[Life Liberty & Levin] Basketball legend Rick Barry: Keep politics out of sports

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https://video.foxnews.com/v/6043845417001/#sp=show-clips

MARK LEVIN, HOST: Hello, America, I'm Mark Levin. This is "Life, Liberty &
Levin." The great Rick Barry. How are you sir?

RICK BARRY, RETIRED PROFESSIONAL BASKETBALL PLAYER: Nice to see you.

LEVIN: Nice to see you. Basketball Hall of Fame '87. Twelve all-star teams.
How many years did you play?

BARRY: Sixty five to eighty, but I sat out one year that's when I kind of
opened up the door. I was kind of Curt Flood before Curt Flood challenged the
reserve clause, sat out a year and then went to the ABA for four years and
then went back to the NBA.

LEVIN: And most year career in the NBA was with Golden State.

BARRY: Yes. And boy, are they going good right now?

LEVIN: Well, no offense, you didn't have all those power players around you
that they have now, right?

BARRY: No, it's a little different world what's happening today. Just -- I
mean, I just joke and say, "Yes, they just forgot three zeros on my contract
when I played $12,500.00," I was offered as a second player in the draft. No
guaranteed contracts. It's a unique situation to watch things evolve over the
years and how things change. But that happens in everything.

I mean, when you got the first great big TVs, right? They cost a fortune, and
then the prices went out. In this case, it was the reverse. The prices were
low and now the price has gone up.

LEVIN: But you were a tremendous basketball player. You were some people
called you an offensive juggernaut and you were and you're almost a no miss
shooter at the foul line. You're a perfectionist in many ways.

You expressed yourself in ways that people would get their attention, you
still do. But let me ask you this about sports today. Guys are paid an
enormous amount of money. You just missed it. I mean, I often wonder about
the great players today who just missed it. You, I think about guys like Mike
Schmidt, even Willie Mays, a generation back, you might have been
unaffordable?

BARRY: Well, I think they could have got me for a lot less than what they are
paying these guys now. I mean, I just think if I was 30 years old today and
have a five-year contract worth $200-plus million, which I can't even relate
to.

But hey, you know, things change. The money is there. Television has just
changed everything dramatically and all the marketing that the NBA does on a
worldwide basis. So the money is there.

I just think that sometimes, the players -- I mean, the owners get a little
carried away by paying so much money for certain guys and some of the other
guys are like short-changed.

In fact, the lowest paid guy in the NBA this year, counting NBA properties
and moneys that they'll get will probably make two times as much as I made in
the best year that I ever had. And you know, God bless them. I'm hoping my
youngest son, Canyon, who is the fifth of my boys to play professional
basketball. He played on the Timberwolves G League team and is now
representing the United States in the world championships on three on three,
he made that team, hopefully he'll get a chance to play there.

And what I did, in being the pioneer and kind of changing things and opening
up the door for some of the big salaries that he'll be able to benefit from
it.

A couple of my other boys did. They made a lot of money playing basketball.
It's been remarkable. Basketball has been incredible for me in my life and my
family and to have five boys to get Division 1 college scholarships and all
five to play professional basketball, the odds on that are just off the
charts.

LEVIN: Let me ask you this about sports today. I mean, I watched a lot of
sports, especially when I was young -- basketball, baseball, football. I
don't remember so much politics in sports and mostly liberal politics in
sports. Am I wrong?

BARRY: No, you're absolutely right. In fact, it wasn't even something that
came up. And it's even something -- because I see your book sitting over
here. I mean, I have stories about the press, and you're so right on about
that.

The writers used to come out with the guys and go have a beer with them after
a game. I mean, now, they're all looking for the sensational story. They're
looking for what's happening in your life, what's happening outside of the
game. I mean, they don't just stick to the game.

I mean, these boycotts that we had for the Olympics. How unfair was that to
these athletes who spent so much time dedicating themselves to their sport to
qualify to be able to play in the Olympics? I know, it would have meant a
great deal to me. It's the one missing element of my career is that I didn't
make the Olympic team in '64.

I did get to wear a jersey one time, USA playing against the Soviet team in
Indianapolis when they came over for an exhibition game. And I know how proud
I felt -- I never felt the same way whenever the national anthem as I did
with that USA on my chest.

And so it's changed and politics should stay out of sports, it really should
stay totally completely out of sports. In fact, it should stay out of a lot
of things, even in personal relationships, it should stay out.

LEVIN: How about taking knees at football games? What do you think of that?

BARRY: Yes, there's a time and a place for everything. Okay. And if you want
to have an opportunity to demonstrate about something or to express your
opinion about something, the time is not to do it while you're being paid at
your job. I really do believe that and you know, certainly they're entitled
to do that but again, a time and a place for everything.

LEVIN: Let me ask you this, you were an early Trump supporter, weren't you?

BARRY: Well, it's not so much of a Trump supporter, it is the fact that I
have always felt, and I've been through a lot of different Presidents because
you know, I'm getting up there and age, I always vote for the person who I
think is going to do what's right for the people and the country.

