(OT) Rossiya

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*skriptis

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Sep 24, 2022, 5:04:19 PMSep 24
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This is a major thread about Russia.

Everyone is invited to speak their minds.


Why do you hate Russia?
Why do you love Russia?

What do you want take from Russia?
What are you willing to concede to Russia?
What feelings does Russia invoke in you?
What does Russia mean to you?

Only long posts allowed.


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Mike DeSantis

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Sep 24, 2022, 6:25:08 PMSep 24
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*skriptis schrieb am Samstag, 24. September 2022 um 23:04:19 UTC+2:
> This is a major thread about Russia.
>
> Everyone is invited to speak their minds.
>
>
> Why do you hate Russia?

I don't hate Russia.
I hate Putler and all Russian fascists.

> Why do you love Russia?
>

I don't love Russia.
I love Tchaikovsky.

> What do you want take from Russia?

Billions of reparations for Ukranie.

> What are you willing to concede to Russia?

Let them back to the families of this planet's peoples in due time.

> What feelings does Russia invoke in you?

Currently - disgust.

> What does Russia mean to you?

Currently - the Evil Empire.



Mike

The Iceberg

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Sep 25, 2022, 5:58:44 AMSep 25
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On Saturday, 24 September 2022 at 22:04:19 UTC+1, *skriptis wrote:
> This is a major thread about Russia.
>
> Everyone is invited to speak their minds.
>
>
> Why do you hate Russia?
> Why do you love Russia?
>
> What do you want take from Russia?
> What are you willing to concede to Russia?
> What feelings does Russia invoke in you?
> What does Russia mean to you?
>
> Only long posts allowed.

Russia and Putin deserve sympathy and compensation because they are still suffering from trauma of when the USA sent to troops to invade them in 1918!

https://www.military.com/history/united-states-invasion-of-russia-was-yearlong-freezing-hell-troops.html

The United States' Invasion of Russia In 1918

Fighting a war in Russia during the winter is never a good idea, and yet time and again, people keep trying. The United States is as guilty of it as Napoleon was.

In November of 1918, much of the world was jubilantly celebrating the end of World War I, the "war to end all wars." As those celebrations caught the attention of newspapers and newsreels all over the United States, there was one group of Americans whose war hadn't yet ended.

Around 5,000 American soldiers were part of an allied expedition to intervene in the ongoing Russian civil war against the "Red" Bolshevik forces. For a little over a year, the American Expeditionary Force in North Russia fought to give the anti-Bolshevik "White" Russians the upper hand.

As summer turned to fall in 1918, the combined forces of Britain, France, Italy, the United States and the rest of their allies were making drastic advances against their World War I enemies. Things were looking bleak for the Central Powers of Germany, Austria-Hungary, the Ottoman Empire and Bulgaria.

In France, the allied forces had pushed the German Army back to the Hindenburg Line, nearly pushing it out of France altogether. Soon, German soldiers and sailors would revolt against the continued war, the Kaiser would be forced to abdicate and an armistice would be negotiated to end the war.

Things were looking good for the allies, but the Russians, who had negotiated a separate peace in March of 1918, were still locked in a brutal struggle for who would control Russia. Britain, France and the United States had sent the Tsar 110,000 new rifles and other war materials to help keep the Russian Empire in World War I. Since the Russian military was unable to distribute any of it, Russia dropped out anyway.

Those arms and supplies were sitting in a warehouse in the northern city of Arkhangelsk. The "Polar Bear Expedition," as the mission had come to be called, was simple on paper. They were to capture the stored weapons and secure an area large enough for the White Russians to form a stable government and army. Neither of those things happened.

The Americans, at the request of the British and French, landed in the city in September 1918. They found the city was already occupied by the British, and they also found that the weapons cache was already discovered by the Bolsheviks, who'd made off with them.

To make matters worse, a force of Czech and Slovak armies called the Czech Legion was in danger of being overrun while fighting along the Trans-Siberian Railway, a front that was hundreds of miles long. The American 339th Infantry, which was largely overcome with Spanish flu, was sent to relieve them.

The Americans, with British help, broke out of the Arkhangelsk perimeter and into Bolshevik territory. For six weeks, they fought their way along the Dvina River, but at the end of it, they found themselves just as stretched out as the Czech Legion. With winter beginning to set in, they had to do something fast.

