How is a Southwest Cue constructed?
AquaticRsh
one in half with a bandsaw or anything.. I know the but is 3 pieces. Do they
use their joint pin to connet the handle and forearm.. What exactly do that do
for that "great" hit?
F.L.
PoolTableMech
AquaticRsh
fl
PoolTableMech
9b4me
A friend of mine and I play with Southwest cues. I do cue repairs and
I called Laurie Franklin and ordered a Southwest joint screw to use on
my cue lathe as an adapter for cleaning the shafts. The joint screw
is made of brass and it is only 2 1/2" total length. The joint pin
has nothing to do with connecting the forearm to the handle. They
don't use any metal rings and I have wondered if they use metal inside
the forearm to connect it to the handle. Southwest cue weight is not
adjustable like some cues because they don't have changeable weight
screws. I read that they turn their shafts 12 times (letting the wood
rest between each cut) before they reach their final dimensions and
because of this process you don't hear much about Southwest shafts
warping.
If you really want to know more about Southwest cue construction you
could X-ray a Southwest butt to see if metal is used inside the butt.
Jholly
Fred Agnir
> What exactly do that do
> for that "great" hit?
If you were to be misled by some, you might think it was today's
modern adhesives alone that did the trick.
Fred
WilleeCue
Some cuemakers are reluctant to sell one of their joint pins.
You can get drive pins for cue maintiance configured for any joint pin from
Unique Products. http://www.uniqueinc.com/price/cue_companion.html#maintenance
They cost about $19 each and have both male and female threads to adapt to the
butt or shaft.
I have not actually made any measurements but I have been told there are three
different tapers used to shape the butt not just one straight taper like most
cues have. Since you play with South West cues could you measure and confirm
that?
William Lee
"9b4me" <jsho...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
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WilleeCue
It keeps the newbees mistified and thinking he is a genius. <G>
William Lee
"Fred Agnir" <oha...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
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dgrossesq
will be more than happy to give you a tour, discuss how their cues are made
and answer any questions you have. You can then learn about SouthWest cues
1st hand and see why they don't require, or have the capacity to, add
additional weight. I strongly suggest the tour if you are truley
interested.
Dave
"AquaticRsh" <aquat...@aol.com> wrote in message
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SSCS
I must add something here... IMHO I think the responses you get is because
of the baiting you do. Had I or 20 other people in this group posted
"Ancient Chinese Secret!" I would bet that AquaticRsh would have responded
with LOL instead of what he did. Baiting begets baiting. Not that this is
possible but try not pissing on peoples opinions for a couple of weeks and
present your opinion without calling someone a derogatory name and I think
you will be surprised with the way people respond to you.
SSCS
"PoolTableMech" <poolta...@aol.com> wrote in message
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AquaticRsh
Jim Buss
I've been in their shop many times. They really don't do anything
different than many top cuemakers except they work really slow, take
their time and make sure everything fits exactly right. One
difference from most other cues is that they use a taper on the shaft
that isn't a true pro taper. It starts increasing in diameter at the
bottom of the ferrule. Not much at first, but it still increases.
Most pro taper cues stay the same diameter for a while before starting
to increase in size.
--JIM BUSS--
http://www.jimbuss.com
tony mathews
9b4me wrote:
> The joint pin has nothing to do with connecting the forearm to the handle.
That is true.
> They
> don't use any metal rings and I have wondered if they use metal inside
> the forearm to connect it to the handle.
Yes they do. From what I saw (when I visited Laurie) they use a 3/8 x 16 threaded rod to connect both the
A joint (forearm to handle) and the solid wood butt portion to the handle (it's not sleeved like most
cues). To get the weight and balance that they need, they vary both the length of the connecting screws
and the metals used. So they might use steel, or aluminum screws depending on the woods and balance
desired.
To connect the forearm to the handle, the handle has a very long tenon. It seemed to be about 2" long
IIRC. The tenon fits very tightly and accurately into a hole in the foreram. To allow glue and air to
escape when joining the handle to forearm, they cut longitudinal shallow grooves on the surface of the
tenon. The rear joint has a similar constuction method.
Imo, the "hit" of the Southwest cue is not really a function of it's construction "method", but more a
function of the execution of that method, and the quality of the materials used.
Everything fits very accurately and tightly, and the wood they use is superb.
Very well made cues, well worth the money imo.
Tony
Fred Agnir
> Fred knows but aint telling.
> It keeps the newbees mistified and thinking he is a genius. <G>
>
> William Lee
>
>
Exactly opposite. I didn't say any of my observations due to the fact
that I know when to keep my mouth shut on such things. That's
something you will probably never understand in your life, and has
been the number complaint against you. You spew "information"
carelessly. Hopefully, newbees understand just how clueless you are.
Unfortunately, some of them won't.
Anyone can read out of the precious Blue Book, call Laurie, e-mail
her, visit her shop, hit with as many South Wests they can get their
hands on, measure them, weigh them, order them. I've done all that,
just like several people on this board have, and still would hesitate
on answering questions on their construction, their business practice,
business history, etc., unless of course someone like you gave
incorrect information that needed clarification.
The guy asked one question that was answered. Did I need to answer it
again?
Fred
WilleeCue
Only a genius would know that! <G>
William Lee
"Fred Agnir" <oha...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
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> > Fred knows but aint telling.
JoeyA
specifically requested by the buyer.
JoeyA
"Jim Buss" <jim...@jimbuss.com> wrote in message
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Bob Johnson
shaft tapers increase immediately, they just vary in how much. I believe
this was something he said Herman Rambow passed on to him, but I could be
wrong on that.
