Four continents
Tarakay80
ANIEBER
Thanks<<<
A competiton for every ISU country that *doesn't* compete in the European
Championships. I think there may have been a North American Championships many
years ago and this might be its reincarnation?
Rob Davison
ANIEBER wrote:
Well It would be nice to think that they are reincarnating the North American
Championships for historical significance etc. But the real reason for the creation
of the Four Continents cup was the introduction of prize money at Europeans. This
meant that north American skaters had less opportunity to compete for prize money.
Thus a competition was devised to parallel euros. to equal out the opportunity
scale. Whether this is a good or a bad thing is at your own discretion.
In my opinion I think prize money is good, I just wish that there could be more
of a trickle down effect. I wonder how long it is going to take for open prize
money to become common place in most all levels of competition. At the current time
money is awarded in the form of "training grants" to skaters competing at the
canadian nationals in varying amounts depending on your placement. I am wondering
how long it will take until this funding gets turned into up front "prize money,"
or if it ever will.
Any way those are my thoughts,
Rob.
--
"If you really want to make a lot of money, start your own religion."
-- L. Ron Hubbard
From Robert B. Davison
a.k.a. Bob, Brother Love, Captain Obvious, Crazy Man Dan, Dave,
Dick head, Harley, Jimbo, Jimmy, Rob, Robbie, Robbie-doo, Roberto,
Rob bob, Rob the Barbarian.
i souport publik edekasion
j...@cypress.com
tara...@aol.com (Tarakay80) wrote:
> Can someone explain what the Four continents competition is all about? Thanks
>
This competition is intended to be sort of the Pacific Rim counterpart
of the Europeans; the Americas, Asia and Australia. Presumably, you will
see skaters from Australia, Canada, China, Japan, Korea, Mexico, Taiwan
and the U.S. at this event. I don't know of any other Pacific Rim country
at all likely to send participants. Four Continents is the long awaited
replacement for the former North American Championships, last held I
think in 1969, at the Oakland Coliseum; that's the last one I remember,
anyway. There was a large stink between Canada and the U.S. over the
results of that event; in particular, the ladies competition. I even
have a bit of Super 8 movie film I shot at that event; 1969, remember,
no camcorders then. The most memorable scene on that film is the one of
Tina Noyes hitting her first triple toe. She landed it right in front
of me and her mouth looks about five inches in diameter.
-jl John
Life's a bitch and then you bake cookies
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OPRASNGR
Thank you.
Trudi Marrapodi
opra...@aol.comnospam (OPRASNGR) wrote:
To make a long story short, the big problem with the old North Americans
(which took place every two years and switched between the U.S. and Canada
each time) was that there was no way to put an equal amount of American
and Canadian judges on the judging panel, because two countries into an
odd number of judges does not go evenly (and the ISU demanded an odd
number of judges after the event had gone on for a while with an even
number from each country). So the deal became that the Americans would get
four out of seven judges when they hosted, and the Canadians would get
four when they hosted. But this meant that whenever there were more
Americans than Canadians, the Canadians feared they would get a raw deal,
and when there were more Canadians than Americans...you get the picture.
And indeed it was so--Americans tended to win in the States, and Canadians
in Canada.
All this came to a head in 1969 and the CFSA reviewed the results and said
there was national bias on both sides. Both countries then became
reluctant to send their best skaters to the other country, not wanting
them to be beaten, so the quality of the competition got watered down.
There was some talk of bringing in European judges or referees, but it
never happened, probably for reasons of both ego and finance. But the CFSA
was starting to chafe at the whole thing and talking about "Why don't we
just create our own international invitational event and to hell with the
Americans?"
Even so, the plans were in place for the '71 event in Canada, but just
before it was set to happen the USFSA said their big gun, Janet Lynn,
wasn't going, and neither was their number-two skater, Julie Holmes. The
stuff hit the fan. The event was almost canceled, but finally, Janet was,
ah, persuaded to compete. Karen Magnussen beat her, but the bad taste of
the whole situation was not washed out of the CFSA's mouth. The year after
that, Calgary hosted worlds and it was a HUGE financial success, which
only whetted the CFSA's appetite more in the direction of hosting its own
annual international. George Blundun was the chairman of '71 North
Americans and when time came to discuss the 1973 event with the USFSA, he
more or less presented them with a fait accompli: Canada wasn't going to
do North Americans anymore. Not even all the Canadians were on his page
with this, but he was kind of a David Dore for the '70s, I guess, and he
didn't want to do North Americans and he had his plans for a Canadian
international and that was that.
