Was Perry Schwarzburg as good as they say?
WatcherOfThSkies
Lane had wins over world class players. They said he might
have even been better than Lane. Apparently he defeated Danny
Seemiller a few times. Not sure if he ever defeated Eric Boggan.
He was described as playing a very similar style to Bengtsson
of Sweden. Very consistent blocking and hitting.
Larry Hodges
news:20010124005407...@ng-ci1.aol.com...
Perry Schwartzberg was always the player who finished as first alternate to
the U.S. Team. It's hard to compare levels from different eras, but he was
usually ranked about 5th or 6th in the U.S. He had very good serves, and a
steady countering game to go along with his loop. Toward the end of his
career, he went to hardbat on his backhand, and only dropped a little in the
rankings. He also switched to a hammer grip late in his career. I believe
Perry only beat Dan once in a tournament match out of many dozens of
matches. They were practice partners (along with Ricky and Randy Seemiller)
for many years, training in Pittsburgh.
Jimmy Lane was a couple of spots lower than Perry. He also beat Dan one
time. He was a steady counterdriver.
-Larry Hodges
pong...@my-deja.com
> Perry Schwartzberg was always the player who finished as first
alternate to
> the U.S. Team. It's hard to compare levels from different eras, but
he was
> usually ranked about 5th or 6th in the U.S. He had very good serves,
and a
> steady countering game to go along with his loop. Toward the end of
his
> career, he went to hardbat on his backhand, and only dropped a little
in the
> rankings. He also switched to a hammer grip late in his career. I
believe
> Perry only beat Dan once in a tournament match out of many dozens of
> matches. They were practice partners (along with Ricky and Randy
Seemiller)
> for many years, training in Pittsburgh.
>
> Jimmy Lane was a couple of spots lower than Perry. He also beat Dan
one
> time. He was a steady counterdriver.
>
> -Larry Hodges
>
time that really sticks out in my mind was during the infamous "Black
Saturday" at the Nationals in 1985. That year they experimented with a
different format which resulted in the final 12 players being divided
into two round-robins of six, rather than the more typical single-
elimination format. From there, the top two finishers from each group
would advance into the semi-finals. In one group, Sean O'Neill went
undefeated, but controversy clouded the determination of the second
place finisher. As the completion of the round-robin drew near, it
appeared there would be a three-way tie: Perry had beaten Danny, Danny
had beaten Jimmy Butler, and Jimmy had beaten Perry. In this scenario,
Jimmy would advance based on tie-breaking procedures. However, in
Perry's final match against the bottom player in the group, Allen
Kaichi, he unexpectedly lost, causing an uproar of speculation that he
dumped in order to give his close friend, Danny the second-place finish
(based on the head-to-head win over Jimmy). This put Danny in the very
awkward situation of choosing between following his competitive
instinct to seek yet another national title or bowing out in
recognition of unfair circumstances. He eventually chose the latter,
enabling the 14-year old Butler to pull a major semi-final upset over
Eric Boggan before losing in the final to the 17-year old O'Neill, his
first of what would eventually be five national men's singles titles.
Incidentally, I practiced with Perry last night. He has recently
started playing a couple of times a week, primarily for the exercise.
He has stated emphatically that if not for the 40 mm ball, he wouldn't
be playing again. I would estimate his current level at around 2200.
- Robert -
Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/
bernd...@my-deja.com
"Larry Hodges" <ttw...@erols.com> wrote:
> WatcherOfThSkies <watchero...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20010124005407...@ng-ci1.aol.com...
> > People are telling me that Perry Schwarzburg as well as Jimmy
> > Lane had wins over world class players. They said he might
> > have even been better than Lane. Apparently he defeated Danny
> > Seemiller a few times. Not sure if he ever defeated Eric Boggan.
> > He was described as playing a very similar style to Bengtsson
> > of Sweden. Very consistent blocking and hitting.
>
> Perry Schwartzberg was always the player who finished as first
alternate to
> the U.S. Team. It's hard to compare levels from different eras, but
he was
> usually ranked about 5th or 6th in the U.S. He had very good serves,
and a
> steady countering game to go along with his loop. Toward the end of
his
> career, he went to hardbat on his backhand, and only dropped a little
in the
> rankings.
I saw Perry Schwartzberg play only once, in 1985 at a tournament at the
Ohio State Fair. Not too shabby. If, late in his career, he had had
the good sense to go to hardbat on his forehand as well, who knows what
he might have achieved?
Berndt Mann
He also switched to a hammer grip late in his career. I believe
> Perry only beat Dan once in a tournament match out of many dozens of
> matches. They were practice partners (along with Ricky and Randy
Seemiller)
> for many years, training in Pittsburgh.
