STARBOARD AERO 127
WARDOG
The new Starboard Aeros (117/127) have arrived and we had a chance the
last couple of days to get a feel for the 127 in very light air with
great waves...
http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/index.html
Short, turny, fast to plane up...light...jumps great...
Perfect nose flip for going over whitewater...and when they said no Vee
between the straps I was a little worried...turns out the Vee is all
along the belly of the board that helps it go rail to rail...
Kiters had long packed up and Kevin (KB) at 230lbs was still picking off
waves...no whitecaps...
http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_kev1.html
http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_kev2.html
http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_kev3.html
http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_kev4.html
Does he looked stoked or what?!?!
He walked up to his van and put it inside...just like he did the first
time I let him ride my Carve 111...
http://www.surfingsports.com/images/carve111_2.jpg
http://www.surfingsports.com/images/carve111_3.jpg
http://www.surfingsports.com/images/carve111_4.jpg
I guess possession is 9/10th's of the law...;-)
KP showed me some shots he had on the Aero 117 that were jaw dropping...
So this board is the real dealio...
(PeteCresswell)
>turny
Do they manage to achieve that without a lot of tail rocker?
--
PeteCresswell
Brian M.
one wonder if the board really existed!!!
Was that a 6.2 Blade you were using in your shots?
Bri
WARDOG
> IMPRESSIVE! The way *board was so "hush hush" for a long time, made
> one wonder if the board really existed!!!
>
We were beginning to wonder with the delays...;-)
> Was that a 6.2 Blade you were using in your shots?
>
5.7m2...one really kewl thang about this board, is it allows smaller
sail size useage by volume compensation...it was ridden with a 5.3m2
most of the day...
WARDOG
http://surfingsports.com
shredulato
reports regarding this ride.
Here:
http://www.boardseekermag.com/equipment_reviews/equipment/starboard_aero.htm
seems things were huish hush or it wasnt going to be released and then
viola, now its out ,
BUT , i wonder what starbords list price will be, alot of hype and alot
of cash???
dont get me wrong i love all boards, even bad ones , love top try im
all, but marketing is marketing .
.But i am glad i waited i was going to buy a s type . the interesting
thing is that the s type has a higher price point than the
carves...why?.. new design hype... cnat be that much harder to make ,
but the aero looks sweet.. kinda rolly polly pear shaped, but sweet.
(PeteCresswell)
>.But i am glad i waited i was going to buy a s type
Reading the spiel on indended use, I was ready to order one sight-unseen as the
replacement for my Carve 123.
Only doubt for me is how much tail rocker it has.
I've been through a couple boards where this was an issue for me. It enhanced
turnability and softened the ride, but made sailing out of the harness too hard
on my hands - not that I sail without wearing same....but if I'm working on my
gybes all day....
--
PeteCresswell
WARDOG
> Per WARDOG:
>
>>turny
>
>
> Do they manage to achieve that without a lot of tail rocker?
Hi Pete,
Here is your tail rocker pic:
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero_127_tail_rocker.jpg
Mid-section belly roll:
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero_127_belly_roll.jpg
Volume distribution:
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero_127_volume_distribution.jpg
I may edit a short vid clip of it in action, if I get a chance...
WARDOG
http://surfingsports.com
JSNTG
"WARDOG" <war...@xxxsurfingsports.com> wrote in message news:gp4se.102$iG5.17@fed1read05...
WARDOG
> Thanks for the pics. How 'bout some measurements: 1' and 4' from tail?
Hi Hugh,
1' off tail = 18"
4' off tail = 27.5" (waterline) : 28.5" (outside rail)
1' off nose = 18.5"
WARDOG
http://www.surfingsports.com
(PeteCresswell)
Thanks. I'm ready to order one fro my local shop.
Jimbo? You reading this?
--
PeteCresswell
ScottG
Hows about a compare and contrast of:
SB AERO vs. Exocet CROSS
In particular, the Cross 117 vs. Aero 117, since they are the same
size, but also any general comments you may have.
You may be uniquely positioned to have experience with both these new
entries into the "big man's wave board" category.
I'm guessing the Cross gets the nod in waves, and Aero wins in planing
power, but I have sailed neither, so that's just a guess.
Thx.
WARDOG
>> Thanks. I'm ready to order one fro my local shop.
>>
>> Jimbo? You reading this?
Yep...ya betcha...he and EVERY other dealer in the country is reading
it, because they couldn't answer your question...;-)
WARDOG
http://www.surfingsports.com
WillV
getting the 117 or 127?
-WillV-
"(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.z.invalid> wrote in message
news:2pg3b1pb7sehs8utg...@4ax.com...
WARDOG
> OK, WD,
> Hows about a compare and contrast of:
> SB AERO vs. Exocet CROSS
>> I'm guessing the Cross gets the nod in waves, and Aero wins in planing
>> power, but I have sailed neither, so that's just a guess.
Hi Scott...
hmmmmmm...that seems to be the 64 million dollar question right now...
We're inundated with phone calls, emails, and other forum posts asking
for detailed answers to that specific question...
I'm still evaluating and digesting the preliminary assessment...but, it
appears that it will come down to minutia and hair-splitting...
They both ride waves well and they both have more than adequate planing
power...for bigger sailors and light wind wave aficionados...as far as
the minutia and hair-splitting...
http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_wardog0.html
http://www.surfingsports.com/cali_lightair_waves/slides/cross117_wardog2.html
I will tell you this...so far, I'm guesstimating that your guess is
prolly, ever so slightly, bass-ackwards...backed up with *real* world
head to head and GPS data...more delineation to be done here , though...
