Keith Mitchell, Invisible Man
David M Tate
baseball map.
Saturday afternoon, during the national telecast of the Braves/Mets game,
Dick Stockton and Jim Kaat were talking about the fact that Deion Sanders
was sitting out, and that the Braves now had 4 "regular" outfielders on
the roster fighting for 3 starting jobs. Kaat then mentioned that the Braves
also had some excellent prospects coming up who were going to make the choice
even harder. "Ah," I thought, "Here's where they talk about how great a year
Keith Mitchell had last year."
Wrong. They talked about Chipper Jones and Ryan Klesko. Not *one word* about
Mitchell; as if he didn't even exist.
Whimper.
If you go by past performance, the Braves' outfielders currently rank in
the following order:
Justice
Gant
Mitchell
Nixon
Sanders.
Give Deion the benefit of the doubt on having really improved himself, and
he passes Nixon, but Mitchell is clearly ahead of both of them. And he'll
be 23 in August. Is he in somebody's doghouse? I can't think of any sane
reason to have this kid in the minors while Otis Nixon is getting significant
playing time...
--
David M. Tate |"Is this the baseball I see before me
dt...@unix.cis.pitt.edu | Come spinning toward the plate? Come,
A poem should be dumb, / As old | let me smite thee. [...] Or art thou but
medallions to the thumb.--MacLeish| a slider of the mind? (MacRuth, act V)
David M Tate
Tim McCarver, Saturday 2 May 1992
National broadcast of Rangers/White Sox game.
McCarver: "That was an absolutely masterful at bat by Al Newman."
On an unrelated note, the best dig of the day was by ESPN announcer
Chris Bergamo. Their film clip of the ChiSox/Rangers game showed Fay
Vincent sitting in the stands, and Bergamo noted that "Here's some guy
who couldn't find any billiards tournaments of tractor-pulls on cable..."
Nelson Lu
>If you go by past performance, the Braves' outfielders currently rank in
>the following order:
>
> Justice
> Gant
> Mitchell
> Nixon
> Sanders.
>
>Give Deion the benefit of the doubt on having really improved himself, and
>he passes Nixon, but Mitchell is clearly ahead of both of them. And he'll
>be 23 in August. Is he in somebody's doghouse? I can't think of any sane
>reason to have this kid in the minors while Otis Nixon is getting significant
>playing time...
Where is Lonnie Smith on this list, Dr. Dave? :-) (He is the *real* invisible
man now...) He is also sitting while Nixon and Sanders get the playing time...
Surely someone can use his .377 OBP ('91, with .394 SLG), no?
===============================================================================
GO CALIFORNIA ANGELS!
Charter Member of the Acker-o-phobics Anonymous
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (clau...@leland.stanford.edu)
Ted Frank
>Where is Lonnie Smith on this list, Dr. Dave? :-) (He is the *real* invisible
>man now...) He is also sitting while Nixon and Sanders get the playing time...
>Surely someone can use his .377 OBP ('91, with .394 SLG), no?
You mean 091/125/091?? :-)
Nixon has a career 320 OBP. BJ has him projected for 247/330/288. They
should trade him while somebody will be stupid enough to give something
up for him.
--
....................................
ted frank | th...@midway.uchicago.edu
the university of chicago law school
unlikely to quote mu'min v. virginia
Unknown
> In article <1992May3.0...@leland.Stanford.EDU>
clau...@leland.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
> >Where is Lonnie Smith on this list, Dr. Dave? :-) (He is the *real*
invisible
> >man now...) He is also sitting while Nixon and Sanders get the playing
time...
> >Surely someone can use his .377 OBP ('91, with .394 SLG), no?
>
> You mean 091/125/091?? :-)
>
> Nixon has a career 320 OBP. BJ has him projected for 247/330/288. They
> should trade him while somebody will be stupid enough to give something
> up for him.
But back to the matter, just where is Keith Mitchell? Atlanta's dugout?
Richmond? Was he traded somewhere while we weren't looking? With Atlanta's
outfield and the number of prospects coming up, should he be?
Hmmmmm, could Tino Martinez hit in the National League?
- David J. Warner - "I know someday you'll have a beautiful life. -
- dwa...@ucs.indiana.edu - I know you'll be the sun in somebody else's sky, -
- dwarner@journalism. - but why couldn't it be mine?" -
- indiana.edu - - Pearl Jam, "Black" -
David M Tate
>> Justice
>> Gant
>> Mitchell
>> Nixon
>> Sanders.
>Where is Lonnie Smith on this list, Dr. Dave? :-) (He is the *real* invisible
>man now...)
Eep! Good point. I screwed up that one, didn't I?
Let's make it
Justice
Gant
Mitchell
L. Smith
Sanders
Nixon
and note that the two best OBP guys in the group are the ones not getting
any major league playing time at all.
Gene Schwartzman
>
>But back to the matter, just where is Keith Mitchell? Atlanta's dugout?
>Richmond? Was he traded somewhere while we weren't looking? With Atlanta's
>outfield and the number of prospects coming up, should he be?
>
K.M. is in Richmond and last time I checked I think he was doing pretty good
(whatever that might mean :) There was a rumor of Nixon being traded to Angels
to make room for an OF, but who would the Braves need?