With the Czech Legion firmly out of reach, the allies tried to raise an anti-Bolshevik army from members of the local population. When winter arrived in force, the allies were without recruits. Then came the Bolshevik counterattack.

In October 1918, the Red armies inflicted a large number of casualties on the Americans, who had expected a relatively calm winter. Instead, the Red assault forced the allies to retreat back toward Arkhangelsk. They were forced to give up all their gains and take a loss of 10% of their force: 110 killed in combat, 30 missing and 70 dead from Spanish flu.

By the time the Polar Bears had secured their position in Arkhangelsk, World War I had ended in an armistice, and the port of Arkhangelsk was frozen over. Even though the war was over, the Americans in Russia would have to survive through the winter until a ship could exfiltrate them.

The soldiers were getting restless, subject to defending an area the size of Texas and Oklahoma alongside Russians who seemed disinterested in the outcome of the battle. The Americans struggled to tell the difference between a Bolshevik and an anti-Bolshevik. All the while, they were inundated by ambushes and Red propaganda, asking: "If the war is over, why are you still here?"

The Red army continued its push against the foreigners throughout the winter. Its new offensive was so successful, the allies decided that their ultimate goal was getting out of there as soon as possible. It wasn't until June 1919 that the USS Des Moines steamed into the port and picked up the Polar Bears.

In all, the Americans lost 344 dead to combat and disease, along with another 305 wounded. They even left 125 men behind. These men wouldn't be returned home until the Veterans of Foreign Wars was allowed to retrieve their remains inside the Soviet Union in 1929.

The Iceberg

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Sep 25, 2022, 6:00:15 AMSep 25
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this is obviously all just you being defensive, you need to embrace your inner and subconscious love and admiration for Putin!

Whisper

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Sep 25, 2022, 7:15:32 AMSep 25
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On 25/09/2022 7:04 am, *skriptis wrote:
>
> This is a major thread about Russia.
>
> Everyone is invited to speak their minds.
>
>
> Why do you hate Russia?
> Why do you love Russia?
>
> What do you want take from Russia?
> What are you willing to concede to Russia?
> What feelings does Russia invoke in you?
> What does Russia mean to you?
>
> Only long posts allowed.
>
>



I love Russia, the people and culture, women etc.

Of course that doesn't mean I love all Russians, eg Putin ; )



Custos Custodum

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Sep 25, 2022, 7:25:44 AMSep 25
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On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 02:58:43 -0700 (PDT), The Iceberg
<iceber...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Saturday, 24 September 2022 at 22:04:19 UTC+1, *skriptis wrote:
>> This is a major thread about Russia.
>>
>> Everyone is invited to speak their minds.
>>
>>
>> Why do you hate Russia?
>> Why do you love Russia?
>>
>> What do you want take from Russia?
>> What are you willing to concede to Russia?
>> What feelings does Russia invoke in you?
>> What does Russia mean to you?
>>
>> Only long posts allowed.
>
>Russia and Putin deserve sympathy and compensation because they are still suffering from trauma of when the USA sent to troops to invade them in 1918!
>
They'd be suffering even more had it not been for the $billions of aid
and military materiel they received from the USA under lend-lease
during WW2. It is doubtful whether they would have been able to push
Hitler back otherwise.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lend-Lease#US_deliveries_to_the_Soviet_Union

Sawfish

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Sep 25, 2022, 10:55:53 AMSep 25
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On 9/24/22 2:04 PM, *skriptis wrote:
> This is a major thread about Russia.
>
> Everyone is invited to speak their minds.
>
>
> Why do you hate Russia?
> Why do you love Russia?
>
> What do you want take from Russia?
> What are you willing to concede to Russia?
> What feelings does Russia invoke in you?
> What does Russia mean to you?
>
> Only long posts allowed.
>
>
I don't think about Russia, much. When I do it's mostly positive. By
this I mean that I can understand them and their motivations better than
I can the French, for example.  Or at least that's what I think.

I don't know any Russians. There are very few in the US.

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"He who talks the talk must also walk the walk."

--Sawfish
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The Iceberg

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Sep 26, 2022, 4:29:37 AMSep 26
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if the USA hadn't taken so many assets from us just to join the war and the USA hadn't backed Nazi Germany with so much with $$$ previously, we and Russia would've beaten the daylights out of Germany easily.

LedZep IgaSwanTech

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Sep 26, 2022, 10:27:59 AMSep 26
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On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 4:04:19 PM UTC-5, *skriptis wrote:
> This is a major thread about Russia.

