Australia Worlds
SoulzMate
I don't usually post here, but I just wanted those who don't frequent the
Grandstand to know that there is some buzz out of Australia. Apparently, the
ISU is *considering* moving the 2000 Brisbane Worlds to a possilbe European
site.
Nothing is definite and I don't have any other information than what's stated
above. I am posting this as a service to those who are considering traveling to
Australia for Worlds. You may want to hold off locking into those travel plans
until the ISU comes out with something definite.
Best wishes...
Kimber
skat...@aol.com
soul...@aol.com (SoulzMate) wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I don't usually post here, but I just wanted those who don't frequent
the
> Grandstand to know that there is some buzz out of Australia.
Apparently, the
> ISU is *considering* moving the 2000 Brisbane Worlds to a possilbe
European
> site.
>
Jean Lenzi
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
Margaret Burwell
SoulzMate (soul...@aol.com) writes:
> I don't usually post here, but I just wanted those who don't frequent the
> Grandstand to know that there is some buzz out of Australia. Apparently, the
> ISU is *considering* moving the 2000 Brisbane Worlds to a possilbe European
> site.
>
> above. I am posting this as a service to those who are considering traveling to
> Australia for Worlds. You may want to hold off locking into those travel plans
> until the ISU comes out with something definite.
Could you be a bit more specific here. 'Some buzz' is rather
vague. My tour group has already paid for it's tickets and is booking
flights. I can't see how the location could be changed at this point in
time. My bet is that this all a big hoax.
Marg
Virginia Blalock
>In article <19990823091010...@ng-cm1.aol.com>,
> soul...@aol.com (SoulzMate) wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I don't usually post here, but I just wanted those who don't frequent
>the
>> Grandstand to know that there is some buzz out of Australia.
>Apparently, the
>> ISU is *considering* moving the 2000 Brisbane Worlds to a possilbe
>European
>> site.
>>
>Actually, I've heard it will be to Japan.
Anyone heard the reason for this possible move? Logistics?
The Skating Rink http://visions.simplenet.com/skate/inded.html
The Skater Advocacy Petition http://visionsdesign.virtualave.net/petition.html
SKHazen
>I don't usually post here, but I just wanted those who don't frequent the
>Grandstand to know that there is some buzz out of Australia. Apparently, the
>ISU is *considering* moving the 2000 Brisbane Worlds to a possilbe European
>site.
>
>Nothing is definite and I don't have any other information than what's stated
>above. I am posting this as a service to those who are considering traveling
to
>Australia for Worlds. You may want to hold off locking into those travel plans
>until the ISU comes out with something definite.
I believe there is substance to this report, although the parameters of what is
going on are still inchoate.
What I do know: (1) large chunks of the JSF membership having prior experience
in organizing / being volunteers at international events were assembled
approximately 5 weeks ago to discuss a possible change and the prospects for
submitting a bid in case the ISU decided to change the venue, (2) two of the
Japanese broadcasting networks were contacted by the JSF shortly thereafter
with a request to indicate interest in joining the bid effort, (3) the
government of Nagano Prefecture was similary invited to participate in a bid,
with the idea being to offer the Big Hat arena (the 98 OWG Hockey venue) as the
site, and (4) within the past week to 10 days (possibly even as recently as
Wednesday of last week), the networks declined as did the prefectural
government of Nagano.
Also known: prior efforts of the AUS fed to host Worlds were either frustrated
or delayed past bid deadlines as a result of problems with the TV side of the
contract. In those cases, the AUS TV was either unable to provide a world-wide
TV feed or declined to do so on the terms required by the ISU (essentially,
providing the feed to the ISU for free and allowing it to resell access to
international TV -- this is where the ISU makes its big money).
Speculation (absolutely no hard facts to support this, but ...): either the
AUS LOC failed to nail down TV arrangements consistent with the ISU
requirements (the contents of which are contained in what, as I recall, is
called "The Memorandum" which is incorporated into the bid terms) or the AUS TV
is now backing out off a verbal commitment to the AUS fed on the matter. If
that is occurring, it would not surprise me if the ISU had primed the JSF for
purposes of putting pressure on the AUS LOC and/or TV -- many of my contacts
there are now convinced that is what it was all about in the first place. If
similar efforts are now underway in Europe, it could well be for the same
purpose.
Suggestion: don't cancel airline tickets just yet unless a deadline for doing
so is rapidly approaching -- but also don't buy any non-refundable tickets now
until the parameter of this situation are clear.
Respectfully,
Steven <---- who has done his best to vitiate the need for footnotes so as to
avoid needling by <fran...@maroon.tc.umn.edu>, gentle though it has been.
skat...@aol.com
> >> Grandstand to know that there is some buzz out of Australia.
> >Apparently, the
> >> ISU is *considering* moving the 2000 Brisbane Worlds to a possilbe
> >European
> >> site.
> >>
> >Actually, I've heard it will be to Japan.
>
> Anyone heard the reason for this possible move? Logistics?
>
Actually I heard they had trouble getting sponsors in the Olympic year.
MorryS
>
>Marg
>
It is not a hoax.. Suggest you check the refund policy.
MorryS
It will be moved to Europe not Japan.
Dave Amorde
says...
>
>>Actually, I've heard it will be to Japan.
>>Jean Lenzi
>
>It will be moved to Europe not Japan.
>
By your wording, are we to conclude that this is a done deal?
-Dave-
NancyA
for the post. NancyA
SoulzMate <soul...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19990823091010...@ng-cm1.aol.com...
> Hi all,
>
> I don't usually post here, but I just wanted those who don't frequent the
> Grandstand to know that there is some buzz out of Australia. Apparently,
the
> ISU is *considering* moving the 2000 Brisbane Worlds to a possilbe
European
> site.
>
> Nothing is definite and I don't have any other information than what's
stated
> above. I am posting this as a service to those who are considering
traveling to
> Australia for Worlds. You may want to hold off locking into those travel
plans
> until the ISU comes out with something definite.
>
> Best wishes...
>
> Kimber
SoulzMate
>is
>going on are still inchoate.
Translation: Kimber doesn't post hoaxes. :) :)
Kimber
New York City
MorryS
Biased Observer
>
>Translation: Kimber doesn't post hoaxes. :) :)
oh just wipe that stupid grin off yer face and find other less
ingratiating forms of self-aggrandizement.
weichi
SoulzMate
>ingratiating forms of self-aggrandizement.
How dare you suggest that I try to get through an entire day without some form
of self-aggrandizement???? ;)
Kimber
Margaret Burwell
I hope nobody thought I was accusing them of less than honourable posting
practises. I guess I was just throwing out a "No, it can't be true."
I have had some experience with organizing committees in the past and I
know that an event of this magnitude does not fall into place overnight.
