Ponting vs Sachin
Don speaks the truth
42.39, 5 hundreds
Sachin from 1 Jan 2008 to 3 Jan 2010: 19 matches 1604 runs avg: 53.46,
6 hundreds
Don
Nirvanam
wrote:
Dude leave that. Our big man claimed Ponting was better than Sachin by
comparing their 2 averages (which really had no practical difference):
Ponting was 55.8x and Sachin was 54.2x a couple of months ago. I
predicted that Sachin will pretty soon take over Ponting even on that
parameter. Our big man has gone into hiding since. As it stands today
(after day 1 of Sydney), Ponting is 55 and Sachin is 54.72. Just a day
before the first day of Sydney Ponting was 55.26... a fall by 0.26 in
one inning.
I'll stick my neck out and say that Sachin will end up with a 55+
average in his career whereas Ponting will be sub 55 (and if he plays
another 30 Tests his average will be sub 52 even) and so will all the
other so called greats of the modern era including Kallis. When age
catches up, it differentiates the wise men from the mere men. With age
Sachin's game is improving whereas Ponting's is deteriorating.
Vicky
and... next stop is Bangladesh for Sachin, right?
Suresh K S
>
> I'll stick my neck out and say that Sachin will end up with a 55+
> average in his career whereas Ponting will be sub 55
Perhaps. But it is worth noting that Ponting played 9 games more than
Sachin. 9 more games in 2 years is significant.
If India continues to play 2-Test series while Australia play 4 and 5
Test series, Ponting, even accounting for the slowdown will have a
fair shot at Sachin's aggregate tally.
Suresh
DingDong
> and... next stop is Bangladesh for Sachin, right?
no.
Nirvanam
And so what is your point?
Dave -Turner
... which says absolutely nothing about either the pitches played on, let
alone the opposition.
They are both world-leading batsmen ... you simply cannot break down
statistics that SIMPLY, and say "yeah he's better because of x vs y".
alvey
Jayawardene from 1 Jan 2008 to 3 Jan 2010: 17 matches 1849 runs avg: 63.75,
6 hundreds
hth
alvey
viper
"Vicky" <vigne...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d13666b6-9da9-4e8d...@u41g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
Ha, ha, ha.....great response and a gentle reminder of Murali's exceptional
efforts against the Banglas, Zimbabwe, Afghanistan and Nepal
Viper
viper
"alvey" <al...@play.com> wrote in message
news:51pw32pvbqrg$.tf96rtpkkena$.dlg@40tude.net...
Pointless introducing common sense to this lot. They'll be reading tea
laeves
next
Viper
dechucka
"Don speaks the truth" <don2...@rediffmail.com> wrote in message
news:46203590-26be-40ee...@u7g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
If this makes you fill warm and fuzzy so be it but cherry picking statistics
that in many cases are not comparable is stupid.
Sanjiv Karmarkar
> On Jan 3, 5:43 pm, Vicky wrote:
> > and... next stop is Bangladesh for Sachin, right?
>
> And so what is your point?
He doesn't have one.
"Incorrect premise invariably leads to erroneous conclusion".
Sanjiv Karmarkar
Sanjiv Karmarkar
> "Vicky" wrote in message
> and... next stop is Bangladesh for Sachin, right?
>
> Ha, ha, ha.....great response ...
>
> Viper
LOL! Idiot leading the idiot....
Sanjiv Karmarkar
Don speaks the truth
> "Don speaks the truth" <don200...@rediffmail.com> wrote in messagenews:46203590-26be-40ee...@u7g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Ponting from 1 Jan 2008 to 3 Jan 2010: 28 matches 2035 runs avg:
> > 42.39, 5 hundreds
>
> > Sachin from 1 Jan 2008 to 3 Jan 2010: 19 matches 1604 runs avg: 53.46,
> > 6 hundreds
>
> If this makes you fill warm and fuzzy so be it but cherry picking statistics
> that in many cases are not comparable is stupid.
More stupid is you people not accepting Ponting's decline with age
which you so attribute other batsmen with!
Don
Don speaks the truth
exposing your stupidity again big brother? i thought the whole point
was about ponting and sachin.
btw, how many tests did jayawardene played in this period outside the
subcontinent? yeah 2 of them and that too in west indies against a
crap team.
rest of the tests are spread between bangladesh, pakistan and india.
Compare
that to sachin who played 7 tests against Aus in that period, 1
against South Africa, 2 against England and 6 of those 19 tests were
played in your little
continent.
