bca board makes undoubtedly the biggest mistake in pool history
randy reinfeldt- wis bca president
system i for one am adamantly opposed to this...i have spent 4 years
building the state of wisconsin league systems up to a strong
membership base(along with my operators)..and i am not willing to sell
off my leagues to the apa or anyone else for that matter...(how can
they sell someting they don't own??????)
>for those of you that don't know the apa has been given a seat on the
board of directors for the bca yet the players of the bca don't have a
voice(sounds like a bit of conflict of interest)...as to how they got
their seat on the board i would liken it to the word extortion....it's
pretty sad that over 60,000 player members some of which are also
business members of the bca don't have a voice yet the apa has a seat
due to some unforeseen reasons...i am prepared to fight this sale to
the end and infact have contacted every state assoc. president for the
bca nad will form new assoc. if they refuse to listen to those of us
that have busted our tails to get the bca leagues to where they are
today...i have done extensive research on this situation and you would
simply be shocked at some of the boards decisions...
>to make matters worse when i contacted the vice president of the
board(fred cohen) he had the nerve to tell me the bca leagues lose
money every year i happen to know they make money every year...why
does a man of his power have to outright lie to a state
president(doesn't hardly seem right does it)...
>the reason we play in the bca is because we are tired of getting
robbed by some of the other league systems out there.
>NOW IS THE TIME FOR THE BCA MEMBERS TO UNITE IN THE FIGHT TO STOP THE
SALE OF OUR LEAGUES AND LET THE BOARD KNOW WE CAN AND WILL CONTROL OUR
OWN DESTINY!!!
FOR MORE INFO FEEL FREE TO CALL ME AT 608-963-8811....OR DROP ME A
LINE AT bca...@charter.net.
john mcchesney
The BCA did not "give" a seat on the board to the APA. The APA in fact paid
their fees as everyone does ... whose wish it is to be a "voting" member of
the BCA via their BCA mandated booth fee at the BCA Expo. The fee just
happens to include the amount necessary for one to become a full voting
member .. and from there ... one can get to a point where they can be
nominated to be on the board .. as the APA ( Renee Poehlman, President ) has
done.
( July 2001, Poehlman was elected to serve in the Billiard Congress of
America's (Industry Trade Organization) Board of Directors. )
( elected by votes from the voting ( full votes ) and associate mebers (
half votes ) from the roles of the BCA membership, i.e. voting members )
It is my understanding that the BCA wants to sell the league operations and
alleviate themselves of this type ( infrastructure ) burden to become what
they should have been all along: a billiard industry trade organization.
Now .. what is it that they are selling? as far as I can determine it would
only be the $10 per year fee that BCA league operators pay per person to the
BCA for BCA recognition. Additionally, it seems that the stall that has
happened in the sale is due to some "faulty" numbers ( of members ) that the
BCA stated that it has ( had ) .. not surprising in my opinion .. as they
( the BCA ) have always had a problem with the truth !!!
I assume the APA .. ( if they buy the league ( memberships ) ) are doing so
to garner the additional membership numbers and income and will operate the
league operations as the BCA does now .. without change ... as it is an
alternative to the current APA style of play .. ( they would then have the
best of both systems ) .. or, they may wish to franchise the BCA leagues in
the future as they do now with the APA leagues ... ???
Now .. sure you BCA league operators have worked hard to make your leagues
work, grow, etc., but you paid nothing to the BCA for them except what the
player's fees were/$10 each .. which most likely was marked up ( to the
players ) so you as the operator could garner some income from the players
in your league.
I hear your call to "unite" .. but it appears you are very confused as to
how and what makes the BCA operate .. it is simply the votes from the
"voting members" that dictates policy .. and not the players, league
operators, business members, etc. UNLESS THEY ARE VOTING MEMBERS !!!
Good luck .. and remember, there are other leagues out there if you don't
want to continue as a BCA integer ..
John McChesney
Texas Express
( formerly a 12+ year voting member of the BCA )
"randy reinfeldt- wis bca president" <bca...@charter.net> wrote in message
news:5e541c56.04013...@posting.google.com...
ratchet
john mcchesney wrote:
> Good luck .. and remember, there are other leagues out there if you don't
> want to continue as a BCA integer ..
