Unfortunate examples of Midwestern Battleship Disposal

[Charles Dewgall]

Jesus, they have the prow of the USS Indiana in a parking lot in
Berkely California

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=4th+St,+Berkeley,+Alameda,+California+94710&hl=en&ll=37.868005,-122.299999&spn=0.000001,0.000941&sll=41.233187,-73.067429&sspn=0.009037,0.030105&geocode=FRHYQQIdpte1-A&hnear=4th+St,+Berkeley,+Alameda,+California+94710&t=h&z=21&layer=c&cbll=37.868005,-122.299999&panoid=ISb54NyeMuNuDHfRThrSgA&cbp=12,261.39,,0,7.83

[J.C. Watts Enslin]

On Feb 9, 10:44 am, Charles Dewgall <ThisSpaceForR...@mail.com> wrote:
> Jesus, they have the prow of the USS Indiana in a parking lot in
> Berkely California
>

> http://maps.google.com/maps?q=4th+St,+Berkeley,+Alameda,+California+9...


How many of these rusty old things do you want to save anyway?

[Charles Dewgall]

Well Jon, there's actually already two South Dakota class battleships
preserved as museums, so I don't have a problem with them having
scrapped the USS Indiana. You of course are making an offhand
comment regarding the SS United States, and that is an entirely
different matter as she and the Queen Mary are the last of the classic
Ocean Liners still afloat (The SS France was scrapped a couple of
years ago).

[Charles Dewgall]

OH, and for those of you who are not as shortsighted as Jon:

http://www.ssunitedstatesconservancy.org/

[Con Reeder, unhyphenated American]

First the right-to-work law, then the world!

--
Find the grain of truth in criticism, chew it, and swallow
it. -- anonymous

[David V. Loewe, Jr]

On Thu, 9 Feb 2012 09:05:09 -0800 (PST), Charles Dewgall
<ThisSpac...@mail.com> wrote:

>On Feb 9, 12:01 pm, "J.C. Watts Enslin" <jonens...@charter.net> wrote:
>> On Feb 9, 10:44 am, Charles Dewgall <ThisSpaceForR...@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > Jesus, they have the prow of the USS Indiana in a parking lot in
>> > Berkely California
>>
>> >http://maps.google.com/maps?q=4th+St,+Berkeley,+Alameda,+California+9...
>>
>> How many of these rusty old things do you want to save anyway?
>
>Well Jon, there's actually already two South Dakota class battleships
>preserved as museums, so I don't have a problem with them having
>scrapped the USS Indiana.

She's wasn't a SoDak, but of all the ones that were scrapped that should
have been saved, USS Washington (BB-56) tops the list. She was the only
American BB to sink an enemy BB in a one on one combat situation in the
war (sinking Kirishima during the Naval Battle Of Guadalcanal).

However, of all the ships of all classes that should have been saved as
a museum ship, USS Enterprise (CV-6) is the most obvious.

>You of course are making an offhand
>comment regarding the SS United States, and that is an entirely
>different matter as she and the Queen Mary are the last of the classic
>Ocean Liners still afloat (The SS France was scrapped a couple of
>years ago).

--
"In the long run, it may or may not, be a good idea for the Sultanate of
Kinakuta to have a gigantic earthquake-, vulcano-, tsunami- and thermonuclear-
weapon-proof Ministry of Information with a cavernous sub-sub-basement
crammed with high-powered computers and data switches. But the Sultan
has decided that it would be sort of cool."
- Neal Stephenson - Cryptonomicon

[Tom Enright]

On Feb 9, 11:44 am, Charles Dewgall <ThisSpaceForR...@mail.com> wrote:
> Jesus, they have the prow of the USS Indiana in a parking lot in
> Berkely California
>

> http://maps.google.com/maps?q=4th+St,+Berkeley,+Alameda,+California+9...

Are you that fat turd in front of Spenglers?

-Tom Enright

[Charles Dewgall]

I've never been to the People's Republic of Kalifornia.

[Charles Dewgall]

On Feb 9, 1:11 pm, "David V. Loewe, Jr" <davelo...@charter.net> wrote:
> On Thu, 9 Feb 2012 09:05:09 -0800 (PST), Charles Dewgall
>

The USS Indiana was one of four South Dakota class ships

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Dakota_class_battleship_(1939)

South Dakota, Indiana, Massachusetts, and Alabama

[J.C. Watts Enslin]

Well, if you do, Oakland is pretty much the last place you want to be.