In 1973, Skate Canada was born. And so was the concept of getting a big
corporate sponsor to help you finance your skating competition, another
thing Blundun was good at...and which continues to drive the CFSA today.
Not until 1979 would the USA come up with the Norton Skate/Flaming Leaves
competition, which eventually evolved into Skate America.
--
Trudi
"If the Teletubby craze continues, it is inevitable that at some future date, there will be a Teletubby live show that will be scheduled to play at the Broome County Veterans Memorial Arena...probably on ice."
--Gene Gray, entertainment columnist, Binghamton Press & Sun-Bulletin
Louis Epstein
:
:
:
: > >>>Can someone explain what the Four continents competition is all about?
: > Thanks<<<
: > A competiton for every ISU country that *doesn't* compete in the European
: > Championships. I think there may have been a North American Championships many
: > years ago and this might be its reincarnation?
:
: Well It would be nice to think that they are reincarnating the North American
: Championships for historical significance etc. But the real reason for the
: creation of the Four Continents cup was the introduction of prize money
: at Europeans. This meant that north American skaters had less
: opportunity to compete for prize money.
: Thus a competition was devised to parallel euros. to equal out the opportunity
: scale. Whether this is a good or a bad thing is at your own discretion.
: In my opinion I think prize money is good,
I don't!
: I just wish that there could be more
: of a trickle down effect. I wonder how long it is going to take for open prize
: money to become common place in most all levels of competition. At the current time
: money is awarded in the form of "training grants" to skaters competing at the
: canadian nationals in varying amounts depending on your placement. I am wondering
: how long it will take until this funding gets turned into up front "prize money,"
: or if it ever will.
God forbid that it ever does!!
But I DO want to see Euros and 4Cs become eliminators for Worlds.
Louis Epstein
: In article <19990214002510...@ng-cc1.aol.com>,
: tara...@aol.com (Tarakay80) wrote:
: > Can someone explain what the Four continents competition is all about? Thanks
:
:
: of the Europeans; the Americas, Asia and Australia. Presumably, you will
: see skaters from Australia, Canada, China, Japan, Korea, Mexico, Taiwan
: and the U.S. at this event. I don't know of any other Pacific Rim country
: replacement for the former North American Championships, last held I
: think in 1969, at the Oakland Coliseum; that's the last one I remember,
: anyway. There was a large stink between Canada and the U.S. over the
It was last held in 1971(won by John Misha Petkevitch).
It was scheduled for 1973,but the Canadians abruptly cancelled it
to invent Skate Canada,catching the host committee in Rochester by
surprise.
: results of that event; in particular, the ladies competition. I even
Sean Cooper
>This competition is intended to be sort of the Pacific Rim counterpart
>of the Europeans; the Americas, Asia and Australia. Presumably, you will
>see skaters from Australia, Canada, China, Japan, Korea, Mexico, Taiwan
>and the U.S. at this event. I don't know of any other Pacific Rim country
According to the CFSA site the following countries are participating:
Australia
Canada
China
Chinese Taipei
DPR Korea
Hong Kong
Japan
Kazakhstan
Mexico
Mongolia
New Zealand
Republic of Korea
South Africa
Thailand
United States
Uzbekistan
opra...@hotmail.com
<trudiwantsnospam...@cci-209150250059.clarityconnect.net>,
trudiwan...@clarityconnect.com (Trudi Marrapodi) wrote:
> To make a long story short,
Thanks, Trudi, for the history lesson. Where do you pick this stuff up?
Erin
loop_...@my-dejanews.com
opra...@aol.comnospam (OPRASNGR) wrote:
> Please, could you give details about "the stink"?
>
> Thank you.