We received a call from the beach yesterday, from a newly stoked,
dripping wet, Aero 117 owner...he's indicated that he's selling a couple
of other recently acquired '05 boards because of the overlap with the
Aero...the Aero does everything they do...and more...which is part of
the design brief...and that appears to be successfully executed, IMO...
"The Aero unleashes a whole new light wind world...
...slash chop, cruise, ride waves, bump, jump, and loop in lighter
winds. The wide wind range makes it the right choice as a one board
solution for those who want to enjoy the ultimate thrills of
action-packed windsurfing in windspeeds never imagined possible before.
Developed as a one board solution for 9 to 29 knots. Starboard continues
its vision of innovative design in windsurfing by launching the most
versatile board range to date."
http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero.asp
http://star-board.com/products/aero.asp
WARDOG
http://www.surfingsports.com
WillV
This is gonna be a very close call because we have been making the CROSS
work very well in the waves so far....and B&J....AND flat water. The 127 is
pretty big and I did not get a chance to ride her last week as my CROSS 117
was working just fine once the wind picked up a bit (6.2 sail). The 127
for sure gets the nod when there's no wind to plane - or just barely - for
sure. All the people who rode it were going for it with sail sizes
(smaller) that would not have been possible with their normal boards....so
that's is saying a lot.
I can tell you that even at my 250lbs, the 117L is just enough float for me,
as long as there's some wind in the sail, chances are a good puff will get
you going and you're off....if I have to "hold my laundry" while waiting for
a puff, I would not hesitate to go out on my MADD 165... But the Aero 127
looks to be a much better wave-riding shape than the MADD 165 (not sure vs.
MADD 135, but because there is a 1-strap option in the rear of the Aero, I
think the Aero wins here to). I wish I could have sailed her last week
because I'm pretty sure that 127L is still too little float for me to be
comfortable (holding my laundry with a big sail) - I've used the *board
CARVE 131L with a 7.5 and if the wind died, so would I (in the water) -
that's why the 165L of the MADD works so well for me right now.
I know that Kevin "took it from Wardog and put it in his van" after riding
it in no whitecaps...he's a very good sailor, and surfer, and is much
lighter on his feet than me....so he loved it. 250lbs dry is still another
notch higher than 230lbs - it makes a difference.
I know that I am pushing my limits and going for big airs, DTL and hard,
over-powered-cross-chopped jibes (on the outside), and smooth inside carves,
all on the Cross 117 (and WD FreeWeed 10.0" fin) - it's my "Huckleberry" and
I am REALLY loving her capabilities as a "big guys wave board". The Aero is
*boards very good answer to light-air wave riding (all-around blasting) and
a true "big-guys" wave board - no doubt. It will give the lighter-weight
guys a supercharged option as well - don't pigeon-hole this as only
"big-guys" board, I can see lighter weights just going off on say the 117
version.
-WillV-
"ScottG" <gla...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1118935589....@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Charles Jutkins
"WillV" <wi...@biofolic.com> wrote in message
news:sxhse.137$Lr4.46@fed1read03...
WARDOG
> What about the total comparison not just waves but freestyle ability etc?
Hi Charles,
Give it some time...we've had the Cross since last Fall...
I think there's over 100 of them out there...
I know that we've sold a sh*tpot of them...
The Aero has just come out here last week, and there is only 6 of them
in the country...and prolly won't be any more until the Fall...and then,
by special order only...
FWIW, a freestylie customer on the Aero 117 told me yesterday, that he
was planing out of his vulcans...selling his '05 FreeSex 110...
The Exocet Cross has done well in the Euro freestyle contests...and
obviously , you've seen what Jason Voss can do on it...
WARDOG
http://surfingsports.com
WillV
Good question. Take a look at the pic's...it's so wide and short that it
will be a great freestyle board choice I think. It planes super early, has
multiple footstrap positions...don't think of it only as a wave board for
sure...it's a true all-around shape that is accessible to all skill level or
rider - pretty darn nice.
I had a never-ever, 19yr old surfer kid get on my CROSS 117 the 2nd day of
sailing in his life! He could uphaul it and sail it back to where he
started....very difficult for him, but what it shows is that these new
shapes are accessible (rideable) to EVERYONE out there.
Hope that helps..
-WillV-
"Charles Jutkins" <ct...@surfnetusa.com> wrote in message
news:DYOdnderz7X...@surfnetusa.com...
Charles Jutkins
would favor the Cross in spinning tricks as the nose is flatter.
"Charles Jutkins" <ct...@surfnetusa.com> wrote in message
news:DYOdnderz7X...@surfnetusa.com...
ScottG
it ;)
Don't give me the marketing quotes from *board, give me your honest
opinion.
2 weeks ago, you said I need the Cross 117.
This week, I need the Aero 117? is it that much better?
Me personally, I am not looking for a light wind early planer.
I want a slightly larger FSW board that I can sail with one strap in
onshore waves and in B&J mode. Largest sail 6.9, weight 220lbs.
I noticed in these pics:
http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_wardog3.html
http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_wardog0.html
that you are out of the rear strap.
Not surprised on the 127, but could you go center strap (or single
offset strap) on the 117 (aero OR cross)??
or is the rail and tail to thick and wide to bury without stepping
over?
Put down the starboard punch glass for a sec and give us an honest
report ;)
One thing starboard says is that the aero has a lot of flat, and may
not be a good B&J board like the Kombat line. Have you had any OP'd
sessions on the Aero yet?