[J. Hugh Sullivan]

On Thu, 09 Feb 2012 12:11:12 -0600, "David V. Loewe, Jr"
<dave...@charter.net> wrote:

>However, of all the ships of all classes that should have been saved as
>a museum ship, USS Enterprise (CV-6) is the most obvious.

Here is what happened to the first 16 in case you don't have the info.


STATUS OF WWII AIRCRAFT CARRIERS

USS Langley (CV 1) 20 Mar 1922 / 27 Feb 1942 Conv. to AV 3; Sunk as a
result enemy action about 75 miles south of Tjilatjap.
USS Lexington (CV 2) 14 Dec 1927 / 8 May 1942 Sunk as a result of
enemy action at the Battle of the Coral Sea.
USS Saratoga (CV 3) 16 Nov 1927 / 26 Jul 1946 Used as a test target
and sunk at Bikini Atoll.
USS Ranger (CV 4) 4 Jun 1934 / 18 Oct 1946 Sold for scrap 31 Jan 1947
to Sun Shipbuilding & Drydock Co.
USS Yorktown (CV 5) 30 Sep 1937 / 7 Jun 1942 Sunk due to enemy action
at the Battle of Midway.
USS Enterprise (CV 6) 12 May 1938 / 17 Feb 1947 Sold, 1 Jul 1958.
USS Wasp (CV 7) 25 Apr 1940 / 15 Sep 1942 Sunk due to enemy action
southeast of San Cristobal Island.
USS Hornet (CV 8) 20 Oct 1941 / 26 Oct 1942 Sunk due to enemy action
at the Battle of the Santa Cruz Islands.
USS Essex (CV 9) 31 Dec 1942 / 20 Jun 1969 Stricken 1 Jun 1973.
Disposed of, sold by Defense Reutilization and Marketing Service
(DRMS) for scrapping 1 Jun 1975.
USS Yorktown (CV 10) 15 Apr 1943 / 27 Jun 1970 Stricken 1 Jun 1973.
Established as a floating museum in Charleston, SC, 13 Oct. 1975.
USS Intrepid (CV 11) 16 Aug 1943 / 15 Mar 1974 Established as a
floating museum in New York City in 1982.
USS Hornet (CV 12) 20 Nov 1943 / 26 May 1970 Stricken from the Navy
List 1989. Donated to The Aircraft Carrier Hornet Foundation for use
as a museum on 26 May 1998.
USS Franklin (CV 13) 31 Jan 1944 / 17 Feb 1947 Reclassified AVT 8 on
15 May 1959. Stricken from the Navy List 10 Oct 1964.
USS Ticonderoga (CV 14) 8 May 1944 / 1 Sep 1973 Stricken from the Navy
List 16 Nov 1973. Disposed of, sold by Defense Reutilization and
Marketing Service for scrapping 1 Sept 1975.
USS Randolph (CV 15) 9 Oct 1944 / 13 Feb 1969 Stricken from the Navy
List 1 Jun 1973. Disposed of, sold by Defense Reutilization and
Marketing Service for scrapping 1 Apr 1975.
USS Lexington (CV 16) 17 Feb 1942 / 8 Nov 1991 Stricken from the Navy
List 30 Nov 1991. Now a museum in Corpus Christi, TX.

They do a great job with the Lex. I have visited 3 times in Corpus and
3 times in FL before it was stricken. The Lexington Association
(former crewmembers) is very active also - quarterly newsletter and
annual meetings around the country.

Hugh

[Michael Press]

In article <4f342172...@news.eternal-september.org>,

Ea...@bellsouth.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:

> USS Ticonderoga (CV 14) 8 May 1944 / 1 Sep 1973 Stricken from the Navy
> List 16 Nov 1973. Disposed of, sold by Defense Reutilization and
> Marketing Service for scrapping 1 Sept 1975.

USS Ticonderoga (CG 47) launched 25 April 1981
is the lead ship of the awesome Aegis
guided missile cruisers. (decommissioned 30 September 2004)

--
Michael Press

[J. Hugh Sullivan]

On Thu, 09 Feb 2012 21:13:49 -0800, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net>
wrote:

I only kept a list of carriers. I only wanted to know what happened to
the ones before the Lex but people have kept me up to date through the
CVN Bush.

I visited one of the first LPHs and have visited a CG - awesome! I
have not been on any nuke.

Hugh

[lein]

The SS United States wasn't a Naval vessel. Hard to say what you do
with that thing, maybe move it to a warmer climate and use it for a
hotel/casino (thought the hotel rooms would probably be small)

We should most definitely save the USS Olympia - the last example of
its kind.

