JETS NEWS: Manson acquired
Steven Eitzen
nosed defenseman Dave Manson from the Edmonton Oilers. Along with
Manson the Jets receive a 6th round draft pick.
However, to convince Glen Sather to part with him, the Jets had to
really open the bank. Going to the Oilers are rookie defenseman Boris
Mironov (2nd round pick, 1992), NHL rights to Mats Lindgren (1st round
pick, 1993), and the Jets first and fourth round picks in this year's
draft. This year's first round pick will be a huge part of the deal, a
fourth overall selection as it stands right now.
This was a trade whose purpose was to improve the Jets *now*, as
opposed to the normal trade over the years which was to trade for the
future. Manson's presence on the Jets' blueline will hopefully have the
effect of keeping the crease clear for the goaltenders and to pressure
incoming forwards to get rid of the puck earlier to avoid getting hit.
Manson is already in Winnipeg, and is happy to be here. He has two
years left on his contract, paying him $1.1 million (US) this season,
and $1.2 million (US) for the next two years. This gives him the title
of Jets' highest paid player, previously held for a week by newly
acquired goaltender Tim Cheveldae.
Manson will make his debut tomorrow night at home against the St. Louis
Blues, wearing uniform #3.
--
Steve Eitzen Internet: umei...@cc.umanitoba.ca
Vice President - UMCCA Senior Advisor - On Line Consulting
r.s.h contact - Winnipeg Jets
"Don't put off to tomorrow that which can be done at midnight"
Tim Covell
Tim Covell
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey,alt.sports.hockey.nhl.winnipeg-jets
Subject: Re: JETS NEWS: Manson acquired
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Is it just me, or are there a lot of GM's making what seem to be
idiotic trades? The above trade, Hartford's trades, Ron Caron's moves, they
all seem stupid. Perhaps with time, Hartford and St. Louis' moves won't seem
so bad, but the Winnipeg move ....
Could the answer be that the talent pool is so deep that a team can
afford to throw away 1'st round picks? Have we in general failed to catch on
to this change? I know that in the past questionable moves have been made.
Tom Kurvers to T.O. for a very high 1st rounder is a prime example. For the
Sabres fans, J.F. Sauve', Andre' Savard, and Tony Mckegney for Re'al Cloutier
is another prime example. Recently, however, I've perceived an increase in
the "bad" trades. I wonder why.
What do you think??
t.c.
Alain DAGHER
: John Paddock made his second trade in a week today as he picked up hard
: nosed defenseman Dave Manson from the Edmonton Oilers.
What is this guy Paddock thinking? He gives up unbelievable future
talent and draft choices for an overpaid, over-rated goon (worse than
McSorely). It doesn't make any sense. The Jets don't have a hope of
making the playoffs, so why acquire Manson? The only way this is a
good deal is if the Jets trade him to someone else who is in
contention. Dumb, dumb, dumb.
Best wishes,
Alain Dagher
Montreal Neurological Institute
E-Mail: al...@pet.mni.mcgill.ca
Connie Cho
>Did you see him play his first game?
>
>that is reason enough to justify his trade...
>
>Your I-net friend, Tim
As did Cheveldae. Drake looks pretty fast. And the whole team just buzzed the
s**t out of the Blues. I hope this is a hint of more to come. Good
special teams play, much better stuff out of Shannon and Zhamnov.
I liked it.
Steven Eitzen
>>Did you see him play his first game?
>>that is reason enough to justify his trade...
>As did Cheveldae. Drake looks pretty fast. And the whole team just buzzed the
>s**t out of the Blues. I hope this is a hint of more to come. Good
>special teams play, much better stuff out of Shannon and Zhamnov.
>I liked it.
Yep. Just think of it. Next year, Teemu will be back and the first two
lines could look like:
Shannon-Zhamnov-Selanne
Tkachuk-Drake-Emerson
Barring any trades of course...
Not bad for a team which has been a one line team all year.
--
Steve Eitzen Internet: umei...@cc.umanitoba.ca
Vice President - UMCCA Senior Advisor - On Line Consulting
r.s.h contact - Winnipeg Jets
"What good is being an admiral if you can't sleep late?"
ramesh
>What is this guy Paddock thinking? He gives up unbelievable future
>talent and draft choices for an overpaid, over-rated goon (worse than
>McSorely). It doesn't make any sense. The Jets don't have a hope of
>making the playoffs, so why acquire Manson? The only way this is a
>good deal is if the Jets trade him to someone else who is in
>contention. Dumb, dumb, dumb.
unknowns. If the deal lives up to it's potential from the Oilers point of
view (a la Mark Messier and Paul Coffey), Sather will be touted as a genius
but if it whimpers (a la Martin Gelinas and Chris Joseph) it will just be
another Oiler "fire sale" tragedy.