>
> >replacement for the former North American Championships, last held I
> >think in 1969, at the Oakland Coliseum; that's the last one I remember,
> >anyway. There was a large stink between Canada and the U.S. over the
Those North Americans occurred 30 years ago and the only controversy
that is at all fresh in my mind was the skating of Janet Lynn and Karen
Magnussen. There was also supposed to be some controversy in the Mens'
event; the only player I remember here was John Misha Petkovich. The
former North American Championships were essentially competition between
Canada and the U.S. The judges were from ONLY Canada and the U.S.; Mexico
is not exactly a power in North American figure skating, in spite of
"Chuckie's" ludicrous claims. There are always an odd number of judges,
so one country would always have a majority; usually the host country.
In the case of the 1969 North Americans, the judge panel for the ladies'
event had a majority of U.S. judges. Karen Magnussen was considered by
many to have skated a superior program to Janet Lynn; the gold went to
Janet Lynn. Remember, also, that these were the days of 60% figures and
40% free skating in the scoring with no short program. As I recall,
Janet Lynn was not real great in figures; Karen Magnussen was supposed
to be better. I have not dug out my Super 8 film from North Americans
and in any case, I don't have complete programs of either skater; nor is
there any sound track. One roll of Super 8 film was 50 feet; good for
just about four minutes unlike the two hours of tape available with the
current camcorders. I recall Dick Button saying in the week-delayed TV
coverage that Janet Lynn landed a triple toe at the end of her program
but I could never see this. The only two items from this competition
are really fresh in my mind; Janet Lynn wearing a yellow dress (her
favorite color) and Tina Noyes hitting her first competitive triple toe.
If I recall correctly, the judges gave the dance and pairs gold medals
to the Canadian skaters when the American teams were a little better;
just the opposite of the singles medals. This event led to the end of
the North Americans; I just can't remember if this was actually the last
one.
-jl John
The Earth is a great, big funhouse without the fun
opra...@my-dejanews.com
loop_...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> I have not dug out my Super 8 film from North Americans
> and in any case, I don't have complete programs of either skater; nor is
> there any sound track. One roll of Super 8 film was 50 feet; good for
> just about four minutes unlike the two hours of tape available with the
> current camcorders.
Thanks for the story. Maybe you should consider transferring what's on that
Super 9 film to video cassette, for posterity!
Erin
Louis Epstein
: In article <19990215182732...@ng61.aol.com>,
: opra...@aol.comnospam (OPRASNGR) wrote:
:
: > Please, could you give details about "the stink"?
: >
: > Thank you.
: >
: > >Four Continents is the long awaited
: > >replacement for the former North American Championships, last held I
: > >think in 1969, at the Oakland Coliseum; that's the last one I remember,
: > >anyway. There was a large stink between Canada and the U.S. over the
: > >results of that event; in particular, the ladies competition.
: To make a long story short, the big problem with the old North Americans
: (which took place every two years and switched between the U.S. and Canada
: each time) was that there was no way to put an equal amount of American
: and Canadian judges on the judging panel, because two countries into an
: odd number of judges does not go evenly (and the ISU demanded an odd
: number of judges after the event had gone on for a while with an even
: number from each country). So the deal became that the Americans would get
: four out of seven judges when they hosted, and the Canadians would get
: four when they hosted. But this meant that whenever there were more
: Americans than Canadians, the Canadians feared they would get a raw deal,
: and when there were more Canadians than Americans...you get the picture.
: And indeed it was so--Americans tended to win in the States, and Canadians
: in Canada.
When did Mexico join the ISU?
Adding one Mexican judge(and a competitor when they had one)
would be the proper answer.
Louis Epstein
: In article <7aci8b$9jk$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
: loop_...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
: > I have not dug out my Super 8 film from North Americans
: > and in any case, I don't have complete programs of either skater; nor is
: > there any sound track. One roll of Super 8 film was 50 feet; good for
: > just about four minutes unlike the two hours of tape available with the
: > current camcorders.
:
: Thanks for the story. Maybe you should consider transferring what's on that
: Super 9 film to video cassette, for posterity!
:
: Erin
Or,these days,DVD?
Trudi Marrapodi
[re "uneven number of Canadian/American judges" problem at old North Americans]
> When did Mexico join the ISU?
I don't know.
> Adding one Mexican judge (and a competitor when they had one)
> would be the proper answer.
Gosh, do you think it would've been completely cheap bringing up a Mexican
judge either? That is, of course, assuming there WERE any Mexican judges
in the ISU at the time.
MorryS
proper answer.
>
Even today, Mexico has no International Judges.