History of Toy-Related Newsgroups (LONG)
Eric G. Myers
Below is something I started a while back for inclusion on my web page.
Since the memory of Usenet history is so short and emphemeral, I thought
it would be nice to document this kind of stuff for the average reader.
Let me know if anyone has any additions or corrections.
Thanks,
EGM
A BRIEF HISTORY OF TOY-RELATED USENET NEWSGROUPS
Eric G. Myers - Copyright 1996
LEGO & MISC
It all began with Lego(r).
In early 1993, an alt.* group was created for the discussion of Lego(r)
construction toys. The group, alt.toys.lego thrived almost immediately
and after only 9 months of existence, plans were made to propose a more
widely propagated rec.* group of similar content. In October of 1993,
the first proposal was drafted for rec.toys.lego.
The proposal for rec.toys.lego, written by David Koblas, also included a
provision for the creation of rec.toys.misc. The proposal called for the
creation of an entirely new hierarchy: rec.toys.*. As was the convention
of the day, the miscellaneous group was added to serve as a "catch-all"
for all non-Lego(r) related toy discussion. Though not the primary focus
of the proposal, rec.toys.misc would soon become an active part of the
rec.toys.* hierarchy.
Interestingly, rec.toys.lego was almost called rec.toys.construction.
Some felt that this would be a broader name and would lead to more
inclusive discussion. However, David Koblas stuck to his guns. His
original intention was wider distribution of the alt.toys.lego group. He
felt that the name alt.toys.construction wouldn't be quite as appealing
to Lego(r) enthusiasts, especially since alt.toys.lego would still be an
active group. When the Call For Vote was issued, the name remained
rec.toys.lego. The charter was as follows:
rec.toys.lego charter:
----------------------
To provide a forum for the discussion of all things and experiences
relating to the Lego(tm), Duplo(tm) and compatible construction toys.
Including interesting models that one has built, experiences one has
had using legos, or questions about how to build particular
components.
The original charter for rec.toys.misc is somewhat humorous in
retrospect. It originally read:
rec.toys.misc charter:
----------------------
To provide a forum for discussion of non-Lego toy topics, from
Barbi <sic> Dolls to My Little Pony gift sets.
Of course, these topics were not to be the focus of the rec.toys.misc
group in actuality, but it is interesting to see how the group was
defined in relation to the Lego(r) group.
In the final Call for Votes, the charter was changed to the current
version:
rec.toys.misc charter:
----------------------
To provide a forum for discussion of topics relating to toys which do
not have their own specific news group in the rec.toys.* hierarchy.
It was this charter that was to set the stage for most of the other
group creations that occurred within the rec.toys.* hierarchy. Topics
were typically weeded out of rec.toys.misc.
On January 3, 1994, the results of the voting were announced. Both
rec.toys.lego and rec.toys.misc passed by substantial margins.
rec.toys.{lego,misc} vote results - 243 valid votes
Yes No : 2/3? >100 : Pass? : Group
219 20 : Yes Yes : Yes : rec.toys.lego
211 18 : Yes Yes : Yes : rec.toys.misc
The toy groups really blossomed in their first few months of creation.
Very soon, rec.toys.misc began to receive more posts per day than
rec.toys.lego. The morass of various topics discussed in rec.toys.misc
was the motivation for the first proposed split of the fledgling
hierarchy.
FISHER-PRICE
As an interesting footnote, Fisher-Price toys have the distinction of
being the first suggested split for the rec.toys.* hierarchy (though not
the first official proposal). On March 9, 1994, Sandra Flor submitted a
request for the creation of a group to be called either rec.toys.fp or
rec.toys.fisher-price. However, Ms. Flor did not submit a valid proposal
(only a request) and the idea was never followed up.
CARS
On January 22, 1995, almost a year to the day after the creation of the
rec.toys.* hierarchy, the first official split proposal was presented.