Thx, and keep the info and feedback coming!
ScottG
WARDOG
> Notice the forward offset of the stock fin.
> http://www.u-ride.net/images/articles05/06/06_aero06.jpg
>
> that's fine for the stock fin, but any aftermarket fin will not be
> forward offset.
> Any thoughts???
Forward offset is one of the ideas behind my fin...
http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_2.html
http://surfingsports.com/images/wardog_freeweed_10_tuttle.jpg
It is critical for waveriding, to have fins offset forward...my custom
surfboard shaper puts them several inches more forward than anyone...
Works awesome on the Carve, Cross, and S-Type genre of boards...
http://surfingsports.com/images/freeweed_freeride_boards2.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/freeweed_freeride_boards1.jpg
WARDOG (Purveyor of the best damn windsurfing gear on the planet)
http://surfingsports.com
> Follow up question re: finbox location
>
> It seems the Aero fin box is quite far behind the rear footstraps.
> http://www.u-ride.net/images/articles05/06/06_aero09.jpg
> maybe this was done to allow a center strap??
>
> Does a regular fin feel ok relative to your back foot?
>
> Does the tail feel too long? or a regular fin seem to far back?
>
> Notice the forward offset of the stock fin.
> http://www.u-ride.net/images/articles05/06/06_aero06.jpg
>
> that's fine for the stock fin, but any aftermarket fin will not be
> forward offset.
> Any thoughts???
> thx.
ScottG
It seems the Aero fin box is quite far behind the rear footstraps.
http://www.u-ride.net/images/articles05/06/06_aero09.jpg
maybe this was done to allow a center strap??
Does a regular fin feel ok relative to your back foot?
Does the tail feel too long? or a regular fin seem to far back?
Notice the forward offset of the stock fin.
http://www.u-ride.net/images/articles05/06/06_aero06.jpg
that's fine for the stock fin, but any aftermarket fin will not be
forward offset.
Any thoughts???
thx.
WARDOG
>> 2 weeks ago, you said I need the Cross 117.
>> This week, I need the Aero 117? is it that much better?
Dood...what I'm saying is that you need BOTH of them to finger it out
for yourself!!!...;-)
>> I noticed in these pics:
>> http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_wardog3.html
>> http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_wardog0.html
>> that you are out of the rear strap.
>> Not surprised on the 127, but could you go center strap (or single
>> offset strap) on the 117 (aero OR cross)??
The strap on the Aero is offset now...lots of options there...pics were
taken before I got it dialed in...when it's light and you are surfing
it, it's nice to move your back foot around on the wide tail to figure
this out...
>> Me personally, I am not looking for a light wind early planer.
>> I want a slightly larger FSW board that I can sail with one strap in
>> onshore waves and in B&J mode. Largest sail 6.9, weight 220lbs.
>>
Dood...I'm saying that you need BOTH of them to finger it out for
yourself!!!...;-)
I said that they are both winners...they both will do what you want...
The Cross is prolly slightly tipped towards freestyle and the Aero
towards waves...
>> Put down the starboard punch glass for a sec and give us an honest
>> report ;)
>>
>> Don't give me the marketing quotes from *board, give me your honest
>> opinion.
LOL...kinda hard...KP's shots on the Aero 117 he showed me on his
laptop, still have me intoxicated...;-)
I honestly said that it will come down to hair-splitting and minutia...
also, availability...
Do you want a board this season?...the Cross is the answer...
We are down to the last couple...if you wait too much longer...paralysis
by analysis will occur...we're down to the last couple and the next
container won't be here until end of July...into August...
Besides...I'm just one reporter...you can always call around to the
shops and talk to the kiter or Formula racerhead that answers...they can
read the "brochurespeak" or print out from rec.ws just as easily...;-)
>> One thing starboard says is that the aero has a lot of flat, and may
>> not be a good B&J board like the Kombat line. Have you had any OP'd
>> sessions on the Aero yet?
We do have some of this info...
Does this l@@k flat to you?!?!
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero_127_belly_roll.jpg
We tried to pry the Aero 127 away from a guy that put a 5.3m2 Simmer on
it when it got windy...wanted him to ride the Exocet OWave 105...he
wouldn't have any of it...additionally, I sent a Kombat 105 to someone
that we just hooked up with the Aero 117, and he may sell his K-105
because there is too much overlap...may drop right to his EVO 92...which
is exactly what Will V does with the Cross 117...
>> Thx, and keep the info and feedback coming!
That's my yob...someone has to do it...;-)
WARDOG
http://surfingsports.com
WillV
Have you checked out the Exocet forum lately? There's quite a few people
talking about their new CROSS's....
http://www.exocet-original.com/forum/forum.asp
WillV
"ScottG" <gla...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1118943690.9...@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
surfer
Kombat 105 and an AERO 117. I've been sailing them back to back to take
a close look at the handling, pros and cons of each board. In case you
are wondering, I'm 6'3", 200lbs and sail freshwater (Lake Michigan)
Here's the skinny :
The AERO 117 all but eliminates the need for me to have the Kombat 105.
Period.
Here's the basis for the statement - My first session on the AERO was a
fully wound 6.5 sesh in crappy chop. The wind had just switched and I
was prepared for a pounding with the 71cm width of the AERO in the
confused sea state. To my amazement, the AERO was super smooth (ok,
smoother than I expected) and it handled the chop with ease. When I
switched to the Kombat, it was a rougher ride, and the nose was
slapping chop more than the AERO.