A local organizing committee is formed as soon as the competition is
awarded to a city -- at least a year before the opening ceremonies. To
try and change the venue and put together everything that would be needed
to run the competition in about 7 months would be a herculean task.
Then there is the question of all event tickets already sold. Would those
ticket purchases be honoured at the new venue?
Anyone who has been to a World Championship in the last few years knows
that a large chunk of the people in the stands have travelled there with
tour groups. Travel agents have made decisions about how many tickets to
buy based on their estimate of how many of their clients would travel to
Australia. They have booked hotel rooms and arranged additional trips
before and after the competition to other locations. (My family is
planning a few days at the Great Barrier Reef.) I think a lot of people
will be planning to use the fact that this may be their only trip to
Australia to do some sightseeing before heading home. Cancelling now will
put a big dent in the tourism industry in Eastern Australia in the first
quarter of 2000. We won't destry the industry if we aren't there, but we
would be missed.
Steven has suggested that this may be in the wind because the Australian
TV has not agreed to the terms the ISU demands. How big is figure skating
on Australian TV? If it weren't broadcast live, would anyone down under
notice? Why should they agree to the restrictive terms demanded by the
ISU? Further, he suggests that Japanese TV may not be any more willing
to accept those terms. What will happen if European TV doesn't agree?
Could Vancouver be ready in time? Would CTV be any more willing than
anyone else to knuckle under? Maybe the ISU will have to accept that they
have pushed the TV cash cow as far as it will go and time has come to back
off.
Unless there has been gross mismanagement on the part of the Australian
organizing committee, pulling out now will simply look like Speedie is
throwing another temper tantrum. Trying to change the location at this
late date just wouldn't be worth the trouble, in my opinion.
Damn! I was looking forward to a warm vacation this year! I'm going to
cross my fingers and hope that this all blows over.
Marg
Biased Observer
>I guess I was just throwing out a "No, it can't be true."
With ya there, Marg.
>Steven has suggested that this may be in the wind because the Australian
>TV has not agreed to the terms the ISU demands. How big is figure skating
>on Australian TV? If it weren't broadcast live, would anyone down under
>notice? Why should they agree to the restrictive terms demanded by the
>ISU?
The things is..... if the local TV network does not provide the feed,
ISU has nothing to sell. EuroSport for example, does not send
cameras/technical people, but instead rely on local feed for coverage.
As I imagine with other stations like SKY and ESPN.
Which does make me wonder just how something as major as providing TV
coverage could be left as an "understanding" and not printed in clear,
concise, legalese. How was this handled previously? Or is the
Australian NGB the first to stand up to ISU on this?
> Further, he suggests that Japanese TV may not be any more willing
>to accept those terms. What will happen if European TV doesn't agree?
My impression is that JSF was used to coerce the Aussie NGB to knuckle
to ISU's terms. That is, if you don't sign on the dotted line, we're
sending Worlds to Japan. But Japan isn't playing the game, so Europe
is being dragged in place. And Didier Gailhalguet has always seemed
pretty willing to play to Speedie's ego.
weichi, who'll be MIGHTY miffed if Worlds ends up in Europe
Dave Amorde
>
>Steven has suggested that this may be in the wind because the Australian
>TV has not agreed to the terms the ISU demands. How big is figure skating
>on Australian TV? If it weren't broadcast live, would anyone down under
>notice? Why should they agree to the restrictive terms demanded by the
>to accept those terms. What will happen if European TV doesn't agree?
>anyone else to knuckle under? Maybe the ISU will have to accept that they
>have pushed the TV cash cow as far as it will go and time has come to back
>off.
>
The Aussie's problems are complicated. Apparently, the desires of the NGB
couldn't be translated into cooperation from the TV networks. The dispute is
over personnel and equipment, not broadcasting, distribution rights or even
money (directly.) However, both the Europeans and the Japanese know a good thing
when they see it, and have experience doing this sort of thing - either of these
groups can "make it happen." Nice, France appears to be the most likely choice
at this moment.
The ISU has done things in the past that seem nonsensical or even idiotic, but
this doesn't appear to be one of them. Providing the telecast requires personnel
and equipment that the Australians were obligated to provide, but seemingly can
not do so. Australia was granted the event under very specific agreements and
obligations which they simply can not meet, regardless of fault.
-Dave-
gat...@my-deja.com
How big is figure skating on Australian TV? Well its not that big at all. I
don't think the networks are particularly interested in broadcasting skating
in the first place. If it weren't broadcast live, would anyone down under
notice? I don't think there'd be much of a public outcry seeing most people
don't even know the Worlds were supposed to be in Australia. Why should they
agree to the restrictive terms demanded by the ISU? They probably wouldn't
agree to the terms demanded by the ISU as they wouldn't profit from it due to
the low level of popularity skating has in Australia compared to some other
sports.
They'll all my opinion only, I could be completely wrong.
Cbert4
>How big is figure skating on Australian TV? Well its not that big at all.
(snip)
>Why should they
>agree to the restrictive terms demanded by the ISU? They probably wouldn't
>agree to the terms demanded by the ISU as they wouldn't profit from it due to
>the low level of popularity skating has in Australia compared to some other
>sports.
IF this is true, then the LOC shouldn't have agreed to the terms in the first
place, or even requested to hold the competition! There are plenty of other
cities/countries that DO want to hold events, especially ones as big as Worlds.
Carol
to reply, delete the "nospam" from my name
Skatecatky
>place, or even requested to hold the competition! There are plenty of other
>cities/countries that DO want to hold events, especially ones as big as
>Worlds.
I can second that with a big AMEN.
What I don't understand about this is HOW In the world did the ISU and the
affiliated folks NOT KNOW that this was a problem until now? I mean, either
they take care of the broadcasting situation or they don't -- and it seems that
this would have all been close to being finalized long before the event you
think.
But then, I have learned not to assume anything in the real world, and the ISU
might have been giving the LOC time to put this all together; however, 7 months
out is not good for not having almost everything that needs to be done
finalized. Time flies and now we must wonder - are any of the tour groups
going to get totally socked?
P
Lee
pieces here...
QUOTE:
I asked an Aussie friend. It seems to be true.
The ISU (cinquanta) has said that 2000 worlds will be moved to Nice,
France.
Essentially, this is over a quite small amount of $$$ us dollars in
'domestic rights' - nothing to do with host broadcasting
responsibilities.
The really BIG part of all this folks is that this CRUCIFIES Australia.
They would be a broke, disenfranchaised skating nation. It rescinds an
ISU FULL COUNCIL decision to award worlds to Australia.
I would like to know on who's say so can a decision of this magnitude
be rescinded!
Apparently, according to my sources, Cinquanta would not let the
Australian Federation take any part in tv negotiation.
If that is the case, ALL nations should be aware that they are not
playing on an even playing field.