[Charles Dewgall]

On Feb 10, 10:32 am, Ea...@bellsouth.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:
> On Thu, 09 Feb 2012 21:13:49 -0800, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net>
> wrote:
>

> >In article <4f342172.23017...@news.eternal-september.org>,

> > Ea...@bellsouth.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:
>
> >> USS Ticonderoga (CV 14) 8 May 1944 / 1 Sep 1973 Stricken from the Navy
> >> List 16 Nov 1973. Disposed of, sold by Defense Reutilization and
> >> Marketing Service for scrapping 1 Sept 1975.
>
> >USS Ticonderoga (CG 47) launched 25 April 1981
> >is the lead ship of the awesome Aegis
> >guided missile cruisers. (decommissioned 30 September 2004)
>
> >--
> >Michael Press
>
> I only kept a list of carriers. I only wanted to know what happened to
> the ones before the Lex but people have kept me up to date through the
> CVN Bush.
>
> I visited one of the first LPHs and have visited a CG - awesome! I
> have not been on any nuke.
>
> Hugh

which CG?

[J. Hugh Sullivan]

On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 09:20:50 -0800 (PST), Charles Dewgall
<ThisSpac...@mail.com> wrote:

>> I visited one of the first LPHs and have visited a CG - awesome! I
>> have not been on any nuke.
>>
>> Hugh
>
>which CG?

I think it was the Little Rock but I'm not sure. If there was a Los
Angeles LPH that was the one I visited.

Between 1951 and 1977 I went on about 22-3 Reserve Cruises from
Norfolk, Boston, Key West, Pensacola, Mayport, New Orleans and
Jacksonville. If there was a type I had not seen I usually visited
while there.

Hugh

[Charles Dewgall]

On Feb 10, 1:53 pm, Ea...@bellsouth.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:
> On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 09:20:50 -0800 (PST), Charles Dewgall
>

> <ThisSpaceForR...@mail.com> wrote:
> >> I visited one of the first LPHs and have visited a CG - awesome! I
> >> have not been on any nuke.
>
> >> Hugh
>
> >which CG?
>
> I think it was the Little Rock but I'm not sure. If there was a Los
> Angeles LPH that was the one I visited.
>
> Between 1951 and 1977 I went on about 22-3 Reserve Cruises from
> Norfolk, Boston, Key West, Pensacola, Mayport, New Orleans and
> Jacksonville. If there was a type I had not seen I usually visited
> while there.
>
> Hugh

probably was the New Orleans?

USS Iwo Jima (LPH-2)
USS Okinawa (LPH-3)
USS Guadalcanal (LPH-7)
USS Guam (LPH-9)
USS Tripoli (LPH-10)
USS New Orleans (LPH-11)
USS Inchon (LPH-12)

[David V. Loewe, Jr]

On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 07:44:00 -0800 (PST), lein
<boomer_...@my-deja.com> wrote:

>On Feb 9, 9:05 am, Charles Dewgall <ThisSpaceForR...@mail.com> wrote:
>> On Feb 9, 12:01 pm, "J.C. Watts Enslin" <jonens...@charter.net> wrote:
>> > On Feb 9, 10:44 am, Charles Dewgall <ThisSpaceForR...@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > > Jesus, they have the prow of the USS Indiana in a parking lot in
>> > > Berkely California
>>
>> > >http://maps.google.com/maps?q=4th+St,+Berkeley,+Alameda,+California+9...
>>
>> > How many of these rusty old things do you want to save anyway?
>>
>> Well Jon, there's actually already two South Dakota class battleships
>> preserved as museums, so I don't have a problem with them having
>> scrapped the USS Indiana.   You of course are making an offhand
>> comment regarding the SS United States, and that is an entirely
>> different matter as she and the Queen Mary are the last of the classic
>> Ocean Liners still afloat (The SS France was scrapped a couple of
>> years ago).
>
>
>The SS United States wasn't a Naval vessel.

That is debatable on the face of things.

She was more or less designed by the USN with a conversion to troop
carrier in mind. The Navy funded over 60% of her building costs. And
she was built to Navy, not civilian, specs (frex, the only wooden
fixtures or details on board were the butcher block and the piano - and
the piano was made of fire-resistant wood) [1].

>Hard to say what you do
>with that thing, maybe move it to a warmer climate and use it for a
>hotel/casino (thought the hotel rooms would probably be small)
>
>We should most definitely save the USS Olympia - the last example of
>its kind.

