Re: Red Menace 36 update
unisk8r
Here's a front shot of the disc brake:
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Filename: 36RedMenace.v4.DiscRear.jpg |
|Download: http://www.unicyclist.com/attachment/14708 |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
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unisk8r
Well, after being distracted with non-uni projects all Summer, I finally
decided a few weeks ago to finish my final design version of The Red
Menace. It has a choice of 5 different gear ratios using common
bicycle granny rings. The transmission is my smoothest version yet.
Less chain tension and no crank play whatsoever. And a Hope Mono disc
brake setup, chosen specifically because the Mono had a reputation as a
sucky bike disc, and true to form, works just wonderfully on the 36"
wheel with no grabbing and great modulation. The paint is a red fading
slightly to brighter on the top. The only part remaining to be added
is the super-secret custom road saddle, in red snakeskin, from the
world's finest saddle maker.
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Filename: 36RedMenace.v4.SideRight.jpg |
|Download: http://www.unicyclist.com/attachment/14707 |
UniTyler
Looks wonderful, Pete!
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unisk8r
And here's the trans. I have pretty much reached the design limit, with
the chain centerlines only 1.0" apart.
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Filename: 36RedMenace.v4.JackFront.jpg |
|Download: http://www.unicyclist.com/attachment/14709 |
UniMOG
*_WOW__*It is a beauty :D
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Spencer Hochberg
I want that uni...
Thats so awesome...
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forrestunifreak
That looks closer to a bike than most uni's... major frame going on
there. Yep.
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Chrashing
Wow, function and form come together so beautifully.
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teachndad
.. um, Gulp:)
Wow!
Are those Carbon Fiber cranks?
Cheers.
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tomblackwood
Ha ha ha...I got to be the second human to ride this baby after Pete
christened it in my neighborhood today. I am here to testify that it is
one sweet machine, and if anything rides better than it looks, which is
saying a lot. Pete is a guy who likes his engineering precise, and it
really shows in this latest and finest example of his design. Purple
Phaze is nice, but this is nicer.
The gearing today was 1:1.4, giving it an effective 50" wheel size. I
wish I could have had more time to get comfortable with the gearing and
really crank it up, but I was pretty timid. After a summer of direct
drive coker cranking in prep for the 'MS-150'
(http://www.unicyclist.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51208), the gearing
felt really strange, even with the ride being super smooth. The uni
wasn't jerky, but I sure was. Still, I made it up the block and back
including a fairly tight u-turn, with no UPD.
Signing off now, while saying silent prayers I'll get another, longer
shot on the Red Menace sometime in the future.
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tomtrevor
wow, that coker is nice! you could ride around the country on that
thing.
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GizmoDuck
Nice machine....I like the incorporation of the disc brake and how the
axle and the hub are now inline as opposed to sitting above it- the
lowered centre of gravity compared with Purple Phaze must make it more
stable at speed.
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iridemymuni
i dont quite get how it works.
can someone please explain it really slowly for me.
is the left crank not attatched to the hub at all?
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DustinSchaap
Pete,
You sure know how to design a sexy thing like that, it's a pity you
live so far away because I'd sure like to try that thing sometime. I've
ridden a Schlumpf coker at Unicon and when your cranks are horizontal
you feel sort of a click and some of the energy you put in the
revolution is just gone. It feels very weird, you said there was no
crank play whatsoever, so you're saying it's a smoother ride than let's
say, a Schlumpf?
I love the handles you put on that thing, it was your Purple Haze
design that made me put handles on mine, and you keep giving me more
ideas on improving my own unicycle, keep up the good work!
Cheers,
Dustin
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john_childs
iridemymuni wrote:
> i dont quite get how it works.
>
> can someone please explain it really slowly for me.
>
The hub is different than any other unicycle hub. The hub body is on
bearings and is able to rotate around the axle. In that sense the hub
is like a bicycle wheel hub that spins on an axle.
The cranks are attached to the axle. There is a jackshaft (the two
cogs above the hub). The chain from the cranks drive the jackshaft.
The second chain from the jackshaft then goes down and drives the hub.
