The Hustler (Newman&Gleason)
WhoWantstaKnow
I just watched this movie and a few questions came up.
1. They're in Ames. Where is Ames? I attend Iowa State University in Ames,
Iowa, and I KNOW that the Ames in the movie is not the Ames I am in.
2. Is the Willie that is holding the money the famous Willie Mosconi?
3. Is the Pool Hall in Ames the same room used in "The Color of Money"
(A much better movie IMHO).
That's it, thanks for the help!
--
Bill Maly
bill...@iastate.edu
Robert L. Paris
: I just watched this movie and a few questions came up.
Ames was a great room; closed more that 20 yrs now. Was exactly
as in the movie, I remember feeling like being at a national shrine in
the place! Yes, Willie Mosconi held the stakes in the movie. For all
the players who never got to see him play, it was mesmerizing; he was
a machine, only missing thru lack of concentration. I still buy copies
of his original book from the 50's to give to new players, there is NO
better teacher.
--
______________________________________________________________
bo...@gate.net | CIS 76360,3477 | GEnie R.PARIS2
jrpr...@ulkyvx.louisville.edu
I was actually fortunate enough to *Play* Mosconi about five
years ago (July 18th, 1990). I went to an exhibition/billiard supplies
demo where about 20 professionals were supposed to show (not all did- about
half). Spectators could donate (to a worthy cause)
$25 to play against one of the pros drawn randomly. I got Mosconi.
INCREDIBLE player. Only got one game of eight ball, but
it was the best $25 I've ever spent, and one of the High points in my
life.
Others in attendance were: Steve Mizerak, Jean Balukas, Nick Varner,
Lou Butera, Robin Bell, Jimmy Carras, David Howard, Peg Ledman,
and Earl Strickland. Pros listed in the program who were noticably absent
were Minnesota Fats (Wanderone?) and Eva Mataya (sp?). I would have liked
to meet her.
BTW- The game went 2 innings each. Mosconi let me win.
--james
Bob Jewett
> in Ames, Iowa, and I KNOW that the Ames in the movie is not the Ames I
> am in.
No, it was Ames' pool hall. (New York or Chicago?)
> 2. Is the Willie that is holding the money the famous Willie Mosconi?
Yes.
> 3. Is the Pool Hall in Ames the same room used in "The Color of Money"
No. Ames had closed by the time CoM was filmed, I believe. There was a
pool hall in San Francisco (Cochran's, owned by Welker Cochran at one
time) that was very similar in appearance to the Ames' in the Hustler.
In the 60's there was a lot of serious action there, especially in one
pocket and pink ball (six ball on the 6x12 snooker table, money on each
ball, double on the pink). It was closed for a while and now is reopened
under a new name after refurbishing.
> (A much better movie IMHO).
CoM is a lot flashier, and The Hustler is majorly depressing, but I think
most movie buffs would give the latter higher marks. The Hustler has more
interesting pool, if the TV editors don't get their way, which they usually
do -- something about fitting a 90 minute movie and 60 minutes of commercials
into a 120 minute time slot.
Bob Jewett
Ron Shepard
writes:
[...]
>CoM is a lot flashier, and The Hustler is majorly depressing, but I think
>most movie buffs would give the latter higher marks.
It has been a while since I've read it (The Hustler), but the book is not
so depressing, with a bit more emphasis on the pool. The girl doesn't
commit suicide, for example (hope that's not a spoiler!).
>The Hustler has more
>interesting pool, if the TV editors don't get their way, which they usually
>do -- something about fitting a 90 minute movie and 60 minutes of commercials
>into a 120 minute time slot.
Is there a "Color of Money" book, or screenplay? I've never seen it in a
bookstore. Maybe it is better than the movie too.
$.02 -Ron Shepard
Bob Jewett
> used to be Cochran's]?
It's Hollywood (or Rack'em?) on Golden Gate half a block west of Market.
Bob Jewett
Paul Hahn
>Is there a "Color of Money" book, or screenplay? I've never seen it in a
>bookstore. Maybe it is better than the movie too.
