Tracy Weinmann/Susan Humphreys
Jon Seydl
of those weird CTV segments when they review a past Skate Canada
champion's career (weird because they are so frank about a skater's
disappointments--something you'd never see in the USA), they discussed
Tracy Weinmann (sp?). I just didn't understand what happened in her
career: According to the segment: Great successes at the age 13-15:
hiatus: comeback a few years later: retirement before 20.
Can someone who actually remembers this skater's career explain more about
these ups and downs. The segment made it seem like she left the sport entirely
but then threw in how she married Jozef Sabovc^ik, which makes it seem
unlikely that she could be far from skating... Confusing.
Also, anyone know how Susan Hunphreys is doing? Is her back better?
Who's coaching her now?
--
Jon Seydl jse...@sas.upenn.edu
Louis Epstein
: I was just rewatching the tape of Skate Canada 1994 last night and in one
: champion's career (weird because they are so frank about a skater's
: disappointments--something you'd never see in the USA), they discussed
: Tracy Weinmann (sp?).
Wainman.
(I thought you didn't have a VCR?)
Faxel 1
easily. She was Canadian champion and Canada's little darling at 13, was
sent to Worlds even before she made it to the top in Canada, and had more
pressure on her than any female skater can take at that age. After two
Canadian championships (and puberty) she was burned out. She tried to make
a comback in 1985-86 and went to Worlds, but didn't do terribly well. I
still like her, though. She lives in Toronto and still skates in various
show. (She was in World Tour Champions on Ice a couple of years ago.) She
and Sabovcik have an adorable three-year-old named Blade. As for Susan
Humphreys, she skated in Skate the Nation.
Sandra Loosemore
TV on cable so I got to witness the Tracy Wainman hype machine in
action. My recollection is that the CFSA sent her to the 1980 world
championships instead of their national champion, because they had
such great hopes for her future and wanted to give her more
competition experience before she got into a situation where there
would be a lot of pressure on her to win. She was only 12 years old
at the time -- this was before the ISU put in the age limit they have
now. From what I remember, Wainman *was* a talented skater and had
good performing skills for her age, but she didn't have any triple
jumps yet. She did win the Canadian championship the next year but
apparently she had a real hard time with puberty and was never able to
get consistent triples. I'm not real sure about the details because
I'd left the UP by then and didn't get Canadian TV any more. I think
that when she won her second Canadian championship in 1986 it was at
least partly because Elizabeth Manley had troubles then, too.
(Incidentally, I remember that Manley was also being promoted as a
future star on Canadian TV as early as 1980 or 1981.)
I've occasionally seen Wainman performing professionally in ice shows or
TV specials in the past five years or so. She was with the World Cup
tour and I think also with Disney or Ice Capades at one time.
-Sandra
Margaret Burwell
> Back around 1980 when I was living in Upper Michigan, we got Canadian
> TV on cable so I got to witness the Tracy Wainman hype machine in
> action. My recollection is that the CFSA sent her to the 1980 world
> championships instead of their national champion, because they had
> such great hopes for her future and wanted to give her more
> competition experience before she got into a situation where there
> would be a lot of pressure on her to win. She was only 12 years old
> at the time -- this was before the ISU put in the age limit they have
At the time, the ISU had announced their intention of introducing
an age limit for World competitions. Competitors who had already competed
and World's would be exempt from this rule. The CFSA chose Tracey that
year so that she would qualify at 13 and not have to wait until she was 14
as required by the new rule. It was an Olympic year and the Canadian
champion was named to the Olympic team. History shows, I think, that they
(the CFSA) did no one any favours.
Marg
Louis Epstein
The rule must diddle back and forth...Kwan went at 13.I understand a reigning
World Junior Champion who is 12(the minimum age there) can also go.Czako
was at Worlds 13 in 1992.
So what does a country with an 11-year-old national champion do??
Sandra Loosemore
[about ISU minimum age requirements]
The rule must diddle back and forth...Kwan went at 13.I understand
a reigning World Junior Champion who is 12(the minimum age there)
can also go.Czako was at Worlds 13 in 1992.
Kwan *was* the reigning world junior champion when she attended worlds
in 1994. Czako got an exemption, as did Natasha Kuchiki in 1990.
So what does a country with an 11-year-old national champion do??
Petition for an exemption, I guess, but maybe the ISU would say no.