> John McChesney
> Texas Express
> ( formerly a 12+ year voting member of the BCA )
>
Can you say "asshole" !!!!!!!!!!!!!11
john mcchesney
here are the current execs. and voting members of the BCA:
BCA Board Members and Officers
(Colorado Springs, CO) The business members of the Billiard Congress of
America (BCA) recently elected new board members at the General Membership
Meeting that took place on July 9, 2003, preceding the 2003 BCA
International Trade Expo (July 10-12 at the Sands Expo & Convention Center
in Las Vegas, NV). The full board then elected officers for 2003/2004.
Skip Nemecek (Tweeten Fibre Company, Inc.) will serve a second term as
President of the BCA Board of Directors for 2003/2004. Other officers are:
1st Vice President Fred Cohen (D&R Industries, Inc.), 2nd Vice President
Henry Hayes, Jr. (Iwan Simonis, Inc.), Treasurer Bob Radford (Antique
Billiard Supply) and Secretary Butch Olhausen (Olhausen Billiard Mfg.,
Inc.).
Fred Cohen (D&R Industries, Inc.) and Clay Etheridge (Showcase Billiards)
were re-elected as Voting representatives. The newly elected Voting
representatives are Mike Baggett (Cue & Case Sales), Dan Dishaw (American
Cuemakers Association) and John Stransky (Brunswick Billiards).
Michael Brownstein (Recreation World, Inc.) and Mark Griffin (Anchorage
Billiard Palace) were re-elected as Retailer representative and Room
Operator representative, respectively. Greg Hunt (Amsterdam Billiard Club)
was elected as a Room Operator representative. Mr. Hunt had previously
served on the BCA board from 2000 to 2001.
Continuing Voting representatives are Roger Blank (Connelly Billiards),
Henry Hayes, Jr. (Iwan Simonis, Inc.), Skip Nemecek (Tweeten Fibre Company,
Inc.), John Nusser (J-S Sales Co., Inc.), Butch Olhausen (Olhausen Billiard
Mfg., Inc.), Reneé Poehlman (American Poolplayers Association) and Bob
Radford (Antique Billiard Supply). The continuing Retailer representative is
Phil Montgomery (Billiards & Barstools).
The next election will be held during the BCA General Membership meeting
that is scheduled for 5:00 p.m. on Wednesday, March 31, 2004, as the BCA
kicks off the newly named International Billiard & Home Recreation Expo
(floor open April 1-3, 2004) at the Las Vegas Convention Center in Las
Vegas, NV
"john mcchesney" <johnmc...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:5nVSb.63$fa6.61...@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com...
John Barton
news:401C2422...@greenapple.com...
Why would you say this? John is right. The BCA ALL AMERICAN TOUR was a
direct competitor of the BCA Member's tours including the Texas Express
National Nine Ball Tour. The BCA leagues are a direct competitor to the APA
and the VNEA. Rene' Pohlman had to be voted to the board or directors. The
BCA "should" be a trade organization that supports their members rather than
competes against them.
In my opinion, making the BCA trade show a "home recreation" show is harmful
to the members of the BCA (Excluding the "new" members who have to "join" to
be allowed to exhibit their ping pong tables and spas). The BCA is NOT
fulfilling it's mandate by allowing other companies to display at the show
and take revenue away from billiard companies.
The BCA has always shown a high disregard for the league operators so why
would they change now?
My question is what will happen to the BCA tournament in Vegas. This is
probably the best thing the BCA has ever done in my opinion. It would be a
shame to see it die. It probably the cornerstone for any deal and is
probably on the table as the crown jewel of the deal.
Just my opinion,
John
ratchet
ratchet wrote:
Maybe I read this message out of context .... I just dont like being counted as
JUST another sheep to bartered or traded ....I switched to the BCA to get out
of the APA
political arena after climbing the mountain to get to Las Vegas to play in the
APA and TAP championships I didn't like what I seen at the top ie: handicaps
were raised and lowered on a whim and it was more like a meeting of Sandbaggers
Unanymous.
in BCA or VNEA nothing is really gained by sandbagging ,although it does occur
, every ball is a point and every point counts .....
>>> Ratchet <<<
dalecue
John Barton wrote in message <1f-dnTo1g7_...@centurytel.net>...
>"ratchet" <rat...@greenapple.com> wrote in message
>news:401C2422...@greenapple.com...