I kept looking down at the AERO when riding it to remind myself that I
was on a 117 liter board with 71cm of width ... cause it sure didn't
handle like it was that big. Granted, you really need to get on the
rails to slash it aggressively, but the soft surf rails sure make the
board turn and burn.
One thing I didn't count on with the AERO was it's relative nose
rocker.... it's got way more than I expected with a board of 235cm.
This is essential in wave riding, and has a nice added benefit in chop.
I've sailed the Kombat in overpowered 5.5 conditions and light air 7.4
freestyle sessions. It doesn't plane up as fast as I thought it would,
and while it's an outstanding board, the AERO 117 handles all the way
down to my EVO 92, so the Kombat is going up for sale.
The AERO and EVO combination is probably the best two board combo I've
owned since I started sailing in '82. (back then my two board combo was
my Windsurfer One-design and my Rocket 99 ;-) The AERO by itself is a
phenomonal single travel board for my trips to Florida where I could be
sailing 7.4 freestyle conditions in Sarasota Bay one afternoon and a
nice gulf surf session the next morning.
Traveling with this board is going to be great with it's 235cm length.
I can go just about anywhere with the board, 3 sails (7.4, 6.5 and
5.5), one mast and one boom in the bag and take on just about anything
mother nature will throw at me. Will there be some compromises? Of
course.
I think the AERO is going to succeed where the Compact failed. If you
ask, I'll bet that the folks who have sailed the Compact will claim
that it's a really nice board, but there's little market for it. The
AERO is a Compact style board, but it has a market with it's refined
shape, rails and rocker. The two fins provide great capabilities and
aside from the typical crappy Starboard footstraps, there's nothing I'd
change on this board. (and I'm usually VERY picky about boards, so this
is saying a lot)
So, anyone want to buy a '05 DRAM Kombat used 6 times? It's in perfect
condition and comes with straps, and both fins.
Jim R.
>
> We tried to pry the Aero 127 away from a guy that put a 5.3m2 Simmer on
> it when it got windy...wanted him to ride the Exocet OWave 105...he
> wouldn't have any of it...
Hi Everybody,
Long time lurke, first time poster, associated with SurfingSports.com
and was the "guy" sailing the 5.3m2 Simmer. I will not comment on
anything except the Aero as I have only ridden the Cross a few times
(very fun board and super easy to sail - couldn't go wrong with this
baby). I have very limited DTL experience but have logged my time in
the Gulf of Mexico (GOM) in onshore, backside conditions, as well as
bay and laguna (FLAT water) conditions (Houston based sailor).
I won't rehash what has been said about the DTL qualities as they have
been addressed well...I will comment that as a newbie for DTL, I felt
the board gave me a great deal of comfort and confidence to get in
there and mix it up.
Planing was never a question and I cannot comment on low wind
applications...yet...;-)
Jibing was a no brainer...step across, apply pressure and flip the sail
after carving...VERY smooth for any board, let alone a 74cm wide board.
Jumping was cake, but unlike some wide boards (C131 - WillV's board at
the J) I didn't give a second thought to flying it off the wind...I'm
guessing it is because you have such a short board under your feet.
Powered to OP'ed on the 5.3 was still a very clean ride...I guessing
from the Vee place in the front 1/3 (?) of the board. I really tried
to beat to weather and produce a bone-rattling ride but just
couldn't...this was ocean swell with moderate chop - still need to see
how it handles bay and GOM chop. Certainly was not an perfect setup,
but pretty close - actually close enough for me...off the wind was
equally sweet and jibes didn't take that much more effort than normal.
As WD said, the only reason I got off that board was because it was
time to leave...;-)
Jim
ScottG
Lake Mich, 1982, 6'3" 220 lbs. - are you my twin brother??
I bet that would be a great Mich board.
Need that extra float for fresh water, and so often when the wind kicks
up to make surf, the wind dies before the surf does.
ScottG
ScottG
> Forward offset is one of the ideas behind my fin...
> http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_2.html
>
> http://surfingsports.com/images/wardog_freeweed_10_tuttle.jpg
Well, actually, its one of the ideas behind your weedwave or freeweed
fins.
Your regular non-weed wave fins are not offset ;-)
I was just wondering why on the Aero, the fin box and the footstraps
seem further apart than most boards, and if this was noticeable.
ScottG
So, when you get the Aero 127, you won't really need yout Cross 117, so
I would love to buy it from ya ;-)
Same goes for any of you other Aero "upgraders".
I just can't afford a "new" board this year.
Wouldn't you know it's the year they finally make the ultimate loose
wave-rideable 115L board I have been dreaming about for the last 5
years!! yarrrgh
ScottG
WARDOG
>> Well, actually, its one of the ideas behind your weedwave or freeweed
>> fins.
>> Your regular non-weed wave fins are not offset ;-)
Hi Scott,
I've said this a gazillion times now...and so have others...
Regardless of whether you have weeds or not...the FreeWeed is a wave fin
with a ramp...this graphic compares my FreeWeed to some of ,fin guru and
legendary surfer, George Greenough's surfing fins...
http://surfingsports.com/images/wardog_greenough_compare.jpg
Or l@@k at KP going mental on the 8.75" FreeWeed a couple of days ago...
http://surfingsports.com/cali_kp/index.html
We set him up on an EVO 74 and my 8.75" WARDOG FreeWeed wave fin...and
he just went mental...shredded hundreds of waves...
http://surfingsports.com/images/wardog_freeweed_875_board.jpg
http://www.surfingsports.com/images/evo74_kp.jpg
http://www.surfingsports.com/images/evo74_kp2.jpg
http://www.surfingsports.com/images/evo74_kp3.jpg
Yet, when asked today about a weedfin recommendation on his forum,
he responded that he didn't have much experience with weedfins...prolly
not realizing that he was using one the last few days...
http://star-board.com/forum/kevin_corner/read.asp?ID=189&t=200561483520
That is my biggest compliment...