>
> Jimmy Lane was a couple of spots lower than Perry. He also beat Dan
one
> time. He was a steady counterdriver.
>
> -Larry Hodges
>
>
pong...@my-deja.com
> I saw Perry Schwartzberg play only once, in 1985 at a tournament at
the
> Ohio State Fair. Not too shabby. If, late in his career, he had had
> the good sense to go to hardbat on his forehand as well, who knows
what
> he might have achieved?
>
> Berndt Mann
>
imagine the lucrative endorsements that would surely follow!
- Robert -
Scott Gordon
: I saw Perry Schwartzberg play only once, in 1985 at a tournament at the
: Ohio State Fair. Not too shabby. If, late in his career, he had had
: the good sense to go to hardbat on his forehand as well, who knows what
: he might have achieved?
About two years ago, I met Perry at one of the major tournaments (US Open
or Nationals, I can't remember), and we played several hardbat-to-hardbat
matches. He mostly chopped, and won every game rather easily.
Scott
SAM
> news:20010124005407...@ng-ci1.aol.com...
> Perry Schwartzberg was always the player who finished as first
alternate to
> the U.S. Team. It's hard to compare levels from different eras, but
he was
> usually ranked about 5th or 6th in the U.S
> -Larry Hodges
Mike Stern was always better than Schwartzberg or anyone in his era, as
long as he trained. Too bad Mike lost interest in the game. This
happens to many promissing players in the game.
SAM
Larry Hodges
news:94n0ne$bn8$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
At the time Stern stopped playing (at age 18 or so?), he was better than
Perry Schwartzberg, but I think he was a couple of years older. (I'm not
sure about their relative ages.) Stern was about 2300 when he stopped. Perry
got much better than Stern ever was later on, although I think Stern would
have been as good if he had continued.
-Larry Hodges
SAM
Mike kept Perry from winning titles. He held 2 titles, 1 in his age
group & 1, above. If there was a successor to Dan S. it was destined to
be Mike.
SAM
John Schneider
would have advanced to the semi's if he had defeated Ricky Seemiller
(Perry lost deuce in the third after having had a match point). I was
working at the control desk on "Black Saturday" and, the way I
remembered it, Perry Schwartzberg had lost in three games to Allen
Kaichi. However, in looking at the write-up in Topics, Perry retired
from the match (apparently just before the start of the third game)
before Allen (possibly at Sue Butler's urging) could do the same. I
guess memory really is the first thing to go...
> Incidentally, I practiced with Perry last night. He has recently
> started playing a couple of times a week, primarily for the exercise.
> He has stated emphatically that if not for the 40 mm ball, he wouldn't
> be playing again. I would estimate his current level at around 2200.
Is Perry still using an old Stiga blade? I remember (at least I think
I remember) that he had an ad in Topics looking for them. BTW, didn't
Perry marry Patti Simon, daughter of former ratings chairman Dan Simon?
John
John Schneider
Mike Stern won the Under-13 event at the 1971 Nationals so he's no
older than 43. From the 1990-91 USTTA Official Media Guide, Perry
Schwartzberg is now 41 (DOB: 10/12/59). Perry's carrer highlights (all
1st place):
1975,1977,1981 Texas State Champion
1975 U-15 U.S. Open
1976 U-17 Junior Nationals
1981 U.S. National Sports Festival (later became U.S. Olympic Festival)
1981 Men's Amateurs U.S. Nationals
1982 National Intercollegiate Championship
1983 Pan American team member
1984 Mixed Doubles Cuban Invitational (with Lan Vuong)
1985 Men's Doubles U.S. Nationals (with Scott Boggan)
BICENBKS
was Jeff Jarvela of Flint, Michigan.
Not Mike Stern. He defeated Steve Hammond of Texas in the final. I know
this because I played in the same club
as Jeff Jarvela. I was unhappy not to
have won, because I beat Jeff in our club
about 10X straight in the club right after.
Mike played in this tournament, but he
didn't win. I think he won in 1973.
John Schneider
I was just going by what Tim Boggan wrote:
http://www.usatt.org/organization/halloffame/rseemiller.html
Jim Short
Steve Hammond was an Okie. A very promising table tennis career (and
life) cut tragically short.
Ty Hoff
tournament. He actually was attending a sports memorabilia show the same
weekend at the Houston Astrodome. Perry was big into sports trading cards.
I believe that he lost a major collection a few years back in a fire but has
since rebuilt his collection.