Well it flopped. Not many responded. So either.

a) It is not a MAJOR thread
or
b) No one gives a shit about Russia or Eastern Europe in general. All the West and Central Europe cares is not many Eastern European hobos in their cities/

>
> Everyone is invited to speak their minds.
>
>
> Why do you hate Russia?

Why would anyone hate any specific country in particular? All of it? All the people? Makes no frigging sense. I don't even hate Pakistan in that regard.

> Why do you love Russia?

Unless you have visited a particular country and seen its culture, food and interacted with it, why would anyone love that country. I loved visiting Germany, Switzerland, Netherlands, Denmark and Norway. Even France and Italy were fun... but I have never been to Russia... and given their authoritarian style of government would rather not go there. Would you go to Sudan? Russia is the Sudan of Europe these days - a third world banana republic ruled by a dictator who censors everything and jails or poisons his opponents.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/dictatorship-countries


>
> What do you want take from Russia?

Maria Sharapova, if she is available.
> What are you willing to concede to Russia?

Concede what?
> What feelings does Russia invoke in you?
Nothing. just disgust presently. I did like the Russian team in Euro 2008 when they were good and played attacking. But right now their soccer team is in decline and honestly boring to watch.


> What does Russia mean to you?
Nothing
>
> Only long posts allowed.
>
This is a non-moderated newsgroup. You are kidding yourself.

LedZep IgaSwanTech

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Sep 26, 2022, 10:29:35 AMSep 26
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On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 5:25:08 PM UTC-5, Mike DeSantis wrote:
> *skriptis schrieb am Samstag, 24. September 2022 um 23:04:19 UTC+2:
> > This is a major thread about Russia.
> >
> > Everyone is invited to speak their minds.
> >
> >
> > Why do you hate Russia?
> I don't hate Russia.
> I hate Putler and all Russian fascists.

Good point. *shitpiss is an idiot and the only here who is supporting Russia's invasion of Ukraine. Iceberg is another fool.

The Iceberg

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Sep 26, 2022, 11:21:41 AMSep 26
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On Monday, 26 September 2022 at 15:29:35 UTC+1, LedZep IgaSwanTech wrote:
> On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 5:25:08 PM UTC-5, Mike DeSantis wrote:
> > *skriptis schrieb am Samstag, 24. September 2022 um 23:04:19 UTC+2:
> > > This is a major thread about Russia.
> > >
> > > Everyone is invited to speak their minds.
> > >
> > >
> > > Why do you hate Russia?
> > I don't hate Russia.
> > I hate Putler and all Russian fascists.
> Good point. *shitpiss is an idiot and the only here who is supporting Russia's invasion of Ukraine. Iceberg is another fool.

if there was a switch to genocide all British, Russians and Republican-voting Texans, you'd press it.

LedZep IgaSwanTech

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Sep 26, 2022, 1:37:31 PMSep 26
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You are an asshole. I don't wish anyone dies except may be you and *shitpiss. Fuck you.

*skriptis

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Sep 27, 2022, 1:10:03 PMSep 27
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Mike DeSantis <aquate...@outlook.de> Wrote in message:
> I don't love Russia. I love Tchaikovsky.


This is a common theme so deserves reply.
The narrative similar to yours goes like this:

"Oh Russia has some fine individuals, some fine artists, composers, musicians, writers, and so on, but it's just their horrible government and nation that we don't like".


Such formulation reveals the russophobic expectations from those who issue it.

1. Against Russian collective identity
2. Against Russian power defending their identity



1. Rallying against Russian collective identity

In the first part of the above statement, the underlying message is this: "Russians are OK as atomised individuals, we can tolerate and like them for their achievements individually as long as they've been washed off of their identity". You can recognize this when they start listing individuals.

Of course, they ignore that if you wash off someone of his identity, he is no longer that person. Tchaikovsky would not have been Tchaikovsky if he weren't Russian. Same as Nadal would not have been Nadal if he weren't Spaniard dedicated to clay. He would still be good, but surely different.

So it's what it is among russophobes in the west.

They have a habit of celebrating all sorts of identities, blacks, Jews, Latinx, today especially the deranged ones, gays, tranny, etc etc.

