Alcaraz crushes Medvedev in Indian Wells final

[*skriptis]

Alcaraz (🔒) - Medvedev (🐻)

63 62


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[MBDunc]

On Monday, March 20, 2023 at 10:25:35 AM UTC+2, *skriptis wrote:
> Alcaraz (🔒) - Medvedev (🐻)
>
> 63 62

...and re-enters #1 (though he will have 1000pts to defend at KB).

Notable: Nadal drops out of top 10, had been in top 10 whole time since Spring 2005.

.mikko

[*skriptis]

MBDunc <mich...@dnainternet.net> Wrote in message:r
> On Monday, March 20, 2023 at 10:25:35 AM UTC+2, *skriptis wrote:> Alcaraz (🔒) - Medvedev (🐻) > > 63 62 ...and re-enters #1 (though he will have 1000pts to defend at KB).Notable: Nadal drops out of top 10, had been in top 10 whole time since Spring 2005..mikko


It's a fake drop out of top 10, had he been given his rightful 720 pts for Wimbledon SF, he would have still been top 10.

And give Djokovic his 2000 pts...


And that's without any coulda woulda regarding Djokovic and Medvedev bans in recent year

[Pelle Svanslös]

On 20.3.2023 10.34, MBDunc wrote:
> On Monday, March 20, 2023 at 10:25:35 AM UTC+2, *skriptis wrote:
>> Alcaraz (🔒) - Medvedev (🐻)
>>
>> 63 62
>
> ...and re-enters #1 (though he will have 1000pts to defend at KB).

That's quite a trouncing. Bad news for the former hopefuls like Tsi,
Meds, and Z who probably thought they would inherit the Earth after the
big 3.

--
"And off they went, from here to there,
The bear, the bear, and the maiden fair"
-- Traditional

[PeteWasLucky]

*skriptis <skri...@post.t-com.hr> Wrote in message:r
> Alcaraz ( ) - Medvedev ( )63 62-- ----Android NewsGroup Reader----https://piaohong.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/usenet/index.html

I was telling my family, there is nothing that Medvedev does that Alcaraz can't do much better. I expected dropshots and volleying from Alcaraz and he delivered.
When he is healthy he is very dangerous but I am worried he may get injured frequently.

[gap...@gmail.com]

Wait till he beats Djoker in a slam 5 setter before anointing him!

[*skriptis]

PeteWasLucky <waleed...@gmail.com> Wrote in message:
> I was telling my family, there is nothing that Medvedev does that Alcaraz can't do much better. I expected dropshots and volleying from Alcaraz and he delivered.When he is healthy he is very dangerous but I am worried he may get injured frequently.



Nadal is a bad matchup for Medvedev and Alcaraz is very similar to Nadal so it's kinda expected that he'd perform well.

Especially yesterday with those windy conditions, the guy with massive topspin against flat hitter?

I remember the blowout...


https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2009/mar/23/andy-murray-rafael-nadal-atp-masters-series-tennis

Mon 23 Mar 2009 00.32 GMT

A virus and Roger Federer could not stop Andy Murray but a wild wind and Rafael Nadal were too deadly a combination for the Scot, who suffered his worst defeat in many months when he lost 6-1, 6-2 in the final of the BNP Paribas Open here.



I'm sure Medvedev could do better in less windy conditions or especially indoors against Alcaraz.


On clay it will be just like in windy Indian Wells. ;)

[*skriptis]

*skriptis <skri...@post.t-com.hr> Wrote in message:r

> Alcaraz (🔒) - Medvedev (🐻)63 62-- ----Android NewsGroup Reader----https://piaohong.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/usenet/index.html



Great Medvedev interview, no clichés.


https://youtu.be/gVEMke120B8

[undecided]

The best match was the semi against Sinner. Meds stunk up the place in the final. He had no answer to Alcaraz.

[The Iceberg]

Sinner always seems to underperform once semi-finals come along, that's the difference between him and Alcaraz.