I've heard it many times...a weedfin that feels like a normal wave
fin...matter of fact...surfers are buying them for surfboards...
I received this email about my 7.5" FreeWeed yesterday...
http://surfingsports.com/images/freeweed_75.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/freeweed_sm_compare.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/freeweed_75_875_compare1.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/freeweed_75_875_compare2.jpg
"Hey Warren,
Hope all is well with you and yours.
We are back in the Gorge, now. Windfest this last week-end turned into
a "Wall-fest" as that was where it was blowing (raining in town). I
stuck that new 7.5" WDWave in my small glass board, over-powered 3.0;
some of the best swell we've seen in a long time, and it was love at
first ride! Great fin, did everything exceptionally, the last thing I
had to even think about.... thank-you once again for making such sweet
fins! I can't wait to ride it more."
All well wishes,
Margaret
Margaret Nold and Olaf Podehl
The Avon Sailhouse
Maybe, I'll just market them as ramped wave fins...or keel fins...but,
they also work well for freestyle and freeride...or freewhatever...maybe
just call it the WD R75...;-)
WARDOG
http://surfingsports.com
WARDOG
>> Wouldn't you know it's the year they finally make the ultimate loose
>> wave-rideable 115L board I have been dreaming about for the last 5
>> years!! yarrrgh
Sheesh...damned if we do...damned if we don't...;-)
Scott, you should prolly just get on the WARDOG "hand me down" list...
I've still got a couple of freshies in the wrappers and I have been
known to flip my boards to good homes...
Matter of fact...Treve just adopted my '05 Exocet OWave 105...
I'm getting the '06 model on the next container...
http://www.surfingsports.com/cali_lightair_waves/slides/owave105_treve1.html
http://www.surfingsports.com/cali_lightair_waves/slides/owave105_treve5.html
I just love what he's doing to my 9.75" WARDOG wave fin...
http://surfingsports.com/images/treve_wd_fin.jpg
Based on the customer testimonials we are getting from the Cross 117...I
wouldn't hold my breath for used ones to pop up on the open market
anytime soon...
WARDOG
http://surfingsports.com
wee...@aol.com
earthquake about an hour ago?
WARDOG
> Hey Warren... not to get off the subject matter but did you feel that
> earthquake about an hour ago?
>
Might have been Will V hitting another rock...;-)
WARDOG
New pics of the Aero 117 next to the Aero 127:
http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero.asp
http://www.surfingsports.com/images/aero_117_127_nose.jpg
http://www.surfingsports.com/images/aero_117_127_deck.jpg
http://www.surfingsports.com/images/aero_117_127_deck2.jpg
http://www.surfingsports.com/images/aero_117_127_deck3.jpg
WARDOG
http://www.surfingsports.com
ScottG
exocet & *board.
You are the only one in the world who can do that!
I (and so many others it seems, in both *board and exocet forums) would
like to see the side by sides.
Thx for the stoke.
WARDOG
> Pretty please, some side by sides of the 117 liter showdown between
> exocet & *board.
> You are the only one in the world who can do that!
> I (and so many others it seems, in both *board and exocet forums) would
> like to see the side by sides.
> Thx for the stoke.
Alrighty then...
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero117_cross117_1.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero117_cross117_2.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero117_cross117_3.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero117_cross117_4.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero117_cross117_5.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero117_cross117_6.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero117_cross117_7.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero117_cross117_8.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero117_cross117_9.jpg
FWIW, it's been my experience that the final purchase decision when I'm
on the tellie with the customer, will prolly come down to color...blue
vs. yeller...and fin box...Powerbox vs. Tuttle...;-)
WARDOG (Purveyor of the best damn windsurfing gear in the world)
http://surfingsports.com
surfer
after work I got some quality time (2 hours) on my 7.4 and the AERO.
Extra nose kick or not, that board is simple to flip vulcans on. Even a
crappily thrown spin will result in decent board slide every
time...trust me, I had some real ugly ones and they all worked out. ;-)
I've not weighed in on the Cross 'cause I've not sailed it, but from
what I can tell and what I've seen, it's a darn nice board.
Personally I think all this discussion is silly since they're both nice
boards and nit picking about nose kick, etc. is all going to come down
to rider preference, so in the end, demo all the boards you can and
pick the one that puts the biggest smile on your face. ;-)
ScottG
WARDOG wrote:
> FWIW, it's been my experience that the final purchase decision when I'm
> on the tellie with the customer, will prolly come down to color...blue
> vs. yeller...and fin box...Powerbox vs. Tuttle...;-)
>
Color, schmolor, who gives a rats ass.
Fin box, well that's another story!!!
particularly when you already have a nice quiver of fins ;-)
Not to beat a dead horse, but this pic:
http://surfingsports.com/images/aero117_cross117_9.jpg
seems to show what I was mentioning earlier, namely that the Aero fin
box seems to be too far behind the rear strap.
I think Starboard's allegiance to Tuttle makes it sooo hard for them to
have a center strap option in this mid-size board category.