The problem that exists in this country, if you are reasonably intelligent,
you can figure it out, is that people do what's right for their party.
They're more concerned about their party and the power that their party has
as opposed to whether it's right for the country and the people.

And if we just went on that basis alone, what's best for the country, and the
people, we would be a lot better off. So I voted for Democrats, I voted for
Republicans. I do lean conservative. There's no question about that.

But it's to the point where it has an impact on your life. I lost a speaking
engagement I was supposed to do because a writer asked me about all this
craziness with Trump and the collusion and everything. I'm coaching in the
Big Three, which is a lot of fun. Ice Cube put that together, and I'm really
enjoying that.

And he's talking about Trump and I said, "Listen, can't you just let this
thing rest? I mean, it's like beating a dead horse. Why are you talking to me
about this now?" I said, "What's going on here and all of the scrutiny that
Donald Trump is going on, this should never happen to any President."

And so he wrote a story and it came out as if I was a big Trump supporter.
And I was supposed to go and speak for this company in San Francisco. And
obviously, it turned out that they were liberal. And they canceled my
appearance to talk to their people who I thought -- I had a good message for
their employees -- but they canceled it because they said that I was for
Trump. So it's so foolish. Why let things like that impact your whole life?

LEVIN: Did you vote for him?

BARRY: Yes, I did. Because I thought he was going to do the best for the
people and the country. And I think he's trying to do that.

LEVIN: You think he's doing a good job?

BARRY: So far, yes. I mean, some of the things he does, like my wife says,
"Sonny, I love your honesty, you've got to get the brutality out of this and
put the filter on."

LEVIN: How about you?

BARRY: Donald has no filter yet. Donald has no filter. He just says what he
wants to say, and I just say, "Oh, well Donald, you need to listen to what my
wife told me sometime." But he is at least attempting to do what's right for
the country.

I mean, just look at all of the results that are there that the press seems
to know -- the press, which is basically more to the liberal side of things,
obviously, and majority of it. They don't want to give credit where credit is
due. And it's really unfortunate.

But the thing I like about him is that neither -- a lot of the Republicans
and certainly all the Democrats don't like him, because he's not a
politician. And he is disturbing the good old boy network.

LEVIN: That's one of the reasons you like him.

BARRY: That's one of the reasons why I voted for him. Yes.

LEVIN: You've had some dealings with the press. What about the sports media?
I'm no expert on the sports media. But my take is, again, they're very
liberal. In fact, they may even be more liberal than the regular media.

BARRY: Well, I don't know about that. But I do know that they're jealous -- a
lot of them of the players -- because of the money that they're making.
Although now a lot of those sports casters are making considerable amount of
money, a lot more than they did back to the old days.

As I said, they used to go out and go to dinner with you. But now they're
looking for the big story. But it happened to me in college, what can happen
with the press, you're right, you know, the fake news that we all hear about
now.

I talked to a writer, and he asked me the question, he said, "Rick, do you
hear the crowd yelling, 'shoot,' when you're playing?" I said, "Yes, I hear
them." I said, "But my attitude was when I played, I was attempting to find a
way to score, provided I didn't have a teammate in a better position. And I
would get the ball to him. And that's the way I was taught how to play the
game."

So the guy writes his whole story. The headline was like, "Rick, I hear the
crowd yell 'shoot,' so I shoot." So I told the writer after when he came back
to me, and I said, "Don't ever talk to me again." I said, "Because you only
put part of what I said in there. And you changed the entire meaning of what
I was trying to convey to you."

And so that was very disappointing to me and I learned a very valuable
lesson. I had that happen and approached it the same way. When a writer was
unfair to me and all I said, "I'm not talking to you anymore, because you're
not giving a fair interpretation," not interpretation, "but a fair report." I
stand on what it is that I actually was saying to you, you're putting your
own spin on it.

LEVIN: I remember as a Philadelphian watching the Philadelphia Phillies,
remember, Steve Carlton was burned a few times? He just stopped talking to
them right all together. It didn't hurt him in any way. He was one of the
greatest pitchers of all time.

How about now? Do you have a decent relationship with the media?

BARRY: Yes, well, they call me all the time, because I'm a good interview. I
mean, I actually know the game, I actually can speak reasonably intelligently
about it and express myself. And so I do a lot of radio interviews all the
time. And it actually works out nicely for me. I get to promote a lot of
things.

And so I use it. I've learned how to use and play the game. It's a game.
You've got to play the game. You have to learn what the rules are, first of
all, and sometimes you get burned until you learn the rules. And then once
you learn the rules, you play within those confines, and you can take
advantage of it actually.

LEVIN: But isn't the purpose of the press, whether it's sports, or actually,
even more importantly, the future the country is to provide the audience, the
fans, the American people with information so the American people can make
decisions on their own, sort of what you're talking about politics? Party
politics, and so forth.

And isn't it the case that the media, it leans heavily Democrat and liberal
today? I mean, you really have to be blind not to see it. Right?

BARRY: I would think so. In fact, so many things that go on in our government
today are an insult to my intelligence. I mean, seriously, how do you justify
a country that's so far in debt to borrow more money, and give it away to
countries that don't like you? And most of the money probably is going to get
into the hands of the leaders of the country, not getting to the people to
try to help them out.