At least Paddock knows what he's getting.
----- Rohan
Gary L Dare
>Did you see him play his first game?
>
>that is reason enough to justify his trade...
On the flip side, Manson might be trying to play himself out
of town ... he was probably expecting to be eating steak at
Smith & Wolensky's in midtown Manhattan with Messier, Lowe,
Tikkanen and Keenan this week ...
Instead, he probably got a coupon for a Mexican Fried Ice
Cream at Chi-Chi's in Polo Park for appearing on the CJOB
postgame show ...
gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> g...@columbia.EDU Support NAFTA
> uk...@freenet.victoria.bc.ca (soon) Eat Mexican (El Teddy's ad)
Doug Chabun
>Timothy John Woelk <umw...@cc.umanitoba.ca> wrote:
>>Did you see him play his first game?
>>
>>that is reason enough to justify his trade...
>On the flip side, Manson might be trying to play himself out
>of town ... he was probably expecting to be eating steak at
>Smith & Wolensky's in midtown Manhattan with Messier, Lowe,
>Tikkanen and Keenan this week ...
>Instead, he probably got a coupon for a Mexican Fried Ice
>Cream at Chi-Chi's in Polo Park for appearing on the CJOB
>postgame show ...
That would be Gringos. Chi-Chi's got traded for Gringos a couple weeks ago.
Bryon Thur
Alain DAGHER <alain@quince> wrote:
>Steven Eitzen (umei...@cc.umanitoba.ca) wrote:
>: John Paddock made his second trade in a week today as he picked up hard
>: nosed defenseman Dave Manson from the Edmonton Oilers.
>
>
>What is this guy Paddock thinking? He gives up unbelievable future
>talent and draft choices for an overpaid, over-rated goon (worse than
>McSorely). It doesn't make any sense. The Jets don't have a hope of
>making the playoffs, so why acquire Manson? The only way this is a
>good deal is if the Jets trade him to someone else who is in
>contention. Dumb, dumb, dumb.
>
I dunno. The Jets have an abundance of overrated but underachieving young
talent that didn't do them an ounce of good this year. Paddock needs to do
the same type of thing that the Nordiques did a while ago (trade talent for
heart), for only then will the general attitude of the team improve. IMO,
Paddock made a good move acquiring Manson.
btw: I saw Manson's news conference, and I must say that he has possibly the
coolest voice I have ever heard. Sounds like he's been gargling Lysol!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bryon Thur | The Leafs for the Cup in '94!|
bht...@watarts.uwaterloo.ca | Gilmour for the Hart
University of Waterloo | Potvin for the Vezina!!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Deepak Chhabra
Alain DAGHER <alain@quince> wrote:
>: John Paddock made his second trade in a week today as he picked up hard
>: nosed defenseman Dave Manson from the Edmonton Oilers.
>What is this guy Paddock thinking? He gives up unbelievable future
>talent and draft choices for an overpaid, over-rated goon (worse than
>McSorely). It doesn't make any sense. The Jets don't have a hope of
>making the playoffs, so why acquire Manson? The only way this is a
>good deal is if the Jets trade him to someone else who is in
>contention. Dumb, dumb, dumb.
I had a feeling someone would bring McSorely into this.
Paddock is thinking that he should pay attention to the way the game
_is_ played, as opposed to the way some feel it _should_ be played. Like
it or not, Manson-types are a valuable commodity in the NHL. And as for
the 'unbelievable future talent', does it dawn on anyone that Winnipeg
might not have much of a future if they don't start giving their fans
something worth paying to see?
--
Deepak Chhabra | "If it weren't for physics and law
dchh...@sciborg.uwaterloo.ca | enforcement, I'd be unstoppable."
Lydia Mancini
[stuff deleted]
>Sather took a risk and traded a known quantitiy in exchange for largely
>unknowns.
Sather unloaded another big salary. Who's left making a million plus
there?
>If the deal lives up to it's potential from the Oilers point of
>view (a la Mark Messier and Paul Coffey), Sather will be touted as a genius
>but if it whimpers (a la Martin Gelinas and Chris Joseph) it will just be
>another Oiler "fire sale" tragedy.
The Edmonton Oilers already are a tragedy. Look what's become of a team who
won a Stanely Cup 4 years ago.
--
(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)(==)
Lydia Mancini | "Oh drat these computers are so naughty and so
sha...@cs.mcgill.ca | complex. I could pinch them."
McGill University | -- Marvin The Martian from Loony Tunes
Giovanni Puggioni
In a previous article, dchh...@sciborg.uwaterloo.ca (Deepak Chhabra) says:
>In article <1994Mar17....@sifon.cc.mcgill.ca>,
>Alain DAGHER <alain@quince> wrote:
>
>>: John Paddock made his second trade in a week today as he picked up hard
>>: nosed defenseman Dave Manson from the Edmonton Oilers.