[Sawfish]

The biggest difference is that Sinner has to play Alcaraz and Alcaraz
doesn't.

--
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"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats."

--H. L. Mencken
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[gap...@gmail.com]

LOL!

[Whisper]

On 22/03/2023 2:29 am, Sawfish wrote:

>>> The best match was the semi against Sinner. Meds stunk up the place
>>> in the final. He had no answer to Alcaraz.
>> Sinner always seems to underperform once semi-finals come along,
>> that's the difference between him and Alcaraz.
>
> The biggest difference is that Sinner has to play Alcaraz and Alcaraz
> doesn't.
>

Sinner beat Alcaraz at Wimbledon last yr and had a match point at USO.
I agree he has under performed, but the margins are often very small. He
even led Djoker 2 sets to 0 at Wimbledon.

So what's missing? He has the game and also is a clever strategic
player. Hard to pinpoint exactly what's failing for him, nothing really
obvious. He just hasn't won a few critical points at the right time,
might just be a bit of a fluke? Probably just needs a decent coach,
which Cahill is so we'll see how he goes this yr. We can't really blame
anyone for losing to the energizer bunny when he isn't injured, that's a
tall order for anyone, but Sinner should be stepping up to beat everyone
else (and Charlie occasionally) if he's going to be a multi slam great.

[The Iceberg]

yes, think it's his coach, he needs an ex-player with slam winning experience, a bit like Tsitsi. Sinner seems to the type of kid that aspires to his coach's level and has the ability to do it, just needs someone with a bit extra.

[gap...@gmail.com]

Cahill is just a nobody! Get Cash or Phillippo…. or whoever!

[undecided]

Sinner has improved dramatically. I don't think it's a shame he lost to Alcaraz. Sinner would have also beaten Meds so he is up there. As long as the draw doesn't have Alcaraz before the final he will start making finals now.

[The Iceberg]

yes Cash won a slam!

[Sawfish]

You know, though...

I watched Sinner against Fritz and Alcaraz at Indian Wells, to get a
current idea of what his game is and what his mentality is. So my idea
is that he's not lacking mentality *that I can see* (for a
counter-example of the other extreme, see Shapovolov), and I see no
glaring or occasional weaknesses (as per Tsitsi's BH, when he loses
faith in it)--maybe 2nd serve could be better, but you could say that
about most players at least part of the time.

With his on court demeanor, control, and focus, it's hard not to like
him, personally, or at least find him admirable. But we can't let that
sway our observation of what's out there.

So I don't see his limitation as being mentality, technique, or
coaching. It leaves two prominent possibilities: a) conditioning
(although I see no overt evidence of this, as per Kyrgios earlier in his
career); and/or b) he is at about his peak potential, and it's about as
far as he'll go.

Think Thiem. Lots of good to be said, but...

Maybe Sinner'll win a couple of slams, and maybe not.

--
"It is Pointless, and endless Trouble, to cast a stone at every dog
that barks at you."

--Sawfish

[MBDunc]

What I have seen so far...(starting from his very teenage years)
.
Alcaraz is about a half notch above everyone else when healthy. His game is next level +0,2.

...only Djoker can match this rest of 2023...but not probably game-wise anymore but mental and experience (Wimbledon)?

.mikko

[undecided]

Sinner looks like a better version of Zverev. I think he can take a few slams. Alcaraz barely beat him.

[Sawfish]

Good comparison.

Similar physical skill set, far, far better mentally/emotionally.

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"It was public knowledge that Sawfish was a loner with strong misanthropic tendencies: it was rare for him to even say a word to his dog."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Whisper]

Will be interesting to see how high his level can go without tier 1
level competition. The big 3 had each other to propel to higher levels,
McEnroe kept getting better because of Borg (Connors/Lendl to a lesser
extent). Sampras was so much better than the field he had no rivals and
had to look to history books for motivation. Federer had no rivals for
a few yrs until Rafa/Djoker emerged.

