Deplorable

[leonard hofstatder]

It's absolutely disgusting what government has done, does and keeps
doing to OUR country. Will it ever stop ? Doubtful, sigh.

https://twitter.com/AaronSiriSG/status/1617722564721381376


#GETOFFMYLAWN

[Michael Falkner]

You've got one, precisely one, and only one recourse. Or shut the fuck up.

Mike

[JGibson]

Made more people survive into adulthood because of vaccines? Yes, how terrible.

[Michael Falkner]

You know, part of the reason I think they actually are anti-vaxx is because of precisely THAT. You know, Replacement Theory and all that kind of stuff.

Mike

[Corky]

'Experts say that people who have already had COVID are likely to get reinfected by XBB.1.5, and those who have managed not to get COVID yet will likely catch this variant regardless of vaccination status.'

I took the first three and got Covid anyway. And before you chime in with the 'but it kept you from going to the hospital' crap, I know lots of unvaccinated people who didn't go to the hospital either. There's no proof it keeps you from getting deathly ill. Doctors could probably have figured out a course of treatment that would've prevented millions of deaths if big pharma and big government would've allowed it.

[Tim VanWagoner]

On Friday, January 27, 2023 at 4:08:22 PM UTC-6, cork...@gmail.com wrote:
> 'Experts say that people who have already had COVID are likely to get reinfected by XBB.1.5, and those who have managed not to get COVID yet will likely catch this variant regardless of vaccination status.'
>
> I took the first three and got Covid anyway. And before you chime in with the 'but it kept you from going to the hospital' crap, I know lots of unvaccinated people who didn't go to the hospital either. There's no proof it keeps you from getting deathly ill. Doctors could probably have figured out a course of treatment that would've prevented millions of deaths if big pharma and big government would've allowed it.

We have plenty of evidence for the vaccine working. And we were throwing the kitchen sink at this trying to save lives. Stop talking nonsense.

[Corky]

Prove the covid vaccine prevents death or hospitalization. I rank that lie right up there with masks prevent the spread and the vaccine prevents the spread..

'40+ years of mass influenza vaccination, in the U.S., Italy, & the U.K, 1970-2011: NO reduction in elderly influenza mortality, or elderly influenza hospitalizations'

Nobody can even tell you with any certainty how long the *vaccine* (chortle) protects you.

[Tim VanWagoner]

After 30 years in the field, I have long ago learned that no degree of evidence will suffice in convincing someone of the effectiveness of vaccines once they have been convinced they are not. I suspect any of the dozens of manuscripts with the data demonstrating this are unlikely to change your mind. You’ve done your “research”.

[Corky]

> > Nobody can even tell you with any certainty how long the *vaccine* (chortle) protects you.
> After 30 years in the field, I have long ago learned that no degree of evidence will suffice in convincing someone of the effectiveness of vaccines once they have been convinced they are not. I suspect any of the dozens of manuscripts with the data demonstrating this are unlikely to change your mind. You’ve done your “research”.

I've had as many or more vaccines than anyone in this group having served in the military overseas. I believed in vaccines and still do. I believed in this vaccine but no more. Take it anyway you want but mandating this stuff when it's unproven is the quickest way to create resistance. Nobody is willing to allow an open discussion about what they're concerned about because they're afraid people won't go lock step. Why is that? It doesn't stop the virus or even prevent spreading, nor do masks. If people like me believe it's unproven and likely will cause harm then why all the effort to convince us otherwise. Just more business for the coroner. I'm not hurting anyone but my self. That's OK for drug abusers but not for people who don't want to be vaccinated?

[JGibson]

On Friday, January 27, 2023 at 5:08:22 PM UTC-5, cork...@gmail.com wrote:
> 'Experts say that people who have already had COVID are likely to get reinfected by XBB.1.5, and those who have managed not to get COVID yet will likely catch this variant regardless of vaccination status.'
>
> I took the first three and got Covid anyway. And before you chime in with the 'but it kept you from going to the hospital' crap, I know lots of unvaccinated people who didn't go to the hospital either. There's no proof it keeps you from getting deathly ill. Doctors could probably have figured out a course of treatment that would've prevented millions of deaths if big pharma and big government would've allowed it.

There's plenty of evidence that its effective. Check out the blue/red lines here:

https://coronavirus.health.ny.gov/covid-19-breakthrough-data

And, anecdotally, yes, I know many people unvaccinated that survived just fine. I know many people vaccinated who were knocked out for quite a bit. But 100% of the people that I know that died or were basically maimed by COVID were unvaccinated (some who never had the chance based on timing).

[TE]

On Friday, January 27, 2023 at 6:46:47 PM UTC-5, tim.vanwa...@gmail.com wrote:

> After 30 years in the field, I have long ago learned that no degree of evidence will
> suffice in convincing someone of the effectiveness of vaccines once they have been
> convinced they are not. I suspect any of the dozens of manuscripts with the data
> demonstrating this are unlikely to change your mind. You’ve done your “research”.

I'm very much a layman on the science. The science bores me to death, though I
know I should care.

Believing that THIS vaccine doesn't work, in part or at all, hardly equates to
stating that ALL vaccines do not work. Observing the news it *appears* to me
that THIS vaccine didn't do much good. At the very least, the vaccine didn't get
close to doing what we were told it would do.