And isn't it just too big a coincidence that France got the World's
instead? Please! Does he think we fans are blind?
How can a member nation be treated so poorly? Apparently Austarlia was
informed by fax from Cinquanta but the news was already on the net! How
rude! And no discussion? No attempt to work out a difference? Just send
and a fax and be done with it? First them, who's next?
Skating fans need to post everywhere (especially the ISU and to places
like Nando).
Send faxes to ISU!!! Fax # is on their web page...inundate that guy
with your outcry! It worked in Edmonton when he tried to stop Canada
from having Kurt skate an exhibition at World's in "96. Fans in
Edmonton shamed the man back to reality. He doesn't own this sport - we
do! The fans! The consumers! The skaters!
As I type representatives of the 2000 World's committee from Australia
is on a plane bound for Switzerland. They don't even have an
appointment! And I am willing to bet that Cinquanta won't see them
unless we make a BIG noise! He won't change his mind unless we holler!
and Soon. This must be done today...it can't wait or he will send those
Aussies home without even reconsidering.
The bottom line is that a Full Council giveth, a full council should
taketh and then they should PAY!
I'd like the ISU in europe to wake up tomorrow (N america ia awake!!)
to some very unfavourable reviews in the net, press and on their fax
machine.
So write a fax! Call your tv stations and newspaper and ask what the
heck is going on! Make people wake up and see that it may be summer but
skating fans never rest!
END QUOTE:
Bit #2: Text of new release by the Aussie federation to the Austrailian
newswires...
QUOTE:
AAP (Australian Associated press) will have this on the wire within the
hour...
"The Chairman of Queensland Events Corporation, Mr Des Power, and a
Departmental Director, Mr David Williams, are on their way to
Switzerland today to see the President of the International Skating
Union, Mr Ottavio Cinquanta, to conduct high level discussions after Mr
Cinquanta had indicated yesterday that the 2000 World Figure Skating
Championships, which are to be held in Brisbane next March, could be
moved to Nice, France.
The 2000 World Figure Skating Championships were awarded to Australia
by the full Council of the International Skating Union (ISU) in June,
1997.
It is believed that the ISU are taking this position becasue of a
concern about the required television coverage."
END QUOTE
Fax number for the ISU: 41 21 6126677
Lee
--
Murphy's Corollary:
It is impossible to make anything foolproof
because fools are so ingenious.
Prodigion
>
> >IF this is true, then the LOC shouldn't have agreed to the terms in the first
> >place, or even requested to hold the competition! There are plenty of other
> >cities/countries that DO want to hold events, especially ones as big as
> >Worlds.
>
> I can second that with a big AMEN.
>
> What I don't understand about this is HOW In the world did the ISU and the
> affiliated folks NOT KNOW that this was a problem until now?
What makes you think that the ISU just came upon this information? With
all that is at stake, don't you think they might have been willing to
work with the Aussies for some time to straighten things out? In
hindsight, they may have thrown good money after bad, but there's a
saying about that.
-Dave-
Cbert4
>What I don't understand about this is HOW In the world did the ISU and the
>affiliated folks NOT KNOW that this was a problem until now? I mean, either
>they take care of the broadcasting situation or they don't -- and it seems
>that
>this would have all been close to being finalized long before the event you
>think.
But maybe they (the ISU) thought it WAS finalized.
If you had a business contract with someone that specified that one party was
responsible for something (in this case, the broadcasting set-up), why would
you doubt that it was being handled (unless you never trusted them in the least
from the start...& if so, why on earth would you award them the event)?!!
Probably at some late stage in the game, someone from the ISU would sit down
with or talk on the phone with someone from the LOC (or from the broadcasting
company) to go over the finer details, but it would likely be assumed that the
major details were already in place & being followed as per the contract!
OR maybe the LOC was "yessing" the ISU for a long time, & somehow they finally
found out that Australia couldn't or wouldn't deliver the goods!
> and the ISU
>might have been giving the LOC time to put this all together; however, 7
>months
>out is not good for not having almost everything that needs to be done
>finalized.
Again, I'd think they'd have every right (if the facts we've heard are correct)
to believe that things were OK & up to their standards. Other countries, even
poor ones, seem to have had no trouble with the TV demands. And
realy...Australia is going to host the next Summer Olympics! You'd think
they'd not only have things in place for broadcasting (even in another city,
and yes, I know it's a huge country!), but also WANT to use Worlds as a bit of
a test event, or to show off their capabilities, even if there won't be any
skating in the Sydney games.
> are any of the tour groups
>going to get totally socked?
I posted about this on SkateFans too, but I'll do so again. Sure, Australia is
going to be a much more expensive (i.e. lucrative) trip for them to book. But
I think more fans (at least fans from certain parts of the world) would go to
Europe more than would go to Australia, so probably any extra packages would be
quickly snapped up! Not only is it much cheaper for may people to get to
anywhere in Europe, but think of the travel time they'd save from North
America.
Also, the tour groups sell trips/take deposits LONG before the event details
are set. At huge profits, too! When they do that, they assume some risks!
Carol (please excuse my many probable typos...it's late & I haven't had much
sleep!)
Cbert4
Since we don't know anything about who the source is in Australia (no offense,
but it could be someone totally clueless about the issues, someone trying to
totally slam the ISU, or someone who just wants to see their favorite skater in
their backyard....or all of the above!), I'll leave most of that to other
people to respond to...
but as for a few ponts...
>And isn't it just too big a coincidence that France got the World's
>instead? Please! Does he think we fans are blind?
What am I missing where France as a possible location is concerned?! What is
the "coincidence?"
>Skating fans need to post everywhere (especially the ISU and to places
>like Nando).
>
>Send faxes to ISU!!! Fax # is on their web page...inundate that guy
>with your outcry!
Fine. When we get some proof of all the accusations you've copied! I'm not
doubting you, Lee...but we have no proof at all!
> shamed the man back to reality. He doesn't own this sport - we
>do! The fans! The consumers! The skaters!
IF the broadcast needs aren't met, & the LOC hasn't got things well-organized,
it's the fans, consumers & skaters who will be screaming when Worlds is poorly
run! And as much as many of us don't like the fact, the ISU is responsible for
making sure an event of this size is properly run!
>Bit #2: Text of new release by the Aussie federation to the Austrailian
>newswires...
>
>QUOTE:
>
>AAP (Australian Associated press) will have this on the wire within the
>hour...
>"The Chairman of Queensland Events Corporation, Mr Des Power, and a
>Departmental Director, Mr David Williams,
What is the Queensland Events Corporation?!! That sounds like a firm being
paid to put on this event. If so why is their representaive flying to
Switzerland instead of a LOC/Skating official going?!
are on their way to
>Switzerland today to see the President of the International Skating
>Union, Mr Ottavio Cinquanta, to conduct high level discussions after Mr
>Cinquanta had indicated yesterday that the 2000 World Figure Skating
>Championships, which are to be held in Brisbane next March, could be
>moved to Nice, France.
