AD Boivin SC-10 ETS (coupler)
Bob Maki
After hearing a rumor of a AD Boivin SKI-DOO SC-10 coupler I e-mailed Denis
Boivin to see if it was true. The next day I received an e-mail from him.
Here is what he said:
-ETS kit for SC-10 will cost $169 U.S.
-ACM will work better
-no kickback effect
-both swingarms are coupled
-parts added will be alum. & uhmw (2 lbs.)
Presently they offer samples for a few of their good dealers to try out. You
can have your local dealer (any Ski-Doo dealer & others possibly) contact
Cinthia Morris sale director for AD Boivin at (418)882-2608 or e-mail Denis
Boivin @ adbo...@quebectel.com
This kit could make a great suspension even better! (my opinion) My season
is over now. So I hope someone will try this out and report back to rss
Bob Maki
97 MXZ-583 2150 miles
mxz
RMaki...@gnn.com (Bob Maki) wrote:
The above post didn't get much follow up when it was
originally posted but I thought I'd follow by saying that I
talked with Denis Boivin today (June 9, 97) and he confirmed that
this couple has been out for evaluation by most of the media, as
well as complete skids of the expert suspension. However, for
reasons he didn't state, no "ride reports" type articles will
appear until this fall. The couple replaces the acm unit and
makes the skid a fully coupled unit. Not as good as a complete
Expert system, but a significant improvement. Suppossedly Kevin
Bielke of Race & Rally has been testing one of these units and
says it makes a significant improvemet in ride comfort (or
somehint to that effect) Maybe kevin is still lurking out there
and can comment. Unless he is bound by a non-disclosure
statement (that's my own opinion of why we haven't read about
this couple yet) For $169 how can you go wrong?
Steve LaMunion
email: m...@ix.netcom.com
IRC DALnet #snowmobile, nick: MXZ
*To reply by mail remove the ".SpamBlocker" from my address
Michael Hart
In article <33acbd3c....@news.muskoka.net>, car...@muskoka.net says...
snipped
>>somehint to that effect) Maybe kevin is still lurking out there
>>and can comment. Unless he is bound by a non-disclosure
>>statement (that's my own opinion of why we haven't read about
>>this couple yet) For $169 how can you go wrong?
But first you must sell a ton of SC-10's to sell very many couplers. Price
seems a bit high perhaps could do better with a street price under $100...
IMO Danger of early comment is that the market itself may be queered by any
negative comment of the SC-10 in the first place. (btw I do feel it needs
coupling both ways)
Or it may be in the works as stock or an upgrade??? Who really knows these
days? If it works it could be a huge improvement and would put the SC-10 on
par with other mfrs...
Michael
mxz
mwh...@execpc.com (Michael Hart) wrote:
>But first you must sell a ton of SC-10's to sell very many couplers.
You mean there is NOT a ton of SC10 equipped sleds out
there?
>Price
>seems a bit high perhaps could do better with a street price under $100...
I disagree on the price. SLP seems to have no problem
selling their skis at around $300/pair (with runners). So I dont'
think $169 for a device that will provide a "40% improvement in
ride quality over the washboard and stutter bumps" is too much.
(I would however, love to know how the 40% figure was arrived
at.)
>IMO Danger of early comment is that the market itself may be queered by any
>negative comment of the SC-10 in the first place. (btw I do feel it needs
>coupling both ways)
Maybe, but how many media reviews have you read where
anything bad was really said about any product? I don't think
the approach will be "sc10 sucks unless you have the coupler".
More of an approach such as "a good system can be made better
with the use of the coupler".
>Or it may be in the works as stock or an upgrade???
No. It will strictly be an aftermarket item for the
97-98 season.
Force1
<SNIP>
>
>Or it may be in the works as stock or an upgrade??? Who really knows these
>days? If it works it could be a huge improvement and would put the SC-10 on
>par with other mfrs...
>
>Michael
I didn't know that the SC-10 wasn't already on par. I thought it compared
pretty well to the other stock '97 sleds I rode (better at some things worse
at others). Am I missing something that I should have seen?
Force1
For...@pconline.com
Michael Hart
In article <5orh13$3...@drn.zippo.com>, Force1 says...
IMO it lacks handling under power due to the coupling problem. It
manifests itself in rather unpredictable ski lift. Gee, could that be
related to the "MXZ 670 won't turn problem"? Or the real reason why they
stuck the narrow plastic skis on last year? Don't get me wrong here..