Personally, I think it would be very unlikely that an 11-year-old
could skate well enough to be at all competitive at worlds anyway. At
that age they lack the physical maturity to skate with the power and
speed of an adult, and the emotional maturity to do the artistic
interpretation. Kids like the younger Stieglers or Tara Lipinski are
remarkably talented children, but if you put them competing against
adults you'll see the difference right away.
-Sandra
Margaret Burwell
>
> So what does a country with an 11-year-old national champion do??
>
Don't push her too hard or too early if they are smart. - Marg
Louis Epstein
: Louis Epstein (lep...@j51.com) writes:
: >
: > So what does a country with an 11-year-old national champion do??
: >
: Don't push her too hard or too early if they are smart. - Marg
Sonja Henie won her first national title at 11 and went on to win 10
Worlds...
IISk8
Sonja Henie's situation was in no way comparable to the intense pressure,
media scrutiny, and technical demands facing modern skaters. Women
weren't even doing double jumps then, I believe, possibly not even axels
yet.
Altarith
Club in Edmonton).
Louis Epstein
: I think the rule is that any skater at age 13 who TURNS 14
: WITHIN A SPECIFIED TIME of the World Championships can go. I'm
: almost certain that Michelle Kwan got to go at age 13 because
: she turned 14 within a month of the Worlds.
Worlds were in March 1994,she turned 14 on July 7,1994.
: And I'm almost certain that Kuchinki got to go because of an
: exemption -- the age rule was partly meant to avoid the
: Soviet "one-and-a-half" pairs teams (the "rag doll" teams).
: Kuchinki and her partner were definitely NOT a "rag doll"
: team; she certainly provided her fair share of skating!
(The term I use is "projectile pairs"...this started with
Tcherkassova & Shakrai).
: I hope that Susan Humphreys has regained her health and can
: compete fully this year. It would be really fun to see a
: healthy and deep competitive field for women's this year.
Well,since Kim DNQed and Robinson was 19th,Canada has one Worlds slot
that most concede to the reinstated Chouinard...
Jane Hunt
I think the rule is that any skater at age 13 who TURNS 14
WITHIN A SPECIFIED TIME of the World Championships can go. I'm
almost certain that Michelle Kwan got to go at age 13 because
she turned 14 within a month of the Worlds.
And I'm almost certain that Kuchinki got to go because of an
exemption -- the age rule was partly meant to avoid the
Soviet "one-and-a-half" pairs teams (the "rag doll" teams).
Kuchinki and her partner were definitely NOT a "rag doll"
team; she certainly provided her fair share of skating!
As for Tracey Wainman -- yes, the CFSA pushed her too hard
and too fast (but where were her parents?) -- BUT she DID
win Canadians the next year, at age 13, thereby winning the
right to go to Worlds as Canada's representative. And she did
finish in the top ten that year (after finishing 12th in her
first Worlds). So at that point she was the top Canadian
women's singles skater.
I'm really sorry she couldn't nail the triples, because Tracey
has always been one of my favorite skaters -- not only her
presentation skills (which are still excellent, but
not appreciated to their full extent because she "disappointed"
so many people by not making it to the top) -- but also
because I simply admire her guts and strong personality by
surviving the whole situation and coming out with her life
intact.
From the accounts I've heard, it was Tracey's decision to try
a come-back. And it was successful -- she regained her
Canadian championship and finished in the top ten in the
World again.
Debby Fortin
LE>Well,since Kim DNQed and Robinson was 19th,Canada has one Worlds slot
LE>that most concede to the reinstated Chouinard...
Not this skating fan!! I think a healthy Susan Humphreys is a
definite threat to Josee.
___
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Fiona McQuarrie
much to do with the CFSA's decision to send Tracy Wainman to Worlds. As I
recall, she won the freeskating portion of the senior ladies competition
at Canadians that year, and I recall that part of the CFSA's decision was
based on that - that they thought she might have a better chance at worlds
than the woman who actually did win (Janet.....? boy, there's a trivia
question :) ).
I also think that, age limit or no, they wanted to put the world's level
judges "on notice" that here was someone who would be back in the future and
who they should take notice of now. Unfortunately (and understandably) the
Hype Monster and the Puberty Monster both took their effects, and
Wainman never lived up to the potential that was placed on her - as if
anyone could.....
