VCR Advice: Toshiba or Panasonic or ???
wino
I am looking for a VCR for my girlfriend. I have 2 models under
consideration:
Panasonic 7662 (Dynamorphous heads) or Toshiba 762 (V3 heads).
Any comments on these or recommendations for other VCRs?
Thanks,
Please e-mail to:
Richard A.
*wi...@pipeline.com (wino) wrote:
>I am looking for a VCR for my girlfriend. I have 2 models under
>consideration:
>Panasonic 7662 (Dynamorphous heads) or Toshiba 762 (V3 heads).
>Any comments on these or recommendations for other VCRs?
>wi...@pipeline.com
>
I just bought the Panasonic 7662 today. I was shocked to find out
that it doesn't have a "tape remaining" function.
The positive things so far are that Panasonic has finally restored
the index function, the EP picture is very good, it has a
spatiallization sound feature (wide stereo), and the remote is working
with my cable box and tv. I'm replacing a broken down toshiba M770
that cost $400 and only made it to it's first birthday. This
Panasonic cost $100 less and seems to be at least as good in most
respects and has a slightly better EP picture. But I'm reserving
judgement because it's been my experience that the quality of VHS
machines has gotten so bad that I feel like we are just renting them.
They just don't last if you use them much. BTW, I got a 2 year
extended warranty and I might go back and get a 3rd year if I decide
to keep this machine. I have 30 days to decide.
I wonder if anyone has checked out the new Proscan hi fi vcr
models. I wonder how they stack up in the $300 to $350 price range.
Any opinions on this subject would be appreciated.
Thanks, Richard A.
Susan Sanders
In article <336fef3e...@news.concentric.net> Richard A.,
pit...@concentric.net writes:
> But I'm reserving
>judgement because it's been my experience that the quality of VHS
>machines has gotten so bad that I feel like we are just renting them.
>They just don't last if you use them much. BTW, I got a 2 year
Well, that may be true of Toshiba's, but I've had my Sony SLV-751 for
probably about 5 years, I'm sure it gets used at least 30 hours/week of
use, and it's never needed servicing of any kind--just keeps going, and
going, and going . . . I also have a Panasonic PV-4469 that I've had
probably 3 years, it gets considerably less use (I use it mainly just for
copying) but I haven't had any problems with it either.
In terms of quality, I'd take the Sony over the Panasonic any day, in
terms of both features and picture quality (though at least
features-wise, I don't expect the Panasonic to be as good since it was a
cheaper model; but it was quite a surprise to find out that the
Panasonic's shuttle offers variable speeds only going forward, not
reverse).
Richard A.
Well, after test driving the Panasonic 7662 for 3 days, I just
felt too frustrated by the lack of the tape remaining function. It
was frustrating "flying blind" during multiple recordings of tv
programs. We do a lot of time shifting because of work hours, etc. I
kept worrying that I was going to miss the end of a program because
the machine lacked the ability to tell me how much tape was left.
I wound up taking another chance on a Toshiba. I bought a 752 for
about $330. This time though, I bought a 2 year extended warranty!
The new 6 head design with 19 micron heads really cleans up the SLP
picture quality. There is very little difference now between the SP
picture and it. This unit does not have DNR. But it's not lacking
any of the normal functions, so I'm satisfied with the setup.
I have heard a lot of great things about old Sonys. But the newer
models are not so reliable. Close to 2 years ago, I purshase the 640.
A couple of functions did not work out of the box. I replaced it and
that one had a couple of other functions that didn't work! So I tried
a third one (I do have patience), and on that one all the functions
worked, but the drum squeeked. So that was the end of that.
When I talk to repair guys, most say that all vcrs (consumer
models) are made very cheaply today, differing greatly from several
years ago. So much of the insides is plastic now.
Hopefully I'll be luckier this time. I think we are all in the
same boat here. The extended warranty I purchased includes the use of
a loaner if there is a problem. So I'm back to "renting" again, I
suppose. I'm just trying to be realistic with a sad state of shoddy,
cost cutting workmanship. Caveat Emptor, I suppose. :)
Richard A.
Joseph Lee
Richard A. (pit...@concentric.net) wrote:
: Well, after test driving the Panasonic 7662 for 3 days, I just
: felt too frustrated by the lack of the tape remaining function. It
Most VCRs don't have a tape-remaining function. I've only seen it on a
AG-1980 in the Panasonic line. Most have a tape-counter and you generally
work off that.