But Russian collective identity is not welcomed. The reason is this, it's one of the strongest white identities, and Christian ones too. Jews who run USA hate it.

https://www.unz.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/russia.png



2. Rallying against Russian power defending their identity

This part becomes clear when russophobes add the "their government" part. They pretend to like the people, more often they say individuals, but "dislike the government", so they throw in disdain for Russian government, but it's not really disdain for the government, rather disdain for the state as a whole, and for the organized power structure tasked with defending Russia.

You see, all the artists you allegedly like, Tchaikovsky, Dostoevsky, and whatever name you can come up with, emerged and happened during the height of power, at the peak of Russian Empire in the 19th century.

Ditto for the greatest technological success of Soviet Union, happening at the peak of that era, first man in space and so on, and so.

Safe Russia = prosperous Russia.

This is not unique to Russian case, it's universal. You can't prosper if you're not safe.

Russia is deeply troubled country historically, geographically, with many enemies and security issues. The can only prosper and flourish once security issues are addressed and security demands fulfiled.

Then they can give Tchaikovsky to the world.

*skriptis

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Sep 27, 2022, 1:19:16 PMSep 27
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The Iceberg <iceber...@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r
> On Sunday, 25 September 2022 at 12:25:44 UTC+1, Custos Custodum wrote:> On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 02:58:43 -0700 (PDT), The Iceberg > <iceber...@gmail.com> wrote: > > >On Saturday, 24 September 2022 at 22:04:19 UTC+1, *skriptis wrote: > >> This is a major thread about Russia. > >> > >> Everyone is invited to speak their minds. > >> > >> > >> Why do you hate Russia? > >> Why do you love Russia? > >> > >> What do you want take from Russia? > >> What are you willing to concede to Russia? > >> What feelings does Russia invoke in you? > >> What does Russia mean to you? > >> > >> Only long posts allowed. > > > >Russia and Putin deserve sympathy and compensation because they are still suffering from trauma of when the USA sent to troops to invade them in 1918! > >> They'd be suffering even more had it not been for the $billions of aid > and military materiel they received from the USA under lend-lease > during WW2. It is doubtful whether they would have been able to push > Hitler back otherwise. > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lend-Lease#US_deliveries_to_the_Soviet_Unionif the USA hadn't taken so many assets from us just to join the war and the USA hadn't backed Nazi Germany with so much with $$$ previously, we and Russia would've beaten the daylights out of Germany easily.



Custos is a vile troll.

Surely USSR would have preferred that it was them who were sending food, trucks and material to USA, if that meant the war was fought on US soil and 27 million Americans died, instead of 0.4 millions.

You need both trucks and soldiers to win the war, that's why it was an alliance, but it's easier to give trucks for war effort than blood.

*skriptis

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Sep 27, 2022, 1:38:24 PMSep 27
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LedZep IgaSwanTech <zepf...@gmail.com> Wrote in message:
> Well it flopped. Not many responded.

It didn't flop. The thread has been a success.





> No one gives a shit about Russia or Eastern Europe in general. All the West and Central Europe cares is not many Eastern European hobos in their cities.


You're mixing eastern Europeans with gypsys (Indians) there.

There's only one type of hobos in Europe.


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-global-roma-rights-idUSKCN1RK01Y

The Roma migrated to Europe from India in the 10th century and have long faced persecution around the world. Many live on the fringes of society and struggle for work.

On Roma Visibility day, here are 10 facts about Roma people.

1. Roma are Europe’s largest ethnic minority, with up to 12 million living across the continent, most of them in Central and Eastern Europe.

4. More than half of Europeans said they would not want to have “Gypsies” as neighbors in a 2008 study that found only drug addicts, heavy drinkers and people with a criminal record were seen as less desirable.


The most gypsy nations in Europe.

• The Indian wheel size represents number of Indians.

• The shade of green represents percentage of Indians.


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9f/Romani_population_average_estimate.png?20090122143038



Mother Theresa is from the Balkans, Macedonia exactly. So in her life, she has meet Indians (gypsies) there long before she went to India.

Here's Macedonia with majority Indian town.

https://www.portal-udar.net/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/sakuplja%C4%8Di-1068x601.jpg







> but I have never been to Russia... and given their authoritarian style of government would rather not go there. Would you go to Sudan? Russia is the Sudan of Europe these days - a third world banana republic ruled by a dictator who censors everything and jails or poisons his opponents.


Dude, your US president Trump got silenced, so you're on top of the mountain when we discuss opression, his aides are arrested, and you even arrested Australian journalist Assange for doing journalism.

What foreign journalist has been arrested by Russia?
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