, maintain inside rail
pressure with that front heel, and step forward with the back foot while we
do several OTHER things with our hands. That footwork was too demanding for
me. Besides, the step jibe's purpose is to get our weight forward to avoid
sinking the tail after we slow down, and we want to accelerate, not slow
down, in our jibes
6. I find it simpler to just take my weight off both feet and switch 'em
simultaneously during any old half-second I'm not steering with them. That
works at any speed, in any chop or swell, overpowered or underpowered,
planing or slogging, Sunday or Wednesday, before or after the sail jibe, in
any instant I'm not footsteering. If I'm barely planing, I slip my new front
foot further forward into the step jibe position before reapplying weight to
it. Unweighing my feet and jibing them simultaneously sent my jibe success
rate way up. It ranges from merely sliding both feet across the deck on
smoother water to hopping a foot off the deck in huge chop. I'll jibe my
feet before, during or (usually) immediately after jibing the sail --
whenever it seems natural; no thinking required.
On my bad days I might still miss half my jibes. Here are my more common
errors:
* A face-plant inside the turn because I bent at the waist – bowing rather
than curtseying into my turn. (I can't perceive that error until too late
since losing an inner ear to surgery.)
* Getting overpowered and pulled forward, maybe even launched, when coming
out of my jibe if I jibe the sail too late and/or carved back up to the new
beam reach before sheeting in. Fixing my eyes on that landmark just past
downwind and spinning the sail simultaneously with the hip thrust stops
that.
* Getting bounced around and unbalanced and losing my carve in very rough
water because I failed to get that front hand WAY out in front of me and
tipped into the turn. Now that we have the front hand palm-up,
straight-arming the rig like this is how we get our weight forward onto the
front of the board to stop bouncing.
* Getting tossed in big chop because I didn't bend my knees DRASTICALLY.
* Being unable to oversheet because I bore off the wind too far before
trying to oversheet. The save? Shove the mast WAY forward and inward as I
oversheet (this shuts off the power instantly), or foot-swerve back to a
beam reach, oversheet, then resume the jibe all in one quick slash.
* Losing track of where I was in the turn because I watched my gear or the
water right in front of my board rather than looking where I was going. You
must look where you intend to go, rather than where you are, because our
boards (and cars and mountain bikes) follow our gaze. Do you look at your
dashboard or far ahead into the turn to steer your car? I get my best
results looking at that spot on the horizon just past downwind.
* Sinking the downwind rail with too much rail pressure for inadequate board
speed.
* Thinking too much. I have my best successes when I get PISTOFF and
JUSTDOIT rather than engaging my brain. My brain apparently hasn’t the
capacity to think real time about the dozen or so steps required in a tight
carved jibe on a small board. A bigger board and sail slow the process
sufficiently that I can think it through.
Textbook footwork and all that boom-to-mast-to-boom handwork works for
millions of people. But 1) I couldn't make them work; 2) they leave other
millions losing their plane before completing their jibe; and 3) they are
not as inherently fast and tight because they involve more steps, they swing
the sail through twice the space, and they require greater coasting
(unpowered) time and space. Sarah James, a leading ABK instructor, now
teaches boom-to-boom jibing instead of the old, more complicated,
cumbersome, slower boom-mast-boom method.
The boom-to-boom sail jibe helps cure the following aborted carved jibe that
I see every five seconds at the amateur end of the Gorge’s Hatchery: They
enter the jibe fast, DELIBERATELY sail off the wind until the board stops
planing and the sail yanks their back hand, release the back hand, let the
sail take its own sweet time blowing around the mast as the board coasts to
a standstill, then grab the new side of the boom and try to get planing
again. While that is a jibe, it is NOT a carved, or planing, jibe, by
definition. And it’s tough to do in big chop.
Aggression and commitment are virtually required to carve planing jibes. The
wind has already done its job in getting us up to speed; the actual jibe is
OUR responsibility, AFTER which the wind comes back into play.
Try this. It sure made my decade.
--
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"Leo Mckibbins" <Le...@btinternet.com> wrote in message
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Mike F
Mike \m/
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Ellen Faller
next time I get the wind.
Ellen
Mike F wrote:
>
> Oops --- there goes the bandwidth. I hit the wrong button. Sorry 'bout that.
>
> Mike \m/
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Louis
While we're into reprints of your previous articles, I think that you
should repost the one about moving your legs around like a helicopter in
order to position your sail for the waterstart. It's brilliant! I've
been windsurfing for 20 years and it had never occurred to me, nor have
I seen it or heard it mentioned before then. If you can't patent it,
then maybe they should name the move after you or something.