Don
alvey
> On Jan 4, 1:15�am, alvey <al...@play.com> wrote:
>> On Sun, 3 Jan 2010 01:11:44 -0800 (PST), Don speaks the truth wrote:
>>
>>> Ponting from 1 Jan 2008 to 3 Jan 2010: 28 matches 2035 runs avg:
>>> 42.39, 5 hundreds
>>
>>> Sachin from 1 Jan 2008 to 3 Jan 2010: 19 matches 1604 runs avg: 53.46,
>>> 6 hundreds
>>
>> Jayawardene from 1 Jan 2008 to 3 Jan 2010: 17 matches 1849 runs avg: 63.75,
>> 6 hundreds
>>
>> hth
>>
>> alvey
>
> exposing your stupidity again big brother? i thought the whole point
> was about ponting and sachin.
You thought rong Donnie. Have another think.
alvey
cricd...@hotmail.com
> one inning.
Since Ponting, typical of the lowlife that he is,
has refused to do the right thing and score another
duck (thereby dropping his average by a further .26),
we Tendulkar groupies have to hope for smaller things
today (P below stands for Ponting's score):
P < 55: Avge < 55
P < 100: Century gap not narrowed
P < 110: .26 given up two days ago not regained
Don speaks the truth
>
> - Show quoted text -
Thats the best you can come with it...homie...come back with a better
one
and i will duly respond.
Don
Sanjay Mokashi
Dear Vicky,
table below illustrates regarding your statment of Bangladesh
Sachin Played 5 tests and scored 3 hundreds
Ponting Played 4 tests and scored 1 hundred the reson i ponting is
hoples against spin . Pontings stocks rose only when quality pace
bowlers declined.
now again with newer good pace bowlers like ashih nehra/kemar roach/
steyn/Ammer you see ponting ducking and finding his true level and on
the top of it this felow is only good on home ground 60 % of his test
hundred are on home soil.
Please dont even try to caompare ponting with sachin you should
compare him with lesser batsmen of his level
Sunny
alvey
DG Bradman.
alvey
Don speaks the truth
So you accept Ponting vs Sachin is a useless debate and that it should
be between the 2 greatest ever to play the game?
Don
alvey
Yep.
> and that it should
> be between the 2 greatest ever to play the game?
Nope.
Why would you want to debate how far #2 is from #1?
alvey
Don speaks the truth
Especially if #2 has not even played one format at all !
Don
Nirvanam
Andrew Dunford
"Vicky" <vigne...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d13666b6-9da9-4e8d...@u41g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
Tendulkar would not be eligible to play for Bangladesh until after a
four-year stand down period.
Andrew
Andrew Dunford
"Don speaks the truth" <don2...@rediffmail.com> wrote in message
news:2436ea2e-ce5a-4936...@j4g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
It's not Tendulkar's fault he never played timeless Test cricket so I don't
think you should hold that against him.
Andrew
Andrew Dunford
"Suresh K S" <sureshka...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:36bf996a-8df9-493c...@b2g2000yqi.googlegroups.com...
Have you seen Ponting bat recently?
I was one who opined a couple of years ago when Ponting was at the peak of
his powers that he would overtake Tendulkar's records, but I have now
changed my mind. Partly because Tendulkar has reversed his earlier decline,
but mostly because Ponting's current decline looks rather steep and may be
irreversible.
This might be one that the idiot Don got right.
Andrew
Don speaks the truth
> "Suresh K S" <sureshkarathin...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:36bf996a-8df9-493c...@b2g2000yqi.googlegroups.com...
LOL...how many times have you changed your mind? I suggest you tone
down
your enthusiasm for always going one up on the other poster through
your smartass statements, that would bring some wisdom into you to say
the right things.
Don
alvey
> Have you seen Ponting bat recently?
>
> I was one who opined a couple of years ago when Ponting was at the peak of
> his powers that he would overtake Tendulkar's records, but I have now
> changed my mind. Partly because Tendulkar has reversed his earlier decline,
> but mostly because Ponting's current decline looks rather steep and may be
> irreversible.
Punter's playing injured atm. He admitted in the post-match yesterday that
his elbow is still not good.
as
Don speaks the truth
He has scored less than even Brad Haddin this season..so called #1
australian batsman.
Don
Andrew Dunford
"alvey" <al...@play.com> wrote in message
news:1hanhatkgf4zw.112sf4zult001$.dlg@40tude.net...
Making allowance for that only reduces his decline from 'steep' to
'distinct'.