The proposal was for a group to be named rec.toys.cars. Written by Serg
Palanov, the proposal was meant to give toy car collectors of all
stripes a place of their own. Posts dealing with diecast cars had become
a significant part of the rec.toys.misc group and constituted a fairly
homogeneous topic area. Thus, the proposal for rec.toys.cars was born.
The charter of the rec.toys.cars group underwent some changes during the
proposal process. Originally, the charter read:
CHARTER:
rec.toys.cars will be an unmoderated forum for discussion of various
collectible toy cars, accessories, related articles,stories, trades,
wants, and sales of related items.
This group will encompass but in no way be limited to:
Hotwheels Lledo
Matchbox Dinky
Johny Lightning Majorette
Tomica Racing Champions
Micromachines Ertl
Bburago Corgi
and any other toy car and related manufacturers.
This lengthy and specific charter was trimmed down to its more generic
and inclusive final format by the time the Call For Votes was issued.
The final version reads:
CHARTER
Rec.toys.cars will be an unmoderated group for the discussion of toy
cars, including: values, trading, selling, buying, locating new and
old items, updates on upcoming events and new releases, and history as
well as collectability of toy cars and their related items. The group
will mainly focus on, but in no way be limited to, diecast toy cars.
On May 3, 1995 the result of the vote was announced. The new newsgroup
rec.toys.cars had passed by a narrow margin, 122:15. Because of the
Usenet new group creation rule that a vote must have by 100 more YES
votes than NO votes to pass, only 8 more NO votes would have sunk
rec.toys.cars. This was the smallest margin of victory for any of the
toy-related newsgroups.
DOLLS & STAR WARS
March of 1995 was a busy month for toys on the Usenet. Two new proposals
were presented that had relevance for the rec.toys.* hierarchy as well
as several other existing hierarchies. On March 7, 1995 Leigh Melton
unveiled a proposal for rec.collecting.dolls. The very next day, Gus
Lopez brought forth his ambitious reorganization of the
rec.arts.sf.starwars hierarchy that would eventually result in
the group rec.arts.sf.starwars.collecting. Although both of these
proposals were for groups outside the rec.toys.* hierarchy, much of what
was to be discussed in these groups would be toy-related.
In the case of rec.collecting.dolls, posts were scattered among the
rec.collecting and rec.toys.misc groups as well as several mailing list
devoted to collecting dolls. It was felt that the rec.collecting
hierarchy was the appropriate venue for this new group to distinguish is
from the toys newsgroups that did not focus exclusively on collecting
for collecting's sake. The charter for the group was as follows:
CHARTER:
rec.collecting.dolls is proposed as an unmoderated discussion group
for those interested in collecting dolls for both amusement and
investment. Discussion of fashion dolls, vinyl dolls, cloth dolls and
any other type of doll or doll accessory will be welcome.
On May 25, 1995 the vote result for rec.collecting.dolls was announced.
The group had passed easily by a margin of 248 to 20. Almost immediately
after its creation, rec.collecting dolls became an active and popular
group.
The path for Gus Lopez's reorganization of the Star Wars groups was far
more ambitious. Star Wars has always been a popular subject on the
Usenet and many felt that a partitioning of subjects within the general
topic would be beneficial to futhering discussions. Gus Lopez (assisted
by David Kemper, the original moderator of the info group) proposed the
creation of three new groups and the renaming of the existing group to
comprise a new hierarchy consisting of four groups. Originally, these
groups were proposed as:
rec.arts.starwars.collecting
rec.arts.starwars.games
rec.arts.starwars.info
and
rec.arts.starwars.misc (renaming rec.arts.sf.starwars)
Note the absence of the "sf" in the group names. This point of the
proposal was somewhat contentious and was ultimately changed to its
final format in a second draft of the proposal (March 22, 1995). With
the "sf" added back to all the group names, the proposal with these four
groups was put to a vote:
rec.arts.sf.starwars.collecting
rec.arts.sf.starwars.games
rec.arts.sf.starwars.info
and
rec.arts.sf.starwars.misc (renaming rec.arts.sf.starwars)
Of these four groups, the rec.arts.sf.starwars.collecting newsgroup was
to focus on toys as well as other Star Wars collectibles. The charter
for that group was as follows:
CHARTER:
This newsgroup will be open to discussion of all issues and topics
pertaining to Star Wars collectibles: toys, posters, cards, ceramics,
etc. This could include information about available collectibles and
wanted/for-sale posts relating to Star Wars collectibles.