Alcaraz has a lot of options which may work against him v certain style
opponents if he doesn't pick the right strategy for any given match. He
has the type of game that can blow away anyone on any surface by the
looks of it, slight question on grass due to small sample size, but his
shots look like they'll work very well on grass too.

Getting to 20+ slam level is a long way into the future and anything can
happen, but he can take a short cut to goat level status if he can win
say a calendar slam in next couple of yrs - if he wins 2 he'd be up
there with Laver and a strong goat candidate. If no calendar slam he'll
have to do it the hard way like the big 3 over 15 yrs or so. Hopefully
we get to see a few slam matches v him and Djoker in next yr or so.
Right now I'd have Djoker as fave, but that's not certain and be great
to have them play off a few times to see what would happen at this point
in time.

[Whisper]

Way more consistent and confident in his ability. Zverev sometimes
looks hopeful, Sinner has no doubt he can pull off great shots from
tough positions. I see Sinner's under performance as a bit of a fluke,
dam has to break soon.

[joh]

On Sunday, March 26, 2023 at 10:53:38 AM UTC+2, Whisper wrote:
> On 26/03/2023 6:29 am, MBDunc wrote:
> > What I have seen so far...(starting from his very teenage years)
> > .
> > Alcaraz is about a half notch above everyone else when healthy. His game is next level +0,2.
> >
> > ...only Djoker can match this rest of 2023...but not probably game-wise anymore but mental and experience (Wimbledon)?
> >
> > .mikko
> Will be interesting to see how high his level can go without tier 1
> level competition. The big 3 had each other to propel to higher levels,
> McEnroe kept getting better because of Borg (Connors/Lendl to a lesser
> extent). Sampras was so much better than the field he had no rivals and
> had to look to history books for motivation.

He should have looked at clay instead.

[*skriptis]

joh <josh...@gmail.com> Wrote in message:

> He should have looked at clay instead.

And what would have he got out of it?




Grass/clay was at its most diverse in 80s and 90s due to advancement of modern racquets with surface (balls) conditions remaining the same as in earlier period, creating such a discrepancy.

Nowadays effect of modern racquets are annuled with modified surfaces and balls to create more competitive environment.



It's not just Sampras. No other major great grass player was competitive enough to win at FO in that era, and likewise, no great clay player was competitive enough to win at Wimbledon.


Multiple Wimbledon champions in 80s and 90s, McEnroe, Becker, Edberg, Sampras, combined 15 Wimbledon titles, 0 FO titles.

Likewise, multiple FO champions, Wilander, Lendl, Courier, Bruguera, Kuerten, 13 FO titles, 0 Wimbledon titles.

It you can't notice it's not just Sampras, I'm afraid I can't help you.


And of course, there was a guy who won at both Wimbledon and FO during that era, Agassi, but at what price so to speak?

He only managed to win 1 title at each of the tournaments, proving that trying to be versatile in such environment would come at a great price. It's almost as if it didn't pay off.

And of course, there's that thing with Agassi sort of cheating, using grass shoes for his FO campaign, sort of changing the conditions for himself, giving himself the benefits similar to what modern players enjoy.

Federer had no rivals for > a few yrs until Rafa/Djoker emerged. > > Alcaraz has a lot of options which may work against him v certain style > opponents if he doesn't pick the right strategy for any given match. He > has the type of game that can blow away anyone on any surface by the > looks of it, slight question on grass due to small sample size, but his > shots look like they'll work very well on grass too. > > Getting to 20+ slam level is a long way into the future and anything can > happen, but he can take a short cut to goat level status if he can win > say a calendar slam in next couple of yrs - if he wins 2 he'd be up > there with Laver and a strong goat candidate. If no calendar slam he'll > have to do it the hard way like the big 3 over 15 yrs or so. Hopefully > we get to see a few slam matches v him and Djoker in next yr or so. > Right now I'd have Djoker as fave, but that's not certain and be great > to have them play off a few times to see what would happen at this point > in time.