And then we spend billions of dollars on people who aren't even supposed to
be in this country. And I know, we were founded on immigrants, I mean -- but
the people came over here and did it the proper way. And they took pride in
being a part of America.

And now we're spending billions of dollars and the way -- and I'm a big
supporter of the military. I live in Colorado Springs and have lived there 35
years. I don't -- I am not there to wonder now. But Fort Carson and I have a
lot of good military friends, the way that we treat our military or the
people who have helped to make this country what it is today is reprehensible
that we have these guys living out in the streets, what's happening at the
VAS, why don't we take this money that we're borrowing and giving away and
the money, billions we're spending on all of these immigrants and help our
own people out first?

LEVIN: And why aren't we?

BARRY: I don't know. That's the part that really bothers me. It really does
bother me that they can sit around and supposedly be doing their job
representing us, but then vote on things and pass things for their benefit.
And not go ahead and ask us, "Is it okay if we do this?" They just do it on
their own?

The same way with term limits. We have no term limits now. I mean, career
politics. I mean, that's what's happened. It used to be what? They came in,
they serve, they went back to their job. Now we have career politicians.

And I just think that there's something wrong with that system. But it's put
in place by the people who are there without asking our permission, when it's
supposed to be about what we, the people want, because they're supposedly
representing us. But yet they don't ask us.

LEVIN: On your immigration point, what about securing the border? And
building a wall?

BARRY: This is -- what do these people -- do they think we're stupid? I guess
they do. Because look at all the videos of all of these people. And I'm not
going to start mentioning names, we know who we're talking about, who are all
in support of a wall.

All of these people who are now against it. Why? Because it's Donald Trump
trying to get the wall built. But when it was other people and other
Presidents trying to get the wall, they were all for it. How conveniently
they forgot the fact that they were for it, but now all of a sudden, they're
not for it. What changed? What changed?

And where are all of the apologies coming from all of the people who were
talking about the collusion that was there and let's impeach our President
and get rid of him because they don't like him. Did we get an apology from
them when the report came out that there was no collusion? I haven't heard
one. Have you heard one?

LEVIN: I don't think we're going to get one.

BARRY: I don't think we are.

LEVIN: When we come back, I've got more on politics and sports. Should they
overlap? They seem to overlap a lot, with The Great Rick Barry.

Don't forget ladies and gentlemen, you can check me out on LevinTV, LevinTV,
most weeknights. Go to blazetv.com/mark; blazetv.com/mark and don't forget,
the biggest book in America right now. Number one, "Unfreedom of the Press."
We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEVIN: Rick Barry, the five greatest basketball players ever, other than
yourself. The five greatest.

BARRY: See, what I always do when people talk about that, I usually always
throw myself in there and pick the four that I would want to play with.

LEVIN: I just picked you.

BARRY: No, I say, I pick four that I would want to play with. But here's the
thing is that, to me, it's very difficult for me to think that anybody can
pick anybody other than Wilt Chamberlain. I mean, Wilt Chamberlain has done
things that they say records are made to be broken. Forget it. Fifty points a
game for an entire NBA season. You know how insane that is?

I mean, I averaged like 36-37 and I was saying, "Wait a second, I've got to
get 13 more game for 82 more games? I don't think so. And then his rebounding
totals, too. I mean, for his career, he averaged 22.5 rebounds a game. He was
a phenomenal athlete as well on top of that.

LEVIN: And he changed the sport.

BARRY: Yes, yes. I mean, he was spectacular. There's a lot of other great
centers, obviously who played the game, you know, Bill Russell. Bill Russell
had the most impact on a team winning championships with his defense and all.
But as far as -- when I talked about the players, I'm talking about overall
skills on both ends of the court in what a player could do at a level that
most people can't accomplish.

And so it has to be to me Wilt, at the position. See if I was playing though,
see, I take Russell as my power forward, block all the shots down. I don't
need him to score points, okay, because the other guys I have all can score
points.

LEVIN: You'll score the points.

BARRY: Yes, they can score the points. And then it used to be the two guards,
it would be Jerry West. But now, it's -- you know, you go with Michael
Jordan, obviously, you have to pick Michael Jordan. The three is a spot that
would be interesting now because you know, people talk about Bird and what
have you with the three where I played, but certainly you've gotten LeBron
James and you also have Kevin Durant.

And then you have Kobe Bryant. I mean, you had a lot of great players playing
there. And so you could have a real interesting debate about that as to who
would be the person that you'd pick there.

The point guard is probably one that you could have a real discussion about.
I mean, you go back to the old days of Cousy and what have you, but then you
come up and you have the Magic Johnson's of the world, you have the John
Stockton's, you have the -- who I'd love Steve Nash. I mean, he was amazing.
And Steph Curry now and what he is doing. There's so many great players.

But it's hard not to go with a six foot eight or nine inch point guard in
Magic Johnson, the things that he did. So that would probably be the choice
that I have to pick for that. And the four is another one that is an
intriguing one.