Andrew
SultanOfSwing
Well there are some "great" posters who get things absolutely
wrong.
For example, a few months ago, Mike Holmans in response to a
question
from yours truly, opined that Kevin Pietersen was a better batsman
than
Sunil Gavaskar, Greg Chappell, Sachin Tendulkar and a few others.
Pietersen is currently in the midst of perhaps the worst batting
slump of his
entire Test career. Did Chappello in the early 1980's have a worse
slump
than Pietersen? RSCer's familiar with Test cricket could make a
comparison
and enlighten me on that.
Surprisingly, I tried to search for that thread (where Holmans made
his
"hollow" claim) on Google Groups but can't find it anymore.
It would be interesting to revisit what exactly Holmans said.
Andrew Dunford
"SultanOfSwing" <asla...@yahoo.co.in> wrote in message
news:02b05d3c-d762-4f9d...@a6g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
Yes. The slump Chappell experienced in the 1981/82 home season was almost
unimaginably bad for a player of his class. At that time Tests and odos
were mixed together in the sort of schedule that is never contemplated now,
and at one stage Chappell 'scored' four successive ducks, two in each
format. Altogether he made 14 single-figure scores in 25 innings. Of
course as soon as he reached New Zealand in February 1982, Greg Chappell
made two wonderful centuries, the one in the Test match at Christchurch
being a particular highlight.
I don't rate Pietersen nearly as highly as does Mike, but the extent of his
so-called slump has been exaggerated in some quarters.
<snip>
Andrew
Jellore
> > and... next stop is Bangladesh for Sachin, right?
>
You are wrong.
Jellore
> "Vicky" <vignes1...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:d13666b6-9da9-4e8d...@u41g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
> On Jan 3, 10:01 pm, Nirvanam <viz.sha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Jan 3, 2:11 pm, Don speaks the truth <don200...@rediffmail.com>
>
> > > Ponting from 1 Jan 2008 to 3 Jan 2010: 28 matches 2035 runs avg:
> > > 42.39, 5 hundreds
>
> > > Sachin from 1 Jan 2008 to 3 Jan 2010: 19 matches 1604 runs avg: 53.46,
> > > 6 hundreds
>
>
> > Dude leave that. Our big man claimed Ponting was better than Sachin by
> > comparing their 2 averages (which really had no practical difference):
> > Ponting was 55.8x and Sachin was 54.2x a couple of months ago. I
> > predicted that Sachin will pretty soon take over Ponting even on that
> > parameter. Our big man has gone into hiding since. As it stands today
> > (after day 1 of Sydney), Ponting is 55 and Sachin is 54.72. Just a day
> > before the first day of Sydney Ponting was 55.26... a fall by 0.26 in
> > one inning.
>
> > another 30 Tests his average will be sub 52 even) and so will all the
> > other so called greats of the modern era including Kallis. When age
> > catches up, it differentiates the wise men from the mere men. With age
> > Sachin's game is improving whereas Ponting's is deteriorating.
>
>
> efforts against the Banglas, Zimbabwe, Afghanistan and Nepal
>
> Viper
That would be Bengalis you ignorant piece of garbage. I guess they are
all Asians to you. Right?
Correct me if I am wrong but Australia also play Bangladesh at cricket?
Nirvanam
> "SultanOfSwing" <aslazr...@yahoo.co.in> wrote in message
I think the larger point is about why Pieterson is even considered an
ATG kinda player within 4-5 yrs. His achievements aren't really all
that great to include him in an ATG list. If he continues achieving
what he has done so far, he will be in an ATG list. But the English
make too much of this fellow. There are greater batsmen than KP who
are not universally acclaimed ATG's still...Smith, Viru for example.
the English have nothing to cheer about when it comes to individual
brilliant performers...hence even a lil above ordinary is celebrated
like crazy. Not that KP is just a little above ordinary....he is
good...damn good but not yet an ATG.
Nirvanam
oh they even host them!
Mike Holmans
<viz.s...@gmail.com> tapped the keyboard and brought forth:
>I think the larger point is about why Pieterson is even considered an
>ATG kinda player within 4-5 yrs. His achievements aren't really all
>that great to include him in an ATG list.
Absolutely true.
> If he continues achieving
>what he has done so far, he will be in an ATG list.
And also absolutely true.