Folks, pay attention. It's a little hard to visualize what he's talking
about, but try it on the water and all of a sudden those monster sails
are not so intimidating to waterstart.
Cheers,
Louis
Mike F
waterstart. I swim for only three reasons: 1) my gear is out of reach, 2)
there's NO wind, not even a breeze, between neck-deep water and the windline
(if there's a breeze, I butt-sail to the windline .... none of that
schlogging crap, y'know), or 3) the wind dropped below the planing threshold
and caught me on a sinker abeam or downwind of my dawg. I usually sail
upwind of my launch if I don't trust the wind, just so I can also butt-sail
back to my dawg. You can butt-sail for miles, effortlessly, if need be.
Saves lots of calories for the next session after you rig up, or if the wind
resumes.
Speaking of saving calories ... what's this "swim into waterstart position"
stuff? Now there's a waste of perfectly good calories if I ever saw one ...
important if most people aren't even out of bed yet and there's still 360
miles of wind coming today (30 mph times 12hours).
So turn your gear around the same way you puked into your inner tube as a
kid. Remember? You jumped in the tube, lay your arms and chin on it, and
swept your entire torso and legs in a four-foot-radius circle just below the
water's surface around the tube as fast as you could, with only your
shoulders stationary. You could pull probably 60-70 RPM doing this,
guaranteed to make any non-ice-skater lose his cookies. At 60-70 RPM, your
barf radius was pretty astounding ... and disgusting. And isn't being
disgusting a big part of being a prepubescent boy?
OK, we smarter bears stopped short of upchucking, but it was CLOSE way too
often, and you get the idea. The world spun for a full minute or two after
that.
Now apply that idea to turning your sailing gear around. When it's not lined
up right, rather than swimming it around using the same tired small arm and
leg muscles you use all day to sail, use your rested and larger torso
muscles to turn that stuff around. Just grab yer kit and start rotating your
legs and torso in as big an arc as you can reach with your extended legs.
Three things: you ain't gonna hit 70 RPM, you better watch that fin, and
you're gonna use some much bigger, fresher muscles to turn it all around
relatively effortlessly. In two or three turns of your torso and legs your
gear should turn 180 degrees .... maybe 4-5-6 turns if on giant sails but
still much less effort than swimming. It also defeats opposing winds very
effectively if on your 3.0.
Is that close enough, Louis? It was easier to spew anew than disinter the
original.
But ... I repeat ... WATCH OUT FOR THE FIN.
Mike \m/
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"Louis" <louish@NO_SPAMnortelnetworks.com> wrote in message
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Jeff Bilyeu
Gee........ Ron thanks for the compliment............Uhhh Errr I guess my
name is Jeff
I forgot :)
Geoff
Louis
description, but believe me, this is the #1 best windsurfing advise that
I got this year. Most of the other suggestions that come your way have
will already been in the public domain in one form or another. To find
something this useful that you'd never heard or thought of is
exceptional. One of the WS mags should pick up on it.
If I can explain it in a slightly different way... Let's say that you're
in the water and you've grabbed the sail by the mast with both hands.
DON'T start flutter kicking like you are swimming with the sail. This
does't work too well in any case in very windy conditions with a lot of
swell. Instead, keep your legs together, keep them straight, and start
rotating them around using your hips as the center of the axis. This
generates a TREMENDOUS amount of torque which you can apply to the mast
to move the sail where you want it to go. You'll find that you should
pull with one hand and push with the other. Like Mike said in the
original post, 3-4 gyrations and less than 20 seconds is all you need to
position the sail.
Cheers,
Louis
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Haakon Langballe
Haakon
"Mike F" <iso...@earthSpamDamlink.net> wrote in message
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Louis
Louis
Glenn Woodell
louish@NO_SPAMnortelnetworks.com says...
>
>Instead, keep your legs together, keep them straight, and start
>rotating them around using your hips as the center of the axis. This
>generates a TREMENDOUS amount of torque which you can apply to the mast
>to move the sail where you want it to go.
This is rather hard to follow but I think I have been doing something very
similar for a long time. It just kinda worked. I will plop my boom up on the
tail, in the waterstart position, and spin my leg in large circles underneath
the board which makes it turn on it's axis pretty quickly. I only have one leg
that I can effectively use for swimming so this works pretty well for me. I
just let the other leg hang straight down in order to offer the least
resistace.
Generally sepaking, it also helps to remember where the pivot point of the
board is when you are spinning your gear around. Rather than place the boom on
the tail and grab the mast at the boom and swim/gyrate/whatever to get the
board to come around, grab the mast down at the foot so you get a greater lever
with respect to the fin. That's where your board will pivot the easiest.