On May 23, 1995 the voting results of this massive reorganization were
announced. All groups had passed by a landslide with
rec.arts.sf.starwars.collecting passing by a margin of 351 to 27.
VINTAGE
On January 2, 1996 Tom Rhone proposed what was to become the most
discussed split to date: rec.toys.vintage. The group was proposed to
give classic toy enthusiasts a place to discuss their interests without
having to compete with posts dealing with contemporary toys. However,
there were numerous points of debate regarding such issues as how the
group should be named, how the scope of the group should be defined and
how the charter should read.
The evolution of the charter gives only a hint of how the discussion
proceeded. Originally the charter was drafted to read:
CHARTER: rec.toys.vintage
An unmoderated newsgroup which would provide a world wide
forum for the discussion of all aspects of vintage toys.
To spread knowledge, and enjoyment, anywhere on the
internet, surrounding the collecting and discussion of
vintage toys.
To provide a forum for the discussion of all interests
surrounding vintage toys, who's audience grows daily.
END CHARTER.
Many felt that that this was too vague and needed more clarity in both
definition and scope. One of the main points of contention was the plan
to define "vintage" as anything 20 years or older. This "rolling
timeline" definition presented a potential problem in that the group's
subject material would be constantly "rolling over" as each new year
passed. Despite the objections of some, the group went to a vote with
the following charter:
CHARTER: rec.toys.vintage
The purpose of rec.toys.vintage is to provide a medium for
those interested in expressing, sharing and exchanging their
views, ideas and feelings about the collecting of vintage toys.
For purposes of this newsgroup, a "vintage" toy is defined
as a toy or game about 20 years or older which is valued as
memorabilia or for historical value rather than for its "play
value."
Discussions encouraged in this newsgroup include;
- Any type toy or game about 20 years or older
- Toy restoration
- Toy display
- Rarity and value of particular toys
- Original contents and parts of toys and games
- Wanted to buy posts
- For sale posts
- Wanted to Swap posts
- Toy company histories
- Changing marketplace values of particular toys
- Determining factors on value fluctuations
- Vintage toy show dates, locations and reviews
It is unacceptable to disuss toys that are not "vintage",
as defined above, or any other irrelavant topics.
END CHARTER.
This is the longest charter of all the toy-related newsgroups to date.
There was yet another controversy with the announcement of the voting
results for rec.toys.vintage. On February 22, 1996 the first result
announcement stated that the group had failed, 109:16. However, due to a
problem with the voting software used to tabulate votes, some votes were
not counted. A second, corrected result announcement was released and
this time rec.toys.vintage had passed by a margin of 178:56.
Rec.toys.vintage has the dubious distinction of receiving the most NO
votes of any rec.toys.* proposal to date. Despite all the controversy,
rec.toys.vintage has a faithful following and remains a group with
moderate traffic and no apparent problems.
ACTION FIGURES
On April 8, 1996 the proposal for rec.toys.action-figures was formally
announced. Over the course of its two year history, rec.toys.misc had
become an extremely high traffic group with an average of well over 200
posts per day. The proposal, written by Eric G. Myers (EGM), was
designed to separate out what had become the dominant topic of
rec.toys.misc: Action Figures.