Perry was the Head Coach my first summer of organized play at a 4 day camp
at the Butterfly TTC in Wilson, NC in 1980. Tom Poston organized the camp
for 16 junior players. Larry Hodges assisted at the camp also. Perry was
very professional. He sent out follow up letters to all the players with
analysis of our games and tips on how to improve (I still have the letter).
Exactly ten years later I coached the #3 USA Men's Team at the 1990 US Open
in Baltimore. My team consisted of Perry Schwartzberg, Scott Butler, and
Derek May. We lost a close match to the #1 team from Peru fielded by the
brother combo of Walter Nathan and Yair Nathan.
Ty
"Scott Gordon" <sgo...@bolt.sonic.net> wrote in message
news:GHDb6.19$FF3....@typhoon.sonic.net...
BICENBKS
you could ever meet. He was like Bjorn
Borg, totally quiet. He really should have
won that match against a very foul mouthed Jarvela. After the match, he told
me that he used to be just as bad a
sport as Jeff. Then he decided to never
reveal his emotions, to be very poker faced.. The story is very similar to the
Bjorn Borg story. Borg claims he was
so loud and obnoxious that he was actually
kicked out of tennis as a junior for several
months. His parents locked his racquet
in a closet. His father won the racquet as
a prize for winning the Sodertalje city
table tennis championship, which Borg
recalls took a full week. It's hard to
even imagine Steve Hammond being a
poor sport.
Mike
SAM
John Schneider <john...@my-deja.com> wrote:
I've red what Tim Boggan wrote John:
Nor was that all the excitement for the U.S. players and their
contingent. In the Men's Doubles, Danny and Ricky upset, or at least
certainly defeated--in straight games, was it?--the Chinese team of Guo
Yuehua/Liao Fu-Min. Though Gao was acknowledged by many as the World's
premier player from 1977 through 1983, Danny's advice to Ricky right
off was, "Don't be scared of these Chinese. Make them scared of you."
And after winning the match, he confided, "They were so confused. They
kept talking all the way through."
I'm confused about his writings. I had to read it several times trying
to understand it. IMO, it's is not good english & it's typical of his
writings.
SAM
Robert E. Mattox Jr.
It helps to have at least a minimal command of the English language when you
read a "Boggan" article-better stick to commenting on "internet video"?
Cheers,
Chipnews:94pbng$c1e$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
pong...@my-deja.com
"Robert E. Mattox Jr." <rem...@parrett.net> wrote:
> SAM
> It helps to have at least a minimal command of the English language
when you
> read a "Boggan" article-better stick to commenting on "internet
video"?
> Cheers,
> Chip
has nothing to do with the vocabulary he chooses, rather his tendency
to drift off on several different tangents before returning to the
original point - all within a single sentence. Nevertheless, his
tournament articles are generally quite interesting in the sense that
he tries to add flavor by throwing little personal tidbits about the
individuals he's reporting on, often having little or nothing to do
with the actual matches.
- Robert -
Jamey Hall
(more typically) great.
Alanzieg
remember it (probably incorrectly) as the under 11 event (even though he had
already turned twelve at the time it was held). It was the same tournament that
John Tannehill was beaten in the finals by Daljun Lee (sp.?) who, apparently in
a deliberate effort to gain the upper hand in the match, resorted to an
illegal serve that he tossed back at his racket for extra speed.
Stern seemed to have more raw talent than Seemiller but never seemed to have
the interest or discipline to concentrate on the game (at least in the manner
that I see when Adam Hugh trains). In fact I don't remember Stern ever
training. I think his coaching was rather minimal. By the time he was
seventeen, he had already broken his playing arm twice during other risky
pursuits.
Alan Ziegler
John Schneider
alan...@aol.com (Alanzieg) wrote:
> I saw Mike Stern win the Nationals when it was held in Long Island,
but I
> remember it (probably incorrectly) as the under 11 event (even though
he had
> already turned twelve at the time it was held). It was the same
tournament that
> John Tannehill was beaten in the finals by Daljun Lee
Dal Joon Lee beat John Tannehill in the finals of two U.S. Opens - 1969
in San Francisco and 1970 in Detroit. The 1972 U.S. Open was held in
Long Island (Hempstead) where D.J. beat Jack Howard in the finals.
Dave Williams
with style and flare but were not necessarily dedicated to "hard training" at the
time included IMO Timmy House, Mike Bush, Tim O'Grosky, the late Rutledge Barry
(an exceptionally precocious talent) and our own newgroup's Mike Baber. Others,
who did not reach the level of Danny Seemiller and Eric Boggan but who worked hard
enough to get a little closer to the ring included Bill Lesner, Erol Cateano and
Mike Velliette. The 80's then ushered in Sean O'Neill and Jim Butler. What names
come to mind who added to the landscape of talented youngsters in that era?