The lack of coupling was what I consider a serious flaw in an otherwise good
machine. IMO Updating the front end is only part of the problem.
BTW Ron K, I'm not blasting your machine since I didn't ride it after the
SLP's were added.
Also consider that for any real gain in ride quality the coupler should
require lower rate springs and that's more dollars... That's my reason for
saying the street price should be lower. (the magical part of coupling is on
big bumps it shares load between springs allowing lighter springs)
Michael
Michael Hart
In article <33b033f...@nntp.ix.netcom.com>,
m...@ix.netcom.com.SpamBlocker says...
>
>mwh...@execpc.com (Michael Hart) wrote:
>
>>But first you must sell a ton of SC-10's to sell very many couplers.
>
> You mean there is NOT a ton of SC10 equipped sleds out
>there?
Logic says less than half of what there will be by Christmas... Wouldn't you
agree. Despite what we like to think the snowmobile market is really pretty
small.
> Maybe, but how many media reviews have you read where
>anything bad was really said about any product? I don't think
>the approach will be "sc10 sucks unless you have the coupler".
>More of an approach such as "a good system can be made better
>with the use of the coupler".
In perspective - How many times have you read a bad review period??? Funny
what ad money can do huh?
Michael
Doug Ritter
On 25 Jun 1997 Force1@.MISSING-HOST-NAME. wrote:
> <SNIP>
> >
> >Or it may be in the works as stock or an upgrade??? Who really knows these
> >days? If it works it could be a huge improvement and would put the SC-10 on
> >par with other mfrs...
> >
> >Michael
>
> I didn't know that the SC-10 wasn't already on par. I thought it compared
> pretty well to the other stock '97 sleds I rode (better at some things worse
> at others). Am I missing something that I should have seen?
From my experience, the "fully-coupled" suspensions work best for hard
riding in the bumps. And personally, I think the XTRA-10 is the class of
the industry at this point, at least for aggressive riding. And the only
thing that I can figure that makes it the best is that it is fully-coupled.
A suspension which isn't coupled hits every bump twice. A suspension
that isn't fully-coupled can kick back uncontrollably in the really bad
bumps and make the sled more difficult to control at high speeds.
That's my take on it. Anything else to add Michael?
--
Doug
Jim&Stacey Turcotte
also, more importantly, how much does it cost.
--
http://www.angelfire.com/me/sledder
"Winter Rules"
Jim&Stacey Turcotte
Where do you find out more about this,,,,ala what is the url?
Jim
mxz
Force1 wrote:
>I didn't know that the SC-10 wasn't already on par. I thought it compared
>pretty well to the other stock '97 sleds I rode (better at some things worse
>at others). Am I missing something that I should have seen?
Took the words right out of my mouth Force1, I even typed
up a response like yours, but canceled at the last minute. Why?
because I read the mags also and most of them rated the Yamaha
suspension best oem setup, so there is some question there by the
self proclaimed experts that the sc10 is not on par. I'm not
saying I agree with them, but certianly someone who wants to
argue the point will point that out. Probably Mr. Hart will. So I
didn't post it. Glad you did though because I never felt the
sled was a bad riding sled. Not even when I was riding on the
cowl of mine while it was speeding down hill out of control....
But that's a story for another time ;)
mxz
>mwh...@execpc.com (Michael Hart) wrote:
>But first you must sell a ton of SC-10's to sell very many couplers.
>m...@ix.netcom.com.SpamBlocker replied:
>You mean there is NOT a ton of SC10 equipped sleds out there?
>mwh...@execpc.com (Michael Hart) wrote:
>Logic says less than half of what there will be by Christmas... Wouldn't you
>agree. Despite what we like to think the snowmobile market is really pretty
>small.
m...@ix.netcom.com.SpamBlocker replys:
Huh? I don't follow your statement. Are you trying to
say that there is no market for this device? If you are then I'd
say you are wrong. Since I did some homework on this let's
examine the numbers. There is an estimated 90,000 SC10/ACM
equipped sleds in service in North America with an estimated
additional 50,000 coming out this season. That is 140,000
potential units. Mind you, not all sc10 sleds have an ACM. These
estimations are only for ACM equpped models. These figures are
from derived at from Bombardiers own reports. If 1% of those
people buy one of these units thats 1400 units. @ $169 each that
comes to $236,600 in sales. I wouldn't say it was too small of
a market for a niche company like AD Boivin.
>
>
>> Maybe, but how many media reviews have you read where
>>anything bad was really said about any product? I don't think
>>the approach will be "sc10 sucks unless you have the coupler".