It also helps to get the sail out of the water as much as possible before
positioning if possible. That sail is nothing but a sea anchor while it is down
in the water.
Glenn
Mike F
Butt sailing = sailing in the water start position, with both feet on the
board and butt in the water. It's how I reach a windline I can't walk to,
and how I return to my dog when the wind shuts down in the evening. The
biggest board I've used for a couple of years now is my 83-liter 8-6/275, so
schlogging is an act of desperation reserved for "life-threatening
emergencies". As dusk nears and the wind starts getting holey, I make sure I
stay upwind of dawg so I can just hook in and butt-sail back home in a broad
reach, relaxed, rather than doing the isometric hula followed by the rocky
barefooted walk upwind. This stuff's supposed to be FUN, not work.
Some sessions take me a mile or three from dawg, not even counting
significant upriver or downriver jaunts, and the current may be nonexistent.
Milking an evening wind in that scenario on a sinker is asking for a major
hassle if I get caught straight offshore or downwind from dawg, especially
if the wind is thermal and can shut off suddenly. Darn near every good
evening I just sail 'til I can no longer plane consistently, staying upwind,
then lay in the water, raise the sail, and butt-sail until I can see dawg's
tail wagging. It's about as fast as schlogging, and **MUCH** less effort. If
dawg is a looooong way off, I may butt-sail until I'm upwind of dawg, then
speed things up if there's enough breeze left by lying, sitting, or standing
on the board -- depending on how much energy and wind remain -- as I run
straight downwind. You can almost plane down the swell while lying on even a
full sinker. I tip over fairly often, but that's why I wear neoprene. It's
part of the fun.
And as for putting my boom on the tail while making like a ruptured
helicopter, its advantage depends on how the gear and wind are oriented.
Sometimes the wind is a bigger factor than water resistance. I'm sure
thinking about pivot points helps efficiency, but with only three or four
rotations required, efficiency isn't a big deal. I just grab whatever gear
parts are handy and swing my legs.
Mike \m/
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"Glenn Woodell" wrote
Mike F
pond.
I wrote
> The biggest board I've used for a couple of years now
>is my 83-liter 8-6/275, so schlogging is an act of
>desperation reserved for "life-threatening emergencies".
Mike \m/
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"Mike F" <iso...@earthSpamDamlink.net> wrote in message
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> Mike \m/
> To reply directly, remove the SpamDam.
Steven Slaby
> relatively effortlessly. In two or three turns of your torso and legs your
> gear should turn 180 degrees .... maybe 4-5-6 turns if on giant sails but
> still much less effort than swimming. It also defeats opposing winds very
> effectively if on your 3.0.
Mike,
Thanks for the great tip!!! tried it yesterday with the 9.5/Hypertech Boss
and the equipment was rotated into position with 3 turns. First time I
accidentally kicked the big pointer (ouch!) so the second time I grabbed the
mast further from the board.
Sure beats fighting the wind/waves to muscle the gear around!
Steve.
--
"The surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is
that it has never tried to contact us" (Bill Watterson)
Ian
rotates around the board by itself - it always rotates with the mast side going
forward and only takes a minute or two to do a full rotation. I am using '99
Ezzy sails. I would imagine the clew is acting like a huge flipper which causes
it to move forward with each wave. This works out great because half the time
when I fall off I'm dead tired anyway, so I just rest until it comes into
position.
- Ian
Wolfgang Soergel
>
> Besides all the other good tips that people have given you, you also can
> slow down
> a little which will help maintain control. In Extreme chop slowing down is
> usually mandatory
small boards at place like the Gorge. But for the typical "jibing in
chop beginner" scenario with sail between 5.0 and 7.0, lots of power but
not insanely powered, tpically a slightly bigger board, lots of chop but
not the real voodoo stuff i've always found the a "go for it" attitude,
i.e. aggressive jibing, initiating with full speed and leaning the sail
into the turn works better. Of course things get easier once you've got
enough experience and eye-body coordination to subtly steer the board
through the turn, avoiding or anticipating and countering the worst
pieces of chop . It's often a question of half a meter to the left or
the right wether the board slams against a wave or surfs down a face,
giving addtional acceleration. The same goes for the timing of foot
change and sail flip: With some experience, you see and feel an
appropriate moment or wait a bit untill the board is on it;s way down a
chop instead of up. But the more aggressive you are, the less dependent
on observing the water you stay.
Ah, and yes, before i forget: Bending the knees is the absolutely most
important hint.
--
Wolfgang