There were two main points of discussion prior to the formal proposal
process. The first involved whether a marketplace group should be
proposed at the same time (or in place of the action-figure group
altogether). The second issue was one of naming. Some felt that it
would be prudent and future-oriented to add a .misc at the end of the
group name to anticipate any future splits without necessitating a
renaming. However, a straw poll held by Pam Green helped to resolve
these issues. The straw poll showed mixed support for the marketplace
idea and general dislike of the ".misc" apellation.
And so the group rec.toys.action-figures was formally proposed with the
following charter:
CHARTER: rec.toys.action-figures
Rec.toys.action-figures is an unmoderated newsgroup for the
discussion of action figure toys and related accessories. The scope of
discussion within this group includes action figures, as well as action
figure playsets, vehicles and other accessories intended for use with
action figures. The types of posts within this group may include (but
not be limited to) posts of news, release dates, collecting,
customizing, and reviews related to action figures and their
accessories. Until the creation of a more appropriate forum, posts
related to the buying, selling, and/or trading of action figures and
related toys are acceptable in this group. Crossposting to other
rec.toys.* groups is discouraged.
END CHARTER.
On June 13, 1996 the voting results were announced and
rec.toys.action-figures had passed by a margin of 137:20. Currently,
rec.toys.action-figures has the highest average daily traffic of all the
rec.toys.* groups (rec.toys.misc is a close second).
ALT GROUPS
The nature of the alt.* hierarchy makes recording its history more
difficult. There are several alt.* groups that deal with toy-related
topics. Most notable of these are alt.toys.gi-joe,
alt.toys.transformers, and alt.food.pez. Although these groups receive
sparser propagation than the rec.toys.* groups, the alt.* groups still
thrive. To date, no attempts have been made to move these groups over to
the more widely propagated rec.* hierarchy. However, this remains a
possibility for
the future.
If anyone has more detailed information regarding the alt.* groups
related to toys, please contact me at emy...@utmdacc.mda.uth.tmc.edu or
e...@worldnet.att.net.
THE FUTURE
The future looks rosy for the toy-related newsgroups. The opportunity
for new newsgroups exists in several forms. As previously mentioned,
there is always the possibility of moving the existing alt.* groups over
to the rec.* hierarchy. Without question, the idea that gets the most
discussion is the idea of some type of marketplace group.
However, there are many issues that need to be resolved before any
marketplace proposal could be successfully launched. Not the least of
these is the issue of where to place any marketplace group(s) within the
existing hierarchy (or potentially even creating a separate
sub-hierarchy). Informal discussions will undoubtedly continue.
The existing toy groups are all healthy and thriving. It appears that
toy discussions will be a fixture on the Usenet for a long time to come.
EGM - Copyright 1996
References for specific proposals:
rec.toys.lego & rec.toys.misc:
ftp.uu.net/usenet/news.announce.newgroups/rec/rec.toys
rec.toys.cars:
ftp.uu.net/usenet/news.announce.newgroups/rec/rec.toys.cars
rec.toys.fisher-price:
ftp.uu.net/usenet/news.announce.newgroups/rec/rec.toys.fisher-price
rec.toys.vintage:
ftp.uu.net/usenet/news.announce.newgroups/rec/rec.toys.vintage
rec.toys.action-figures:
ftp.uu.net/usenet/news.announce.newgroups/rec/rec.toys.action-figures
rec.collecting.dolls:
ftp://ftp.uu.net/usenet/news.announce.newgroups/rec/rec.collecting.dolls
rec.arts.sf.starwars.collecting (Star Wars reorganization):
ftp.uu.net/usenet/news.announce.newgroups/rec/rec.arts.sf.starwars-reorg
--
|\ The Raving Toy Maniac Page: Surf the World Wide Toybox! /|
| \ http://www.mdacc.tmc.edu/~neuro/eric/rtm/rtm.html / |
| \ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ NEW URL ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ / |
|e...@worldnet.att.net / Eric G. Myers / emy...@utmdacc.mda.uth.tmc.edu|