>>More of an approach such as "a good system can be made better
>>with the use of the coupler".
>
>In perspective - How many times have you read a bad review period??? Funny
>what ad money can do huh?
>
>Michael
>
>
Steve LaMunion
Force1
>From my experience, the "fully-coupled" suspensions work best for hard
>riding in the bumps. And personally, I think the XTRA-10 is the class of
>the industry at this point, at least for aggressive riding. And the only
>thing that I can figure that makes it the best is that it is fully-coupled.
Yes, for hard riding I agree that fully-coupled is the way to go. It may
even be an advantage in not-so-hard riding provided that the spring rates
are reasonable. Maybe the reason it hasn't been a big deal for me is that
I don't ride hard all the time. SC-10 has provide a good all around package
IMO. I had the opportunity to ride an XTRA-10 on a '97 XCR 600 and a '97 Indy
Trail. It's probably not fair to compare the Trail to my MXZ, but I was not
impressed with the XTRA-10 in the XCR either. I assume that the XC has
a better package, but the XCR did not ride as well as the MXZ and was not
even close in terms of total package, IMHO. No ski lift though.
>A suspension which isn't coupled hits every bump twice. A suspension
>that isn't fully-coupled can kick back uncontrollably in the really bad
>bumps and make the sled more difficult to control at high speeds.
><SNIP>
>
>Doug
How does Arctic Cat deal with the problem? Are they in the same boat
as Ski-Doo?
FWIW my '97 experience left me with this:
SC-10: I agree with Michael (and said it before) that SC-10 may contribute
to ski lift and that could be an issue. But, the rear end rides nice and
handles the rough stuff well. Good all-around rear end. No failure issues.
XTRA-10: I was not impressed, but to be fair, I would have to spend more
time adusting it for me. Being attached to the XCR 600 is not an advantage
for this rear end. A XC600 would be a better comparison.
Yamaha XTC 600: Offered a better ride than the SC-10 in many conditions.
It was more difficult to adjust and it lacked weight transfer. Front shock
was damaged because of a suspension design problem a few hundred miles
into the season. Required the replacement of the front shock, spring, and
track. The track had 120 studs on it, so those had to be done again.
Arctic Cat: Did not ride a '97.
If I had to pick again, I would not have a problem going with the SC-10
based on my experience. That said, I will still be interested to see what
the ETS kit can do to make a good rear end better.
Force1
Force1
>IMO it lacks handling under power due to the coupling problem. It
>manifests itself in rather unpredictable ski lift. Gee, could that be
>related to the "MXZ 670 won't turn problem"? Or the real reason why they
>stuck the narrow plastic skis on last year? Don't get me wrong here..
Surprisingly, I tend to agree with these comments. I think we covered a lot
of those issues in previous threads and most agree that the MXZ requires
the rider to change riding style to get the most out of the machine. I
guess you can take that part of it as a negative, but it hasn't been a big
deal for me. I don't remember how many times I wrote that I believed the
ski lift to be more a part of the rear end than the equal length radius
rods that everyone seemed to think was the cause. Your point is well noted
and if the ETS kit helps this issue it may offer a big improvement for
most people who are not comfertable with it now. But, the SC-10 does
ride nice and handles the rough stuff well. Overall, I've been very happy
with it.
>The lack of coupling was what I consider a serious flaw in an otherwise good
>machine. IMO Updating the front end is only part of the problem.
>BTW Ron K, I'm not blasting your machine since I didn't ride it after the
>SLP's were added.
>
>Also consider that for any real gain in ride quality the coupler should
>require lower rate springs and that's more dollars... That's my reason for
>saying the street price should be lower. (the magical part of coupling is on
>big bumps it shares load between springs allowing lighter springs)
>
>Michael
I agree again. I currently run all springs in my SC-10 at the softest
pre-load. I am considering adding the ETS kit, but without a change in
springs, I don't think I would see all the benefits the kit could offer.
I only rarely bottom the front shock as it is today, so the extra coupling
may only effect ski lift which hasn't been a big issue for me.
I guess we just disagree on how *big* a difference there is between the
quality of the SC-10 and the quality of the other manufactures rear ends.
Thanks for your comments.
Force1
Jean Menard
mxz wrote:
>Not even when I was riding on the
> cowl of mine while it was speeding down hill out of control....
> But that's a story for another time ;)
Hey, I know a bit of that story! It was called Netride East '97. Will
we get an encore this year, MXZ?