So the hub is able to spin at a different RPM than the axle. That is
what allows for gearing. It can be geared up or down based on the size
of the cogs.
I hope that makes sense. It's hard to explain without pictures.
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unisk8r
Thanks all! Yep, I am pleased with it. A new paint job on old frame
tubes that were cut & re-welded many time can go a long way.
Drawings for my next project have begun.
PS: Happy International Harper Day!!!
smcmorrow
That is a very nicely designed peice of equipment. I would really like
to try it. It looks so nice.
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john_childs
Very nice Pete. It's projects like this that keep the Seattle area at
the forefront of unicycle technology development.
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flyer
That is absolutely incredible. What a sexy unicycle. I don't think I'd
ever stop riding it (not that I stop riding my other ones either..)
Man, that's amazing.
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unisk8r
I bet Dave Stockton would duplicate this for anyone interested...and I'd
also bet he could do it for less than I would. :)
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tomblackwood
unisk8r wrote:
> I bet Dave Stockton would duplicate this for anyone interested...and I'd
> also bet he could do it for less than I would. :)
Would that be Dave Stockton from 'LiveWire Unicycles'
(http://www.livewireunicycles.com/)?
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iridemymuni
john_childs wrote:
> The hub is different than any other unicycle hub. The hub body is on
> bearings and is able to rotate around the axle. In that sense the hub
> is like a bicycle wheel hub that spins on an axle.
>
> The cranks are attached to the axle. There is a jackshaft (the two
> cogs above the hub). The chain from the cranks drive the jackshaft.
> The second chain from the jackshaft then goes down and drives the hub.
> So the hub is able to spin at a different RPM than the axle. That is
> what allows for gearing. It can be geared up or down based on the size
> of the cogs.
>
> I hope that makes sense. It's hard to explain without pictures.
ahh i get it now.
i wasn't sure how the other crank spun at the same time as the other
crank. that would make sense.
thanks
--
iridemymuni
Evan Byrne wrote:
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> wrench.
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U-Turn
Your projects are looking great, Pete! They are very impressive.
unisk8r wrote:
> I bet Dave Stockton would duplicate this for anyone interested...and I'd
> also bet he could do it for less than I would. :)
That's the goal, Pete. At the moment, I'm working through some bumps
in the road. Well, more like NYC potholes that you could lose a tour
bus in. :rolleyes: So the geared projects are on hold for a little
while. There are some cool innovations in the works though!
tomblackwood wrote:
> Would that be Dave Stockton from LiveWire Unicycles?
*wave* Hi Tom!
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harper
I thought that Pete's PurplePhaze had less backlash than either my
internally geared hubs or Florian's. His jackshaft design has really
panned out to provide tremendous flexibility with gear ratio choices
which are quite limited in internal designs. Hearing that the backlash
on RedMenace is even less is good news, too. The massive Coker wheel
and tire are only advantageous with geared unicycles in my opinion. It
seems to add an element of stability. The addition of a disc brake
makes it a complete, flexible, high-speed touring machine.
Congratulations, Pete. I hope Dave cranks them out sometime in the
future.
May I be the first to break this one, too?
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B L U E S H I F T
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unisk8r
You taught me very well, Greg! I will never again build a prototype
that cannot withstand your monumental running start torque! The Phaze
prototype may have only lasted 2 seconds in your hands, but NEVER
AGAIN! You will soon fear the strength of The Red Menace...in fact, it
would take a congressional hearing to stop the spread of this wicked
machine! MMWWWAAAAAHHHHHH!!!
--
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Rubix
bump since someone mentioned it in another thread
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underdog
Wow! I missed this thread the first time around. Then I realized that
it came and went while I was off on vacation.
That thing is a work of art. Very nice. Reminds me of the Guinness
commercials: "Brilliant!"
--
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siafirede
Rubix wrote:
> bump since someone mentioned it in another thread
Best bump ever. I also missed this thread the first time around. I am
mad jealous, it looks amazing!
I know that this uni does not shift on the fly, but how do you change
the gearing on it, and how long does it usually take you to change the
gear ratio?
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Into the blue
Just imagine this in Sam's (Redwelly's) hands.