--
Joseph /================+========+=============+============================\
nugu...@netcom.com | Kronos | Anime Expo | Cal-Animage Epsilon (Anime) >
-------------------------+--------+ '97 | Engineering Tower TEC #201 >
II(> Creative 'Ware <)II | IIGS | Los Angeles | Thursdays, 7pm - 10pm /
JB
In article <nugundamE...@netcom.com>, nugu...@netcom.com (Joseph
Lee) wrote:
My Toshiba M782 has a tape remaining function. Its also a great VCR.
Can't say anything about longevity, though, as I just got it a month ago...
JB
Richard A.
nugu...@netcom.com (Joseph Lee) wrote:
>Richard A. (pit...@concentric.net) wrote:
>: Well, after test driving the Panasonic 7662 for 3 days, I just
>: felt too frustrated by the lack of the tape remaining function. It
>
>Most VCRs don't have a tape-remaining function. I've only seen it on a
>AG-1980 in the Panasonic line. Most have a tape-counter and you generally
>work off that.
>Joseph
Joseph,
Look again, They all have tape remain except for the new 97 models
of Panasonic. I know, I've just looked at every name brand sold at
The GoodGuys. Richard A.
Craig Brown
I spotted in your post that you have a Toshiba M752. I'm trying to make
a decision on a new Hi-Fi VHS recorder and I do a lot of off-the-air
recording in EP mode. Do the 6 heads/ 19 microns make a significant
difference? As I understand it, the Toshiba models (both M752 and M782)
have nothing like Sony's cable mouse to allow the timer to change the
cable channel on the box. Do you know if this is true?
Thanks,
- Craig
Richard A. wrote:
>
> Susan Sanders <ssan...@umich.edu> wrote:
> >In article <336fef3e...@news.concentric.net> Richard A.,
> >pit...@concentric.net writes:
> >> But I'm reserving
> >>judgement because it's been my experience that the quality of VHS
> >>machines has gotten so bad that I feel like we are just renting them.
> >>They just don't last if you use them much. BTW, I got a 2 year
> >Well, that may be true of Toshiba's, but I've had my Sony SLV-751 for
> >probably about 5 years, I'm sure it gets used at least 30 hours/week of
> >use, and it's never needed servicing of any kind--just keeps going, and
> >going, and going . . . I also have a Panasonic PV-4469 that I've had
> >probably 3 years, it gets considerably less use (I use it mainly just for
> >copying) but I haven't had any problems with it either.
> >In terms of quality, I'd take the Sony over the Panasonic any day, in
> >terms of both features and picture quality (though at least
> >features-wise, I don't expect the Panasonic to be as good since it was a
> >cheaper model; but it was quite a surprise to find out that the
> >Panasonic's shuttle offers variable speeds only going forward, not
> >reverse).
>
> Well, after test driving the Panasonic 7662 for 3 days, I just
> felt too frustrated by the lack of the tape remaining function. It
Richard A.
Craig Brown <drj...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>I spotted in your post that you have a Toshiba M752. I'm trying to make
>a decision on a new Hi-Fi VHS recorder and I do a lot of off-the-air
>recording in EP mode. Do the 6 heads/ 19 microns make a significant
>difference? As I understand it, the Toshiba models (both M752 and M782)
>have nothing like Sony's cable mouse to allow the timer to change the
>cable channel on the box. Do you know if this is true?
>
>Thanks,
>- Craig
Craig,
I've tested the units with the 19 micron heads at the store
several times.
I've recorded and played back repeatedly in ep (slp) mode. I expected
to see
a better picture quality and frankly, I didn't see it. And I feel
like I'm a very
picky consumer.
My opinion, for what it's worth, is that the panasonic 7662 had a
better ep
picture than any of the 19 micron head models. The panasonic comes
with
something called a dynamorphous head. It is supposedly made of a
harder
combination of metals; an alloy. This is supposed to last longer and
have good
picture quality. I feel this has been a very good success.
Only one other company has what I consider to be a slightly better
quality
picture in ep mode. That's the Sony. They have two model lines that
I saw.
The cheaper models, in the $200 to $260 price range had just an
average ep
picture, but the more expensive models in the $300 to $350 price range
have a
head assembly that they call DA Pro. It is very very good, once
again, in my opinion.
I returned the toshiba and finally purchased the Sony SLV-765hf.
It has every
conceivable feature. They require you to send off for the cable
mouse, but it's offered
for free. It's the best vcr that I've seen in a long time and I'm
glad that I kept looking and
didn't accept a lesser product. I paid $299 for it and another $80
for a two year extended
warranty. I'll explain why I did that later. I think I may have paid
a sale price on the Sony,
but I'm not sure. It was sort of a weird situation, because the
computer at the sales desk
said $299 while the display said $349. I think it's well worth $350
however.