This year, for Netride East '98, I am "duct-tapping" a camcorder on my
helmet. This will help me catch all of MXZ's stunts. Then, maybe we
could post them as Mpegs?
Jean Menard
1998 Formula 500
1995 Formula SL
aka "F500" on #snowmobile
for e-mail reply, please remove "SpamBlocker"
Mark A Zimmerman
> XTRA-10: I was not impressed, but to be fair, I would have to spend more
> time adusting it for me. Being attached to the XCR 600 is not an advantage
> for this rear end. A XC600 would be a better comparison.
The XTRA10 on my Ultra SP worked well I thought. As far as
getting into some rough sections of trail, well, you just added a
bit of speed and everything smoothed out. I did find that depending
on where you adjusted the rear scissors stops, that of course made
the difference on where the front skis were (on or off the ground)
when coming out of a corner. I have my springs at their lowest
or nearly lowest settings. I am going to mess around with it more
this coming season and see just what can be done with it to more
extent. But I can't complain about anything with it and I didn't
have any bolts come loose, etc., as has been the case with the
XTRA12 on some sleds....
As far as having the CRC to limit inside ski lift, well, the
machine still does a little bit, but you're moving right along and
turning pretty hard to get it to lift - much harder than would have
been the case with my '91 650. The '97 is alot smoother through
the curves and you almost have to reteach yourself how to corner...
No more "lock the brakes, slide it sideways and full power on"
anymore.
I think when it comes to overall sled feel, a person is going
to like the feel that your present brand of sled delivers. If you're
riding a CAT, you're likely going to like the way a CAT sits, turns
and handles bumps. Same with Ski-Doo, Yamaha and Polaris. I know
that when I ride a different brand, that sled will feel so different
that you almost can't enjoy it as you don't really have any idea on
how to get the most out of the handling of it. Now, say, maybe ride
it for a week, then maybe that'd be different - but just for a quick
run down the trail, no, I can't get comfortable to a different brand
that quick and then turn around and say, "Ya, that's really great!".
Mark Zimmerman
'97 Ultra SP
Michael Hart
In article <5otslm$k...@drn.zippo.com>, Force1 says...
>
>I guess we just disagree on how *big* a difference there is between the
>quality of the SC-10 and the quality of the other manufactures rear ends.
>
Well I did say "on par" with other sleds... Par may only be a point or two
less than another player. In golf terms buying a point for only $169 would
be a bargain. But when someone here can test the thing and report back
honestly we'll really know... What do you say we appoint an official rep to
solicit a test piece for an article?
The drawback IMO is only a real problem on tight twisty trails. For other
uses it might actually be fun not knowing when or where the front end will
go. Compared to some relatively recent Doo's the SC-10 is way better.
Michael
Marcie Walther
I talked to race&rally and supertrax magazine and they both tested the
boivin coupler kit. They both said it was a big improvement. It really
took the harshness out at slow speeds and the kickat high speed was gone.
I ordered one already. I look at it like this if it sucks it's easy to
take off. I'm also ordering a pair of ohlins shocks for my 97 mxz-670.
Last season I had severe front of rear shock fade to the point of at 10mph
a 10'' bump it would bottom bad. I already widened my front end to 45''
this made a big improvement in ski lift. It really let me corner allot
harder.
Force1 wrote in article <5otumn$r...@drn.zippo.com>...
> XTRA-10: I was not impressed, but to be fair, I would have to spend more
> time adusting it for me. Being attached to the XCR 600 is not an
advantage
> for this rear end. A XC600 would be a better comparison.
>
Force1
<SNIP>
>Not even when I was riding on the
>cowl of mine while it was speeding down hill out of control....
>But that's a story for another time ;)
>
>
I'd like to hear that story sometime :-).
Force1
Marcie Walther
By the way both magazines said that this kit makes the sc-10 better than
any current factory suspension when asked.
Doug Ritter <do...@infinet.com> wrote in article
<Pine.SUN.3.91.97062...@user2.infinet.com>...
> On 25 Jun 1997 Force1@.MISSING-HOST-NAME. wrote:
>
> > <SNIP>
> > >
> > >Or it may be in the works as stock or an upgrade??? Who really knows
these
> > >days? If it works it could be a huge improvement and would put the
SC-10 on
> > >par with other mfrs...
> > >
> > >Michael
> >
> > I didn't know that the SC-10 wasn't already on par. I thought it
compared
> > pretty well to the other stock '97 sleds I rode (better at some things
worse
> > at others). Am I missing something that I should have seen?
