While many in Leftism blame the US real estate collapse solely on those "greedy bankers" those same are now blaming the Euro crisis on those Germans. "...it is common for the wayward debtor to blame the thrifty creditor for his dilemma.."

[PJ O'D]

As many in Leftism blame the US real estate collapse on those "greedy
bankers" more are blaming the Euro crisis on those Germans. "...it is
common for the wayward debtor to blame the thrifty creditor for his
dilemma.."


"....those who speak German are sort of like red-staters, who view
the rest of a failing Europe, or indeed the world at large, the way
those in Texas look at California

.....as a rich French socialist from his Mediterranean villa lectures
on “fairness,” and as Obama worries that Europe won’t print and borrow
enough before November....

..it is common for the wayward debtor to blame the thrifty creditor
for his dilemma. The Germans now are in the impossible situation of
being told they did something wrong by doing things mostly right. They
retire too late and caused others to retire too early; they saved too
much money so others had to borrow too much; they built too many
things that others wanted;..

...Right now the continent’s psychological problem is not that
southern Europeans cannot pay the northerners back, but that they are
often arguing that they should not have to pay them, as if those who
lent are more to blame than those who borrowed....

....Again, it would be as if Californians would lecture Texans about
why they must give the Golden State $16 billion to solve our current
budget shortfall. And then to add insult to injury, we would offer a
critique of exactly what is wrong with the Texan go-get-‘em mentality
and what is right with the California laid-back lifestyle that spawned
one-third of all the nation’s welfare recipients, with the highest
paid teachers in America’s near-bottom-rated schools. How long would
Texas take that? The answer is about as long as Germany will take
that...

....government, economics, and social policy are critical, but
themselves are driven by the minute-to-minute culture of everyday
people. Germans pick up trash; in Athens, Greeks toss it. Germans do
not honk; Italians do not not honk. In Libya or Egypt the pedestrian
is a target; in Switzerland he is considered perhaps your father or
grandmother. A bathroom in Germany is where someone else uses it after
you; in Greece or Mexico, it is where you pass on the distaste of
using the facility to the sucker who follows you....

...I watch fender benders a lot. In northern Europe, addresses and
information are exchanged; south of Milan, shouts and empty threats of
mayhem follow. When I check out of a German hotel, I know the bill
reflects what I bought or used; when I check out of a Greek hotel, I
dread all the nonexistent charges to appear, and a “50/50 split the
difference” settlement to be offered.

..... I rent a car in Athens and expect charges for “dents” to appear;
in Germany, there are such charges only if there are actual dents. Add
all that up — and millions more of such discrepancies repeated
millions of times over each hour — and you have one country that
creates vast wealth and another that cons to land vast wealth it did
not create..."

google any part if you wish to read the article in its entirety (long)

[Bill]

In article <7a631711-3588-4f7e-9ade-b0495ab6faa7
@j25g2000yqn.googlegroups.com>, p20...@hot-shot.com says...

>
> As many in Leftism blame the US real estate collapse on those "greedy
> bankers" more are blaming the Euro crisis on those Germans. "...it is
> common for the wayward debtor to blame the thrifty creditor for his
> dilemma.."
>

Nope, it's still the bankers...

--
William Black

When you hear the words 'Our people are our greatest asset' then it's
time to leave.

[PJ O'D]

On May 29, 8:53 am, Bill <blackuse...@gmail.com> wrote:
> In article <7a631711-3588-4f7e-9ade-b0495ab6faa7

> @j25g2000yqn.googlegroups.com>, p209...@hot-shot.com says...

>
>
>
> > As many in Leftism blame the US real estate collapse on those "greedy
> > bankers" more are blaming the Euro crisis on those Germans. "...it is
> > common for the wayward debtor to blame the thrifty creditor for his
> > dilemma.."
>
> Nope,  it's still the bankers...
>
> --
> William Black
>
> When you hear the words 'Our people are our greatest asset' then it's
> time to leave.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20080927.COWENT27/TP...