(snip)
>It is believed that the ISU are taking this position becasue of a
>concern about the required television coverage."
>
>END QUOTE
If this press release does appear, I hope someone will post a link to it
(preferably not just a quote). However, from what is posted above, nothing in
this release says anything different from what we already heard, aside from the
fact that someone from Australia is flying to meet with Cinquanta, and that the
move does appear definite! It doesn't say anything about an issue with unfair
broadcasting rights, as was in the original post...only about an issue with TV
coverage, which is what we've already been discussing.
OK, I know many of us have serious issues & a dislike of the way the ISU
operates, but this whole FSW post appears to be written NOT by a regular
skating fan, but by someone privvy to inside (& biased) info too. And if
that's the case, I don't like the feeling of being manipulated by them any more
than by the ISU!
Carol
sharo...@my-deja.com
the ISU 'think we are blind'?
I appreciate you are quoting someone but you obviously agree with the
sentiment to be posting it here.
Sharon
Biased Observer
>>And isn't it just too big a coincidence that France got the World's
>>instead? Please! Does he think we fans are blind?
>
>What am I missing where France as a possible location is concerned?! What is
>the "coincidence?"
Oh, nothing special. Only that Didier Gailhalguet seems to be
especially good chums with Speedie. That the FFSG is financially broke
doesn't quite seem to matter. Hey, they can always file for
bankruptancy .. again!
>>AAP (Australian Associated press) will have this on the wire within the
>>"The Chairman of Queensland Events Corporation, Mr Des Power, and a
>>Departmental Director, Mr David Williams,
>
>What is the Queensland Events Corporation?!! That sounds like a firm being
>paid to put on this event. If so why is their representaive flying to
>Switzerland instead of a LOC/Skating official going?!
Um, maybe they are the group responsible for the terms that the LOC is
failing to meet? You seem rather eager to see Worlds out of Australia
aren't you? I guess only NAmerican and European viewers deserve to
attend Worlds.... all other skating fans can go eat dust.
weichi
Biased Observer
over which Australian network will cover Worlds, and the move to take
Worlds away from Australia is driven by profit, certain parties
wanting a cut of the pie.
Any truth in this matter? There are so many stories out there that I'm
having a hard time figuring out what's true or what's hearsay.
weichi
Margaret Burwell
Cbert4 (cbe...@aol.comnospam) writes:
> Lee var...@my-deja.com psoted quite a bit that was quoted from a post on FSW.
>>
>>AAP (Australian Associated press) will have this on the wire within the
>>"The Chairman of Queensland Events Corporation, Mr Des Power, and a
>>Departmental Director, Mr David Williams,
>
> What is the Queensland Events Corporation?!! That sounds like a firm being
> paid to put on this event. If so why is their representaive flying to
> Switzerland instead of a LOC/Skating official going?!
I don't know what the Queensland Events Corporation is, but if it
were in Canada and someone posted a reference to the Events Trust would
you assume someone has hired a private corporation? The Events Trust is
an arms length body of the CFSA formed to provide continutity in planning
skating events in Canada. Maybe the Queensland Events Corporation is a
similar organization.
As a second point, what's wrong with hiring a corporation to plan
an event? I have had involvement with an organization that puts on an
international conference/trade show every year. It hires a private firm
to do much of the planning. This firm has done this kind of work for
years. They know what needs to be in place and when. They know the
people to call to get things done when there are problems. That leaves
the making of policy decisions and arranging guest speakers and the like
to the organizing committee who are able to continue their careers and
maintain a semblance of family life. I have seen people who chaired the
LOC for World's during the 80's literally take a year's leave of absence
from their jobs because of the demands of organizing an event of this
magnitude.
> If this press release does appear, I hope someone will post a link to it
> (preferably not just a quote). However, from what is posted above, nothing in
> this release says anything different from what we already heard, aside from the
> fact that someone from Australia is flying to meet with Cinquanta, and that the
> move does appear definite! It doesn't say anything about an issue with unfair
> broadcasting rights, as was in the original post...only about an issue with TV
> coverage, which is what we've already been discussing.
Since nothing has been released publicly as to why this is being
done, we are all in danger of drawing biased conclusions. I, for one,
intend to reserve judgement until I have *all* the facts.
> OK, I know many of us have serious issues & a dislike of the way the ISU
> operates, but this whole FSW post appears to be written NOT by a regular
> skating fan, but by someone privvy to inside (& biased) info too. And if
> that's the case, I don't like the feeling of being manipulated by them any more
> than by the ISU!
At the moment, the only person I feel is manipulating me is
Cinquanta, and it's not a new feeling.
I am personally bummed about this. I have been budgeting for this
trip ever since it was announced that World's 2000 would be in Brisbane.
My husband and daughter decided that this was the chance of a lifetime to
see 'the land down under' and were planning to attend World's this year
even though they are both casual fans at the best of times. While I will
be at World's this year no matter where it is held, it just isn't going to
feel the same. It's going to have a second best feeling to it.
Marg
Margaret Burwell
I should have added that I feel really bad for the people who have put in
a year's work at this point to try and get this event organized. To work
your heart out and then have it taken away at this point has got to be one
of the most discouraging feelings in the world. It somehow doesn't seem
fair to them.
But then...... who ever said life was fair.
Marg
Cbert4
>You seem rather eager to see Worlds out of Australia
>aren't you? I guess only NAmerican and European viewers deserve to
>attend Worlds.... all other skating fans can go eat dust.
That is NOT what I said or meant at all - not in any way. I have NO reason to
wish for the move, OR to see fans disappointed. Please don't put words in my
mouth about skating fans in other parts of the world!
The only person I know personally who has been planning on going to Brisbane is
not in N. America or Europe, & found Brisbane "convenient," despite being a
9-hour flight, and I was thrilled for her. I hope she'll still be able to
go...as I hope EVERYONE who wants to go will still be be able to!
Cbert4
if it
>were in Canada and someone posted a reference to the Events Trust would
>you assume someone has hired a private corporation? The Events Trust is
>an arms length body of the CFSA formed to provide continutity in planning
>skating events in Canada. Maybe the Queensland Events Corporation is a
>similar organization.
I did not know that, & appreciate your explaining it.
> As a second point, what's wrong with hiring a corporation to plan
>an event?
Absolutely nothing! But if it were a corporation totally removed from the
skating federation or LOC except for being hired to put on the event (as
opposed to what you posted about the Events Trust), I'd still wonder why
someone from the official organization was not getting more involved in
protesting such an important decision.