You know, do you go with somebody like the old days would be Bob Pettit would
be the guy that most people would pick. And then you go have a Karl Malone.
But then you have a Tim Duncan, and then you have a number of other players
that are playing that today who could conceivably be put into that category.

So it's not an easy thing to do and it's always good conversation to have.
But to me, it's about the overall skills. I mean, you can't have a glaring
weakness I don't think if you're a great player, you shouldn't have a glaring
weakness. You should be good at certain things and great at others.

LEVIN: May I ask you something? Are the big men today -- I mean 6'8", 6'9" 7
-footers. Let's put Chamberlain aside, are they better today than they were?

BARRY: I think nowadays, the seven footers all want to shoot threes. I mean,
Dirk Novitzky came over from overseas and started doing it. Now, Kevin Durant
is seven feet tall. He dwarfs me. Unbelievable player, but he plays like a
guard. I mean, he shoots the three, he goes to the basket. He has got the
mid-range shot. He can shoot the free throws, and now he's become a better
facilitator and creating things.

LEVIN: How do you stop him?

BARRY: You can't. he is indefensible. That's the problem. He is indefensible.
And the same thing, that's why the Warriors are so good. They have three
players that you can't really truly guard. They can drive, they can shoot
from threes, they can shoot from mid-range, and they're great free throw
shooters. And that's Klay, Steph and KD.

And so that's what makes them so incredible. And then they have you throw
into the mix, you know, Draymond Green, who just does things that a lot of
players have never done.

So it's amazing what's happened with the game and the transition that it has
taken. It's gotten to the point though, where it may be a little bit
overdone, too much of the threes. In fact, a lot of teams have lost. The
Warriors lost that championship to Cleveland in game seven, because it was
all three-point shooting in the last four minutes and 20 to 40 seconds of the
game. They took nothing but threes, and it cost them a chance to win the
championship in that year.

So like anything in life, you can't overdo it. Too much of anything is really
not good.

LEVIN: Who is the greatest player right now?

BARRY: There isn't. That's the whole thing. See, a lot of people come up and
they talk about, "Hey, LeBron is the greatest. Kevin is the greatest." In a
team sport, there is no such thing as the greatest player. There's the
greatest player at his position. Because the skills required to play each
position are different, even though it's getting to the point where the one
twos and threes kind of do similar type things, but it's still different.

And there's still certain skills that you have to have to play those
positions. It would be ludicrous to be able to compare Magic Johnson to Wilt
Chamberlain. I mean, you can't do that.

And so you pick the best players at their position. Same in baseball, are you
going to pick Sandy Koufax over Willie Mays? I mean, going back where you
watch those guys play? No, you can't do that. It has to be by position.

LEVIN: Do you keep in touch with a lot of these basketball players? Not just
the ones that were on your team, but the ones that were in the league at the
same time?

BARRY: Well, I see them and the nice thing about coaching in the Big Three,
Ice Cube's league is that I get to see a lot of these guys. I get to see
George Gervin, "The Iceman" who I love and we actually do a lot of fishing
together. That's one of my new passions in life. I've actually put trips
together to go fishing, especially up in Alaska. But it's such a thrill to
get that strike and set that hook. And it's a skill. So fly fishing is an art
form. So I love doing that.

And I get to see these guys, but it's not, you know, other than my teammates,
I don't keep in touch with a lot of them. I got to know Jerry West quite well
and played actually in his Member-Guest Golf Tournament. But it's not like I
see them on a regular basis and have a super close friend from another team.

The close friends I have are the guys like Clifford Ray, like starting center
on our championship team. He is like a brother to me. And I see him all the
time. We fish together, we spend a lot of time together. And it's great.
That's the beauty of a team.

See, at golf, tennis. Who do you share your success with? Your coach, your
family, but they weren't doing it with you, were they? In basketball, we were
a family. We were together. When we get together, it's awesome.

LEVIN: I think that's a good point. Because you also said in politics, forget
about the parties. Do what you need to do for the people.

BARRY: Right.

LEVIN: But in basketball, you say, team.

BARRY: Right.

LEVIN: Team first.

BARRY: Right.

LEVIN: It's absolutely crucial. Forget about the fans. I mean, don't blow
them off, but it's not what the fans want. It's what the teams want. Totally
different, right?

BARRY: Oh, for sure. I mean, but it is a situation that you owe -- what I
tell people when you're playing, you owe your best effort. As my father told
me, "Son, always give your best effort in everything you do." One of the
greatest lessons I had in life. And so you owe it to yourself, first and
foremost, so that you can be happy with yourself as a person knowing you
always gave your best effort and never be afraid to fail because that's the
quickest way to learn how to do something right.

Then you also owe it to -- you owe it to the owner, because he's paying you.
Someone is paying you, you owe them your best effort. And then to the fans
who are supporting you, and there for you and to your teammates. I mean, so
you owe it to all those people.

But first and foremost, it should be to yourself, and you have to feel good.
When I talk to kids, that's one of the messages I give them is that you want
to be able to put your head on your pillow at night and sleep comfortably
knowing you gave your best effort that day. Even if it didn't work, even if
you failed at what you were doing because that helps make you a better
person.