>
> From my experience, the "fully-coupled" suspensions work best for hard
> riding in the bumps. And personally, I think the XTRA-10 is the class of
> the industry at this point, at least for aggressive riding. And the only
> thing that I can figure that makes it the best is that it is
fully-coupled.
>
> A suspension which isn't coupled hits every bump twice. A suspension
> that isn't fully-coupled can kick back uncontrollably in the really bad
> bumps and make the sled more difficult to control at high speeds.
>
Michael Hart
In article <Pine.SUN.3.91.97062...@user2.infinet.com>,
do...@infinet.com says...
>
>From my experience, the "fully-coupled" suspensions work best for hard
>riding in the bumps. And personally, I think the XTRA-10 is the class of
>the industry at this point, at least for aggressive riding. And the only
>thing that I can figure that makes it the best is that it is fully-coupled.
>
>A suspension which isn't coupled hits every bump twice. A suspension
>that isn't fully-coupled can kick back uncontrollably in the really bad
>bumps and make the sled more difficult to control at high speeds.
>
>That's my take on it. Anything else to add Michael?
That's about it in a nutshell for front-rear coupling but:
Most new suspensions are coupling front to rear (obvious as that's the way
the bumps come) but coupling rear to front for both tail plants (also as
Doug mentioned high speed tail kick when "skipping" moguls) and squat on
acceleration. It's really adjustable and does help handling at all times.
Ever goose the throttle at crest of a mogul only to see the nose climb and
then regret doing it as you pancake into the next one? Ouch! Greatly
minimized if coupling is done (and adjusted) right. This is where *I* think
the SC-10 is lagging (and others but the SC-10 is the current topic) and
*I'm* attributing it as the cause for the many compaints we heard last year.
I personally don't want a "light feeling" front end. I'm riding a snowmobile
not a hang-glider. I need to know what it will do when. That means skis
planted as much as possible and yes more steering effort.
Are they that far behind other brands? IMO Nope, and in some ways ahead. In
fact if they'd fix this very problem and still meet what I expect out of
Polaris in '99 I could well be riding a Doo by then. Read that as saying I'd
better see one heck of an MXZ racer this year...
Now is that brand bias? FWIW I now ride Polaris, If I had to buy a sled this
year it would have been a Cat, Who do I hold the most hope for? Ski-Doo...
If only because they came so far so fast and they know the rest of the
challenge is minor in comparison.
Of course all this is my opinion based on my experience.. To argue it in a
another never ending thread serves no purpose. If I have enlightened a few
in any way it's worth it. As Doug knows I tend to call 'em as I sees 'em.
OTOH if there is merit in an argument finding fault with my writing go fo
it. :-)
Michael
mxz
Force1 wrote:
Had you been on the Netride East last Feb you might have
seen it in person. After the main ride for the day was over a
few of us ventured out for a night time ride down our favorite
trail. It was a twisty trail with rolling hills 10-20' in
elevation that when you went up the hill, the sled would catch
some (a lot!!) of air and then you would notice that while you
are going straight in the air, the trial does not (look out for
the trees!!). Oh yeah, it's a great section of trail, well one
thing led to another as we went up & down that trail each time
pushing a little faster, driving a littler further into the turns
before braking, when suddenly, the MXZ and I are up on one ski.
When in doubt, throttle out!! I watch way to many monster truck
racing on TNN :) I throttled out a litte too much, the sled shot
forward, I braked hard for the next turn (all this as I'm hanging
onto the handle bars and being dragged along side the sled. I
was not about to let go of the sled with all those trees around!
Hard turn coming up, turn the handle bars, while maintaining full
throttle, sled picks up the other way and somehow I end up half
on the cowl, half hanging over the right ski, looking at the
sleds behind me. Still maintaining the brake & throttle. Got the
sled slowed down and the ski flopped back down to earth. It
jolted me and I finally lost my grip and slid off. As I lay on
the snow I see a sled slowly coming toward me. I was thinking
that the guys behind me are about to run me over. I scooted to
the side of the trail, stood up and shook myself off only to
notice that the sled going by was MY sled, and it was picking up
speed going downhill!! Now I'm running down the trail after it.