Exocet, just like *board, is a tuttle box company, but for the cross
line, they swallowed their pride and went with the powerbox.
Starboard in the Aero line, really should have a center fin screw
system (like Powerbox) just to get the fin box/footstrap relationship.
OTOH, that would mean that the typical starboard customer will be
pissed that their Tuttle quiver can't be used with the Aero, so I guess
it goes both ways.
Anyway, thanks for the side by side pics. Very helpful.
ScottG
WARDOG
> Not to beat a dead horse, but this pic:
> http://surfingsports.com/images/aero117_cross117_9.jpg
> seems to show what I was mentioning earlier, namely that the Aero fin
> box seems to be too far behind the rear strap.
Hi Scott,
I have only used my offset forward fins , thus far...
FWIW, if you need a number for your observation...
the back of the Cross box is ~ 1 5/8" more forward than the back of the
Aero box...
WARDOG
http://www.surfingsports.com
(PeteCresswell)
>chuck the Tuttle box
Not for any sophisticated/technical reason - just the PITA factor of two screws
vs a single toggle bolt.
--
PeteCresswell
(PeteCresswell)
>the typical starboard customer will be
>pissed that their Tuttle quiver can't be used with the Aero, so I guess
>it goes both ways.
This one would be *really* happy if StarBoard would chuck the Tuttle box and
adopt PowerBox.
--
PeteCresswell
WARDOG
>>> Put down the starboard punch glass for a sec and give us an honest
>>> report ;)
>>>
>>> Don't give me the marketing quotes from *board, give me your honest
>>> opinion.
>
>
>
WARDOG wrote:
LOL...kinda hard...KP's shots on the Aero 117 he showed me on his
laptop, still have me intoxicated...;-)
They're running a shot of a KP aerial, on the Aero, on the splash page
of the Starboard site...
WARDOG
http://surfingsports.com
WillV
That's pretty funny...I hear ya.....but you know, the Cross 117 is working
so well (plus you can't even get an Aero for months)...it will be some time
until I let this one go.
On another note re: CROSS
I gotta say that the footstraps (and heel bumpers) are super nice on the
Cross - I can't believe that with single-bolts, there is ZERO TWIST!!! This
is the first board that has had no twist in the straps while I've sailed
it....the last 4 boards I've owned have all gone in for double-screw inserts
to keep the straps from twisting. Also, the straps themselves are cushy and
holding up very good so far (I normally change out the stock straps after
about 3-5 sessions).
So Scott, get a Cross 117 while there's still one left!!! :)) You're gonna
love it bro!
-WillV-
"ScottG" <gla...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1118954029.2...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
WillV
Was awesome sailing with you last weekend - we could not have asked for
better overall conditions....you stepped off a plane into 4.0 conditions,
then it went light-air and bigger waves....for 2 days! Whew, gotta calm
down after a weekend like that ;)
I got some great video of you - will be sending out a DVD soon...hey, don't
be afraid to talk-up the Cross buddy - both of these new shapes (Cross &
Aero) are helping to make the sport way easier than before huh? Wondering
if Exocet will come out with a bigger Cross now??
L8t,
-WillV-
"Jim R." <jimr...@surfingsports.com> wrote in message
news:1118951790.7...@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
surfer
carries SO MUCH POWER when you land.... so the tactics changed - screw
the vulcans and keep on spinning... Lots of Advil today as my leg and
ankles are killing me. ;-)
Seriously, the AERO is probably the most innovative board I've ridden
since Starboard came out with the EVO - the 92 is still my main wave
machine for here on Lake Michigan. NOTHING can turn and bash like that
board!
The combo of the 117 and 92 will be my new 2 board quiver for
wavesailing. Sure, the 92 is big for those really windy days, but it's
amazing how much wind that 92 can handle. (then again, I'm 6'3" and
200lbs....)
I think I need to go and hit the west coast next week. I need a big
wave fix. ;-)
(PeteCresswell)
>Way to go Pete! You are gonna be super-stoked on the new Aero....are you
>getting the 117 or 127?
127. Hoping to hear that it's in on Monday.
Prolly be a few more days, assuming it doesn't support a center rear strap and I
have to get one put on.
--
PeteCresswell
(PeteCresswell)
>http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_kev1.html
>http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_kev2.html
>http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_kev3.html
>http://www.surfingsports.com/starboard_aero_127/slides/aero127_kev4.html
Is Kevin on a 6.6?
--
PeteCresswell
(PeteCresswell)
>Prolly be a few more days, assuming it doesn't support a center rear strap and I
>have to get one put on.
Oooooh! I see from WarDog's pix that it *does* support a single rear strap.
--
PeteCresswell
Brian M.
waves on Saturday. On the outside, we had the good steep swell with
some cross chop on it (the type you go barrelling down at mach1 hoping
not to skip out!), but the Cross came through with flying colors and
handled with ease! It was light wind (13-17), but the 117 and 6.8
Phanom worked great! Even my kiting friends had doubts that I would
get out and actually plane! They were impressed too!
Took me a bit to figure out the turning on the 117, as I'm so use to
how the Evo 92 snaps around on a bottom turn (thus I expect it from
all boards, unrealistic I know). Ran a center rear strap, but may
try offsetting the (both screws) to one side or the other depending on
wind direction and see how that affects the turning.
I was really jealous reading this whole Aero thread, but knew I
couldn't wait for the Aero to come out, as I didn't want to miss out
on any action, plus I really needed something for summer time besides
the Evo 92 & 6.8. Plus anytime there is something new, it gets lots
of press. The Cross has me super stoked! I'll only be bummed
(slightly) if you guys tell me the Aero snaps turns like the Evo 92
(and smaller boards!), but then again, I'm sure I just need a little
more time to get used to a big board again.