>
>>What is this guy Paddock thinking? He gives up unbelievable future
>>talent and draft choices for an overpaid, over-rated goon (worse than
>>McSorely). It doesn't make any sense. The Jets don't have a hope of
>>making the playoffs, so why acquire Manson? The only way this is a
>>good deal is if the Jets trade him to someone else who is in
>>contention. Dumb, dumb, dumb.
>
>I had a feeling someone would bring McSorely into this.
>
>Paddock is thinking that he should pay attention to the way the game
>_is_ played, as opposed to the way some feel it _should_ be played. Like
>it or not, Manson-types are a valuable commodity in the NHL. And as for
>the 'unbelievable future talent', does it dawn on anyone that Winnipeg
>might not have much of a future if they don't start giving their fans
>something worth paying to see?
Paddock gave up "potential talent" for proven talent. The first
rounder in the trade, seems a bit too much considering what else
he also gave in terms of potential. Edmonton has consistently
traded away for draft picks and "potential" in order to cut down
on their salaries. Remember how Doug Weight was supposed to
be the next Mark Messier.
Don't get me wrong, I believe you need draft picks and you need
to groom "potential", but sometimes you need to recognize maybe
you're working against the odds unless you place something
real on the ice rather than your imagination.
I think Winnipeg will be a super team to watch next year. With
Selanne healthy, Zhamnov, TKatchuk, Emerson, Drake and toughness
up front with King and Domi, they're solid. On defence they have
a good blend of skill and toughness.
Can't say that I'm too keen on Cheveldae (sp?) since I don't think
he's the type of goaltender to be a solid #1 guy....
Just my 2.14 cents (GST included)....
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ @ ~~~~~~ @ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Here's looking at you, kid" - Humphrey Bogart - Casablanca
Garry Holmen
>
> btw: I saw Manson's news conference, and I must say that he has possibly the
> coolest voice I have ever heard. Sounds like he's been gargling Lysol!
Manson got a high stick in the adams apple last year and it's been damaged
ever since. I always thought he sounded like a cross between Tweety and Darth
Vader.
Garry
Derek Krezeski
Actually I thought it was from a punch, during a fight with Sergio Momesso of
the Canucks (I'll have to dig up the old Hockey News from when this happened).
As for the trade, I think alot of people are selling Manson short because he's
having an off year with only 3 goals. He's alot more than just a goon. I
believe he was a first (if not 2nd) round pick. He's had a couple 15 goal
years with 30-40 assists - healthy totals for a defenseman. As a 27 year
old defenseman, he's about ready to break through and have a career year.
He's tough as nails, and is one of those "unique" players who is feared
around the league because you never know when he may "snap".
So Winnipeg got an established, big, physical, offensive defenseman (something
everyone is always looking for) for a mediocre defenseman and some nice draft
picks/prospects who may or may not turn out. They usually say that the team
that got the best single player wins the deal. Only time will tell if any of
the prospects turn out, but at this point it looks pretty good for the Jets.
.../Derek
Scott Jeffrey
>Subject: Re: Paddock is an idiot
>Date: Fri, 18 Mar 1994 15:09:21 GMT
> btw: I saw Manson's news conference, and I must say that he has possibly the
> coolest voice I have ever heard. Sounds like he's been gargling Lysol!
He talks that way because of an on-ice incident a year or so back. Either
he got punched in the throat during a fight, or took a stick in the throat.
In any case, for a while there, he had practically no voice.
Scott Jeffrey
University of Alberta
sjef...@re.ualberta.ca
Go Leafs Go!!!!
27 years is long enough to wait!!
Scott Jeffrey
>From: sha...@cs.mcgill.ca (Lydia Mancini)
>Subject: Re: Paddock is an idiot
>>Sather took a risk and traded a known quantitiy in exchange for largely
>>unknowns.
>Sather unloaded another big salary. Who's left making a million plus
>there?
Only Ranford is getting the big bucks on the Oilers at present. One theory
is that Sather traded Manson in order to be able to afford Ranford when his
salary comes up for renegotiation.
>>If the deal lives up to it's potential from the Oilers point of
>>view (a la Mark Messier and Paul Coffey), Sather will be touted as a genius
>>but if it whimpers (a la Martin Gelinas and Chris Joseph) it will just be
>>another Oiler "fire sale" tragedy.
>The Edmonton Oilers already are a tragedy. Look what's become of a team who
>won a Stanely Cup 4 years ago.