And then along with that, find something -- you have a passion in life for.
Because then you don't work for a living. You could say you're doing work, I
didn't. I played basketball. I thought -- I played the sport that I just love
and still love to this day and wish I could still be playing it. And someone
paid me. I got paid to do what I love to do. That's not a job.

LEVIN: We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

AISHAH HASNIE, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Live from "America's News
Headquarters," I'm Aishah Hasnie. The Pentagon is asking the White House to
stop politicizing the military. That request comes after the Trump
administration ordered that the Navy ship honoring the late Senator John
McCain be hidden from Mr. Trump's view during his visit to Japan last week.

A defense official says, acting Defense Secretary Patrick Shanahan is now
considering sending out formal guidance to military units in order to avoid
similar incidents in the future.

Still no clear motive behind Friday's mass shooting at a municipal building
in Virginia Beach. Today, police confirming that the gunman who worked for
the city had not been fired from his job, and his employer was not in the
process of firing him. Twelve people died, four others injured. The gunman
was killed in a shootout with police.

I'm Aishah Hasnie, now back to LIFE, LIBERTY & LEVIN.

LEVIN: Rick Barry, I want to circle back to politics a little bit.

BARRY: Oh good. My favorite subject.

LEVIN: Your favorite subject. You say you lean conservative?

BARRY: Yes.

LEVIN: I'm not trying to put you on the spot.

BARRY: No, it's okay. I might have to filter on you.

LEVIN: Your wife will be pleased. You think Trump is doing a pretty good job.

BARRY: Just look at the record. Anybody that could say he hasn't done a
decent job is lying. I mean, it's that simple.

LEVIN: What do you think about the number of these Democrats lining up
running for President and their views about the Green New Deal, which is
really sort of an evisceration of capitalism? Or they're arguing let's get
rid of I.C.E. or Medicare-for-All which is to destroy Medicare all together.
They're pretty radical, aren't they?

BARRY: Yes, yes. They really are, and even to the point of absurdity. I mean,
so how am I going to get the Hawaii?

LEVIN: Swim.

BARRY: Yes, I'm not that good. I mean, it's really silly. I mean, just think
about it. I mean, you have some people there that are actually almost being
like they are spokespersons, and yet they have no background and no
credibility whatsoever. It's kind of like when I listen to some of these
talking heads on TV with sports and I did a lot of radio sports talk as well
and they always bring up, "You're not going to bring up, 'you didn't play the
sport' on me, are you?"

And I said -- you know, play that card. I said, "Of course, I'm going to play
that card." Because I don't care how much you follow the sport, how much
you've been involved in the sport, if you didn't play the sport at the
highest level, your credibility is not what it should be.

And they have people who are out there talking about things what they think
should happen, and look at their credentials. They have none. Zero. And I'll
give you an example of how crazy it is and what turned me off the politics.
You'll love this one.

So when I'm playing with the Warriors. I was very successful, obviously. So
I'm at a party and I had the good fortune, I know you worked with the Reagan
administration. I got to meet Ronald Reagan who was governor of California.
And it was really a thrill and an honor. I loved him. He was a great guy.

So I met him. I still have actually a handwritten nice little note from him.
And so I'm at a party, and the Speaker of the House at the time, Jesse Unruh,
he comes up to me. He says "Rick, you ought to run for politics, run for
office." I said, "What are you talking about, Jesse?" I said, "I'm playing
basketball." He said, "No, no, seriously, with your popularity and
everything. You can get elected."

"Jess, I'm playing basketball." He said, "No, no, don't worry about it." I
said, "But I have to be at the game." He said, "No, no, no, it's okay. If you
win, you don't have to be there." I said, "What?" Can you imagine this? You
can get elected, but you don't have to be there.

Wow. Please. I mean, seriously, that turned me off so much to politics right
then. And from that point on, I said, "Oh, boy, I've got to watch out for
what's going on here.

LEVIN: But with all of these people running? They're not there.

BARRY: They have no credentials. They have no credibility. Why would anybody
vote for most of them? Seriously?

LEVIN: A lot of people might.

BARRY: Well, they might. Well, you know.

LEVIN: You think there's a problem in the country?

BARRY: There is a serious problem in our country.

LEVIN: What is it?

BARRY: The people don't understand, they don't take the time. They're just
happy to live their lives and they really don't take the time to read about
what's going on, to really understand what's happening with our government,
to really understand the ways that we have and how we squander money, as I
talked about, with the immigration and the money, we spend the billions of
dollars there. It's just so foolish.

And it's -- I don't know how you can change it, seriously, I really don't.
But it's very sad. And then they're bombarded on TV all the time with the
opinions of people talking about what they think is right what they think is
wrong, whether they know -- in their minds, they know that it's not the right
thing, but it's the right thing for their party. So they say what they have
to say.

And then as I said before, you get no apologies, when it proves that what
they said was totally erroneous. It's insulting to me, it really truly is
insulting. I'm a reasonably intelligent man. And what happens there, it just
insults me to the point that I don't even like to get involved.