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MrBoogiejuice
Into the blue wrote:
> Just imagine this in Sam's (Redwelly's) hands.
Or, more accurately, his crotch.
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Hazmat
It's funny, weird and would be awesome to ride.
It's funny and weird because it almost looks like NKahler avatar. :p
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ivan wrote:
> Its a wild ride, grabs me by the shoe-lace, and doesn't let go till I do
> a face-plant.
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unisk8r
Just noticed this thread bumped from last year.
The gear ratio is changed by loosening the chain tension, pulling out
the jackshaft, changing the cogs, and also pulling the right crank and
changing the crank cog accordingly. The two sides of the driveline are
symmetrical. Same as on Purple Phaze. The process takes about 10-15
minutes, not really field-serviceable.
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harper
unisk8r wrote:
> Just noticed this thread bumped from last year.
>
> The gear ratio is changed by loosening the chain tension, pulling out
> the jackshaft, changing the cogs, and also pulling the right crank and
> changing the crank cog accordingly. The two sides of the driveline are
> symmetrical. Same as on Purple Phaze. The process takes about 10-15
> minutes, not really field-serviceable.
No, not really field serviceable. But in a short period of time it can
be set up for whatever ride you want. A wide range of gear ratios are
available. This makes it extremely versatile. You're not just stuck
with 1:1 or 1:1.5. How many gear ratios have you tried in your
jackshaft design? How many do you know to be possible?
--
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unisk8r
I've ridden it in 1.22 (22x20), 1.44 (24x20), and 1.69 (26x20) ratios.
You can also do 1.00 (20x20), 1.96 (28x20), or even an 0.82 underdrive
(20x22).
The Menace has gotten even redder lately with a red painted rim, and
new brake cable guides in the form of red skulls:
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Filename: RedMenace.v5.cable.jpg |
|Download: http://www.unicyclist.com/attachment/22855 |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
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siafirede
Does it feel about the same as a regular coker in 1:1 mode, or do you
notice a few differences? If so, what are they?
Love the red skulls.
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unisk8r
The lowest gear I've ridden in is 1.22 with 175mm cranks. A good climber
would have little problem with hills in that combo. My climbing is
still limited whether I'm on a guni or direct drive.
My best guess is that it would still have some perceptible driveline
friction as compared to a direct hub, but in general riding around you
don't really notice it. What you do notice is the lightweight wheel.
It's available for local test rides anytime.
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Hazmat
unisk8r wrote:
> It's available for local test rides anytime.
Well that leaves me out of it. :(
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ivan wrote:
> Its a wild ride, grabs me by the shoe-lace, and doesn't let go till I do
> a face-plant.
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unisk8r
Too bad Hazmat. Seattle is still the guni capital of the world! (i.e.
highest guni/rider ratio) :p
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siafirede
unisk8r wrote:
> The lowest gear I've ridden in is 1.22 with 175mm cranks. A good climber
> would have little problem with hills in that combo. My climbing is
> still limited whether I'm on a guni or direct drive.
>
> My best guess is that it would still have some perceptible driveline
> friction as compared to a direct hub, but in general riding around you
> don't really notice it. What you do notice is the lightweight wheel.
>
> It's available for local test rides anytime.
I'll keep that in mind! Hopefully I can make it out to the Seattle
area around/after Thanksgiving weekend to visit my Brother.
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nathan
To say this is cool is an understatement. I would love to visit sometime
and try it out. I borrowed a 1.5 geared Hunter36 for a while this
summer and managed to get pretty comfortable with the 54" equivalent
gearing, at least on flat and down. Uphills really take effort. But man
does it love downhill.
I didn't see the whole weight in the thread - Pete have you weighed
it?
---Nathan
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jimbojones
that is a work of art.:) it's great that people like you are pushing
the bounderies of this sport even furthor then they are.
I'm curious as to what kind of cranks those are? they sort of look like
CF but that to me dosen't really seem like something that would be used
for cranks hmm.
--
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tomblackwood
nathan wrote:
> I would love to visit sometime and try it out.