They have hit rock bottom. They have no where to go but up, and could
improve over the next few years. It's going to be awhile before they are
competitive for the Stanley Cup, however. In the short-run, this deal will
hurt Edmonton, as only Luke Richardson is left as far as "tough" defensemen
are concerned. The long-term implications are less certain, however, and
Manson was not going to be an important part of the team if and when the
Oilers are once again competitive. It was a deal that could work out for
both teams. It depends on the Jets' ability to succeed in the near future,
and the Oilers' ability to use their 1st round picks wisely (likely to be #4
and #5 in the upcoming draft).
Andrew W. Korbut
>Alain DAGHER <alain@quince> wrote:
>
>>: John Paddock made his second trade in a week today as he picked up hard
>>: nosed defenseman Dave Manson from the Edmonton Oilers.
>
>>What is this guy Paddock thinking? He gives up unbelievable future
>>talent and draft choices for an overpaid, over-rated goon (worse than
The only things that bother me about the trade from the standpoint of
the 'peg, is the timing, and the #1. I would *not* have given the Oilers
a certified top-5 draft pick, along with a young defenseman, a #1
former pick, and a #3 for Manson.
Also, why now? If this was the price, why didn't the make the move
in November when they still had a chance of accomplishing something
this year? And now, when it won't do any good, they pay this
price? Good PR, very good D-man in Manson, dumb timing, and bad move
in the giveaway of the #1 pick. Hope it does not haunt them.
--
Dr.D [The Devils Advocate]
awko...@cs.buffalo.edu Don't mistake lack of talent for genius.
Steven Eitzen
>The only things that bother me about the trade from the standpoint of
>the 'peg, is the timing, and the #1. I would *not* have given the Oilers
>a certified top-5 draft pick, along with a young defenseman, a #1
>former pick, and a #3 for Manson.
Minor nitpick: It was a #4 choice, not a #3 choice (Yeah, big deal. :)
>Also, why now? If this was the price, why didn't the make the move
>in November when they still had a chance of accomplishing something
>this year? And now, when it won't do any good, they pay this
>price? Good PR, very good D-man in Manson, dumb timing, and bad move
>in the giveaway of the #1 pick. Hope it does not haunt them.
I hope so too. The timing of the trade would also have something to do
with the fact that Mike Smith was unwilling to make a deal like that
back in November. Most of the principals were the same, Sather wanted
Mironov and Lindgren, plus draft picks. He just didn't want to pull the
trigger on the deal.
--
Steve Eitzen Internet: umei...@cc.umanitoba.ca
Vice President - UMCCA Senior Advisor - On Line Consulting
r.s.h contact - Winnipeg Jets
Deepak Chhabra
Andrew W. Korbut <awko...@cs.buffalo.edu> wrote:
>The only things that bother me about the trade from the standpoint of
>the 'peg, is the timing, and the #1. I would *not* have given the Oilers
>a certified top-5 draft pick, along with a young defenseman, a #1
>former pick, and a #3 for Manson.
Admittedly the price was high. But it would appear that Winnipeg has
loads of 'potential talent' that isn't doing a hell of a lot of good.
Bautin was one example; everything I've read about him since he was dealt
to the Wings has been negative. He's been called everything from a
pylon to an extra forward for the other team. As for Mironov, I vaguely
recall someone (Steven?) saying that he might be the steal of the
draft....har har. I guess not.
>Also, why now? If this was the price, why didn't the make the move
>in November when they still had a chance of accomplishing something
>this year? And now, when it won't do any good, they pay this
>price? Good PR, very good D-man in Manson, dumb timing, and bad move
>in the giveaway of the #1 pick. Hope it does not haunt them.
Simple. Paddock was not the GM in November. The Jets will have an
entirely new look next season. Manson is 27, btw, and has a lot of years
left. Do you remember what happened last season when Domi and King
arrived in the 'peg? Didn't they go 10-0? Or was it just unbeaten in 10?
Whatever. The point is that the move had impact. What happened in
between then and now is anybody's guess; the CBC and TSN most certainly
don't allow me to see the Jets enough to tell you. But if Manson does
what he is expected to do for the team, then it was a good trade. Winnipeg
might have traded away a couple of first-round picks, but none of them are
franchise players, and none of them will have an impact for several
seasons. None of them will be in Edmonton long enough to get paid either,
but that's a separate issue....
Sami Kallio
: Timothy John Woelk <umw...@cc.umanitoba.ca> wrote:
: >Did you see him play his first game?
: >
: >that is reason enough to justify his trade...
: On the flip side, Manson might be trying to play himself out
: of town ... he was probably expecting to be eating steak at
: Smith & Wolensky's in midtown Manhattan with Messier, Lowe,
: Tikkanen and Keenan this week ...
========
I would love to see Paddock getting Tikkanen for Manson+some others, but
I also want to see Tikkanen win another SC.
--
*** Sami Kallio ** Student of Oulu Institute of Technology ***
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