The new simonis slide/skid
Bob Green
so last Saturday about 1/2 the tables have old simonis & half have new
felt for the tournament. Makes it pretty challenging as you go from
table to table. My question is, " It almost seems like the cue ball
skids at least some of the time when you put English on it". I assume
this has to do with the lower resistance of the new simonis? Any body
have a feeling about this? It seems to go away after a few weeks of
play.
Thanks
Bob
Patrick Johnson
> ... " It almost seems like the cue ball
> skids at least some of the time when you put English on it"
Same situation at my pool hall, so I have some recent experience with
the differences between new and old Simonis (860). But what does this
statement mean, Bob? Could you be more specific?
Pat Johnson
Chicago
Fred Agnir
"Bob Green" <robg...@cvm.tamu.edu> wrote in message
I notice this every time I play on new Simonis, which is one reason I'd
rather not. IMO, balls skid too much on brand new Simonis if they aren't in
pristine condition.
Fred
Bob Green
I'm not sure that I can, except that sometimes what you expect doesn't
happen on soft draw shots for example. Whereas on older felt the expected
draw occurs, but on new simonis, the ball seems to lose its spin & just
skids. Maybe what's happening is on older felt, there is a certain
resistance that you can detect with a soft hit which though feel can
control the outcome of the shot. On new felt there is so little
resistance that it is very difficult to put precise spin (draw) on the
cue ball, so sometimes it just spins & not much happens or maybe the shot
doesnt achieve the expected spin due to lack of resistance.
....especially on softer shots. Of course on the hard draw shots the lack
of resistance can give ya those 2 table length draw shots...bottom line
is that it is very difficult to control position with soft spin shots on
new simonis (for me).
Looking forward to your explanation
Bob <- whose game when to pot last Saturday & is despirately searching
for an excuse!
Bob Jewett
> ... It almost seems like the cue ball skids at least some of the time
> when you put English on it".
"Skid" is a synonym for "cling." Is that what you mean here? If so,
I think the condition of the cue ball has a lot more to do with it
than the cloth.
If you mean slide, then yes, the cue ball slides more because the cloth
is slippery when new. This means that you can get some very impressive
draw action at low speed, but the draw takes longer to develop.
--
Bob Jewett
Thomas Schmitz
curious to know the cloth condition at major tournaments. Do they start with
new, slick cloth?
--
Thomas M. Schmitz
Seattle, WA
"Bob Jewett" <jew...@netcom.com> wrote in message
news:98391656...@emperor.labs.agilent.com...
Patrick Johnson
> ... Whereas on older felt the expected
> draw occurs, but on new simonis, the ball seems to lose its spin & just
> skids.
I don't think this computes. Hitting the same draw shot (say straight
on, one tip below center, medium speed), you should get more draw on
the new cloth, although it'll sit and "peel out" a second longer
before starting to draw back. Is this what you mean by "skid"?
> ... On new felt there is so little
> resistance that it is very difficult to put precise spin (draw) on the
> cue ball
This is true until you get used to the new cloth, then it's harder to
be precise on older cloth.
> so sometimes it just spins & not much happens or maybe the shot
> doesnt achieve the expected spin due to lack of resistance.
The cue ball may sit and "peel out" a little longer (as I said above),
but the resulting draw should still be more than with old cloth.
> ...bottom line is that it is very difficult to control position
> with soft spin shots on new simonis (for me).
Only until you get used to it. Then you appreciate the greater
accuracy and more subtle control you have from being able to hit more
softly. With a greater range of speeds available to you, your speed
control can be more finely calibrated.
(Kinda like having an amp that goes to 11...)
Pat Johnson
Chicago
Ron Shepard
>curious to know the cloth condition at major tournaments. Do they start
>with
>new, slick cloth?
Yes, and this is one of the big advantages that the pros have over the amateurs
they play in a tournament. Most of us only get to play on new cloth once or
twice a year. The pros get to play on new cloth at every major tournament.
They know exactly what they can do, how hard to hit, how far the ball will
slide, and so on. The rest of us must extrapolate based on our experience
playing mostly on slow cloth.
Here is one trick you can play on yourself to help with this adjustment. Say
you have a long shot and you are trying to choose between drawing back or
following forward to get position. On slow cloth, you might have to use the
topspin version because you can't get your draw to stay on the ball long
enough. But, you think, on slick cloth, the draw might be better. The trick
is to imagine that the cue ball is at the same angle, but only half the
distance to the object ball, and that you are playing on your regular slow
cloth. At the shorter distance with normal cloth, it might be very clear which
shot is best. So, you just tell yourself, on the slick cloth, you will lose
the same amount of draw on the long shot as you would with the short shot on
slow cloth. The "half the distance" part is just an estimate, it might be only
1/4 the distance, depending on just how fast is that new cloth.
$.02 -Ron Shepard
Bob Jewett
> This sounds similar to going from bar felt to Simonis 860. Bob, I'd be
> curious to know the cloth condition at major tournaments. Do they start with
> new, slick cloth?
Nearly always. It is rare that a major tournament is in a pool hall, so
the tables must be set up specifically for the tournament, and the cloth
is new. Two exceptions that I can think of: The eight-ball tournaments
in Las Vegas on 7-foot tables are played on tables that are moved and
stored in one piece (I don't think they take the tops off when moving
them). The cloth is not changed for every 10-day tournament. At major
3-cushion tournaments, there is a qualification tournament which is
followed by a main tournament when the seeded players show up. With
three days of play on the tables, they are nearly "normal" for the main
tournament. Most of the change to the cloth happens in the first day or
two.
I think a major advantage to players near the top of the pro tour is that
they are playing on new cloth nearly all the time. If an open entrant
comes from Joe's Pool Hall where they last changed the cloth after the
great fire of '91, he will need a few rounds to adjust.
--
Bob Jewett