I think Seattle could get behind that concept. :) Ideally we could
pick a time of year where we could get a good turnout, and coordinate a
few different types of rides, uni touristing, etc.
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Cliffacer Le Fall
Great solution: pedestrian technology, applied cleverly. Tell me, will
you post detailed drawings? Also, I'd like to see step photos of the
wheel being freed from the bearings and chain drive. Is it tedious?
As pictured, how much does it weigh?
Now go chase down some impala- there really should be a spear-rack.
--
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unisk8r
Total weight with disc brake setup is 19.8lbs (9.0kg). Cranks are FSA
carbon pro. Saddle is custom Wallis Design.
Sorry but I build by sight only, and have no plans to disassemble it
anytime soon for pics or drawings. However, here's a repeat post of the
business end:
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Filename: RedMenace.v4.jackfront.jpg |
|Download: http://www.unicyclist.com/attachment/22968 |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
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unisk8r
Nathan, do try to visit up here sometime, you're just the kinda guy to
take The Red Menace to a new envelope. I'd be happy to set it up with
the 1.96 for ya!
nathan
Actually you know what the coolest would be? Bring it to Ride the
Lobster and/or UniCon next year! 1.96...wow sounds almost scary. Over
70" effective!
---Nathan
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tomblackwood
nathan wrote:
> Actually you know what the coolest would be? Bring it to Ride the
> Lobster and/or UniCon next year! 1.96...wow sounds almost scary.
Yeah...it has been whispered about here in Seattle...that there is an
obligation, perhaps even an exectation, that the Seattle Area Riders
will field at least one team. I've been hesitant due to devoting 2
weeks of vacation already to Uninam. But RTL is unique...it's like the
gumball ralley for unis...if you get the call, you need to go.
Current whisperers...TB, Bruce, Steve...we'd need an alternate and a
support person at least. The geared uni would need to come along.
That would allow Pete to take my breakfast shift, so I could have time
for extra hash browns to fuel up for the long afternoon.
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Cliffacer Le Fall
Are the disc brake and sprocket at hub cold connected? It almost looks
like screw heads or rivets protruding from the break side. Is the hub
stock, or modified stock- or custom built? Are the multiple holes in
the gear cage to accommodate different sized gears, or for tensioning?
Your tolerances are sooooo tight. Beautiful, beautiful work- like a
giant clock.
--
Cliffacer Le Fall
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chuckaeronut
Yet another year goes by, and yet another bump!
Geared riding has really taken off in the past year or so... Gigahats
off to Unisk8r for making something so awesome... it's a pretty huge
contribution. Even if it's only one, it proves it's totally possible and
doable... gives us something to look forward to.
I've always heard stories about the Red Menace, but for some reason I
never found this thread until now. It's quite breathtakingly beautiful!!
Would it be possible to make it be able to disengage the jackshaft
drivetrain and re-engage a 1-1 lock-in to make the cranks lock directly
to the hub, to enable shifting between 1:1 and whatever gear ratio is
selected? Seeing how the Schlumpf hub shifts its drive plate thing back
and forth between the planet carrier and the hub housing, I don't see
why it wouldn't be possible with this design, either, but I could be
missing something important. To make this shiftable back to 1:1 would be
absolutely epic.
And UniSk8r, though I don't know your name (my name is Chuck, btw :)),
would it be possible for me to come to Redmond some time to ride your
unicycle? I don't know offhand when I'd be free to come up, but I
really, really, REALLY would like to, if you'd let me. I've been wanting
for quite some time now to ride something geared higher than 1.5, and
this looks, quite frankly, amazing.
--
chuckaeronut
Uni to work to eat to live to uni to work to...!
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View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/52571
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tomblackwood
chuckaeronut;1138957 wrote:
> And UniSk8r, though I don't know your name (my name is Chuck, btw :)),
> would it be possible for me to come to Redmond some time to ride your
> unicycle? I don't know offhand when I'd be free to come up, but I
> really, really, REALLY would like to, if you'd let me.
If you decide to head up this way Chuck, give us enough notice to plan
a decent group distance ride. Probably we could turn out all the RTL
Puget Sounders, as I think Joe is probably just about ready to get back
on the horse (if he hasn't already), and we could easily get another
handful of locals to come along.