Basically I think the Australian press release, if it was quoted correctly,
should have made things a bit clearer.
Battersby
extremely disappointed in what has happened, but remain hopeful that the
issue can be resolved in a fair and equitable way), people should be aware
that the Queensland Events Corporation is an arm of Government and this
issue is being treated very seriously at the highest level.
There should also be absolutely no doubt of the ability of the organizing
committee to run the Worlds in Australia, as it would follow the very
successful 96 Junior Worlds in the exact same venue, with the same people
(and to some extent, the same - now maturing - skaters!)
Bob (Australia)
Lee
sharo...@my-deja.com wrote:
> Lee, I'd like to know what you mean by your remarks about France and
do
> the ISU 'think we are blind'?
> I appreciate you are quoting someone but you obviously agree with the
> sentiment to be posting it here.
>
serious financial difficulties, even to the point of almost (or did
they?) declaring bankruptcy a year or two ago. It is also believed by
some that the head of the French federation in 'in' quite tight with
Cinquanta, and that the French federation is benefitting from this mess
because of this. Hosting Worlds will mean a major cash infusion for the
French which will help them out of some of their difficulties.
I believe, by saying 'think we are blind,' the original poster is
referring to how these things are fairly widely known -- at least among
'net skating fans.
Lee
--
Murphy's Corollary:
It is impossible to make anything foolproof
because fools are so ingenious.
Lee
cbe...@aol.comnospam (Cbert4) wrote:
>
> Basically I think the Australian press release, if it was quoted
correctly,
> should have made things a bit clearer.
>
Austrailian representatives were already in the air, and because they
had little warning, they were trying to get word out as fast as
possible, hoping to hit the North American newswires in time for a hue
and cry to be raised. It was midnight MDT when I and a few others got
word of what was afoot. It does seem rather odd that news of a possible
move hit the Internet before the Aussie's had received a fax from the
ISU. As of Monday (North American daytime), folks had contacted the
Aussie LOC, and they knew NOTHING about the possibility of a move (this
was posted on FSW).
The original source, who IS quite close to the LOC in Australia, has
stated the LOC was not permitted to be a part of any television
negotiations. This source stated that Mr. Cinquanta (or people in his
office?) handled the negotiations and would not even speak to the one
network involved (did not return phone calls, etc). When verbal
problems arose with the other broadcasting, this person says Mr.
Cinquanta promptly cut off all talks, and again, would not return
calls, etc. From what this source has told me, problems arose when the
network would not accept verbal agreements as binding -- they wanted
things in writing. Apparently, THAT's when the ca-ca hit the whirly-
bird.
Vespertine
> As a second point, what's wrong with hiring a corporation to plan
>an event?
<<Absolutely nothing! But if it were a corporation totally removed from the
skating federation or LOC except for being hired to put on the event (as
opposed to what you posted about the Events Trust), I'd still wonder why
someone from the official organization was not getting more involved in
protesting such an important decision.>>
Hum. It's far more likely that they FORMED a corporation to handle the event
, as opposed to HIRING a corp to handle the event.
sharo...@my-deja.com
Lee <var...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> It's been well-known for a few years that the French federation has
had
> serious financial difficulties, even to the point of almost (or did
> they?) declaring bankruptcy a year or two ago. It is also believed by
> some that the head of the French federation in 'in' quite tight with
> Cinquanta, and that the French federation is benefitting from this
mess
> because of this. Hosting Worlds will mean a major cash infusion for
the
> French which will help them out of some of their difficulties.
>
> I believe, by saying 'think we are blind,' the original poster is
> referring to how these things are fairly widely known -- at least
among
> 'net skating fans.
>
>
> Good old Didier eh? ;) Can't say that the Politics of various
Federations have ever interested me that much or Speedy's antics.
I thought the Japanese were offered it first anyway, but turned it down?
Go A&P!! Hehehehe :)
Biased Observer
>It's been well-known for a few years that the French federation has had
>serious financial difficulties, even to the point of almost (or did
>they?) declaring bankruptcy a year or two ago.
They did.
It just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to have a bankrupt
organisation host a major event like Worlds. They're already hosting
the GPFinals. And they haven't even figured out where they are going
to hold that event!
At last year's Lalique, there weren't even any steeenking programmes
because they were too cheap to print any. They gouge the spectators
with very high ticket prices and no all-event passes.
The argument that the FFSG is somehow more competent isn't very
convincing. They are, however, more pliable to the charms of a certain
high velocity blade runner.
weichi, still rooting for Brisbane.....
Virginia Blalock
Observer) wrote:
>>What am I missing where France as a possible location is concerned?! What is
>>the "coincidence?"
>
>Oh, nothing special. Only that Didier Gailhalguet seems to be
>especially good chums with Speedie.
And from what I have read(or got the impression from posts), is a
pretty darn political fellow.
BTW,
Does anyone think that A&P have a better shot at a world title this
year because of this move?
> That the FFSG is financially broke
>doesn't quite seem to matter. Hey, they can always file for
>bankruptancy .. again!
And the ISU(with American TV money) may bail them out.. ;)
>Um, maybe they are the group responsible for the terms that the LOC is
>failing to meet? You seem rather eager to see Worlds out of Australia
>aren't you? I guess only NAmerican and European viewers deserve to
>attend Worlds.... all other skating fans can go eat dust.
I can attend worlds in France? Wow! Where do I pick up the money to
go?? :)
The Skating Rink http://visions.simplenet.com/skate/inded.html
The Skater Advocacy Petition http://visionsdesign.virtualave.net/petition.html
pi...@antispam.ca
>On Wed, 25 Aug 1999 11:02:03 GMT, sim...@hotmail.com (Biased
>Observer) wrote:
>
>
>>>What am I missing where France as a possible location is concerned?! What is
>>>the "coincidence?"
>>
>>Oh, nothing special. Only that Didier Gailhalguet seems to be
>>especially good chums with Speedie.
>
>And from what I have read(or got the impression from posts), is a
>pretty darn political fellow.
>
>BTW,
>
>Does anyone think that A&P have a better shot at a world title this
>year because of this move?
I hope so, I would love to see them win. It is sooo their time.
>
>> That the FFSG is financially broke
>>doesn't quite seem to matter. Hey, they can always file for
>>bankruptancy .. again!
>
>And the ISU(with American TV money) may bail them out.. ;)
>
>
>>Um, maybe they are the group responsible for the terms that the LOC is
>>failing to meet? You seem rather eager to see Worlds out of Australia
>>aren't you? I guess only NAmerican and European viewers deserve to
>>attend Worlds.... all other skating fans can go eat dust.