>>
>>
>> john mcchesney wrote:
>>
>> > Good luck .. and remember, there are other leagues out there if you
>don't
>> > want to continue as a BCA integer ..
>> > John McChesney
>> > Texas Express
>> > ( formerly a 12+ year voting member of the BCA )
>> >
>>
>> Can you say "asshole" !!!!!!!!!!!!!11
>>
>
>
>Why would you say this? John is right. The BCA ALL AMERICAN TOUR was a
>direct competitor of the BCA Member's tours including the Texas Express
>National Nine Ball Tour. The BCA leagues are a direct competitor to the
APA
>and the VNEA. Rene' Pohlman had to be voted to the board or directors.
The
>BCA "should" be a trade organization that supports their members
long before the BCA ever even thought about holding trade shows
- they used to be the governing body for the sport/game/recreational
activity that is pool
among other things, they used to hold the annual championship
tournament and sanction qualifying tourneys.
they used to be involved, in various ways, in promoting the playing of
pool - that all seemed to get left out in the cold once the trade show
became established
IMHO the trade show should be in a seperate but equal organization from the
'sactioning body' and league operating efforts
Dale
Tim Dolan
with you.
"randy reinfeldt- wis bca president" <bca...@charter.net> wrote in message
news:5e541c56.04013...@posting.google.com...
randy reinfeldt- wis bca president
leagues...gee maybe they were losing too many players tired of feeding
the wallets of greedy operators and thus decided they better try and
stop the greatest pool tourney on earth(bca natl championships)...all
we are asking is for the board to spin us off into a non-profit entity
much like the vnea where we the players and operators have a voice and
can control our growth...the bca has long been looked at as the strong
arm in pool and it is a shame to see this assoc. break up....why not
spin us off and work together to achieve an ultimate goal of promoting
the sport and at the same time the sport is promoted we as players can
promote the products of the bca members...i don't think the bca trade
org. needs the money from the sale unless of course they are greedy!!
>it's time for the bca players and operators to unite and let the
board know we are not for sale as we are just as important as the apa
and the rest of its members...without bca leagues they will lose some
business members...
>as for the apa maybe if ya wouldn't take all the money from your
members you'd have better leagues...and WOW WHAT RULES YOU
FOLLOW....GUESS POOL ISN'T REALLY A GAME OF SKILL AFTER ALL LIKE I
THOUGHT FOR 36 YEARS...
>keep your nose out of the bca league affairs and tend to your own
league business(apa)!!!!!!!
TC99999999
vnea where we the players and operators have a voice and can control our
anyone in Colo to make that decision for you?
Not wanting to argue, just curious about all of the "us vs them" words.
tc99999999
Sam at TAP
> Maybe I read this message out of context .... I just dont like being counted as
> JUST another sheep to bartered or traded ....I switched to the BCA to get out
> of the APA
> political arena after climbing the mountain to get to Las Vegas to play in the
> APA and TAP championships I didn't like what I seen at the top ie: handicaps
> were raised and lowered on a whim and it was more like a meeting of Sandbaggers
> Unanymous.
> in BCA or VNEA nothing is really gained by sandbagging ,although it does occur
> , every ball is a point and every point counts .....
>
> >>> Ratchet <<<
Ratchet....Please don't compare TAP with the APA's problems of
handicapping. At the TAP nationals this past year not one team or
player was dqed for handicaps. Can the APA say the same? TAP does not
adjust players handicaps in the middle of a tournament as the APA
does. We simply throw them out. At the Valley Forge TAP event last
year(of which I directed) there were only 3-4 players dqed.
My own local area has grown from a mere 6 teams to 70 in under six
years. And I am in a rural area. The reason it started was because of
a local independent non handicap league alot like a BCA league. Why do
you think we grew so much? Players are getting tired of competing
against loaded teams such as the BCA format. There are more average
ball bangers out there than the A+ players. And I may add that the
same local independent league has lost teams since I quit and started
TAP.
I will also state that I can proudly say that two of my members have
done very well in the BCA nationals (Mike McClain won the open in 94
and Ron Beard who took 4th in 2001...I think I am correct on the
years) So even the good players are seeing what TAP has to offer. If
you don't like these leagues, I respect your opinion but please make
sure your facts are correct. Sam Rullo, TAP Vice President
ratchet
Sam at TAP
> Some of them should have been .......
