Phil Bruder's Old Team
Gary Haning
>
> gary has 12 national championships, larry and phil are tied with 11
however
> phils are all at the most advanced age level while larry and gary have
some at
> younger age divisions. all three are great coachs and have placed
hundreds of
> girls at div 1 level schools on scholarships. someone once told me that
if you
> want finesse softball play for larry if you want hardcore softball play
for
> phil. i'd say gary is sort of in the middle but lurks around more!!
> glenn
Glenn:
Since I am the only person who reads this newsgroup who really knows and I
do not want Jim Dolan, John Sansone, Bob Wenk, Tyrone, Dale Moore
overlooked:
None of the numbers mentioned for any of the teams/coaches are correct
(except that "Batbusters" have won 12 times, not all OC were mine and some
were also CASE BB), I am not going into the numbers as it is really without
meaning. The times were different when Phil was involved, Larry's teams are
asssembled differently than ours, and I think the fairest statement is that
all are/were good teams.
(if you really have to know the numbers look closely at the Rule Book or
email me)
For what it is worth, from 1976-1985 Phil's teams were the best there have
ever been relative to their competition. The team Larry brought into 18U in
1987 with Lisa and much of the 1986 National Champion, Inland City Raiders
(not Phil's), was possibly the best ever 18U and then 19U team, it still
took them 2 years to beat the Raiders (Phil's). Although Phil's team won in
again 1991, 1988 was his last truly superior team (I was in younger age
groups during this time, post-87 through 92).
Also for what it is worth, though Phil was the BEST game coach that there
has been, he could not have kept the players to dominate in today's
softball.
Gary Haning
Rebels16U
I remember a game against a vastly inferior out of state team where the fans on
the third base side would have hung him if they could have found a rope..he
kept telling them when he was going to score..It is hard to explain but he kept
taunting them the whole game..I also know that the girls who played for him
liked him and said that he was different at practices, etc. but I thought from
the outside looking in, he was pretty abusive...JMHO But it would be funny to
see someone even close to him today to see how people would react.
Earl Headrick
today?
Gary Haning
>
> Gary, What has changed that makes you feel that Phil couldn't keep the
players
> today?
>
Hello,
First I should say that Phil is a friend who I like alot and I think he is
still a great coach. He is totally devoted to his family and a much
different person even while coaching. Anyone who has seen his teams since
1990 or so has NO IDEA what he was like earlier.
It was all to bond his team, to make them think it is "us against the
world", and it was them against the world. No one in softball has ever
matched Phil as a motivator. For one game with my life on the line, he is
the coach. I don't know why it worked so well but it did.
His team was the only game in town, no other team from So Cal even went to
18U ASA Nationals until we did. There were no Qualifiers, there was ONE
berth for the state, and very few teams even played ASA. There was an AGSA
team called the Bravados that beat the Raiders 3 times in three tries one
year when the Raiders won ASA Nationals, the Bravados actually had 3 or 4
players that became All-Americans in college and one of their two best
players did not even complete her freshman year at UCLA or she would have
been a multiple time All-American, I'm not sure I have ever,to this day,
seen a better shortstop. They were not an ASA team and did not care about
nationals. The Westminster Rowdies which is the team Phil's mother-in-law
formed, beat the Raiders. She played a huge part in the success of the
Raiders.
In today's world I have been considered to be harsh, on my harshest day I
could not even begin to approach what Phil did; he actually thinks it is
hilarious that anyone could look at me as being harsh. He was a RELENTLESS
recruiter, he recruited players from Texas, Virginia, at a time when they
had to live here during the school year to be eligible for JO. Colleen, his
mother-in-law, would house them for the year. Not the Virginia pitcher,
supposedly they told him to take a flying leap after he called them a number
of times. (BTW this is hearsay, I never asked Phil about it)
There are too many teams, too many berths, too many scholarships in softball
now for people to accept what they did then, Phil would still have a good
team and probably win now and again but he could not get all of the good
players any longer and his behavior as it was then would prevent him from
getting the players to consider his team and they would not have a chance to
learn that he really is a good guy.
Probably the funniest thing is that Phil, who is the world's biggest
advocate and teacher of "swing hard you might hit it", has a wonderful, cute
little girl who just happens to be a slapper. Phil used to say, "Slappers
should just take a baton up to the plate, they really don't deserve a bat",
and now he and Raleen bring her out here to visit and come by for some
slapping lessons while in So Cal, that was really fun.
Phil of course still believes she will also hit home runs and I surely would
not argue with him. She will be very good.
Gary Haning
Earl Headrick
I got to know Phil a little last year when I coached in the same organization as
he is. I watched him in his last years with the Raiders when he visited here.
I believe I saw the Batbusters and Raiders play in Ft. Collins. Phil is very
controversial, but as you say a "good guy." Your comment that he is the "best
game coach" also impresses me. Thanks for the history.
Earl
Earl Headrick
pitchers from California and have them live here. Phil was his teams batting
coach. Now I know where the plan came from.