--
Bob Johnson, Denver, Co.
bo...@cris.com
"JoeyA" <jo...@officeNOHAMspecialties.net> wrote in message
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Fred Agnir
> I believe Mike Bender also does not follow the "pro taper" design unless
> specifically requested by the buyer.
> JoeyA
>
I think a lot of cuemakers do not make the shaft diameter constant for
the first several inches. I think according to Ray Schuler, the
original "pro taper" concept had minor growth, not constant diameter.
IIRC, Bob Meucci reported that everyone copied him with the Meucci Pro
Taper being the same diameter in the first several inches, even though
he also had very minor growth in the diameter. All of my Meuccis grow
maybe .25 mm from ferrule to ~ 12 inches.
Fred
Bob Johnson
the taper of his shafts:
A Compound-Taper Butt - "Most cues feature a straight-taper butt. In other
words, the diameter of the butt increases uniformly from the joint to the
butt plate, like the frustum of a cone (which is a cone with its point cut
off). This type of taper can result in a cue that is too thin through the
forewrap to offer adequate structural integrity.
"Instead of a straight taper, the Schuler cue features a compound taper,
that is, a series of different tapers, between the joint and the butt plate.
This design results in a stronger, better-performing cue that is still
comfortably thin through the gripping area. A compound taper requires extra
steps during construction, but as with the extra steps required for the
Schuler joint, the benefits are worth the extra work."
The Schuler Shaft - "The taper, or profile, of the shaft is probably the
single most important determinant of a cue's performance. The term pro or
professional taper has come to define a shaft that, instead of being
tapered, is cylindrical from the ferrule back for 10 to 14 inches, sometimes
more. This type of shaft taper is more or less standard on modern pool cues.
As an engineer, I consider it a serious design flaw.
"Herman Rambow is credited with inventing the pro taper. But I visited
Herman's shop many times and knew him well, and I know that he never made a
shaft that wasn't tapered along its entire length. The taper was so minor in
many cases, however, that you couldn't feel it. Consequently, when cuemakers
came along who wanted to imitate Herman's cues, they mistakenly thought his
shafts were cylindrical for some distance back from the tip. Hence the
'modern' pro taper.
"At The Schuler Cue, we offer a variety of standard shaft tapers, but every
Schuler shaft grows in diameter from the ferrule on back. The growth may be
difficult to see or feel on some of our more flexible tapers - such as the
Super ProTM or Super XTM - but it's there, and it's important. You lose a
tremendous amount of consistency and strength when any part of the shaft is
cylindrical instead of tapered.
--
Bob Johnson, Denver, Co.
bo...@cris.com
"Fred Agnir" <oha...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
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Patrick Johnson
> tremendous amount of consistency and strength when any part of the shaft is
> cylindrical instead of tapered.
I tried to comment on this kind of statement before without much luck,
but here goes again...
Ray could be misconstrued to be saying that if you start with a
cylindrical shape and then turn it down to a conical shape it can be
stronger/stiffer. This isn't true, and statements like this could be
more clear about that.
I'd say, "a taper is stronger/stiffer than a cylinder OF THE SAME LENGTH
WITH THE SAME AMOUNT OF WOOD."
Pat Johnson
Chicago
Donald Tees
You are sure, are you? The equations for bending force on a
cantilevered cross-sectional area are more complex than I want to
tackle, but at a rough glance, they sure do not seem that simple to me.
Perhaps you could explain them to the rest of us dummies.
Donald
Patrick Johnson
> tackle, but at a rough glance, they sure do not seem that simple to me.
> Perhaps you could explain them to the rest of us dummies.
Perhaps you could give an example that illustrates some actual point
you're trying to make so we can talk about something other than our
technical vocabularies.
(Assuming that's your purpose...)
Pat Johnson
Chicago
Donald Tees
converse? Woof like hell then run like hell as soon as someone calls
you? I notice you removed the blanket, know-it-all statement that
prompted my remark before you posted your smart-assed answer. You are an
intellectual coward, as well as a blusterer.
Donald
Unknown
If you go to LV and order a cue in person Laurie has a example cue
that Jerry made for their childrens show and tell that will show you
the super secret innerworkings of a SW cue.
She is a really nice person and I highly recommend the trip.
Cory Barnhart
Patrick Johnson
Is that how Gen Z spellz it?
> Do you play pool like you
> converse? Woof like hell then run like hell as soon as someone calls
> you?
You "called" me? LOL. I made a plain English statement with which you seem to
disagree, but haven't yet said how or why except to name-drop some equations
(without saying how they disagree either). I (mostly) overlooked your insulting
tone to ask what exactly you're talking about, but that doesn't seem to be
what's really on your mind.
Once again, do you have something specific in mind that you think is wrong with
what I said, or is this all just a slapfight wrapped in a technobabble tapdance?
Pat Johnson
Chicago
AquaticRsh
into a heated argument or etc.. I ask is a cue worth it.. 91 replies.. about 8
answered the question ,,, i ask how they are constructed... 3 people answer..
the rest is all some sort of argument or something... my how they are testy and
opionated in this groups.
lol
fl.
WilleeCue
That is the way things are around here.
Ya just gotta separate the wheat from the chaff.
William Lee
"AquaticRsh" <aquat...@aol.com> wrote in message
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rhncue
is worth whatever someone is willing to pay for it. Actually a Southwest cue
is probably worth about double what Laurie sells them for. If you order one
and wait for it to be built the price is around half of what they sell for
on the street with no wait. All supply and demand.
Dick
--
repairing and building fine custom cues for
real pool players at affordable prices.
over 30 years experience.
Richard H. Neighbors
web sight http://www.dickiecues.com
ph.# (513) 242-1700
cinti. oh.
"AquaticRsh" <aquat...@aol.com> wrote in message
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