"..In fact, no one wants to level with the people. If they did, they'd
have to explain that everybody had a hand in creating the credit
crisis - even Democrats. In fact, it was the Republicans who pushed
for tighter regulations on Fannie and Freddie, the government mortgage
lenders, and the Democrats who opposed them. "These two entities ...
are not facing any kind of financial crisis," said Democratic
congressman Barney Frank back in 2003. "The more people exaggerate
these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the
less we will see in terms of affordable housing." Mr. Frank is now a
central figure in the bailout talks...."

[chatnoir]

On May 29, 6:20 am, "PJ O'D" <p209...@hot-shot.com> wrote:
> As many in Leftism blame the US real estate collapse on those "greedy
> bankers" more are blaming the Euro crisis on those Germans. "...it is
> common for the wayward debtor to blame the thrifty creditor for his
> dilemma.."
>

US Bankersters were thrifty?????? Their gambling over derivatives
caused the crises!

[Bill]

In article <3f5d40c6-dc08-4c84-a0a9-
520b5f...@c19g2000yqk.googlegroups.com>, gap...@gmail.com says...

>
> On May 29, 8:53 am, Bill <blackuse...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > In article <7a631711-3588-4f7e-9ade-b0495ab6faa7
> > @j25g2000yqn.googlegroups.com>, p209...@hot-shot.com says...
> >
> >
> >
> > > As many in Leftism blame the US real estate collapse on those "greedy
> > > bankers" more are blaming the Euro crisis on those Germans. "...it is
> > > common for the wayward debtor to blame the thrifty creditor for his
> > > dilemma.."
> >
> > Nope,  it's still the bankers...
> >
> > --
> > William Black
> >
> > When you hear the words 'Our people are our greatest asset' then it's
> > time to leave.
>

> "..In fact, no one wants to level with the people.

Yes they do.

It's still the bloody bankers.

They're incompetent greedy and insufferable and eventually someone whose
family died is going to work it out and start assassinating the bastards

[Snordo]

"PJ O'D" <p20...@hot-shot.com> wrote in message
news:7a631711-3588-4f7e...@j25g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...




hey gomer, yall ever tote that scraggly ass out into the sunshine ??

yall know what sunshine is ??


is your skin gray and dropping ?

got any hair left, other than on your back ??

[Snordo]

"Bill" <black...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.2a2eef027...@news.eternal-september.org...
: In article <3f5d40c6-dc08-4c84-a0a9-

:



why wait?

let's git the ropes and pitchforks now,hang all them right wing cocksuckers, their
wives,children, and dogs too

[Go Fig]

The only reason banks were willing to trade these “commodities” is
because they were insured by the federal government and THAT is what
caused the crisis… The federal government insuring loans to people
that had no business getting loans.

jay

[Poetic Justice]

Go Fig wrote;

>The only reason banks were willing to
>trade these "commodities" is because they
>were insured by the federal government
>and THAT is what caused the crisis…
>The federal government insuring loans to
>people that had no business getting loans.

In my capital city (200,000 pop) the lead story back then was of a
legal immigrant taxi driver making $18,000 who wanted to buy a 3 family
tenament bldg.
He and his wife on 1 floor and rent out the other 2 floors.

This was done by the Irish and the later Italian immigrants and worked
out well, they usually rented to family members and paid the morgage
with the rents.

This couple couldn't decide on 2 seperate properties so the Real Estate
agent said "Why not just buy both, it's no problem".

So they did. Followed by foreclosure and then by the bank owning 2
boarded-up properties with no income.

I personally know of 2 legal immigrants thru work that also lost their
homes while their income remained the same.

The big questions are;

What government agency regulated this and made those laws?

Who was in charge of this agency (politician's names/party) and did
they receive any compensation?

And *why* did they allow people who couldn't afford this to be able to
buy homes?
Regards, Walter

..And Paradise Was Lost...like teardrops in the rain...

[Bill]

In article <6074-4FC...@storefull-3172.bay.webtv.net>,
paradi...@webtv.net says...