_The Color of Money_, like _The Hustler_, was a novel by Walter Tevis
before it became a movie. Be warned, though, that while Robert Rossen
was fairly faithful to the book when he made the _Hustler_ movie, the
_Color of Money_ book and movie have almost zip to do with each other
aside from the game of pool and the name of the protagonist. I like
them both (the book a bit better), but it's almost unfair to compare
because they are _so_ different.
--pH <many...@library.wustl.edu>
O
/\ "Churchill? Can he run a hundred balls?"
-\-\-- o
Bob Jewett
There is a book. The plot line is quite different from the movie.
I think the movie was better.
Bob Jewett
Paul Hahn
>In article <369q0r$m...@wupost.wustl.edu> many...@library.wustl.edu (Paul Hahn) writes:
>>_The Color of Money_, like _The Hustler_, was a novel by Walter Tevis
>>before it became a movie.
>Do you know the IBSN or the publisher? I've checked the "Books in Print"
>references before under Tevis and I've never found "The Color of Money"
>listed.
My copy is a paperback from Warner Books. The ISBN is 0-446-34419-2.
Ron Shepard
>>Is there a "Color of Money" book, or screenplay? I've never seen it in a
>>bookstore. Maybe it is better than the movie too.
>
>_The Color of Money_, like _The Hustler_, was a novel by Walter Tevis
>before it became a movie.
Do you know the IBSN or the publisher? I've checked the "Books in Print"
references before under Tevis and I've never found "The Color of Money"
listed.
-Ron Shepard
Ralph Leslie Davis
Ron Shepard <she...@sampson.ccsf.caltech.edu> wrote:
>In article <6589...@opus.hpl.hp.com> jew...@opus.hpl.hp.com (Bob Jewett)
>writes:
>
>bookstore. Maybe it is better than the movie too.
>
>$.02 -Ron Shepard
Yes, Ron, there is a "Color of Money" book out there. It is NOTHING like
the movie. About the only thing similar is that Fast Eddie returns to
playing pool. The major difference between the book and the movie is the
fact that there is no "Tom Cruise/Vincent" character in the book. When
people ask me which is better (the book or the movie), I say it is impos-
sible to compare them because they are so radically different.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Whether it is good or bad, it is sometimes very pleasant, too, to smash
things."--Dostoevsky
kro...@leland.stanford.edu
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Ralph Leslie Davis
>No. Ames had closed by the time CoM was filmed, I believe. There was a
>pool hall in San Francisco (Cochran's, owned by Welker Cochran at one
>time) that was very similar in appearance to the Ames' in the Hustler.
>In the 60's there was a lot of serious action there, especially in one
>pocket and pink ball (six ball on the 6x12 snooker table, money on each
>ball, double on the pink). It was closed for a while and now is reopened
>under a new name after refurbishing.
>
>
So what is the new name of this freshly refurbished place? And
while I'm on the topic, who out there knows of some hidden 3-cushion
billiard places (in San Fransisco) that are cheap and good?
Bart Federici
>$.02 -Ron Shepard
There is and it follows the movie, not at all. I'll dig it up and let ya
borrow it Ron. (There is no Tom Cruise character for example:-))
Bat
Greg Sommerville
As a pool fan, I want to actually see the shots. CoM was interesting
in having the camera track right behind the cue ball as it rolled, but
c'mon - you can't see what the hell is going on. At least in The Hustler
you got to see some great shots.
And why wasn't there a climactic showdown between Eddie and Vincent at
the end of CoM? The movie almost led up to that, then just ended. Poor.
Mark Stieffenhofer
: For what it's worth, I'll take The Hustler any day over Color Of Money.
: As a pool fan, I want to actually see the shots. CoM was interesting
: in having the camera track right behind the cue ball as it rolled, but
: c'mon - you can't see what the hell is going on. At least in The Hustler
: you got to see some great shots.
My favorite gem of CoM is when Vincent is shooting to the tune
"Werewolves in London" (or whatever it is). Right before the shot he
shoots one-handed, you see the cue rolling along. Suddenly when the
camera goes back to the table, the cue is in the *perfect* position for
the one-hander.