BasBalPlar
this past summer w/ the Shamrocks, Tommy Orndorff had him stop by and speak to
the team, great speaker and speech to motivate the girls. After this ended he
ended up back at the hotel telling his stories w/ Tommy to those of us who
hadnt heard them. Needless to say I walked out of the room crying from
laughing so hard, especially the story about him mooning the fans from the
opposing team when they were yelling at him. Anyway, that is all I have. Just
wanted to say Phil is a good guy.
Ken
Glenn pin
played with wenk's batbusters and feel very close to tyron so whoever is
running the show at what ever age , good luck again!!!!
glenn
Hiller SB
In article <76cl2v$r...@sjx-ixn9.ix.netcom.com>, Gary Haning
<dus...@ix.netcom.com> writes:
>Also for what it is worth, though Phil was the BEST game coach that there
>has been, he could not have kept the players to dominate in today's
>softball.
>
>
Girls don't like gettting yelled at. It is less of a motivator nowadays and now
we have Donna Lopiano claiming it is a form of sexual harrassment to do so, so
now we have the threat of lawsuits attacking the way men coach women.
Gary is right, the game may have passed by Phil in this respect. He is on top
of the list of Politically Incorrect softball coaches. People forget that is
why he was and probably still is the best. Phil is not behind the times. He was
ahead of the times. Girls and womens softball simply wouldn't exist in its
present form without his approach.
Gary pales in comparison to Phil, agreed. There are many Bruder fakes out
there. Just plain yelling and screaming doesn't get it. Yelling and screaming
has to accomplish something for the team, and Phil was/is a master at it. Few
have that eloquence.
I don't think Phil ever lost sight of how fun the game was back in the late
80s...but coaches have evolved a little. Probably one of the better coaches to
admire who is in Phil's mold is Steve Alessi of the Jazz, who can balance
jumping a kid's shit with plain old having fun. Steve can make a player hate
his guts and love every minute of it.
Gary's not quite as good at it. Gary's sarcasm is a bit more tame and
philosophical than Steve's. I won't discuss Dykstra here, he can speak for
himself. Sorry, Don, but you're no Phil Bruder.
Larry's approach to JO ball is more of a team atmosphere as far as his
wonderful assistance and his lack of regard for the philosophy/ethics of
keeping college players away from a JO team.
Now, if you'll excuse me, I have an appointment with my schooner.
Vince
Jazzsoft
>himself. Sorry, Don, but you're no Phil Bruder.
Never in a million years could I hope to be as good a coach as Bruder. Having
played against his womens teams a couple of times I can say he treated them
with respect. I have over the years heard people complain about his methods but
I have never talked with a PLAYER who did not have the highest respect for him.
This says alot about the person.
> Probably one of the better coaches to
>admire who is in Phil's mold is Steve Alessi of the Jazz, who can balance
>jumping a kid's shit with plain old having fun. Steve can make a player hate
>his guts and love every minute of it.
I would not go that farLOL.. Having been associated with Steve since the
begining I can tell you I have learned a great deal about the game from him.
Over the years we have had our share of disagreements but one thing I never
doubted was his loyality to the game and people involved with the Jazz.
If you want to hear sarcasm at its best go to a college game and sit near some
of the Womens coaches. Some of the best and most brutal comments will be heard.
You will laugh your ass off. For example at a Fullerton game the first base
umpire, who was having a bad day, got tired of the banter and came over to
fence and asked us if we knew what NCAA meant. Steve quickly told him it meant
No Clue At All.
Don
FRUTHCORP
my experience of the 90's........nice article
jim fruth
asa Legends
UNLV SB 21
>wonderful assistance and his lack of regard for the philosophy/ethics of
>keeping college players away from a JO team.
I would bet, playing for the Panther's myself, that the players WANT to come
back and play. The Panther teams are very close, we got along very well and I
wish I could've came back my freshman year to play for him. We all have SO much
respect for him and all of the time and effort he puts in tio making our summer
AWESOME!! You are Always learning new things, seeing new places and spending
time with girls and coaches you love. Larry's motto is FAMILY, ACADEMICS and
Softball. Another motto, once a Panther, Always a Panther...you can tell every
year when we have our X-MAS Party. Lots of people come every year. This year
was kinda sad because some players, example Lisa Fernandez, couldn't come, (the
fact that there were recruitable athletes present), but we had a fun time
visiting.
UNLV SB 21
>not argue with him. She will be very good.
not to mention, I hear she is a hell-of-a pitcher!!
Hiller SB
In article <19990103202414...@ng19.aol.com>, unlv...@aol.com (UNLV
SB 21) writes:
>I would bet, playing for the Panther's myself, that the players WANT to come
>back and play.
Two problems with this. It does not benefit those who have to sit on the bench
as a result; and it does not benefit those who "come back" to play because they
then are lowering themselves as far as level of play.
Bad ideas.
Vince