The Toshiba m770 that I had previously had cable control on the
remote. But that was
a 94/95 model and the newer ones don't seem to have that anymore. I'm
not totally sure
that the 782 doesn't have it, because I didn't look too closely at it.
The disappointing thing
about the Toshiba model line is that the picture quality had gone from
very good to below
average in sp. The ep mode is ok, but not in the same class as the
Panasonic and Sony
machines with the special heads that I mentioned. I would have stuck
with the Panasonic,
except for the inexplicable absence of a tape remain function. I'm
sure you'd agree that
anyone that does a lot of recording needs to know how much tape
they've got left so they
don't run out of room. When I talked to the Panasonic customer
support line, the woman
that I talked to was shocked that the new 97 models left this out and
she had to check with
her supervisor!
From my experience, no vcr is perfect. But I'm actually surprised
at how much I like this
new Sony. Whatever you decide on, check with the store you buy it
from about Extended
Warranties. I used to think they were a rip off, but VCRs break down
a lot. So in this case
it's a good idea to protect your investment. The store where I bought
my Toshiba 770 was
The Good Guys. They have a policy that gives you a loaner vcr while
yours is in for repair, even
if it's a head cleaning. And if it breaks down 3 times during the
life of the extended warranty, they
will replace it with a new one. That's what happened to me.
Otherwise, this would have been a
much more frustrating experience.
Good Luck, Richard A.
btw, I'd like to know how this goes for you once you settle on a
unit. Let me know what
you decide and if you are satisfied. :)
Eric Smith
On Sat, 17 May 1997 01:18:02 GMT, pit...@concentric.net (Richard A.) wrote:
> I returned the toshiba and finally purchased the Sony SLV-765hf.
>It has every
>conceivable feature. They require you to send off for the cable
>mouse, but it's offered
>for free. It's the best vcr that I've seen in a long time and I'm
Can you make it display the time of day on the front of
the VCR while a tape is playing? Most VCR's have a
clock/counter button for that, but I can't find one on the
remote that came with my new Sony.
>machines with the special heads that I mentioned. I would have stuck
>with the Panasonic,
>except for the inexplicable absence of a tape remain function. I'm
Why not just subtract the tape counter from six hours? That's
all the tape remain function does anyway. Not being able to
see the time of day while a tape plays seems like a bigger flaw
to me. The clock is there, but they just don't bother to let you
look at it. Just like a Sharp microwave oven with a steam sensor
which restricts you from using the steam sensor in any multi-
stage programs, because they think it will be too complicated
for you to understand.
-- Eric Smith <e...@iname.nospam.com>
-- (To reply, remove .nospam from the address.)
Joseph Lee
Richard A. (pit...@concentric.net) wrote:
: Look again, They all have tape remain except for the new 97 models
: of Panasonic. I know, I've just looked at every name brand sold at
: The GoodGuys. Richard A.
Hm.. then Panasonic didn't have it for a while since my '95? 4566 doesn't
have a tape remaining counter either.
Richard A.
e...@iname.nospam.com (Eric Smith) wrote:
>On Sat, 17 May 1997 01:18:02 GMT, pit...@concentric.net (Richard A.) wrote:
>
>> I returned the toshiba and finally purchased the Sony SLV-765hf.
>>It has every
>>conceivable feature.
>Can you make it display the time of day on the front of
>the VCR while a tape is playing? Most VCR's have a
>clock/counter button for that, but I can't find one on the
>remote that came with my new Sony.
>
>
>>machines with the special heads that I mentioned. I would have stuck
>>with the Panasonic,
>>except for the inexplicable absence of a tape remain function. I'm
>
>Why not just subtract the tape counter from six hours? That's
>all the tape remain function does anyway. Not being able to
>see the time of day while a tape plays seems like a bigger flaw
>to me. The clock is there, but they just don't bother to let you
>look at it. Just like a Sharp microwave oven with a steam sensor
>which restricts you from using the steam sensor in any multi-
>stage programs, because they think it will be too complicated
>for you to understand.
>-- Eric Smith <e...@iname.nospam.com>
Eric,
It's just a case of no vcr having exactly the features each
individual wants. Not being able to display the current time is odd.
I noticed that right away on the Sony myself. But it's not a deal
breaker by any means (for me). It's not like there are a lot of other
vcrs in the same class when you look at the balance of the features
that _are_ included.