>
>I can attend worlds in France? Wow! Where do I pick up the money to
>go?? :)
>
>
>The Skating Rink http://visions.simplenet.com/skate/inded.html
>The Skater Advocacy Petition http://visionsdesign.virtualave.net/petition.html
---
To send email replace "antispam" with "sprint"
Vespertine
<<Does anyone think that A&P have a better shot at a world title this
year because of this move?>>
OK, let's get some totally groundless conspiracy theories going (gee, where's
ole chuckieg when you need him?) Here's my spin: the French federation agreed
NOT to sue/make a stink/etc about the "judging irregularites" (playing footsie)
in the World's ice dance competition, and in a double secret handshake, the ISU
agreed to give them 2000 Worlds in exchange.
There! Maybe I *could* write skating fiction.
zigzagm...@my-deja.com
Nice, France appears to be the most likely choice
> at this moment.
What the hell...
Podium said she was posting from Nice a few weeks ago (at the rate of $3 per
min.!). Podium, did you know anything about this, because it's really a
headache for those of us with deposits in with tour agents?
-- zigzag
Sk8maven
> >instead? Please! Does he think we fans are blind?
>
> What am I missing where France as a possible location is concerned?!
> What is the "coincidence?"
Two words: "Didier Gailhaguet".
The same slimy weasel who trumpeted around the world that Anissina &
Peizerat would medal at the 1998 Olympicas and Bourne & Kraatz would be
shut out -- MONTHS in advance of the Olympics actually taking place. The
same scumsucker who ADMITTED selling Moniotte & Lavanchy - once the
leading French ice-dance team - down the river in order to guarantee
medals for Anissina & Peizerat. The same scuzzball who pulls every
string within reach to boost and push and favor skaters that his wife
coaches, and does the same to shut out and blackball skaters who are
rivals to his wife's skaters.
Gailhaguet is also a major suck-up to Ottavio Cinquanta and is
undoubtedly owed a number of favors by now.
It looks from this viewpoint as though the ISU is *MORE* corrupt than
the IOC.
Maven
OperettaJK
<sk8m...@monumental.com> writes:
>Gailhaguet is also a major suck-up to Ottavio Cinquanta and is
>undoubtedly owed a number of favors by now.
Was he the one who asked Speedy to forbid Kwan and Eldredge skate in the Skate
American last year? The ISU seems to be run by a very small group of Speedy
cronies.
Jas
Jocelyn
>year because of this move?
Hm. With a performance like at Helsinki, and a French judge on the panel, I
don't see how they could not win. They *should* have won in Helsinki, IMO.
The crowd heavily favored them there, too - though obviously not to the fever
pitch I'm sure the French crowd will!
We'll see. Dueling Carminas, take your positions!
Jocelyn
--
a shameless plug for my website...
http://welcome.to/inside-edge/ - Inside Edge: A Figure Skating Resource
Skatecatky
But you think, with a venture this BIG that there would have been something
done a long, long time ago instead of 6 months out.
From the reports we're hearing now about how the ISU allegedly was the only one
involved in the television negotiations, then perhaps they ARE to blame for all
of this - and not the Australian federation or LOC.
I still think the tour groups are going to get a wallet wham-bang from this.
It's my understanding that these folks purchase blocks of tickets, up front,
with their own resources (or at least one tour group promoter I know does) and
then sells their packages and recoups their money. This doesn't bode well for
those tour group promoters/owners because, normally, the best seats (which they
all over) are the ones they purchase well in advance -- meaning the LOC has the
money for a long time, and there is, to my knowledge, no refund policy if these
tour folks buy too many tickets and can't sell them all.
So, the whole mess is going to get worse.
But I'm more inclined to go to Worlds if it's in Europe - I'm not up for almost
24 hours of travel from where I live.
Smallovian Insider
(Skatecatky) writes:
>>But maybe they (the ISU) thought it WAS finalized
>
>But you think, with a venture this BIG that there would have been something
>done a long, long time ago instead of 6 months out.
>
>From the reports we're hearing now about how the ISU allegedly was the only
>one
>involved in the television negotiations, then perhaps they ARE to blame for
>all
>of this - and not the Australian federation or LOC.
>
>I still think the tour groups are going to get a wallet wham-bang from this.
>It's my understanding that these folks purchase blocks of tickets, up front,
Hmmm. Will the tour promoters also sue? How about the fans? Any merit for a
class-action law suit about breech of promise? Actions detrimental to a member?
Peg
reply to p.egl...@aol.com [re move the obvious ext ra dots]
==
join OT-r...@onelist.com - for off-topic discussions. Send an email to
OT-rssif-...@onelist.com to subscribe
@>--\--- Any request to delete this post is a forgery---/--<@
Virginia Blalock
>>Does anyone think that A&P have a better shot at a world title this
>>year because of this move?
>
>Hm. With a performance like at Helsinki, and a French judge on the panel, I
>don't see how they could not win. They *should* have won in Helsinki, IMO.
>The crowd heavily favored them there, too - though obviously not to the fever
>pitch I'm sure the French crowd will!
>
>We'll see. Dueling Carminas, take your positions!
:)
I have no idea if any result will happen towards A&P at all at worlds,
but I do know that I would bet that I would not want to be two Russian
ice dancers with the last names that begin with K and O. I feel sorry
for them already for the fan reaction they are bound to get(or not get
depending on how French audiences uaually act).
Margaret Burwell
Smallovian Insider (dele...@aol.composer.) writes:
> In article <19990825230716...@ng-cr1.aol.com>, skate...@aol.com
> (Skatecatky) writes:
>>I still think the tour groups are going to get a wallet wham-bang from this.
>>It's my understanding that these folks purchase blocks of tickets, up front,
>
> Hmmm. Will the tour promoters also sue? How about the fans? Any merit for a
> class-action law suit about breech of promise? Actions detrimental to a member?
I don't suppose that anything has been said as to whether tickets
sold to this point will be honoured in France or will it be back to square
one. I spoke to my travel agent/tour organizer and she told me that she
was just at the point where money had to be spent to hold hotel room
bookings so she is not faced with losing that money quite yet. What she
has lost is the time spent researching hotels, sightseeing, side trips,
best possible airline schedules and prices. Nothing will compensate her
for that, though I suppose it is part of the risks of doing business. I
would assume that she could sue for the cost of tickets if she has to buy
them again, but any losses associated with side trips and sightseeing is
gone.
The big question mark at this point is whether or not the
Australian Federation will fight. If they decide to take legal action,
who has jurisdiction - Australia, France, Switzerland? How would a
judgment be enforced? It's a conundrum inside an enigma.
Marg
Marlene A Koenig
papers about this.
I don't know about the alleged problems, but having the Worlds in
Australia seemed to be a bad idea from the start.
Forget about the time difference, and yes, there would be a question about
television coverage. For the US and European networks, it is more expensive
to set up in Australia. There is also psychological disadvantage for
the skaters. It will be late summer, not winter.