In fact, when I meet someone and I do it, I try to say, "Well, where do you
lean? Which way do you lean?" I say, "Okay, great. If we're going to be
friends, we can't talk politics." Because you get into so many things. And
it's just not worth it.

I mean, a friendship and a relationship could be great, and politics should
have no impact on it. And unfortunately, it does, like we were talking about
how it has an impact on sports. That's not the place for it. Let sports be
sports. Let everyday life be everyday life. And let politics be politics.

What's the thing? You know how it became? Where did it come from? Polly and
tics? Okay, and we might have to get into that. Yeah, boy, I'll tell you,
it's a tough subject with me. It really, truly is.

LEVIN: But you say you're fairly conservative?

BARRY: Yes.

LEVIN: Where does that come from?

BARRY: My father, probably.

LEVIN: And tell us about him, why?

BARRY: My father just was, you know, a person that just believed in that you
are -- what you do. Here is life, it's about -- nowadays, it's entitlement.
The thing I was brought up was "Son, the only thing you're entitled to in
life is what you earn. Put the work ethic in. Do what you have to do to be
successful."

And to me, that's kind of conservative. I mean, you know, I'm not looking for
a handout. I'm not looking for something. I get what I deserve by putting the
time and the effort into it. And I think that's, you know, being a
conservative person. A liberal person wants to you know, give things away, do
this, do that.

And yet so many of them are talking about doing it and you talk about the
walls and let's go look at the houses of the people that are against it,
where do they live? Some of them live in wall, you know, fences and walls
around their property, but yet, no, no, we should have no walls. Let's just
let these people come flowing in.

Those types of things really do bother me a great deal, they do. But I don't
want it to impact stuff. Like I don't want to not be able to go talk to some
employees because of the fact that I lean conservative, that I shouldn't be
able to talk to them about lessons in life, that may help them to be
successful in what they're doing in their careers, and that opportunity taken
away from me because of the fact that I'd lean conservative? It's foolish.
Why do that? But yet people do it obviously.

LEVIN: We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEVIN: So Rick Barry, you've done hosting, broadcasting. Some of the more
memorable guests you've had.

BARRY: Oh my god in the sports world, it is unbelievable. I actually had --
my hero Willie Mays, so I grew up as a bit of a baseball player. My father
let me catch it like this, the basket catch and he came in as a rookie. That
was my hero. I wound up getting to meet him obviously when I went to San
Francisco. He became a friend of mine, invited me to speak at his 70th
birthday celebration at Bally's which was unbelievable.

I mean I cut school to see him play and shook his hand and then when I was in
parochial school and PAL had a trip to Polo Grounds and I jumped the fence
and ran up before they went up the stairs in centerfield, go to the clubhouse
and shook his hand and go home and my brother says, "Oh, how was the game
today?"

I said, "What are you talking about?" I said, "I was at school." He says,
"No, you weren't. You were at the game." I said, "No, I wasn't." He said,
"Yes, you were, I saw you on TV." I said, "What?" "Yes, I saw you. The camera
got this kid jumping off over the fence and running up to shake Willie Mays'
hand." I said, "Oh my god, don't tell mom or dad," because they both were
working. So they weren't there at the time.

And then from there, I get to have my boyhood idol, the guy who wore number
24. And I got them meet him and become his friend. I mean, what a great
country we're in, right? I mean, it's amazing.

And then I had Barry Bonds come on and did a show and he did the entire show
for me -- three hours.

LEVIN: When was that?

BARRY: After he set the record and when he revealed on my show that he had a
death threat during the course of that season when he set the home run
record. And so -- and then another one that you hardly ever heard on radio
and I got to meet all these guys, Sandy Koufax came on my show.

LEVIN: He doesn't do a lot.

BARRY: That's what I'm saying, and I said, "Sandy," "Oh, come on, Rick," I
said, "Please, do it for a favor for me." So he came on my show and spent you
know, quite a bit of time. I mean, to have those types of people.

LEVIN: Let me stop you there. What was he like? Since you got to interview
him.

BARRY: No, he was great. He was great. I still have the tapes of all these
people that had on.

LEVIN: One of the greatest pitchers ever.

BARRY: Oh, maybe probably the -- yes, without question one of the greatest
lefties ever. I mean, if not the greatest lefty along, you know, Whitey Ford,
some of the other guys over there, but he was an amazing player, amazing
player.

And see, I love greatness. I don't care what it is. I love people who excel
in what they do. I have great admiration and respect for them, regardless of
what their field of endeavor. Although I have to think about politics. No,
actually, even if somebody does their job in politics the right way. I mean,
I have no problem with it.

LEVIN: You liked Reagan.

BARRY: Yes, I really like Reagan. I didn't get to meet John F. Kennedy, but I
got to be around and meet some of the other -- I was almost on the trip. I
was supposed to go on the trip when Robert got assassinated.

LEVIN: To LA.

BARRY: Yes, I was supposed to be -- I turned down the trip because something
was there to go. But they had asked me to go on their trip, I would have been
there with Rosie and those people and that would have been horrific to
experience that.

But again, I just -- I respect people who do whatever it is they're doing in
life and do it at a very high level. Great respect for that in anything.