[joh]

On Sunday, March 26, 2023 at 12:57:02 PM UTC+2, *skriptis wrote:
> joh <josh...@gmail.com> Wrote in message:
> > He should have looked at clay instead.
> And what would have he got out of it?

A more nuanced view on how dominant he was than Whisper is capable of giving.

>
>
>
>
> Grass/clay was at its most diverse in 80s and 90s due to advancement of modern racquets with surface (balls) conditions remaining the same as in earlier period, creating such a discrepancy.
>
> Nowadays effect of modern racquets are annuled with modified surfaces and balls to create more competitive environment.
>
>
>
> It's not just Sampras. No other major great grass player was competitive enough to win at FO in that era, and likewise, no great clay player was competitive enough to win at Wimbledon.

clown era

[Whisper]

On 26/03/2023 8:47 pm, joh wrote:
> On Sunday, March 26, 2023 at 10:53:38 AM UTC+2, Whisper wrote:
>> On 26/03/2023 6:29 am, MBDunc wrote:
>>> What I have seen so far...(starting from his very teenage years)
>>> .
>>> Alcaraz is about a half notch above everyone else when healthy. His game is next level +0,2.
>>>
>>> ...only Djoker can match this rest of 2023...but not probably game-wise anymore but mental and experience (Wimbledon)?
>>>
>>> .mikko
>> Will be interesting to see how high his level can go without tier 1
>> level competition. The big 3 had each other to propel to higher levels,
>> McEnroe kept getting better because of Borg (Connors/Lendl to a lesser
>> extent). Sampras was so much better than the field he had no rivals and
>> had to look to history books for motivation.
>
> He should have looked at clay instead.
>

He was capable of winning on clay, eg beat 7 FO champions on clay, 4 at
FO etc. You were probably a toddler but at the time tennis was far more
diverse than today, greater surface variety, greater range of opponent
styles, different equipment etc. Other factors were Sampras' blood
condition which prevented him playing brainless baseline slugfests like
we see everywhere today.

What I find remarkable about Sampras is he was so far ahead of the field
he actually could get away with half trying and still being no.1 a
record 6 yrs in a row. How many players today can get away with
coasting on return games, knowing they won't be broken and just go for 1
break per set? Absolutely nobody is that far ahead of the field to pull
it off. My greatest wish is for Sampras to have played in this era.
Imagine how much more lethal his serve would be today with the juiced
strings and rackets? Remember he served bigger in retirement with
modern equipment than in his playing days. If he had to play the big 3
regularly we would have seen him up his level from half arsed to fully
arsed. The contrast in styles v Djoker/Nadal would have produced some
of the best tennis ever imo. You have the ultimate big
server/volleyer/athlete v the best baseliners ever. As much as I like
Rafa I think he would have been at a huge disadvantage off clay.
Sampras himself said he was smacking his lips watching how far Nadal was
behind the baseline v Federer in those classic 2007/8 Wimbledon finals,
just itching to get back out there. For a guy like Sampras playing guys
that far behind the baseline (Rafa, Medvedev) would have been an amazing
free kick. I'm more fascinated with the Djoker challenge at Wim/USO.
Djoker has the advantage of being the best returner ever, so the battle
would be get enough big serves back in awkward positions and try and
wrest control.

Remember Sampras has 12 Wim/USO titles despite playing only to 31.
Roger has 13 but played til 41, 10 years more. Djoker is at 10 at age
35. The big 3 needed a Sampras in the mix to make the era more dynamic
on the court rather than just tearing up the history books.