I saw her skate on a canadian champions' tour just after she won her last
Canadian title and I thought she was really good (she was hitting triples
consistently in both shows and was quite thrilled). I agree that the CFSA
bears a lot of responsibility for hampering a very promising career.
ON a rerlated note (age), wasn't Natasha Kuchiki 13 at Worlds in Oakland?
Or had she just barely turned 14? I know there was some flap over her
age...
Cheers, Fiona
Margaret Burwell
> I'm not sure that the "age limit" pending for Worlds competitors had too
> much to do with the CFSA's decision to send Tracy Wainman to Worlds. As I
> recall, she won the freeskating portion of the senior ladies competition
> at Canadians that year, and I recall that part of the CFSA's decision was
> based on that - that they thought she might have a better chance at worlds
> than the woman who actually did win (Janet.....? boy, there's a trivia
> question :) ).
No, it was trying to get Tracey there before the age rule came
into effect. She would then be "grandfathered" and not come under the new
rule. As for your trivia - it was Janet Morrissey. I know because she
was from my home club - the Nepean Skating Club - and later coached there
part time while working as a broadcast journalist. After she stopped
competing, she graduated from Carleton University with a degree in
Journalism.
> ON a rerlated note (age), wasn't Natasha Kuchiki 13 at Worlds in Oakland?
> Or had she just barely turned 14? I know there was some flap over her
> age...
True, but anyone can apply to the ISU for an exception to the rule
which the US did for Natasha.
Marg
Louis Epstein
: ON a rerlated note (age), wasn't Natasha Kuchiki 13 at Worlds in Oakland?
: Or had she just barely turned 14? I know there was some flap over her
: age...
1994 Olympic team biodata said Kuchiki was 17,so in 1992 she would have been
15...in 1991,the year she won Nationals,14,and in 1990,her FIRST Worlds,in
Halifax,she was 13(as was Kwan in Chiba).
Debby Fortin
Fiona,
- that they thought she might have a better chance at worlds
FM>than the woman who actually did win (Janet.....? boy, there's a trivia
FM>question :) ).
You are thinking of Janet Morrisey, but actually it was Heather
Kemkaren who won the title in 1980. Janet's win came a year or two later.
FM>ON a rerlated note (age), wasn't Natasha Kuchiki 13 at Worlds in Oakland?
FM>Or had she just barely turned 14? I know there was some flap over her
FM>age...
Actually she was 14 and they were able to get approval for her to be
on the team as she was maturely built for her age. The rule was set for
those 'Mutt and Jeff' teams that the Russians were notorious for and
thus didn't apply to Kuchiki and Sands.
Debby
debby....@bbs.logicnet.com
__
__
Louis Epstein
: Fiona,
: - that they thought she might have a better chance at worlds
: FM>than the woman who actually did win (Janet.....? boy, there's a trivia
: FM>question :) ).
:
: You are thinking of Janet Morrisey, but actually it was Heather
: Kemkaren who won the title in 1980. Janet's win came a year or two later.
No,Janet Morrissey's only win at Canadians was 1979,between Kemkaran's
two.Wainman's first was 1981.[what lists I have of Canadian champions
cover singles 1951-82...Sandra's FAQ picks up from 1980]
: FM>ON a rerlated note (age), wasn't Natasha Kuchiki 13 at Worlds in Oakland?
: FM>Or had she just barely turned 14? I know there was some flap over her
: FM>age...
: Actually she was 14 and they were able to get approval for her to be
: on the team as she was maturely built for her age. The rule was set for
: those 'Mutt and Jeff' teams that the Russians were notorious for and
: thus didn't apply to Kuchiki and Sands.
But set up well after Tcherkassova & Shakhrai won...
Debby Fortin
LE>: You are thinking of Janet Morrisey, but actually it was Heather
LE>: Kemkaren who won the title in 1980. Janet's win came a year or two later.
LE>
LE>No,Janet Morrissey's only win at Canadians was 1979,between Kemkaran's
LE>two.Wainman's first was 1981.[what lists I have of Canadian champions
LE>cover singles 1951-82...Sandra's FAQ picks up from 1980]
Yes, you are right...I'm sorry. It was Kay Thomson, the spinner,
who took over after Tracy's win in 1981 for the next three years.
Debby
debby....@bbs.logicnet.com