[1] Which was demonstrated by pouring gasoline on the thing and lighting
the gas. The wood did not burn.
--
"Does any one know where the love of God goes
When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
Gordon Lightfoot

[J. Hugh Sullivan]

On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 10:56:33 -0800 (PST), Charles Dewgall
<ThisSpac...@mail.com> wrote:

I thought it was LPH-4 but you don't list that.

I recall now that the Los Angeles was the Cruiser that I went from
Dago to AIEA in the summer of '45. I don't remember the name of the
ship I rode to Eniwetok where I became ship's company on the Lex.

With the war coming to a close, only 17 years old and 2 months out of
high school. and moving from one place to another so fast I find it
difficult to remember all the details 65 years later.

Hugh

[Charles Dewgall]

> USS Inchon (LPH-12)- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

USS Boxer (LPH-4)

[michael anderson]

On Feb 9, 10:44 am, Charles Dewgall <ThisSpaceForR...@mail.com> wrote:

> Jesus, they have the prow of the USS Indiana in a parking lot in
> Berkely California
>

> http://maps.google.com/maps?q=4th+St,+Berkeley,+Alameda,+California+9...

I couldnt give a crap about "saving" old ships(or planes for that
matter), but just who in the heck do you think should be funding these
ship preservation projects you envision?

if private donors or whatever want to contribute to do it, thats
fine. But we shouldnt be spending bunches of my money on this nonsense

[J. Hugh Sullivan]

On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 13:42:36 -0800 (PST), michael anderson
<miande...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Feb 9, 10:44=A0am, Charles Dewgall <ThisSpaceForR...@mail.com> wrote:
>> Jesus, they have the prow of the USS Indiana in a parking lot in
>> Berkely California
>>

>> http://maps.google.com/maps?q=3D4th+St,+Berkeley,+Alameda,+California+9..=

>.
>
>I couldnt give a crap about "saving" old ships(or planes for that
>matter), but just who in the heck do you think should be funding these
>ship preservation projects you envision?
>
>if private donors or whatever want to contribute to do it, thats
>fine. But we shouldnt be spending bunches of my money on this nonsense

The USS Lexington CV-16 was funded as a Memorial in Corpus Christie by
private donations. It is maintained by visitors paying a fee for a
tour and spend-the-nights by Cubs and Scouts - maybe other groups.
There were about 500 Scouts there the night I spent aboard several
years ago. Most of the other ships were funded the same way - probably
all.

I suspect any veteran here would be interested in revisiting some of
his old haunts while serving. I have enjoyed seeing where I lived in
1945 and 1946 on several visits to the ship.

Hugh

[Charles Dewgall]

I think you should pay for it - massive taxes on the entire medical
profession, along with a concerted effort to ferret out and tax
illegal gambling winnings. I'd also put a luxury tax on certain
metrosexual staples.

[Thomas R. Kettler]

In article
<b5fdad7b-2efc-4fbf...@d15g2000yqg.googlegroups.com>,

Metrosexuals staple their stomachs? That would explain why most of them
look like anorexic girls.
--
Remove blown from email address to reply.

[Charles Dewgall]

On Feb 11, 6:01 pm, Ea...@bellsouth.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:
> On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 13:42:36 -0800 (PST), michael anderson
>

> <mianderso...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >On Feb 9, 10:44=A0am, Charles Dewgall <ThisSpaceForR...@mail.com> wrote:
> >> Jesus, they have the prow of the USS Indiana in a parking lot in
> >> Berkely California
>

> >>http://maps.google.com/maps?q=3D4th+St,+Berkeley,+Alameda,+California...

> >.
>
> >I couldnt give a crap about "saving" old ships(or planes for that
> >matter), but just who in the heck do you think should be funding these
> >ship preservation projects you envision?
>
> >if private donors or whatever want to contribute to do it, thats
> >fine.  But we shouldnt be spending bunches of my money on this nonsense
>
> The USS Lexington CV-16 was funded as a Memorial in Corpus Christie by
> private donations. It is maintained by visitors paying a fee for a
> tour and spend-the-nights by Cubs and Scouts - maybe other groups.
> There were about 500 Scouts there the night I spent aboard several
> years ago. Most of the other ships were funded the same way - probably
> all.
>
> I suspect any veteran here would be interested in revisiting some of
> his old haunts while serving. I have enjoyed seeing where I lived in
> 1945 and 1946 on several visits to the ship.
>
> Hugh

the two I know directly about, the USS Massachusetts and the USS
Intrepid, are funded as you say. Of course, the granddaddy of them
all, the Constitution is still a an active US Navy ship.