>
> Go Fig wrote;
>
> >The only reason banks were willing to
> >trade these "commodities" is because they
> >were insured by the federal government

> >and THAT is what caused the crisis?

> >The federal government insuring loans to
> >people that had no business getting loans.
>
> In my capital city (200,000 pop) the lead story back then was of a
> legal immigrant taxi driver making $18,000 who wanted to buy a 3 family
> tenament bldg.
> He and his wife on 1 floor and rent out the other 2 floors.
>
> This was done by the Irish and the later Italian immigrants and worked
> out well, they usually rented to family members and paid the morgage
> with the rents.
>
> This couple couldn't decide on 2 seperate properties so the Real Estate
> agent said "Why not just buy both, it's no problem".
>
> So they did. Followed by foreclosure and then by the bank owning 2
> boarded-up properties with no income.
>
> I personally know of 2 legal immigrants thru work that also lost their
> homes while their income remained the same.
>
> The big questions are;
>
> What government agency regulated this and made those laws?
>
> Who was in charge of this agency (politician's names/party) and did
> they receive any compensation?
>
> And *why* did they allow people who couldn't afford this to be able to
> buy homes?
> Regards, Walter
>
> ..And Paradise Was Lost...like teardrops in the rain...

Don't you just love the idea that unless they're regulated by
governments banks are so irresponsible that they'll destroy themselves
and the country they're based in.

That's a wonderful basis for the nationalisation of all financial
institutions.

So I assume you'll be fighting for that now.

[chatnoir]

Greed caused the crises!

[EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)]

Poetic Justice wrote:
> Go Fig wrote;
>
>> The only reason banks were willing to
>> trade these "commodities" is because they
>> were insured by the federal government
>> and THAT is what caused the crisis…
>> The federal government insuring loans to
>> people that had no business getting loans.
>
> In my capital city (200,000 pop) the lead story back then was of a
> legal immigrant taxi driver making $18,000 who wanted to buy a 3 family
> tenament bldg.
> He and his wife on 1 floor and rent out the other 2 floors.
>
> This was done by the Irish and the later Italian immigrants and worked
> out well, they usually rented to family members and paid the morgage
> with the rents.
>
> This couple couldn't decide on 2 seperate properties so the Real Estate
> agent said "Why not just buy both, it's no problem".
>
> So they did. Followed by foreclosure and then by the bank owning 2
> boarded-up properties with no income.
>
> I personally know of 2 legal immigrants thru work that also lost their
> homes while their income remained the same.
>
> The big questions are;
>
> What government agency regulated this and made those laws?

I think the main portion of the problem in such cases is that many
laymen don't understand what "adjustable rate mortgage" MEANS. (And
often realtors trying to sell the property see no reason to enlighten
them.) They start with payments they can afford, suddenly the interest
rate increases enormously, and they find themselves with a payment
amount they can no longer manage to pay. (And of course, too many
people regarded increased "home equity" as a source of funds, rather
than viewing a paid-up mortgage as contributing to their permanent
security.)

[Poetic Justice]

>The big questions are;

>What government agency regulated this
>and made those laws?

>Who was in charge of this agency
>(politician's names/party) and did they
>receive any compensation?

>And *why* did they allow people who
>couldn't afford this to be able to buy
>homes?

Bill wrote;

>Don't you just love the idea that unless
>they're regulated by governments banks
>are so irresponsible that they'll destroy
>themselves and the country they're based
>in.

Banks are regulated in the US as you know I'm sure.

The banks *never* would have written those extremely high risk loans on
their own because that would have destroyed them.

The government backed payment on those risky loans and politically
pressured the big banks to go after them.

>That's a wonderful basis for the
>nationalisation of all financial institutions.

No but it's a wonderful basis for the government to stick just to
regulation and not making political party gains by insuring high-risk
mortage loans to people who cannot afford them.

>So I assume you'll be fighting for that
>now.

And I assume you know the answers to my 3 questions but prefer to place
no part of the blame at the political source.