Lefty
Larry Hodges
news:3A741093...@mindspring.com...
> Other teen talents on the US Mid West/East Coast table tennis scene who
played
> with style and flare but were not necessarily dedicated to "hard training"
at the
> time included IMO Timmy House, Mike Bush, Tim O'Grosky, the late Rutledge
Barry
> (an exceptionally precocious talent) and our own newgroup's Mike Baber.
Others,
> who did not reach the level of Danny Seemiller and Eric Boggan but who
worked hard
> enough to get a little closer to the ring included Bill Lesner, Erol
Cateano and
> Mike Velliette.
I assume you are referring to Erol Caetano of Canada? He reached nearly the
same level as Dan Seemiller and Atanda Musa. Besides being Canadian Champion
a number of times (anyone know how many times?), he reached #33 in the
world.
-Larry Hodges
Big Hair Televangelist(tm)
He beat Seemiller at least once, and one of the big
name, Swedish players, back when they were juniors.
SAM
Caetano & everyone at that level had to train oversees to get there.
Caetano also trained in Hungary.
SAM
John Schneider
I believe Errol Caetano won the Canadian Nationals seven times.
John Schneider
"Big Hair Televangelist(tm)" <bighairtel...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> I heard that Jim Lane was a good west coast player.
> He beat Seemiller at least once, and one of the big
> name, Swedish players, back when they were juniors.
Other good young West Coast players of the 1970's include Paul Raphel,
Dean Galardi, and Dennis Barish. Paul Raphel and Rutledge Barry are
the two most talented players that I have known personally. Dean Wong
was one of the best young West Coast players in the early 80's.
John
>
> Dave Williams wrote:
>
> > Other teen talents on the US Mid West/East Coast table tennis scene
who played
> > with style and flare but were not necessarily dedicated to "hard
training" at the
> > time included IMO Timmy House, Mike Bush, Tim O'Grosky, the late
Rutledge Barry
> > (an exceptionally precocious talent) and our own newgroup's Mike
Baber. Others,
> > who did not reach the level of Danny Seemiller and Eric Boggan but
who worked hard
> > enough to get a little closer to the ring included Bill Lesner,
Erol Cateano and
> > Mike Velliette. The 80's then ushered in Sean O'Neill and Jim
Butler. What names
> > come to mind who added to the landscape of talented youngsters in
that era?
> >
> > Lefty
>
>
bernd...@my-deja.com
At the Columbus club in the early '70s, besides John Tannehill, we had
Richard Farrell, a two wing looper who on his A-game could give
Tannehill a tussle, and Roger Lewis, a kid with a real clean flat
forehand. Mark Wampler, a lefty with a nasty loop and smash follow,
also played there, as did Mike Joelson, who played out of Cleveland.
John Lehman of Cleveland was also playing some pretty fair all-round
hardbat; forehand by Reisman (stylish but nowhere near as hard as
Marty's) and defense after Miles (pretty decent--Steve Berger, who is
stronger, comes to mind). I practiced with John in the early '60s and
a bit in the early '70s after I got out of the Army. I liked his style
and at that time patterned mine (except for Danny Vegh's footwork)
after his as he had patterned his after Reisman and Miles.
Berndt Mann
Big Hair Televangelist(tm)
John Schneider wrote:
> In article <3A747577...@my-deja.com>,
> "Big Hair Televangelist(tm)" <bighairtel...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> > I heard that Jim Lane was a good west coast player.
> > He beat Seemiller at least once, and one of the big
> > name, Swedish players, back when they were juniors.
>
> Other good young West Coast players of the 1970's include Paul Raphel,
> Dean Galardi, and Dennis Barish. Paul Raphel and Rutledge Barry are
> the two most talented players that I have known personally. Dean Wong
> was one of the best young West Coast players in the early 80's.
>
> John
>
I remember Paul Raphel, and Dean Galardi, and Dennis Barish.I believe Dean,
and Dennis were Lou Dubbins students for a time.
I think that Dean Galardi died. Not sure where Paul Raphel
ended up. I remember Jim Lane blocked him down, once.
Larry Hodges
> I think that Dean Galardi died.
Yes, he died in a car accident, I think around 1980 or so.
-Larry Hodges
BICENBKS
I believe Dean died while riding his
bicycle at night in L.A. I think it was
after he left the L.A. club. Dean had
only one kidney.