Australia is also not a Skating powerhouse so it doesn't make
sense to put the championships in a country not known for skating.
Today's Aussie papers, including the Brisbane paper, were more
intersted in the Pan Pacific swimming championships
--
"Best leave the sins of others well alone until you've made some
headway with your own." Celimene, The Misanthrope (Tony Harrison adaptation,
HILL JANET SWAN
>What is also interesting is the lack of real coverage in the Aussie
>papers about this.
that is interesting. Though I wonder how big a deal it would be in the US
papers if worlds were moved from a US city. Sure, the US (and probably
Canadian) folks who are serious fans would be livid. But would most of
the papers care?
>I don't know about the alleged problems, but having the Worlds in
>Australia seemed to be a bad idea from the start.
I don't know why.
>Forget about the time difference
Japan doesn't pose any greater problem in this regard
>and yes, there would be a question about television coverage. For the
US and European networks, it is more expensive to set up in Australia.
And in Japan, which has successfully hosted several worlds.
>There is also psychological disadvantage for
>the skaters. It will be late summer, not winter.
I don't buy this. Skaters don't see anything but the inside of ice rinks
and hotels.
>Australia is also not a Skating powerhouse so it doesn't make
>sense to put the championships in a country not known for skating.
Au contraire. it makes very good sense to rotate the championships around
the world "spreading the wealth", increasing the exposure of the sport,
etc.
>Today's Aussie papers, including the Brisbane paper, were more
>intersted in the Pan Pacific swimming championships
Of course. They are currently being held
I would think that this move, which could be seen as a move to
exclude a member nation from some of the benefits of membership, would not
sit particularly well with some of the other "lesser powers".
Mind you, I'm making no particular observations about whether it was
necessary to move the championships from Brisbane to Nice, because I don't
know the facts of the case, and can't judge. I'm just noting that I don't
believe there is any *substantive* reason that Australia should be
regarded as an "undesirable" place to put the competition.
Years ago (1991?) the USFSA put Precision Nationals in Anchorage. It was
long past "their turn" to host a major competition. Lots of people
complained because of the cost of travel, and the distance, and the time
away from school. And lots of teams chose not to attend. Well, my
daughter's team went. It was a wonderful experience. The people from the
LOC were gracious and welcoming. The competition was great fun. The
skating was topnotch.
I'm from "the hinterlands" myself. I get really tired of people who
always want to put (US) national events in places like Los Angeles, New
York, San Francisco, Chicago, Boston, Atlanta, etc. It's not that I don't
enjoy visiting those places. It's that there's a whole lot of the country
left over. Ever so often you have to give the people who have been
inconvenienced nearly every year a chance to be the ones who have an
easy time of it.
janet
--
Margaret Burwell
Marlene A Koenig (74642...@CompuServe.COM) writes:
> What is also interesting is the lack of real coverage in the Aussie
> papers about this.
> Australia seemed to be a bad idea from the start.
> television coverage. For the US and European networks, it is more expensive
> the skaters. It will be late summer, not winter.
Well, I know of a couple of skaters who are looking forward to a
warm weather competition as much as I am. Skaters train right through the
summer. Skating in warm weather will not be a problem, believe me.
> Australia is also not a Skating powerhouse so it doesn't make
> sense to put the championships in a country not known for skating.
> Today's Aussie papers, including the Brisbane paper, were more
> intersted in the Pan Pacific swimming championships
First, there is no reason to think that a country that is not a
skating powerhouse cannot put on a good World Championships. I would
point to Great Britain, Switzerland, and Finland as recent examples. All
have hosted marvelous championship events and not one of them had a medal
winner. Often, their skaters advanced to the final portion of the event
based solely on their host nation status.
Second, there is no reason that the announcement concerning a
competition that won't take place for another 6 to 7 months would displace
a competition now underway in which Australian athletes have a strong
competitive history.
Marg
Marlene A Koenig
after all the AP had the story, and it was picked by a good number
of member papers. But it is unlikely that the worlds would
be moved from the US.
Marlene A Koenig
Yes, skaters do train all year, but travel-wise, for most of the skaters,
Australia is loooooong plane ride.
Personally, whatever the reason, moving the championships seems like
a good idea.
Dave Amorde
>
>
>>Australia is also not a Skating powerhouse so it doesn't make
>>sense to put the championships in a country not known for skating.
>
>the world "spreading the wealth", increasing the exposure of the sport,
>etc.
>
>necessary to move the championships from Brisbane to Nice, because I don't
>know the facts of the case, and can't judge. I'm just noting that I don't
>believe there is any *substantive* reason that Australia should be
>regarded as an "undesirable" place to put the competition.
>
I believe the very nature of a "World" event dictates that no member nation
should be exempted from the rotation unless they expressly desire it. This is
especially true of an event that gains most of it's monetary support from TV
broadcasts, as opposed to actual attendance. However, I can also see why an
inability to provide said TV feeds/coverage would be a reason for excluding a
location. I can't begin to understand the details behind the decision to move
the comps, but I agree with Janet that there is nothing inherently wrong with
Australia as a location.
-Dave-
Dave Amorde
says...
>
> Well, I know of a couple of skaters who are looking forward to a
>warm weather competition as much as I am. Skaters train right through the
>summer. Skating in warm weather will not be a problem, believe me.
>
Actually, since most of the club comps take place during summer & fall, the
skaters first competitive experiences most likely took place during warm
weather. Nothing like walking out of a cold rink into 95f weather!
-Dave-
Highlander
SKHazen
(Margaret Burwell) writes under the "Re: Australia Worlds" thread:
> The big question mark at this point is whether or not the
>Australian Federation will fight. If they decide to take legal action,
>who has jurisdiction - Australia, France, Switzerland? How would a
>judgment be enforced? It's a conundrum inside an enigma.
Actually, it's pretty straight-forward. Any final decision made by the ISU
Congress, the ISU Council (as this decision is announced to have been) or the
ISU Appeals Commission may be taken directly to the Court of Arbitration for
Sport. ISU Constitution Article 23 (1998-2000). Were there an actual ISU Rule
being cited by the Council (as contrasted with an "understanding," "rescript,"
or the like) as having been violated by the AUS fed and serving as the basis of
the decision, the appeal to the CAS would have to be preceded by exhaustion of
administrative remedies within the ISU -- in this case proceedings with the ISU
Appeals Commission pursuant to ISU Constitution Article 22.
All international sports federations ("IF") such as the ISU are required by the
IOC Charter to submit to the jurisdiction of the CAS. Although based in
Lausanne, the CAS has proven to be a remarkably independent body -- which, as a
multinational juridical body recognized by international treaties, it should
be. Recall, for example, that it was the CAS which overturned the IOC decision
in Nagano to strip one of the Canadian athletes of a medal following testing
which revealed exposure to marijuana (at that time, a non-banned substance
under the IOC rules).