LEVIN: I want to talk about -- you have five sons. All of whom have been or
are in the NBA.

BARRY: Yes, they all had Division One college basketball scholarships, all
have played professional basketball.

LEVIN: Did they do this on their own? Or did you kind of push it on them?

BARRY: No. I think the one thing is apparent, I tell people, expose your kid
to as many different sports as possible, let them choose and support them in
all of them and let them choose the one that they decide that they want to
really dedicate their time to. I think it's great to not just focus on one. I
think kids get burned out, some of these kids.

People try to live their life vicariously through their kids and they force
them into things and they burn them out and they just want to get away from
it. So expose them to it. And that's what I did with my boys.

I brought them to my camps. I laid the foundation that my father laid for me.
I think in anything in life, I tell people, you can't build a skyscraper on a
small foundation.

LEVIN: Your father was a coach.

BARRY: My father was a player, semi-pro player coach. So if you have a small
foundation, you only go so high and that building is toppling over. So the
bigger the foundation, the taller the building. So if you teach the
fundamental principles and concepts of whatever it may be, not just in
sports, and music, whatever it is, learn that. Learn as much as you can. Get
that huge foundation.

Then if you're blessed with God-given talents and abilities, you'll be able
to maximize those. There were a lot of guys who made it to the NBA who never
will be as good as they should have become because they weren't taught
properly. They don't have that great foundation. And so they're only going to
go so high. And that's it. They're not going to be able to go any further.

LEVIN: Isn't that all life?

BARRY: Yes, that's in every -- all walks of life.

LEVIN: What's that?

BARRY: This is my championship ring from 1975. I have a ring from the top 50.
I have a ring from the Hall of Fame. They all are meaningful to me. But the
only ring I ever wear is this one.

LEVIN: Why?

BARRY: Because basketball is a team sport. It's not about individual honors.
The way I equate it is this. If I won these awards, like I won scoring
titles. I won steal titles. I won free throw titles -- all these other --
being on first team all-pro All-Star games. Those are like a cake. You can
have decorations, right? You have the little flowers, you have the cherries,
you have the candles, you have all these great things.

Take all those things and put them on a plate without the cake. That looks
still good, does it? Just a whole bunch of stuff just sitting there. You've
got to have the cake. Get the cake and then I was fortunate enough to get the
cake. And now I have all the adornments with it. And that's the way that I
equate it.

So that is what the most important thing to me. I had a lot of wonderful
things happen to me in my life, but nothing more meaningful than being a part
of that championship team with all my teammates who helped it happen because
you don't do it by yourself.

LEVIN: I don't mean to upset you. 1967.

BARRY: Yes, two pick and roll plays. Not that I remember.

LEVIN: You're up against the 76'ers who some consider one of the greatest
teams.

BARRY: Without question.

LEVIN: Chamberlain and so forth. You all took it to six games.

BARRY: Yes and I said, it was two pick and roll plays. Nate Thurmond, my Hall
of Fame teammate, God rest his soul, not with us anymore. We ran a pick and
roll play against Wilt Chamberlain. And I remember the first one was in
Philadelphia, and I hit Nate on the way to the basket on a roll. And Wilt
came over his back and fouled him.

I remember this like it was yesterday and the ball came off and all of the
players -- we all stopped. We knew it was a foul, and the ball came and
bounced out and then we didn't the whistle didn't blow.

Now, it turns out that the official was under the basket. It had to be
somebody living in the Philadelphia area, I found out later, but not that
that had any impact on it. But anyway, if we won that game, that changes the
whole dimension.

Now all of a sudden, we have the home court, and we have the advantage. Then
we're back in game six and I ran a pick and roll on the right hand side with
Nate and with Wilt, I came off, I went up, and was going to pass it to Nate
on the roll. And Wilt Chamberlain took the largest step I've ever seen a
human being take in my life and I couldn't make the pass. I had to double
clutch the shot and I missed it and we wound up losing the close game in game
number six, but I don't remember any of that stuff.

LEVIN: Was he the strongest man you ever met?

BARRY: Yes, he was amazingly strong. People have no idea. I still -- Wilt can
hold like a hundred like some ridiculous number of pounds out in front of
them like this.

And one time I remember a player drove in and he got hit, he was going to
fall to the ground and Wilt just reached over like that and just kind of
grabbed him and put him down like it was nothing.

LEVIN: And yet, I remember as a kid going up to Wilt Chamberlain. He was the
nicest guy I'd ever met.

BARRY: Boy, he is a great guy. I got to know Wilt afterwards. I got to go up
to his crazy house in LA where he had a roof that opened up over his bed and
thing, and every door was nine feet tall or something. And it was pretty
amazing. But he was a great guy. Interesting guy. He loved fast cars. He had
custom made cars and he used to have a fast car made up, an old American car
to pull up next to the Ferraris and Lamborghinis in LA and he would just blow
their doors off and he had the seat removed and put all the way back.

But a very interesting guy. You know, people always ask me, "Well, come on,
20,000 women?" I said, "Come on. I've been around -- well, 20,000 women," I
said, "No way. But he came awfully close."