Lots of low traffic farm roads around here, where there will be little
risk of you getting pulled over for speeding.
--
tomblackwood
Tailgate at your own risk...
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chuckaeronut
Hahahahahaaa, riiight :-p
Yeah, I'd love to come up some time. Pretty much as soon as I get my
motorcycle frame augmented to hold my uni rack. Then I can do an
Ironbutt ride and another half an ironbutt the day after, and I'll be in
Washington! Ugh, that'll be a long ride. But it'll be sooo cheap! About
$60 worth of gas to get to Seattle from San Diego! :D
What if it was in mid to late December? Is that enough time? I have
family all around the Seattle area, and in Spokane, and some other
places as well, so I could make it a quadruple whammy trip, with some
2-wheelin', one-wheelin' and family-seein'... and hopefully some
mega-geared one-wheelin' too :)
Edit: w00t, 300th post!!
--
chuckaeronut
Uni to work to eat to live to uni to work to...!
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maestro8
chuckaeronut;1139021 wrote:
> About $60 worth of gas to get to Seattle from San Diego!
Hey Chuck, y'know Corbin got a Prius, and that got us to SD and back
for only about $50 in gas. We should all pile into that thing and do an
extended weekend in Seattle, eh?
--
maestro8
Those are my principles. If you don't like those, I have others. --
Groucho Marx
The only way to comprehend what mathematicians mean by Infinity is to
contemplate the extent of human stupidity. -- François-Marie Arouet de
Voltaire
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chuckaeronut
Yeah! Then I'd only ride up to there, and we could all hop in for a much
more comfortable and social 900 miles. This should be something to think
about...
Sorry for the threadjack, by the way; this isn't a thread that should
get jacked.
I'd really love to ride this unicycle at some point, even if only for a
couple of minutes... but this is getting more about a trip up north.
Maybe we should go to PMs?
--
chuckaeronut
Uni to work to eat to live to uni to work to...!
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Unicycle-Emele
Please post a vid. It would be awesome to see it in action. Also, have
you tried it with a bike saddle?
--
Unicycle-Emele
Any unicyclist in Westchester County, NY 'pm '
(http://tinyurl.com/6xu626)me.
'My video' (http://youtube.com/watch?v=cvBUcQ9QL_8)
'Other Vid' (http://youtube.com/watch?v=9_j_UFiv3sY)
'newest vid' (http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=ReFi44k2lgY)
maestro8 wrote:
> I'd rather watch you gas, brake, dip, dip.
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saskatchewanian
chuckaeronut;1138957 wrote:
> Would it be possible to make it be able to disengage the jackshaft
> drivetrain and re-engage a 1-1 lock-in to make the cranks lock directly
> to the hub, to enable shifting between 1:1 and whatever gear ratio is
> selected?
Wow, why didn't anyone think of that sooner? That is an awesome idea
Chuck.
I don't see why it wouldn't work.
And I love the brilliant simplicity of the jack shaft design.
--
saskatchewanian
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tomblackwood
maestro8;1139027 wrote:
> Hey Chuck, y'know Corbin got a Prius, and that got us to SD and back for
> only about $50 in gas. We should all pile into that thing and do an
> extended weekend in Seattle, eh?
This thread just gets better and better. With a car, you could toss
some munis on the roof, and we could mix up the offroad and geared
distance stuff. Some good muddy muni that time of year. Just an FYI,
if you target December, bring some long-johns and water-resistant riding
gear. There's a much better chance that the multi-day forecast will be
back-to-back rain than back-to-back sun.
And then, there's always the 'Chilly Hilly'
(http://www.cascade.org/EandR/chilly/index.cfm).
--
tomblackwood
Tailgate at your own risk...
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skrobo
it would be a little complicated, but i've just imagined a reasonable
design engage-able and disengage-able with simple allen screws, so no
shift-on-the-fly, but still reasonable.
--
skrobo
><> Unicycle For Christ <><
'MY VIDEOS' (http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=skroboskim)
'World Record' (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oig5IEq-v4Y)
"dude when i first got into this sport and saw one of you videos i
almost threw up it was so sick"
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unisk8r
By the way, past inventors have utilized a jackshaft approach, such as
Keith Macay of the UK. I merely refined the design.
