Space ratio
Shazinz
ratio on the ship? And where I could find the statistics?
I would assume this equation would give a hint on how crowded a full ship would
be.
Thanks for any help,
Shaz
Ray Goldenberg
>Is there a certain word or term that would describe the per passenger/space
>ratio on the ship? And where I could find the statistics?
Hi,
This is called the Passenger Space Ratio. It can be based on 2
passengers per cabin or all berths. It is available in guides such as
the Berlitz Complete Guide to Cruising and Cruise Ships.
Any more questions, just ask!
Best regards,
Ray
LIGHTHOUSE TRAVEL
800-719-9917 or 805-566-3905
http://www.lighthousetravel.com
diane5511
says...
Space ratio is easy to define, but difficult to use.
For cruise ships, it is gross registered tonnage divided by the "total"
passenger capacity --- measured by multiplying the number of cabins by two.
It does not take into account ships that sail routinely with greater than 100%
on board. For example. 1000 cabins X 2 = 2000 passengers, but with 400 "extra"
upper bunks and sofa bunks, a ship may have 2400 on board if it is full.
PSR would be measured like this. 100000 grt/2000 passengers equals 50 for a psr
of 50:1.
Another ship may have 100000 grt/3000 passengers (1500 cabins) for a psr of
33.33:1 which tells you it is "more crowded" than the 50:1 ship.
This may not be the case though, since grt is measured in Volume, not area. If
a ship has a HUGE atrium, that is lots of volume but little area. (How can you
stand or sit on the open space on all those decks with the soaring atrium?)
You can use it to compare similar ships.
For example, Carnival Spirit, 2100 passengers in 84,000 grt for a psr of 40:1.
New HAL Vista ship, 1800 passengers in 84,000 grt for a psr of 46.67:1.
Less passengers in the same "space".
Generally, psr's greater than 40 are considered good. But on ships like Voyager
all that space in the ice rink and the promenade, all that "air space" counts so
the ship will feel more crowded.
Confusing, isn't it?
Diane
Tom & Linda
Berths Filled.
For what it's worth, I've found that larger ships with 3400+ people feel
much more claustrophobic than mid size ships with 2000 people, even
though they have similar ratios.
--Tom
Ray Goldenberg
<TKAN...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>Berlitz DOES have the figures for both "100% double occupancy", and All
>Berths Filled.
Hi Tom,
Yes it does.
Any more easy questions, just ask!
Lee Schwartzberg
> Is there a certain word or term that would describe the per passenger/space
> ratio on the ship? And where I could find the statistics?
you could go to www.cruiseopinion.com. they have space/passenger ratios
for all the ships, and passenger reviews. very handy site, I think.
Lee
j.o.boyle
Gross tonnage divided by passenger capacity.
Under 35 is bad~~over 40 is good.
Anyway, that is what I copied down and recorded for myself years ago.
Jean<~~~~~hope I have it down right!
"Shazinz" <sha...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010827151611...@mb-cc.aol.com...
TRACY A CROSS
Here's what Berlitz says:
10 or below - Extremely cramped
10 to 20 - Moderate to high density
20 to 30 - Reasonably spacious
30 to 50 - Very spacious
50 and above - The ultimate
Tracy
"j.o.boyle" <j.o....@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:skOy7.114352$3d2.3...@bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Raoul Fiebig
> ratio on the ship? And where I could find the statistics?
> I would assume this equation would give a hint on how crowded a full ship
would
> be.
>
> Thanks for any help,
> Shaz
>
Hi Shaz!
You get the space ratio if you devide a ship's gross tonnage by its passenger
capacity.
Please note, however, that the space ratio only gives a very rough indication
of the spaciousness of a cruise ship. This is due to its strange definition.
The gross tonnage of a ship inlcudes all enclosed spaces of the ship, including
the engine / boiler rooms, crew accommodations etc.
It is obvious that an older cruise ship usually has a far larger engine /
boiler room than a brand-new ship of the same size, making it less spacious
than the newer one. Yet, the space ratio (given the two ships have the same
size and carry the same number of passengers) is identical for both ships. This
is only one of several possible examples. It is simply beyond me why the space
ratio is calculated using the gross tonnage instead of the net tonnage, which
would give a much better indication, as the net tonnage includes passenger
spaces (cargo spaces on cargo ships) only.