"I think that the responsibility that the Democrats had may rest more
in resisting any efforts by Republicans in the Congress, or by me when I
was President, to put some standards and tighten up a little on Fannie
Mae and Freddie Mac." – Former President Bill Clinton (D-AR),
September 25, 2008

"Like a lot of my Democratic colleagues I was too slow to appreciate the
recklessness of Fannie and Freddie.
***I defended their efforts to encourage affordable homeownership when
in retrospect I should have heeded the concerns raised by their
regulator in 2004. Frankly, I wish my Democratic colleagues would admit
when it comes to Fannie and Freddie, we were wrong." – Congressman
Artur Davis (D-AL) , September 30, 2008

[Poetic Justice]

EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) wrote;

>I think the main portion of the problem in
>such cases is that many laymen don't
>understand what "adjustable rate
>mortgage" MEANS.

Do you think if they went for a job and the employer said we pay an
'adjustable wage rate' which now is $X/hr they would not question that?

The 3 big questions when applying for a mortgage are;
Down payment, interest rate and monthly payment amounts.

An 'adjustable rate mortgage' is not some legal doublespeak lingo, it is
pretty self explainatory...it's *adjustable* Up or Down.

It was a gamble but with the government backing and basically no real
down payment they risked very little.
And if they defaulted it would take (IIRC in my state) 6 months before
they could be evicted.
Which now with 6 months mortgage/rent-free they would likely recoup
their small down payment and just walk away...free and clear.

>(And often realtors trying to sell the
>property see no reason to enlighten
>them.)

Why would they? The seller's realtor is not financing their mortgage,
the bank is?

>(And of course, too many people regarded
>increased "home equity" as a source of
>funds, rather than viewing a paid-up
>mortgage as contributing to their
>permanent security.)

True but in personal responsibility times those 2nd mortgages usually
went for home improvement as an investment in their homes and not for
RV's, boats, vacations, etc. Regards, Walter

[Bill]

In article <28771-4F...@storefull-3171.bay.webtv.net>,
paradi...@webtv.net says...

> >Don't you just love the idea that unless
> >they're regulated by governments banks
> >are so irresponsible that they'll destroy
> >themselves and the country they're based
> >in.
>
> Banks are regulated in the US as you know I'm sure.
>
> The banks *never* would have written those extremely high risk loans on
> their own because that would have destroyed them.
>
> The government backed payment on those risky loans and politically
> pressured the big banks to go after them.

That's only the case in the USA.

Everywhere else the bankers did it all without government backing.

The reality is that the banks pressured the governments (note plural) to
reduce regulation and so allow them to change from 'counting houses to
casinos.

>
> >That's a wonderful basis for the
> >nationalisation of all financial institutions.

> No but it's a wonderful basis for the government to stick just to
> regulation and not making political party gains by insuring high-risk
> mortage loans to people who cannot afford them.

That's a local problem, we're in an international crisis.

>
> >So I assume you'll be fighting for that
> >now.
>
> And I assume you know the answers to my 3 questions but prefer to place
> no part of the blame at the political source.

The politicians must take some of the blame, but the bankers should
accept some too.

[EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)]

Poetic Justice wrote:
> EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) wrote;
>
>> I think the main portion of the problem in
>> such cases is that many laymen don't
>> understand what "adjustable rate
>> mortgage" MEANS.
>
> Do you think if they went for a job and the employer said we pay an
> 'adjustable wage rate' which now is $X/hr they would not question that?

Probably they would, but I suspect qa few would even ignore that!

>
> The 3 big questions when applying for a mortgage are;
> Down payment, interest rate and monthly payment amounts.
>
> An 'adjustable rate mortgage' is not some legal doublespeak lingo, it is
> pretty self explainatory...it's *adjustable* Up or Down.

You know that, and I know that, but some people are so convinced they
"don't understand finance" that they expect everything to be explained
to them. Also, haven't you noticed how many people are reluctant to ask
questions, when they don't understand something? They are afraid of
being thought ignorant, even though they are. (I used to have a placard
on my office wall: "Don't be afraid to ask dumb questions - they're a
lot easier to handle than dumb mistakes.")