I caught up to it just as the skis were going off the side of the
trail heading down an 10' embankment loaded with sled eating
trees. I stretched across the sled and grabbed the brake and
stood there, balancing, waiting for assistance. Bob Alger stops
his sled to help. As he gets off his, the guy behind him tags his
sled... oops!. What a scene. Too bad the Raceline Snowtrax
folks were'nt out with us on that one. Just 3 New Yorkers
overjoyed at the beauty of the Quebec trail system. The next day
there we 2 other spots on that same trail where people went off
into the trees that night. So it wasn't just me :) You should
have heard all the talk about the dangerous MXZ ski lift the next
day. I can't wait until Netride East 98. We'll see what the 98
MXZ "with coupler" can do on that trail. Who's going with me????
mxz
Jean Menard <jean....@nrc.ca> wrote:
>mxz wrote:
>>Not even when I was riding on the
>> cowl of mine while it was speeding down hill out of control....
>> But that's a story for another time ;)
>
>Hey, I know a bit of that story! It was called Netride East '97. Will
>we get an encore this year, MXZ?
>
>This year, for Netride East '98, I am "duct-tapping" a camcorder on my
>helmet. This will help me catch all of MXZ's stunts. Then, maybe we
>could post them as Mpegs?
Anyone following 1-3 positions behind me at Netride East
98 will have to sign non-disclosure statments. No one will be
allowed to share any audio, video, or still photography of my
unusual antics.
Doug Ritter
On Thu, 26 Jun 1997, Mark A Zimmerman wrote:
> > XTRA-10: I was not impressed, but to be fair, I would have to spend more
> > time adusting it for me. Being attached to the XCR 600 is not an advantage
> > for this rear end. A XC600 would be a better comparison.
Not sure who wrote this - I didn't see the orginal article. Infinet is
*great* as far as price, accessiblity and resources, but their newsfeed is a
little slow.
You have to ride the XTRA-10 hard over bumps to see the advantages.
Where other suspensions start behaving unpredictably is where the XTRA-10
starts to "shine".
> The XTRA10 on my Ultra SP worked well I thought. As far as
> getting into some rough sections of trail, well, you just added a
> bit of speed and everything smoothed out.
OK, we're into Mark's comments now.
And IMO, Mark nails it right here - *this* is where the XTRA-10 is at
it's best. It is *not* "plush" when riding slow, although it could
probably be setup to be, maybe. It's smooth and predictable on rough
trails "at speed".
> I did find that depending
> on where you adjusted the rear scissors stops, that of course made
> the difference on where the front skis were (on or off the ground)
> when coming out of a corner. I have my springs at their lowest
> or nearly lowest settings. I am going to mess around with it more
> this coming season and see just what can be done with it to more
> extent.
Both the XTRA suspensions take time to setup right for your preferences.
When you start getting into shock/spring changes, you could spend a whole
season tweaking the setup there are so many possible variations.
> I think when it comes to overall sled feel, a person is going
> to like the feel that your present brand of sled delivers. If you're
> riding a CAT, you're likely going to like the way a CAT sits, turns
> and handles bumps. Same with Ski-Doo, Yamaha and Polaris. I know
I try to be as honest about it all as I can be Mark, mainly because I
work way too hard for my money to not buy the best available product.
I've been riding Cats for a while now and I do like the way they corner,
but of all the rear suspensions I've riden, I like the XTRA-10 best. I
still like Rotax motors better than any others. I like Polaris clutches
best. Short of building a hybrid (it'd be pretty hard to put an AWS
suspension on an Indy), it's tough to pick the "best all-around" sled.
More than ever before in the last 10 years, I'd take just about any
reed-inducted 500cc-to-600cc sled by any manufacturer and be happy
trail-riding it.
--
Doug
mike_strukel
Well, I guess I should get my 2 cents worth in here too. The 97 XCR600 that
Force1 was making the Xtra-10 comments about was my brother inlaw's sled. After
I sold my 96 MXZ583 this spring, we went on one last ride. I ended up riding
that sled for about 800 miles that weekend. I would have to agree with
Force1's comments. I felt the Xtra10 performed well on smooth to moderately
bumpy trails, but was not impressed when I got into the big moguls. Now, I
have to take into consideration that I was not used to the sled, and had it
been mine, I may have been able to improve it by changing the setup.
One thing that I would have to say though, was that it cornered very "flat",
and had more of a "drive it" feel that the "ride it" feel of the MXZ.
I guess the low down on the whole thing is that everyone likes different things.
If we didn't, then we would only have one sled to choose from, we could not rip
on our buddies, and life would be awfully boring.
Mike Strukel
98 MXZ670 [with inferior rear suspension :-) ]