That's your opinion and your entitled to it. I personally sent three
teams to the TAP nationals and not one of them complained about bad
handicaps. None of these teams did well in the main event and only one
did decent in the second chance event(2nd). The problem with the TAP
and APA nationals and Valley Forge are the tables. The Diamonds play
great but IMO they are way to easy. Everything falls in and they make
everyone look a handicap better than what they really are. At any
national event you are going to have the "gray" area players but at
TAP once we get a second complaint on a player, there is a audit run
on their scores. If it turns out they are playing way over their
handicap, they are tossed. At the TAP nationals there were few
complaints on handicaps even with the loose tables.
John Barton
John
"Sam at TAP" <tap...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:d25b0c90.0402...@posting.google.com...
ratchet
Let me post a retraction here to say I am sorry for including TAP in the Las Vegas Championship
bitch , The tournament in Vegas was a damn good event
but the location did suck as far as having to take a cab to the strip , the free trolley was ok
but the timing was off for us as a group the food at the buffet wasn't the best and the casino
left a lot to be desired , why couldn't you get a casino on the strip ???? I will say the
Diamond tables were excellent . The timed matches were
not fairly enforced though , we got timed twice and it eventually killed us when
saved our 7 up against a 6 and it ended up being called a race to one , the other guy broke and
ran out !! then as we were walking to the escalator two other teams told us they were allowed to
play their matches out well past 4 hours!!
>>> Ratchet <<<
Sam at TAP
> Would you rather go back to Valley tables?
>
> John
I didn't say that John but the Valley tables played tougher. All they
have to do is tighten up the Diamonds a bit but it does play havoc on
the handicaps.
Cuesrus
>and APA nationals and Valley Forge are the tables. The Diamonds play
>great but IMO they are way to easy. Everything falls in and they make
greg
are you there? a lot of players are saying
the same thing. too easy
John Barton
r e a l small on those Diamond bartables. :-)) I wonder why?
John
"Cuesrus" <cue...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040203183213...@mb-m16.aol.com...
Sam at TAP
> Sam ,
>
> Let me post a retraction here to say I am sorry for including TAP in the Las Vegas Championship
> bitch , The tournament in Vegas was a damn good event
> but the location did suck as far as having to take a cab to the strip , the free trolley was ok
> but the timing was off for us as a group the food at the buffet wasn't the best and the casino
> left a lot to be desired , why couldn't you get a casino on the strip ???? I will say the
> Diamond tables were excellent . The timed matches were
> not fairly enforced though , we got timed twice and it eventually killed us when
> saved our 7 up against a 6 and it ended up being called a race to one , the other guy broke and
> ran out !! then as we were walking to the escalator two other teams told us they were allowed to
> play their matches out well past 4 hours!!
>
I could not make the TAP nationals this year (I was suppose to direct
it) but you have to realize that there is no such thing as a perfect
pool tournament. Times run late and directors are human like everyone
else and we make mistakes. I know the guy that was mainly in charge
(Robert) knows what he is doing. On a different note, TAP is close to
finalizing the details for their 2004 nationals to be held in New
Orleans. We are the only league that are "floating" their nationals
every year. I hope to see you there. By the way. Where are you playing
out of and who is your league op?
Cuesrus
>All I know is when I was playing Jesse Bowman for $200 a set the pockets got
>r e a l small on those Diamond bartables. :-)) I wonder why?
>
john
where were you playing? maybe you were playing on different cut tables than the
tourament.
Ron Hudson
I've been following this and wondering too if they have changed the tables. At
the APA tournaments in Las Vegas last year, no one was saying how loose the
tables were; just the opposite. The corner pockets were especially tight, With
the angles of the pocket mouths and the depth of the shelf inside the corners,
you would usually rattle the ball and leave it hanging if you tried to cheat the
pocket even a little bit.
Ron
lfigueroa
loose pockets "Raise the bet, they'll tighten up."
Lou Figueroa
"Ron Hudson" <R...@Intermediacorp.net> wrote in message
news:lfa320t86nhnqo1da...@4ax.com...
John Barton
John
"lfigueroa" <lfig...@att.net> wrote in message
news:VasUb.57931$6O4.1...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Ron Hudson
comments from Sam at TAP that did not appear to be in jest.
Ron