-TE

[Michael Falkner]

On Friday, January 27, 2023 at 3:02:26 PM UTC-8, cork...@gmail.com wrote:

> Prove the covid vaccine prevents death or hospitalization. I rank that lie right up there with masks prevent the spread and the vaccine prevents the spread..

The very fact we haven't already lost a good 20-30 million, instead of the 7-10 million we have lost (commensurate with the amount of the population which refuses to immunize, making further boosters pointless).

> Nobody can even tell you with any certainty how long the *vaccine* (chortle) protects you.

And as long as pigs won't help with herd immunity, there is no way to do so.

You want the right to infect, and the chances are that you have it!

Mike

[Michael Falkner]

On Friday, January 27, 2023 at 5:13:22 PM UTC-8, TE wrote:

> Believing that THIS vaccine doesn't work, in part or at all, hardly equates to
> stating that ALL vaccines do not work. Observing the news it *appears* to me
> that THIS vaccine didn't do much good. At the very least, the vaccine didn't get
> close to doing what we were told it would do.

I actually disagree with that and believe that most people would as well.

That the only reason the vaccines work is those that are forced that EVERYBODY takes -- the ones you need to get in to school, especially.

Mike

[Tim VanWagoner]

Vaccine resistance comes in two forms; those completely distant to all vaccines and those that are resistant to an individual vaccine or certain vaccines. Nevertheless, the psychology behind the difficulty in vaccine communications is exactly the same in both. Once you move beyond hesitancy to resistance for all or certain vaccines, not only will information that demonstrates the effectiveness and safety not move the needle, paradoxically they actually make the individual more resistant.

This vaccine was extremely effective, especially considering the class of virus we are combatting. Our own immune systems do not form long-term effective responses to coronaviruses, adenoviruses and rhinoviruses. It’s why we have never had a working vaccine against any of them.

I’ve already waded far too much into all of this than I am normally willing to go so I’m stopping here.

[xyzzy]

As the graph JGibson’s post shows, the vaccine has been very effective,
that’s obvious and clear from the data.

The problem is that the virus has evolved. When the vaccines came out they
were extremely effective against infection. That claim was true. But then
the Alpha and Delta variants came along which eluded the effectiveness
against infection. People who claim “they lied about the vaccine preventing
infection” do not understand this. A lot of them could understand this but
simply don’t want to.

But regardless of how the virus has evolved to evade immunity the vaccines
continue to be extremely effective in limiting the seriousness of
infection, per JGibson’s numbers.

--
“I usually skip over your posts because of your disguistng, contrarian,
liberal personality.” — Altie

[leonard hofstatder]

The answer lies somewhere among all the billions and billions and
billions big pharma profited off of it.

[xyzzy]

I get off the liberal train when people start complaining about this.

They earned those profits developing and manufacturing a lifesaving vaccine
in record time. We want companies to be motivated to do things like this.

[Eric Richardson]

On Saturday, January 28, 2023 at 7:43:55 AM UTC-6, xyzzy wrote:
> TE <rando...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Friday, January 27, 2023 at 6:46:47 PM UTC-5, tim.vanwa...@gmail.com wrote:
> >
> >> After 30 years in the field, I have long ago learned that no degree of evidence will
> >> suffice in convincing someone of the effectiveness of vaccines once they have been
> >> convinced they are not. I suspect any of the dozens of manuscripts with the data
> >> demonstrating this are unlikely to change your mind. You’ve done your “research”.
> >
> > I'm very much a layman on the science. The science bores me to death, though I
> > know I should care.
> >
> > Believing that THIS vaccine doesn't work, in part or at all, hardly equates to
> > stating that ALL vaccines do not work. Observing the news it *appears* to me
> > that THIS vaccine didn't do much good. At the very least, the vaccine didn't get
> > close to doing what we were told it would do.
> >
> > -TE
> >
> As the graph JGibson’s post shows, the vaccine has been very effective,
> that’s obvious and clear from the data.
>
> The problem is that the virus has evolved. When the vaccines came out they
> were extremely effective against infection. That claim was true. But then
> the Alpha and Delta variants came along which eluded the effectiveness
> against infection.

And when they realized the new strains were eluding the vaccine's effectiveness, they halted the mandates that were unnecessarily putting young, healthy people at risk, right?

[Michael Falkner]

On Saturday, January 28, 2023 at 1:30:45 PM UTC-8, Eric Richardson wrote:

> And when they realized the new strains were eluding the vaccine's effectiveness, they halted the mandates that were unnecessarily putting young, healthy people at risk, right?

No.

They threw in the towel and COVID is going to win because the Right is never going to get vaccinated, meaning those who are can really only maintain against, but that there enough carriers out there to ensure the virus now does become permanently endemic.

In short, we're done and I do think Scott Adams is right: The anti-vaxxers have won -- they will get the kill off they have begged for with COVID. The only problem is, they can't control who goes.

Mike

[leonard hofstatder]

Oh, is that why they continue to gouge people for insulin ? Guess free
market and all that blah blah blah.

[TE]

Often, I'm not saying it's true here, I don't know enough about the issue, it's not
a choice between "expensive insulin" and "cheap insulin" but "insulin" and "no
insulin."

-TE