Regards from Germany,
Raoul Fiebig
E-Mail: <firstname>DOT<lastname>@gmx.net
"Das Ruderhaus": http://www.ruderhaus.de/
"CruiseReviews.com": http://www.cruisereviews.com/
"Cruisin' ": http://www.stutt.com/cruising/home.html
Tracy Cross
Actually (and I hate to sound like I teach the subject) but... 1 GRT = 100
cubic feet of enclosed, revenue-earning space within a ship. Which means
that the outside pool areas, crew quarters, engine room, bridge, etc are not
included in the total Gross Registered Tonnage. I just had this question on
one of my Accredited Cruise Counselor tests. Oh yes, and I got it right.
Tracy
Warren H. Davis
in another response.
I've been on small ships with a fairly low PSR, and megaliners with a
fairly high one, and felt less cramped on the smaller ship. Why?
Because a LOT of the PSR is the open air of the atrium, three deck
high showroom, and double decked restaurants. I wonder what the PSR
would be if atria were removed from the calculation?
Warren
"TRACY A CROSS" <ma...@flash.net> wrote in message news:<K6Py7.11499$cc7.357...@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com>...
Raoul Fiebig
Hi Tracy!
I've had this discussion with Ray earlier this year, and he told me that CLIA
tells people the above *wrong* description for the gross tonnage. That
"revenue-earning space" definition is not correct and highly misleading!
Here's an excerpt from my posting from earlier this year:
>I'm sorry, but you're wrong here. I have a copy of the protocol summary
>of the "International Convention on Tonnage Measurement of Ships"
>here, and it does say that the gross tonnage "is the capacity of a
>vessel expressed in tonnage (tons of 100 cubic feet), without deductions."
>
>The net tonnage OTOH is "obtained by deducting from the gross tonnage
>the volume of certain spaces which cannot be utilized for the carriage of
>cargo or passengers, that is to say the space occupied by the engines,
>the crew's quarter, the stores, etc. It is the carrying capacity of a vessel
>expressed in tonnage tons of 100 cubic feet."
>
>And it is interesting that Ken Stutt was given exactly the same
>statements when he asked about tonnage measurement on a cruise
>last year. You can look this up at:
>http://www.stutt.com/cruising/f-tonnage.html .
>
>I don't know where your "enclosed revenue earning space" definition
>comes from, but the above is the official defintion (but without the
>mentioning of some compliacted factors that are based on sample
>calculations of a number of ships - and do not make much difference,
>but just an incredibly complicated calculation) by the IMO as passed by
>the International Convention on Tonnage Measurement of Ships in
>London in June, 1969.
I'd like to ask you the same question I asked Ray earlier this year: if the
CLIA definition of gross tonnage was correct, how would you define the term net
tonnage?
I really guess I will have to tell CLIA about their mistake. :o)
Terry Steinford
crew quarters and engineroom. Those spaces (and others) are deducted from the
gross tonnage to calculate the net tonnage.
I teach the subject.
Terry Steinford
Supervisory Marine Inspector
US Coast Guard Marine Safety Office Miami
Raoul Fiebig
>Whoever wrote that question on the test got it wrong. Gross tonnage includes
>crew quarters and engineroom. Those spaces (and others) are deducted from the
>gross tonnage to calculate the net tonnage.
>
>I teach the subject.
>
>Terry Steinford
Hi Terry!
You might want to tell CLIA. They seem to have it wrong in all of their
publications, as well. I wonder if this is by accident...
JopMo
"Terry Steinford" <t...@gate.net> wrote in message
news:3BCCE939...@gate.net...
> Whoever wrote that question on the test got it wrong. Gross tonnage
includes
> crew quarters and engineroom. Those spaces (and others) are deducted from
the
> gross tonnage to calculate the net tonnage.
>
> I teach the subject.
>
> Terry Steinford
> Supervisory Marine Inspector
> US Coast Guard Marine Safety Office Miami
Okay, great, an expert. Got a question for you then. What is the advantage
of using Gross or Net tonnage over Displaced tonnage? Seems to me displaced
tonnage would be the one and only true measure of ship size. Am I missing
something here?
JopMo
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Tracy Cross
I didn't mean to cause a fire storm here. I certainly think that Terry
Steinford is right. Who else can match his credentials. However, the CLIA
2001 Cruise Manual is wrong. So are every other book that I have. Maybe
European and American terms are different. Hmm, I wonder if I should I call
CLIA and tell them to deduct a few points from my test results? Ha!
Happy cruising,
Tracy