tip consistency part II
tom simpson
<i...@tuckerbilt.com> wrote:
::Play test- I installed a 65 Hercules and a 65 Elk Master on two identical
::shafts and played for about an hour with each one. I feel that the Hercules
::offered a solid and controlled hit while the Elk Master was softer and
::harder to control. I'm not sure why two tips that measure the same hardness
::play so different. Maybe there are other factors involved besides hardness
::that affect the playability of a tip. Any feedback on this would be greatly
::appreciated.
Could it be that the hardness changes deeper into the tip
than your instrument measures? Or that overall, the hardness
measures out the same, but the surface or base hardness is
different?
tom simpson
sheldoncue
being consistent through the whole tip. I also know that the hardness WILL
change with use.
I have never used a "break cue" so my tips will get harder pretty quickly. I
am curious as to whether the layered tips will stay more consistent with
use. I think for overall consistency, the layered tips are definitely a
little better. I know a guy that like a soft elk master and when it hardens
up on him he takes a really small drill bit to it to soften it back up!
Murray Tucker
Hercules medium 9 tips tested
4@60
2@65
3@67.5
Elk Master 10 tips tested
1@55
2@60
2@65
4@67.5
1@70
All measurements were made with a type A duromerter
Play test- I installed a 65 Hercules and a 65 Elk Master on two identical
shafts and played for about an hour with each one. I feel that the Hercules
offered a solid and controlled hit while the Elk Master was softer and
harder to control. I'm not sure why two tips that measure the same hardness
play so different. Maybe there are other factors involved besides hardness
that affect the playability of a tip. Any feedback on this would be greatly
appreciated.
--
Murray Tucker III
i...@tuckerbilt.com
http://www.tuckerbilt.com/iii
talism...@my-deja.com
> | Could it be that the hardness changes deeper into the tip
> | than your instrument measures? Or that overall, the hardness
> | measures out the same, but the surface or base hardness is
> | different?
> |
> | tom simpson
Tom has a very good point. With a laminated tip you can only be testing
the hardness of either the top or bottom layer. I am not sure if it
give an acurate indication of overall hardness of the tip. Maybe some
one with a more scientific background could comment.
On the subject of consistency I think that well constructed layered
tips offer more consistency. After the first few hours of play a
laminated tip gets a little harder as the action of striking the CB
compresses the layers even tighter than in production. Some people have
told me they do this with a hammer to speed up the process. After this
intial settling period the tips should play consistently until you need
to change.
We maintain consistency by strict production process. The leather
layers are exactly the same thickness, after the layers have been
assembled they are fixed into tools and uniform pressure is applied
until the tips are compressed to the correct height. Changing the
number of layers and the applied pressure give us the different
hardness grades.
Is there a better way available to test laminated tip hardness than a
durometer? I have heard of ultrasound hardness testing on some
materials, does anybody know about this?
Tony - Talisman Billiard Accessories.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Paul J. Mon
>
> Is there a better way available to test laminated tip hardness than a
> durometer? I have heard of ultrasound hardness testing on some
> materials, does anybody know about this?
>
> Tony - Talisman Billiard Accessories.
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
There are better ways to test hardness or more accurately whats called
compressive load modulus or compressive load deflection. It requires a
fairly expensive Instron measuring device, in excess of $50K. Hardly
what is needed to measure pool tips. I've used an Instron to measure
the surface of rubber/urethane rollers. Many times durameter readings
are influenced by the substrate (or in the case of your tips many
substrates). I have not heard of any ultrasonic measuring devices, but
something of that nature may very well exist. Regards.....Paul