But, just as a lot of people saw something very, very special about
Sachin Tendulkar when he had only been around for 4-5 years, I have
seen something very, very special in KP. His 158 at Lord's when he
smashed Murali all round the park was one of the most astonishing
innings I've ever seen. The only batsman I've seen who could be as
brutal, as inventive, as fearless, as menacing a physical presence as
that was IVAR. The question is whether that was a short peak period or
indicative of his true quality.
Were he to replicate that for the next 8 years or so, no-one would be
in any doubt of his stature. If he doesn't recover that kind of form
and fizzles out, he will be another failed great. I'm of the opinion
that the former is more likely than the latter; no doubt those who
love to denigrate England players simply because they play for England
(hi, Don!) will think the opposite.
>But the English
>make too much of this fellow. There are greater batsmen than KP who
>are not universally acclaimed ATG's still...Smith, Viru for example.
They have had much longer careers, so there is a lot more evidence.
Neither, though, made it obvious they were likely ATGs from the
beginning as KP has done. I'm coming very close to acclaiming Smith,
but I'd like to see him do something useful against Australia to round
out his CV. Sehwag may also make it when I come to look at his whole
career: there's a possibility that he may have one which looks like a
patchwork quilt with sequences of huge scores and long periods of low
ones and then we can debate for hours whether or not he fulfils your
criteria or mine or someone else's.
Cheers,
Mike
--
Nirvanam
> Sachin Tendulkar when he had only been around for 4-5 years, I have
> seen something very, very special in KP. His 158 at Lord's when he
> smashed Murali all round the park was one of the most astonishing
> innings I've ever seen. The only batsman I've seen who could be as
> brutal, as inventive, as fearless, as menacing a physical presence as
> that was IVAR. The question is whether that was a short peak period or
> indicative of his true quality.
Only time will tell us that. I personally think KP is good. But
whatever I have seen of him when he played against India has not been
exceptional. There have been damn good damn cool few innings. But
against India he hasn't performed as well as he has done against SA or
even Aus. So on the viewing experience of KP I don't have much
delight. But I am rooting for him anyway, after all he plays for me
team BRC ;-)
He seems to have special performances against RSA like how Beefy had
for Aus...lol!
> Were he to replicate that for the next 8 years or so, no-one would be
> in any doubt of his stature. If he doesn't recover that kind of form
> and fizzles out, he will be another failed great. I'm of the opinion
> that the former is more likely than the latter; no doubt those who
> love to denigrate England players simply because they play for England
> (hi, Don!) will think the opposite.
Let's hope he does well. If there is one Englishman in the last 20 yrs
who could get there, it is him. Let's hope he gets there. England need
a world-beater desperately. I think Broad will become a good all-
rounder....much better than Freddie.
> They have had much longer careers, so there is a lot more evidence.
> Neither, though, made it obvious they were likely ATGs from the
> beginning as KP has done. I'm coming very close to acclaiming Smith,
> but I'd like to see him do something useful against Australia to round
> out his CV. Sehwag may also make it when I come to look at his whole
> career: there's a possibility that he may have one which looks like a
> patchwork quilt with sequences of huge scores and long periods of low
> ones and then we can debate for hours whether or not he fulfils your
> criteria or mine or someone else's.
Yep, in 2005 they did not have the status that they have today
although by that time they had some breathtaking innings and were
definitely considered, at least by many I know of, that they are
potential ATGs. Exactly the state which KP is in today. Viru and Smith
are making very strong cases of late to be included in the ATG list
but to get here they have had to do well mostly in their 9 yr careers.
Let's see if KP can do it.
KP hasn't shown the class that Sachin and Lara showed back in
1994...by 1997 both of them made it to the serious ATG waitlist...in
fact you could argue that they already got in there by 96-97. KP has
played for 4 yrs, unless he performs exceptionally well, or has a
period like what Sachin and Lara had between 93-94 and 96 in his next
2-3 yrs I don't think KP will make it to the ATG list without
question. On current evidence, he will probably follow the path to
ATGness like Dravid, Kallis, and Smith / Viru of late. But he's too
good a player to not get there. It will really be a shame if he
doesn't.
Andrew Dunford
"Nirvanam" <viz.s...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7fdfce37-86de-4f0b...@l30g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
You need to be a bit careful with the 'only played for four years' thing.
Pietersen has played 57 matches and scored 16 tons - it took Tendulkar eight
years to achieve either statistic owing to a quieter fixture list.
Andrew
Nirvanam
> "Nirvanam" <viz.sha...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Yep ur right...the frequency of Tests has increased quite a lot. If KP
does justice to his talent I think we would be in for another 30 ton
bugger.