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Filename: Guni.KeithMacay.jpg |
|Download: http://www.unicyclist.com/attachment/29784 |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
--
unisk8r
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unisk8r
chuckaeronut;1138957 wrote:
> Would it be possible to make it be able to disengage the jackshaft
> drivetrain and re-engage a 1-1 lock-in to make the cranks lock directly
> to the hub, to enable shifting between 1:1 and whatever gear ratio is
> selected? Seeing how the Schlumpf hub shifts its drive plate thing back
> and forth between the planet carrier and the hub housing, I don't see
> why it wouldn't be possible with this design, either, but I could be
> missing something important. To make this shiftable back to 1:1 would be
> absolutely epic.
>
> And UniSk8r, though I don't know your name (my name is Chuck, btw :)),
> would it be possible for me to come to Redmond some time to ride your
> unicycle? I don't know offhand when I'd be free to come up, but I
> really, really, REALLY would like to, if you'd let me. I've been wanting
> for quite some time now to ride something geared higher than 1.5, and
> this looks, quite frankly, amazing.
To make it shift on the fly would involve machining a keyway into the
through-axle, so that a pin of some kind could lock the axle to the hub
shell. That same "pin of some kind" would also lock the hub sprocket to
the hub shell. It would be an either-or engagement, similar to Schlumpf.
But at the moment, with the chain system I can't envision how to
disengage the jackshaft from the cranks, even when the hub is locked in
1:1 mode. In other words, in direct mode the hub sprocket would simply
turn freely on the hub shell (at whatever the gear ratio happens to
be).
The 6 current available ratios are: 0.83 (20t/22t underdrive), 1.00
(20/20), 1.22 (22/20), 1.44 (24/20), 1.67 (26/20), and 1.96 (28/20).
Takes about 15 minutes to disassemble, change the ratio, and
re-assemble.
Yes, it's here in my shed waiting to be ridden more!
Pete
--
unisk8r
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boisei
The more I look at the options, I think this is the sort of GUni I'd
like. What it lacks in ready availability it gains in maintainability.
What it lacks in push-button shifting it gains in flexible gearing
options.
Any advice on how to go about building or getting the more intricate
bits of something like this built? If one wanted to commission a build
like this would Dave Stockton still be the guy to go to?
--
boisei
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boisei
boisei;1140679 wrote:
> If one wanted to commission a build like this would Dave Stockton still
> be the guy to go to?
Hrm, apparently not.
"11 May 2008 -- LiveWire Unicycles is on hold indefinitely and not
taking orders. Thanks for your understanding!"
Klaas Bil
unisk8r;1140065 wrote:
> By the way, past inventors have utilized a jackshaft approach, such as
> Keith Macay of the UK. I merely refined the design.
For the record, I think he is from Australia, and his last name is
spelled McKay.
--
Klaas Bil
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dangerdog
And shamefully copied by me.
[image:
http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh155/dangerdog_photo/100_1922.jpg]
--
dangerdog
once I was young and stupid....that was some time ago
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ion...@gmail.com
> Well, after being distracted with non-uni projects all Summer, I finally
> decided a few weeks ago to finish my final design version of The Red
> Menace. It has a choice of 5 different gear ratios using common
> bicycle granny rings. The transmission is my smoothest version yet.
> Less chain tension and no crank play whatsoever. And a Hope Mono disc
> brake setup, chosen specifically because the Mono had a reputation as a
> sucky bike disc, and true to form, works just wonderfully on the 36"
> wheel with no grabbing and great modulation. The paint is a red fading
> slightly to brighter on the top. The only part remaining to be added
> is the super-secret custom road saddle, in red snakeskin, from the
> world's finest saddle maker.
>
>
> +-------------------------------------------------------------------+
> |Filename: 36RedMenace.v4.SideRight.jpg |
> |Download: http://www.unicyclist.com/attachment/14707 |
> +-------------------------------------------------------------------+
> --
> unisk8r
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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