Absent possible involvement of the ISU Appeals Commission (of which, BTW,
Donald McKnight who is Pres of the AUS fed is a Substitute Member), the time
frame for appeals is quite tight. The final decision being appealed must be
filed with the CAS within 21 days following receipt of the decision.
FWIW, there is an appeal pending before the CAS on a final decision made this
past summer by an IF. From what I understand of it, there would appear to be a
good chance that the CAS will rule against the IF in that matter -- possibly
before the 21-day period in the AUS matter would run, providing some further
indications of how the process works before a decision must be made as to
whether to invoke CAS review. In any event, the decision under challenge in
that other matter was itself never publicly announced and probably will not be
unless/until the CAS acts.
Determinations by the CAS may include monetary damages but may also order the
IF (or the IOC itself, as occurred in Nagaon) to take specified actions
including recinding the decision appealed and/or enjoining implimentation of
the substitution effected by such decision. Final determinations of the CAS
are enforceable in any court of competent jurisdiction -- in FRA, SWI, or AUS.
Respectfully,
Steven <---- who, the foregoing notwithstanding, assertedly "does not know any
info basic or other wise"
skat...@aol.com
like Johnny Cochran who is a genius at getting press, putting the other
guy in the hot seat, and making whatever circumstances exist look
awfully good for his side. Come to think of it, get Leslie Abramson
(sp?)too. Even if Cochran never sets foot in an international or ISU
"courtroom" the publicity he could garner, at least in North America,
would be great for Australia and very detrimental to the ISU. It
sounds to me like the ISU may have made a capricious decision and
deserves to pay big time for it. I wish Australia could actually stop
the worlds this year through a court injunction or something.
If I were Vancouver or anyone else on the ISU's schedule I'd be hiring
lawyers too and making sure everything was nailed down tight or
withdrawing my bid. If I were a city considering offering to host
Worlds, I'd forget it completely. You can't have cities, clubs,
individuals, corporations investing millions of $$ that may be totally
wasted because of someone's whim. I hope some of the powers that be in
the ISU with courage and integrity (if there are any--certainly not the
USFSA folks and certainly not Didier G --who is a proven liar) start a
quiet movement NOW to get rid of Cinquanta as president. He has been a
total fiasco. He appears to wield total power and no one has the nerve
to stand up to him or stop him.
Jean Lenzi
Connie Swab
reassigning Worlds they have lost whatever shred of honor they had.
Completely ignoring the issue of contracts and business is it hopelessly
naive to believe an organisations word should be honored. Anyone who
has attended international figure skating competitions in the last
decade is well aware of the inconveniences and snafus that occur daily
at ANY site. Are we then to believe that the ISU sanctioned it's most
important competition of the year (well in advance, let's not forget)
without sufficient reconnaissance? No officals visited the site, spoke
of TV access and international broadcast rights? Did the ISU pick the
city out of a hat? International TV generates significant amounts of
cash each year for the ISU and only NOW do they perceive a problem? Are
we to believe that IQ's have dropped sharply within the ISU or are they
counting on the effects of Zamboni exhaust on our brain cells? If the
ISU is bold enough to pull the Championships from Brisbane be bold
enough to give the REAL reason(s). Whatever reason is given what would
be done? One day I fear the noblesse oblige attitude of a very small
cadre of ISU officials will bring our sport to it's knees. Ruling by
decree may have been popular in the era of Avery Brundage but it's now
chipping away at the integrity of figure skating. The ruling elite have
managed to co-opt or neuter any opposition so I see no change in the
near future. The sad truth is that any lawsuits will be working their
way through the international courts long after everyone has returned
from France.
SKHazen
writes:
> The sad truth is that any lawsuits will be working their
>way through the international courts long after everyone has returned
>from France.
If this goes directly to the Court for Abritration of Sport, it will be
resolved quite promptly. The CAS is set up for actions which must be handled
in exactly situations such as this for which the normally lengthy court
proceedings would be quite ineffecrtive. And, of course, once a decision is
rendered by the CAS it can then be enforced in FRA courts (or elsewhere) with
very little administrative hurdles.
AUS seems to be setting up an argument for taking the matter through the ISU
Appeals Commission first before any resort to the CAS. If it takes that
course, then the author quoted above may indeed be correct ... depending on who
independent the AC turns out to be (again, Donald McKnight being a Substitute
member of the Commission).
Respectfully,
Steven
HILL JANET SWAN
>One day I fear the noblesse oblige attitude of a very small
>cadre of ISU officials will bring our sport to it's knees.
Noblesse oblige is one of the things that these people seem to be LACKING.
(noblesse oblige = the obligations that fall to those of noble birth. That
is, the obligation that those of high rank and power have to behave with
honor and compassion)
janet
--
Connie Swab
Connie Swab
have been lost. I think ISU officials have become so wrapped up in the
power of their positions that they have forgotten to meet their
obligations to the sport. What is that quote about absolute power?
Perhaps that is more apropos? Is there such a word as Ivorytoweritis?
Let me know. Connie
Jocelyn
Absolute power corrupts absolutely. I believe it may have been in reference to
Louis XIV, who thought he was the King of the Sun and probably would've been
institutionalized today. :-)
HILL JANET SWAN
>Quite true. Unfortunately Rank & Power remain while Honor & Compassion
>have been lost.
(smile) It certainly looks that way ....
(snip)
>HILL JANET SWAN wrote:
>>
>> Connie Swab <comfyw...@home.com> wrote:
>>
>> >One day I fear the noblesse oblige attitude of a very small
>> >cadre of ISU officials will bring our sport to it's knees.
>>
>> Noblesse oblige is one of the things that these people seem to be LACKING.
>> (noblesse oblige = the obligations that fall to those of noble birth. That
>> is, the obligation that those of high rank and power have to behave with
>> honor and compassion)
>>
>> janet
>>
>> --
--
Pat C
>If this goes directly to the Court for Abritration of Sport, it will be
>resolved quite promptly. The CAS is set up for actions which must be handled
>in exactly situations such as this for which the normally lengthy court
>proceedings would be quite ineffecrtive. And, of course, once a decision is
>rendered by the CAS it can then be enforced in FRA courts (or elsewhere) with
>very little administrative hurdles.
Then why would Aus use the appeals commission first, rather then CAS?
Pat C
gobigred
Connie Swab <comfyw...@home.com> wrote in message
news:37D0131A...@home.com...
> Quite true. Unfortunately Rank & Power remain while Honor & Compassion
> power of their positions that they have forgotten to meet their
> Perhaps that is more apropos? Is there such a word as Ivorytoweritis?
> Let me know. Connie
>
All power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
Lord Acton (dk year, think it's 17somethingish)