Oh yea, props to Wardog 10" Freeweed! Killa combo with 117!!! I feel
I have a great 2 board quiver with the Cross 117 & Evo 92, which will
cover 90% of my sailing. Now I just got to figure out what to replace
the Acid 77 with! All the talk about the new Evo's and Acid's on the
*board forum has me foaming at the mouth! :-)
Bri
On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 08:51:38 -0700, "WillV" <wi...@biofolic.com>
wrote:
(PeteCresswell)
>Way to go Pete! You are gonna be super-stoked on the new Aero....are you
>getting the 117 or 127?
Picked it up today. The guys I'm currently serving are out of town today and
tomorrow - so I sailed it all day today and plan on going back for more
tomorrow.
Today was one of those 'teaser' days - bay sailing... just on the verge, but not
quite there... but Aero definately passed the schlog test - kind of fun
actually. Also, it *really* wants to take off on just about any little bay
wave that comes along.
Seems easier to sail fin-first than my Carve 123 - geeze, I might even learn how
to do that with some control...
Even if it doesn't work out on the bay, at least I've got myself a lite-air wave
board that fits and I can start visiting the ocean like I've been intending to
do for about the last five years...
Sailed it today with the 400 mm fin. Couldn't point on a schlog worth beans
until I realized that Aero wants to be dead flat or canted a little bit to
leeward - as opposed to digging the Carve's windward rail in.
During the few puffs that came along, the 400 under a 7.8 Infinity and my 220#
tended to lose traction when I loaded it up, but the recoveries were so quick
and effortless that it almost qualifies as something you'd do for grins.
Tried to put my 460 from the Carve on it, but it wouldn't fit in the Aero's box.
God bless Tuttle.... I think I'd pay $100-$150 extra for a board just to have
a PowerBox or Chinook box in it.
So far - besides having a Tuttle box in it - the only negative I can come up
with is the vent screw. Why on earth would somebody spec a vent screw that
needs a Phillips-head screw driver? Were the screws on sale or something?
Heaven forbid they should stick with the slot-head screw that other boards use,
people have spares for already, stores have on their shelves, and which is
operable with a quarter, a penny, a nickel, a piece of clamshell, the head of a
car key.....or any one of about a hundred other commonly-available objects.
OTOH I have a history of buyer's remorse....so maybe I'm just raving.
iWindsurf thinks tomorrow has possibilities...
--
PeteCresswell
ScottG
1) surprised it doesnt shlog with windward rail buried, using the nose
scoop to drive you upwind. Maybe its too floaty to get the scoop
buried??
2) Hillarious (well, tragically sad actually) that the fin from your
Starboard Carve will not fit your Starboard Aero.
Say what you will TUTTLE SUCKS!!
When a quality manufacturer cannot have interchangeability of all its
fins in all its boards, there is a serious manufacturing tolerance
problem.
Blame it on the fin box subcontractor if you want, but Starboard should
reject fin boxes and suppliers that are not standard and uniform.
Again, I re-iterate my suggestion of a TUTTLE 2 fin (a high tolerance,
interchangeable version of the current Tuttle, that would be as
interchangeable as Powerbox fins)
3) dont worry about the philips vent screw, my JP and others do that -
its that same as a footstrap screwdriver, and a US box philips
screwdriver works also. Its not a big deal because you should "set it
and forget it". I agree the slot is more universal, but I dont even
notice the philips screw until I'm packing my board for a plane flight.
ScottG
Ellen Faller
I think I have a spare slotted vent plug screw in my van that you
could have. Let me know and I can put it in the mail. The vent plug
screws, whether slotted or phillips, are the same at the threaded end
and are interchangeable.
Your feelings on the fit of tuttle box fins is common, and mostly has
to do with the very slight differences in measurement units. The box was
designed in inches, and most boxes are in metric units. I find that 98%
of my stock fins fit right out of the box, but one may be a bit loose,
and another may need a bit of work on the ends. After-market fins often
require a lot more work. However, once they fit they are much nicer than
powerbox fins in my opinion. I've used a lot of powerbox fins over the
years, before switching to Tuttle, and I don't miss them at all.
good sailing on your new board,
Ellen
wsurfn
(PeteCresswell) wrote:
> Tried to put my 460 from the Carve on it, but it wouldn't fit in the Aero's box.
> God bless Tuttle.... I think I'd pay $100-$150 extra for a board just to have
> a PowerBox or Chinook box in it.
I totally agree! Why I have to finish the fit on my damn tuttle fin
boxes I will never understand! Only to have the fins fit only one
board. I might understand it for Formula, but not wave!
> So far - besides having a Tuttle box in it - the only negative I can come up
> with is the vent screw. Why on earth would somebody spec a vent screw that
> needs a Phillips-head screw driver? Were the screws on sale or something?
>
> Heaven forbid they should stick with the slot-head screw that other boards use,
> people have spares for already, stores have on their shelves, and which is
> operable with a quarter, a penny, a nickel, a piece of clamshell, the head of a
> car key.....or any one of about a hundred other commonly-available objects.
I agree again.
Keep us posted on the straight dope.
Craig Goudie
have with Tuttles.
-Craig
"wsurfn" <MPlu...@austin.rr.com> wrote in message
news:1120082549.1...@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Cliff Frost
fins, but makes no sense for smaller sizes. I guess the "a" box is ok for really
thin boards.