[gap...@gmail.com]

Cheap $1 peter is behind ND, RN, RF, and RL, even BB! Not a bad player tho’

[joh]

On Sunday, March 26, 2023 at 5:02:23 PM UTC+2, Whisper wrote:
> On 26/03/2023 8:47 pm, joh wrote:
> > On Sunday, March 26, 2023 at 10:53:38 AM UTC+2, Whisper wrote:
> >> On 26/03/2023 6:29 am, MBDunc wrote:
> >>> What I have seen so far...(starting from his very teenage years)
> >>> .
> >>> Alcaraz is about a half notch above everyone else when healthy. His game is next level +0,2.
> >>>
> >>> ...only Djoker can match this rest of 2023...but not probably game-wise anymore but mental and experience (Wimbledon)?
> >>>
> >>> .mikko
> >> Will be interesting to see how high his level can go without tier 1
> >> level competition. The big 3 had each other to propel to higher levels,
> >> McEnroe kept getting better because of Borg (Connors/Lendl to a lesser
> >> extent). Sampras was so much better than the field he had no rivals and
> >> had to look to history books for motivation.
> >
> > He should have looked at clay instead.
> >
> He was capable of winning on clay, eg beat 7 FO champions on clay, 4 at
> FO etc.

But he didnt realise it was winning the final it was all about?
Looking at history books for inspiration, but too dense to get it?
Sad.

You were probably a toddler but at the time tennis was far more
> diverse than today, greater surface variety, greater range of opponent
> styles, different equipment etc. Other factors were Sampras' blood
> condition which prevented him playing brainless baseline slugfests like
> we see everywhere today.

Boo hoo.

[The Iceberg]

yes very good post, also Sampras' mentality would've been a huge problem for them. He wouldn't have rolled over for any of them, you might've seen scenes like Djoker vs Stan/Meds a lot more vs Sampras, it would've been amazing to have him in the mix.

[The Iceberg]

where does that put your hero Agassi?

[The Iceberg]

On Sunday, 26 March 2023 at 16:59:28 UTC+1, joh wrote:
> On Sunday, March 26, 2023 at 5:02:23 PM UTC+2, Whisper wrote:
> > On 26/03/2023 8:47 pm, joh wrote:
> > > On Sunday, March 26, 2023 at 10:53:38 AM UTC+2, Whisper wrote:
> > >> On 26/03/2023 6:29 am, MBDunc wrote:
> > >>> What I have seen so far...(starting from his very teenage years)
> > >>> .
> > >>> Alcaraz is about a half notch above everyone else when healthy. His game is next level +0,2.
> > >>>
> > >>> ...only Djoker can match this rest of 2023...but not probably game-wise anymore but mental and experience (Wimbledon)?
> > >>>
> > >>> .mikko
> > >> Will be interesting to see how high his level can go without tier 1
> > >> level competition. The big 3 had each other to propel to higher levels,
> > >> McEnroe kept getting better because of Borg (Connors/Lendl to a lesser
> > >> extent). Sampras was so much better than the field he had no rivals and
> > >> had to look to history books for motivation.
> > >
> > > He should have looked at clay instead.
> > >
> > He was capable of winning on clay, eg beat 7 FO champions on clay, 4 at
> > FO etc.
> But he didnt realise it was winning the final it was all about?
> Looking at history books for inspiration, but too dense to get it?
> Sad.

no it was a pizza, remember, duh.

>are you saying that cos you

> You were probably a toddler but at the time tennis was far more
> > diverse than today, greater surface variety, greater range of opponent
> > styles, different equipment etc. Other factors were Sampras' blood
> > condition which prevented him playing brainless baseline slugfests like
> > we see everywhere today.
> Boo hoo.

why do you keep switching players?

[gap...@gmail.com]

Armenian bad hair not my hero, paid for Pancho’s funeral, who died penniless in a trailer park, made millions for kramer, laver and thousands other, would have destroyed petey boy!

[Sawfish]

Is that you, gypes?

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"To the average American or Englishman the very name of anarchy causes a shudder, because it invariably conjures up a picture of a land terrorized by low-browed assassins with matted beards, carrying bombs in one hand and mugs of beer in the other. But as a matter of fact, there is no reason whatever to believe that, if all laws were abolished tomorrow, such swine would survive the day."

--H. L. Mencken
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