Now if ya could only be able to do that in a money game... ;)
mkm...@skcla.monsanto.com
I love in the CoM, when vincent is playing eddie at the huge open/pro
turny, and he has the worst shape I've ever seen for any level. When he
tells eddie later that he missed the five ball bank to wow the crowd. I
got a good laugh at that one, he played NO SHAPE. If I was a gambler, I
would KNOW that he was dumping. There are many places where the balls
move on there own between shots. Still, I loved all the Chi-town shots.
MILLER
"Money won is twice as sweet as money earned"-color of money
"Fly by night away from here, change my life again..."-Rush
Ron Shepard
>>Is there a "Color of Money" book, or screenplay? I've never seen it in a
>>bookstore. Maybe it is better than the movie too.
>
>borrow it Ron. (There is no Tom Cruise character for example:-))
Cool! BTW Bart, thanks for not mentioning on the net that embarassing
thrashing you gave me in last week's 9-ball tournament. Such restraint! ;-)
-Ron Shepard
Robert J. Pawlik
I read all the replys regarding The Hustler and The Color of Money,
and I liked The Hustler better.
With the technology in the film industry today I thought they could
have used flashbacks to combine excerpts from The Hustler with
The COM. I think they also should have brought back George C. Scott,
even if just a cameo role. The COM shouldn't have been a sequel, but
it's own book/movie.
Comments?
Bob
mkm...@skcla.monsanto.com
Well, he did'nt mention it on the net, but I was pretty amazed that someone
can be up 7-0 going to 8 and lose. I have lost with leads before, but WOW :}
I don't mean to pick on you Ron, even though that match must have lasted FOR
EVER, but I was hoping to start a thread on peoples most horrid loses. I don't
mean the lose that knocked you out of the money. I mean the
on-the-hill-lose-7-in-a-row to lose kind of stories. I guess I should start,
but I don't have any thing that would really fall into this area. I don't know
if that is good or bad though.
MILLER
"Money won is twice as sweet as money earned"-Color of money
Ron Shepard
mkm...@skcla.monsanto.com writes:
[...]
>I mean the
>on-the-hill-lose-7-in-a-row to lose kind of stories. I guess I should start,
>but I don't have any thing that would really fall into this area.
You're too modest, Mike. ;-) All I can say is that anything can happen
in this game, and usually does. After all, the chances of me winning 7
in a row are the same as Bart's (who played well and earned the games, by
the way), or your's, or anyone else's? It is just that it feels so much
better to win them in the end than in the beginning.
$.02 -Ron Shepard
Michael Cassin
Do you think that Piper Laurie's character had a fling with George C. Scott's (sheesh: I can't remember their names) just before she committed suicide? She comes into the bathroom from George's room with a nightgown on and writes in lipstick on the mirror and then next thing you know she's dead.
What happens in the book? I understand she doesn't commit suicide.
Mike.
Paul Hahn
> Do you think that Piper Laurie's character had a fling with George C.
> Scott's (sheesh: I can't remember their names) just before she
> committed suicide? She comes into the bathroom from George's room
> with a nightgown on and writes in lipstick on the mirror and then next
> thing you know she's dead.
Of course they did. Well, it depends on what you call a fling. They
certainly had sex.
(BTW, their names: George C. Scott's character is Bert Gordon. Piper
Laurie's is Sarah, umm, Packard I think--I don't think she ever had a
last name in the books.)
> What happens in the book? I understand she doesn't commit suicide.
She doesn't even go with them to Lexington in the book. Eddie learns
his lessons and gains "character" through the game, not through some
melodramatic suicide thing. :-) After he comes back, he goes to see her
again and tells her he almost bought a ring. "Why didn't you?"
"Suppose I had?" "I don't know. Maybe you did the right thing." In
_The Color of Money_ we find out that they did indeed break up; he
eventually married someone else.
--pH <many...@library.wustl.edu>
O
/\ "A three-cushion player doesn't need to be married.
-\-\-- o He already has enough aggravation."