I will note also that those of us who got a batch of Starboard f186x's 3 years
ago had lots of variation in the Tuttle box fin fit and trim. It was a real pain
for me, involving tons of sanding.
I've never had a moment's problem with my Mike's Lab Formula board Tuttle boxes,
and I don't know anyone who has. So clearly they can be done well but maybe
not in a big production line.
Thanks,
Cliff
(PeteCresswell)
>1) surprised it doesnt shlog with windward rail buried, using the nose
>scoop to drive you upwind. Maybe its too floaty to get the scoop
>buried??
I have to retract my statement. Wasn't putting enough weight up front
yesteday. Now I see that it works with the nose just about submarining.
RE/Tuttle, it seems to me like the design is flawed by the parallel sides on the
box. Being parallel, there's no room for error. Every fin and every box have
to be *exactly* the right size. PowerBox, OTOH, tapers the sides so there's
some wiggle room.
--
PeteCresswell
(PeteCresswell)
> I think I have a spare slotted vent plug screw in my van that you
>could have.
I was just on a rant about the functionality thing.... Somebody still had to
sit down and *decide* to go Phillips head. Left me wondering what's in store
for 2006. Hex key? 20 mm Torx?
Thanks for the offer. But I've got a couple too...although the top part is a
little thicker and protrudes about 1 mm above the deck.
What I was *really* trolling for was some sort of fin recommendation from
WarDog.
--
PeteCresswell
(PeteCresswell)
>Keep us posted on the straight dope.
We had some decent wind today. A lot of solid 7.8 and some pretty-good 6.6.
Jury's still out on whether I'm going to retire the 123 or adopt a two-board
quiver. I won't be able to tell until I come up with a fin that will hold me
and my 7.8 on the Aero. Starboard rates it for up to a 9.5 sail. I'm
guessing that's with a pretty humongous fin bc even the 7.8 is a lot of work
with the 400 mm fin - it's just always kind of unbalanced bc I have to let the
ce stay forward of the fin to keep from breaking it loose.
With a powered 6.6 on it, the Aero seems to have an edge for me even when bay
sailing. It just feels so light - almost like you're floating a few inches over
the water and it *really* zigs and zags. OTOH, I can ride the Carve down to
4.7 - although nobody in their right mind would do that if they had a smaller
board available.... It'll be interesting to see how far down I can go on the
Aero before it becomes too much board on the water.
I started to say that the Carve has better acceleration when I head up, find a
little roller, bear off and sheet in hard... but I can't say that until I've got
a skeg on the Aero that won't break loose when I do the same thing.
Funny thing; when I went from my old Flow 284 to the Carve 123, my reaction was
"Geeze Louise, this thing is soooooo wide...". Today when I was A/B-ing Aero
and Carve, the Carve felt like a speed needle.
--
PeteCresswell
Juri Munkki
>When a quality manufacturer cannot have interchangeability of all its
>fins in all its boards, there is a serious manufacturing tolerance
>problem.
About a year ago there was a long thread about tuttle box issues on the
Starboard forum. One of the things promised was that Cobra would try to
solve the problem and make the fin boxes the right size.
And they did.
Thing is, the old boxes were wider than the standard allows, so now that
the boxes are the right size, the old fins need a bit of work to fit in.
It was one of those situations where you really couldn't win: you could
either keep on doing the slightly wider than standard boxes for all
eternity (redefine the standard) or you could fix the box and prevent
some old fins from fitting new boards.
I have a 2005 Carve 94, 2005 Prokids S-Type and a 2004 Hypersonic 96.
The box on the HS is a bit wider, but I intend to have a look at that
this weekend. Most of my fins have clear packing tape on each side, so all
I have to do is take the tape off to make them fit a narrower box.
The wind forecast for this weekend is 2-4 knots, so it should be a pretty
good time to work on the fin box. (And if doing it will jinx the weather
and create some wind, it will only help the formula competition that
is scheduled here this weekend...)
--
Juri Munkki - http://www.iki.fi/jmunkki - Windsurfing: Faster than the wind.
Dan Weiss
room. Literally. Ever try to shim an ill fitting PB fin? Those tapered
sides make for some pretty strange results.
-Dan
"(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.z.invalid> wrote in message
news:hhr6c11ehgc9vpjbc...@4ax.com...
ScottG
That is really good news and might make me by a tuttle box again.
One problem might be that other mfgrs (not many other than cobra,
though), including aftermarket fin mfgrs, might not be following the
new standard.
Aftermarket fins seemed to have been made intentionally oversize so
they could be sanded for any board.
Well, at least now, once you sand them to fit your 2005 starboard, they
should fit all your future starboards (and hopefully all Cobra boards).
its about freaking time.
thx.
(PeteCresswell)
>Thing is, the old boxes were wider than the standard allows, so now that
>the boxes are the right size, the old fins need a bit of work to fit in.
That might explain the situation on my (older...) Carve 123. The aftermarket
fin I always use on it (46cm Curtis FreeRide) fits perfectly - right out of the
box, but won't fit into the new Aero's box.
OTOH, the 38cm fin that came with the Carve is a loose fit (as in wiggles
back-and-forth) in the Carve (and hums like crazy....maybe that's the cause...)
- but it's a perfect fit in the new Aero.
Seems like the box diff must be quite small bc other aftermarket fins that I
have fit both boxes - snug in the Aero, maybe a little less than snug in the
carve.
--
PeteCresswell