As far as the tape counter goes, there are certainly ways to work
around it. I can think of a couple right off the top of my head. But
they all require math or record keeping of previous recordings. And
as far as I'm concerned, a royal pain in the ass. I'd much rather
just pop in a previously partially recorded tape, run it for a few
seconds and see exactly how much tape I have left. I'd hate to record
2 hours of a movie just to miss the last 15 minutes. (or whatever)
If I had to choose between the two functions we are talking about,
and actually, I have, I would choose the Sony over the Panasonic and
look at the clock I have on the wall across the room. Clocks are all
over the place, but there's no painless way to know how much tape is
left on one of my 200+ tapes without the above mentioned math. I
guess it all depends on what you plan on doing with it and what seems
important.
Richard A.
Scott Lange
Craig Brown wrote:
>
> I spotted in your post that you have a Toshiba M752. I'm trying to make
> a decision on a new Hi-Fi VHS recorder and I do a lot of off-the-air
> recording in EP mode. Do the 6 heads/ 19 microns make a significant
> difference? As I understand it, the Toshiba models (both M752 and M782)
> have nothing like Sony's cable mouse to allow the timer to change the
> cable channel on the box. Do you know if this is true?
>
> Thanks,
> - Craig
Craig:
For what it's worth, here's a copy of a recent post of mine to this group!
I'd appreciate anyone's comments on the following, which are an email to Video
Magazine's equipment reviewer Timothy Liebe and a note to Toshiba's Customer Service
people:
ATTN: Timothy Liebe c/o Video Magazine
Timothy:
I recently bought a Toshiba M782 VHS VCR, largely based on your glowing review of the
unit in the November, 1996 issue, and its subsequent choice as one of Video's "Products
of the Year."
The purchase was made necessary by the demise of one of my two NEC N965U VCRs, which (1)
I dearly love(d), (2) are no longer available`nor are replacement units since NEC got
out of the consumer video business a number of years ago and (3) repair parts for which
are no longer available since NEC stopped supplying them after the required five or so
years. The machines are/were around 10 years old and are/were excellent performers at
all speeds (including SLP), with a raft of features no longer available on today's
consumer VHS machines, which now seem designed to be "one-touch," "simpleton-friendly"
units.
For a number of reasons, I cannot switch to S-VHS at this point, so I began looking for
a standard VHS replacement unit that would be a good record/playback performer and
strong at SLP speed, since I have a large number of videos at that speed in my
collection. You can easily see why I was attracted to the Toshiba M782.
I've just faxed the following note to Toshiba Customer Service, and will anxiously await
their reply. Since you do many of the VCR reviews for Video, perhaps you can help as
well, with a question that's starting to nag at me -- is it my eyes and the kind of
performance I'm used to with the NECs, or have consumer VHS VCR playback pictures been
getting softer and softer, either from lack of quality or from a perception that, to the
consumer, "smoother is better," even if it means a significant loss of picture detail?
Or, to put it another way, are the manufacturers "dumbing down" the picture the same way
as they're "dumbing down" the controls and features? I'd really appreciate your
thoughts on the matter! My email address is below.
Okay, here's what I faxed to Toshiba:
Toshiba Customer Service:
I recently bought one of your Model #M-782 VHS VCRs (Serial #99585201), and I am having
some trouble discerning whether or not the unit is defective or misadjusted.
The unit I looked at in the store seemed relatively sharp on playback, Timothy Liebe, in
his review of the unit in the November, 1996 issue of Video Magazine talked about the
"less mushy picture" and "amazing SLP playback quality," and your own Press Release of
1/9/97 spoke of "pictures that are incredibly crisp and clear" and "sharper, clearer
images." I can say none of this for the M-782 I now own -- its playback video is
decidedly "mushy" and lacking in detail. In fact, even with the DNR Perfect off, when I
compare SLP playback between both machines of a tape recorded on the new M-782 with the
19-micron heads, I see far clearer and sharper (although somewhat noisier) images from
my old machine, a 10-year-old NEC N965U with it's Sharpness Control at the "Normal"
detent!
So, it seems the signal is being adequately recorded, but the playback side is either
defective or the video playback equalization has been set too low. While the DNR
Perfect does a good job reducing chroma noise, I am very disappointed with the lack of
sharpness and detail in the video playback as a whole. I would gladly trade off a
little chroma and/or video noise for the sort of detail a machine like this should be
able to deliver. Is there a way for you or an authorized Toshiba repair facility to
either check the machine or adjust the video playback EQ for more detail? I got a peek
at the M-782 Service Manual at a VCR repair place, and the closest I could see to an
adjustment point was the EQ block of IC V61 on the Main (Video) Board.