LEVIN: Ladies and gentlemen, don't forget, most weeknights you can watch me
on LevinTV, LevinTV. Go to blazetv.com/mark, blazetv.com/mark and don't
forget the number one book in the country, thanks to you. Get your copy right
away. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEVIN: Rick Barry, do you think basketball is different than most other team
sports? I mean, obviously, the dynamics are but --

BARRY: Well, here's the thing, it's not as sophisticated as football because
you have more players on the field, and it's in a confined area. But -- so
it's really a pretty simple game, if you understand how to play it properly.
And that's why I love watching my team play because they play the game the
way I was taught to play, the Warriors, I'm speaking of today. Pass, cut,
move.

My father always said, "Son, the more decisions you force the defense to
make, the more the likelihood that sometimes they're going to make a mistake.
And then if you really understand the game, you'll capitalize and take
advantage of those mistakes." And that's why the Warriors win a lot.

Because a lot of the other teams now, the game has gotten to the point where
it's so much of the one on one stuff, "Here, Mark, go score for me," as
opposed to move, cut, pass.

LEVIN: Isn't that a life lesson? You're trying to figure out the best aspects
of what you can do, the worst aspects of what the other guy can do. And
rather than one on one, it's kind of a team sport.

BARRY: Yes, and it's kind of when I talk to businesses about it. It's also up
to the coach who is the same thing as the guy who is running the office, you
know, who is the office manager who own the company.

It's your responsibility to analyze the talent of your personnel and utilize
them the best way possible. You don't take someone in business, who is good
at sales, and just put them in the research department. And this is what
happens in sports.

Some coaches have players and they make them play the game the way they want
them to play, run the offense they want to run instead of putting in an
offense that utilizes his talents to the best. And one of the great examples
I always give as years gone, people -- a lot of people not that you'd
remember him, but it's a guy named Dale Ellis who played with the Dallas
Mavericks, and Dick Motta was down there coaching and had his style of play.
And he traded him because he didn't think he can do anything.

Why? Because he never utilized Dale's skills. He was a great three-point
shooter. He goes to Seattle. He becomes an all-star player. I mean, that's
the perfect example of not utilizing your personnel properly. And you need to
do that in life as well.

I want to say one thing, though, about back to the President, congratulations
on your book, and the success it is having is that the problem with the press
is that they have so much power, there's no recourse. So if they write
something about you, whether -- and it's wrong, and it's just terrible. Even
if they did a retraction, which most of them never do, the same people who
read it or heard it or saw it on TV, don't necessarily get to see that
retraction.

And so it's really kind of sad, the power that they have, and you're
fortunate at least some time, you get an opportunity to go on your show, and
you'll be able to go ahead and give your side of the story and hope that
everybody gets to hear it.

But for the everyday person, the sports personality, the person in politics,
whoever it may be, they have no recourse. It's really unfair.

LEVIN: And what do we do about it?

BARRY: I don't know what you can do about it. I mean, in my case, I tried to
go on interview shows like you and talk about it. So I mean, that's what I
have to do, but the everyday person? What chance do they have? Seriously?
They don't have much of an opportunity to do that.

LEVIN: I think that's why, honestly look at CNN, they have no ratings. You
look at "The New York Times" they need an influx of money, so a
telecommunications billionaire from Mexico, basically buys into "The New York
Times" 20 percent or so. And Bezos buys the failing "Washington Post" for a
quarter of a billion dollars.

I think these media outlets that push these agendas and are not fair and
don't even try to be fair, that are progressive, mostly promote the agenda of
the Democratic Party, I think they're failing. And I think it's like a
basketball team. If you don't like your fans, or if you turn off half the
fans, you're not going to be around a long time. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEVIN: Rick Barry, I'm going to ask you a question I ask most of my guests.
How do you see the future of the country?

BARRY: Wow. It's a scary situation that exists today. It really is. I feel
concerned about my grandkids especially and what's going to happen with them
and their families the way things are going right now.

The values of this country was formed are disappearing. Not all of them
fortunately. But we need people to come in who are going to stick by what the
Constitution was, to keep the values that our founding fathers had, so that
this country can possibly get back to -- I'm sorry, but people say, you know,
to have -- to get this country to be great again, because our country has
faltered.

I mean, we've lost a lot of respect around the world. And we were the
greatest country in the world. We still are, but not like we used to be. And
it's disturbing to me, it really is.

LEVIN: Why is that?

BARRY: Well, it's because of the leadership that we've had and the way that
these people are approaching things. I don't know where they got these things
into their head to try to change what's worked for so many centuries. Why do
you want to change what's working? And that's why I'm happy with what I'm
seeing right now.

Hopefully this is going to continue that we will be able to grow and get more
jobs, do the things -- you know, black unemployment, minority unemployment,
youth unemployment is down. We just need to get back to the values of what we
had in the past. And if we do that, I think we'll be fine.

LEVIN: Been a pleasure.

BARRY: Thank you.

--
Watching Trump come up with schemes to "catch Trump" is like watching
Wile E. Coyote trying to catch Road Runner.