Mike
John Schneider
Dean Galardi died in the early 80's. I believe he choked on something
while riding his bike. Paul Raphel made a short-lived return to TT a
few years ago. He had a problem with an umpire at the first tournament
he played (Paul has a history of problems with umpires) and at the
second tournament he had to wait about six hours before playing a
match. I don't think he wanted to play in any tournaments after these
experiences. However, he is talking about making another return,
perhaps at this year's Meiklejohn National Seniors tournament. BTW,
Paul accomplished more in TT than Jimmy Lane did (i.e. 1973 U.S. Open
Junior champion and 1975 and 1977 U.S. team member).
MFBaltaxe
better than Galardi , Barish or Lane.Lane was very consistent but lacked a big
shot. I agree with John that the most talented were Raphael and Barry who
played a lot in the 90s in los angeles before commiting suicide
John Schneider
Mike,
I meant to mention Ray and Ricky Guillen. There was also musclebound
Craig Manoogian who defeated Eric Boggan at the 1979 Nationals. Kevin
Choes was another good young player in Los Angeles in the early 80's.
John
Big Hair Televangelist(tm)
John Schneider wrote:
People like to make comparisons about various players,
but ultimately, it's pointless.
So, and so beat so, and so.
This too is meaningless, a chasing after the wind.
Regards,
Big Hair
Big Hair Televangelist(tm)
MFBaltaxe wrote:
Hello Baltaxe,
Thanks for sharing.
I barely remember Paul Raphel, only that he had long hair,
and seemed to me to be a rebellious guy, but that's just me
judging people.
Nobody ever answered my question over at About.com.
I wanted to know who did Jim Lane beat during his career?
I know he defeated Appelgren, when they both were juniors.
Regards,
Big Hair
MFBaltaxe
heard of them
Larry Thoman
ever been around. I went to at least 2 to 3 training camps with Rutledge
in the 70's. He was pretty small but extremely smart. He had excellent
placement and a knack for selecting the exactly correct response to any
incoming shot. Once he found a winning strategy, he was like a bulldog in
that he would never let go of it as long as he was winning points with it.
The most memorable wins of his that I witnessed were two wins over Charlie
Wuvanich of Thailand. At the time, Charlie was staying in the US, and had
beaten Istvan Joyner of Hungary was he was reigning World Champion.
Wuvanich's best competition was Danny Seemiller, and they would meet many
times in tournament finals. Wuvanich would win probably 2/3 to 3/4 of the
times they played. Wuvanich had a awesome straight arm smash and was one
of the early proponents of the high toss serve.
I was always amazed when Danny would kill loop a push (he was considered
to have the best loop off push in the US at the time) and Charlie would
smash it back at twice the speed. He was fearless! The only person Charlie
feared in matches was little Rutledge Barry, the one person (to my best
recollection) that he could never beat. Rutledge had such absolute mastery
over ball control that Charlie could never get his big smash off. Had
Rutledge not gotten off into drugs and kept training, I had no doubt that
he had the talent to be world champion.
In article <9522v2$c09$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, John Schneider
<john...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
>Other good young West Coast players of the 1970's include Paul Raphel,
>Dean Galardi, and Dennis Barish. Paul Raphel and Rutledge Barry are
>the two most talented players that I have known personally. Dean Wong
>was one of the best young West Coast players in the early 80's.
--
PLAY PONG & LIVE LONG!
Larry Thoman, General Manager, Newgy Industries
805 Teal Drive, P.O. Box 959, Gallatin, TN 37066 USA
Phone (615) 452-6470, Fax (615) 230-9785, http://www.newgy.com
MFBaltaxe
for the game
Alanzieg
Dal Joon Lee beat John Tannehill in the finals of two U.S. Opens - 1969
in San Francisco and 1970 in Detroit. The 1972 U.S. Open was held in
Long Island (Hempstead) where D.J. beat Jack Howard in the finals.
As I also saw the 1972 Dal Joon Lee match with Howard, I must have been
remembering the semi-final match with Tannehill. As I recall, Howard had a very
impressive backhand kill but could not cover the entire table with it against
Lee's loop drive. I don't recall Lee using an illegal serve in this match.
rcg...@cox.net
John Merkel
> I don't know how many years Jimmy and Perry played at the same time. Sometime around 1980, Jimmy was ranked #4 in the USA. He beat Eric Bogen once at tournament in Houston (that was probably when he reached #4 on the rankings, around 2450 at the time). After training in China, he beat Danny Seemiller at a smaller tournament in Hollywood. Jimmy had a winning record versus Atilla Malek, but Atilla peaked in 1978, while Jimmy peaked a few years later. Jimmy left table tennis in the mid to late 1980's.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gRjOYlwTqY
Jeffrey Steif
rcgldr
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUmhIazHl-s