If this is the best this machine can do, I'm very disappointed, so I'd really appreciate
your help! My address, phone and fax numbers are listed above.
--
Scott Lange
<scott...@worldnet.att.net>
ric...@erols.com
> My opinion, for what it's worth, is that the panasonic 7662 had a
> better ep picture than any of the 19 micron head models. The panasonic comes
> with something called a dynamorphous head. It is supposedly made of a
> harder combination of metals; an alloy. This is supposed to last longer and
> have good picture quality. I feel this has been a very good success.
> Only one other company has what I consider to be a slightly better
> quality picture in ep mode. That's the Sony. They have two model lines that
> I saw. The cheaper models, in the $200 to $260 price range had just an
> average ep picture, but the more expensive models in the $300 to $350 price
> range have a head assembly that they call DA Pro. It is very very good, once
> again, in my opinion.
> I returned the toshiba and finally purchased the Sony SLV-765hf.
> It has every conceivable feature.
Just a note on this as I just went through the same choices myself. I
needed to decide between the Sony SLV-975HF and the Panasonic PV-S7670.
The Sony had more editing capabilities (but I never really use them) but,
it isn't an SVHS machine. The Panasonic is and I use S-Video connections
(better picture). That was the deciding factor for me. It has an
excellent picture and seems to have every other possible feature. It's
not as feature rich as my top-of-the-line JVC, but that one ran me $899
two years ago. I looked for an SVHS VCR in the Sony line and they appear
to only have one, at over $1000. No thanks.
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
c...@mail.danville.net
In article <8643207...@dejanews.com>,
I recently purchased the Sony SLV 695HF and I'm stunned by the design
flaws on this model (and I'm told, on all of the new models in their
line?) No visible clock while tape is in, a clumsy joystick remote, and
no tracking on the remote. This latter oversight is perhaps the result of
arrogance, given Sony's APC(Adaptive Picture Control). You can of course,
turn off the APC, and I've not had a chance yet to try a number of
different tapes with the APC off, but overall, I can't believe Sony made
this model so inconvenient to use. The official company word on this is
that the 695HF is their most popular and bestselling new machine, that
the joystick remote takes some practice, and that the Japanese designers
didn't see any need for a clock while the tape is in, e.g., it's only
their for use as a timer. Does anyone else have this model or another
with the same lack of conveniences?
K -
Dan Reuting
As someone who works in the industry I can tell you that the Panasonic
VCRs with Dinamorphis heads are an excellent purchase. The price has
just come down on them this year also. The jog shuttle on the VCR itself
is a useless feature but everything else about these machines is
excellent!
Richard A.
c...@mail.danville.net wrote:
>I recently purchased the Sony SLV 695HF and I'm stunned by the design
>flaws on this model (and I'm told, on all of the new models in their
>line?) No visible clock while tape is in, a clumsy joystick remote, and
>no tracking on the remote. This latter oversight is perhaps the result of
>arrogance, given Sony's APC(Adaptive Picture Control). You can of course,
>turn off the APC, and I've not had a chance yet to try a number of
>different tapes with the APC off, but overall, I can't believe Sony made
>this model so inconvenient to use. The official company word on this is
>that the 695HF is their most popular and bestselling new machine, that
>the joystick remote takes some practice, and that the Japanese designers
>didn't see any need for a clock while the tape is in, e.g., it's only
>their for use as a timer. Does anyone else have this model or another
>with the same lack of conveniences?
>
>K -
I agree completely on that terrible remote with the "joystick".
I tried using it for quite a few minutes at the store and I realized
it would have been a constant irritation.
I decided on the Sony model 765 instead. It has a full feature
remote and so far, I think it's the best vcr I've owned. The only
drawback is the lack of the clock being visible, but that's minor
compared to the crap I've encountered with other company's vcrs
lately. It's all a matter of giving in on one feature or another.
But I agree that it's goofy not to be able to choose "clock display"
if you want to. Someone in Japan needs to be called on the carpet and
made to wear a bunch of red ribbons ala "Gung Ho" starring Michael
Keaton and Gedde Watanabe. :)
Richard A.
CDRMaker
da...@webtv.net (Dan Reuting) wrote:
>As someone who works in the industry I can tell you that the Panasonic
>VCRs with Dinamorphis heads are an excellent purchase. The price has
||| Is this spelled correctly??????????? :-)