1B? They got Klesko coming next year (probably)
2B? Lemke/Treadway/Blauser (trade all 3 to get 1 decent? :)
SS? Chipper Jones is gonna be there in 2 years
3B? Pendleton
C? That looked weak, but with Berryhill's bat waking up it might not be as
open as before.
OF all 3 positions are set
P? Smoltz, Avery, Glavine are solid. Bielecki seems to be off to a good start
but the jury is still out. He could win 10+ but his era will probably end
up around 4.00. Leibrandt seems to be the weakest starter at the moment.
And the closer position is a joke unless Wohlers starts pitching good
enough to come back to Atlanta (so far he's being lit up at AAA, something
like 6.00 ERA...)
So the conclusion? 2B, 5th starter and a possible closer is the need. Now
who can they pry away from who for Nixon?
Gene
CAV...@yalevm.ycc.yale.edu
gen...@envnet2.gsfc.nasa.gov (Gene Schwartzman) writes:
>
>K.M. is in Richmond and last time I checked I think he was doing pretty good
>(whatever that might mean :) There was a rumor of Nixon being traded to Angels
>to make room for an OF, but who would the Braves need?
>
>
>So the conclusion? 2B, 5th starter and a possible closer is the need. Now
>who can they pry away from who for Nixon?
>
be fine. Blauser's fielding at 2B concerns me a little, but I think
he'll supplant Pendleton at third in a couple of years -- Jeff is 26,
Terry is 31; STATS projects Blauser to be a better hitter than Pendleton
this year, but even if that doesn't pan out it'll certainly be true by
1994; and though Pendleton's range factor led all ML 3Bs last year,
Blauser's was well above average. Anyway, 2B is not our biggest need.
As for a closer, we have one of the deepest bullpens in baseball already,
surely we can find one closer in the bunch or just get by on a committee
of Pena, Stanton, Berenguer, Wohlers, Mercker, and Freeman. Hell, we
could trade one or two of them and still have a strong pen. Clearly what
we want for Nixon is a starter. Maybe 2B will be a weak spot but I'd
rather have 4 dominant starters and one hole in the lineup than 3 dominant
starters and no holes in the lineup. The Angels seem to be really
interested in Nixon; maybe they'd give up Finley for him and a reliever?
Or Finley for Nixon and Hunter?
There's one big caveat in any Nixon deal: does he have a no-trade
clause in his contract? After all, he signed with us for less money than
the Angels offered him; why would he allow us to trade him to the Angels?
Jeff Caveney
Sam Lane
> K.M. is in Richmond and last time I checked I think he was doing pretty good
> (whatever that might mean :) There was a rumor of Nixon being traded to Angels
> to make room for an OF, but who would the Braves need?
>
Keith Mitchell was about 1 for spring, so they sent him down to AAA where
he could get out of the slump playing everyday. Seems like they'll need to
trade away some outfielders soon to get him back up.
> 2B? Lemke/Treadway/Blauser (trade all 3 to get 1 decent? :)
Second base is a big need. Blauser has a good bat with power, but seems to
fit better at SS. Start Blauser at short, and use Belliard as a (excellent)
defensive replacement. Now, at second, we have Lemke. Despite his World
Series performance, he's no more than a late inning defensive replacement.
On a team with this much talent, there's no reason, they can't field a
second basemen who can contribute offensively.
I say package up Lemke, Lonnie Smith,and Nixon for Roberto Alomar.
Flame shield redirected towards Toronto. Shields activated.
Sam
Robert J. Skrobola
I've been asked to stop posting weekly stats to this newsgroup
because of the problems it causes small UUCP sites. I do apologize to
those people for any problem I've caused. I must point out however, that
before I posted the first time, I did ask if people would have a problem
with it...No matter.
If you have found the stats useful, please email me, and I'll
put you on a mailing list to receive them each week...
Rob
--
-----------------------------------------------------
Rob Skrobola Institutional File Server Project
Normal Disclaimer: I speak only for myself
-----------------------------------------------------
Nelson Lu
>1B? They got Klesko coming next year (probably)
>2B? Lemke/Treadway/Blauser (trade all 3 to get 1 decent? :)
What are not decent about Treadway and Blauser? They are among the best
offensively in the NL for their respective positions. They are weak
defensively, but there aren't too many whose offense+defense make them more
valuable. I can only name Sandberg and Thompson as definite ones...
>SS? Chipper Jones is gonna be there in 2 years
>3B? Pendleton
>C? That looked weak, but with Berryhill's bat waking up it might not be as
> open as before.
>OF all 3 positions are set
>P? Smoltz, Avery, Glavine are solid. Bielecki seems to be off to a good start
> but the jury is still out. He could win 10+ but his era will probably end
> up around 4.00. Leibrandt seems to be the weakest starter at the moment.
> And the closer position is a joke unless Wohlers starts pitching good
> enough to come back to Atlanta (so far he's being lit up at AAA, something
> like 6.00 ERA...)
>
>So the conclusion? 2B, 5th starter and a possible closer is the need. Now
>who can they pry away from who for Nixon?
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu
>I say package up Lemke, Lonnie Smith,and Nixon for Roberto Alomar.
>
>Flame shield redirected towards Toronto. Shields activated.
You'd better. Toronto would probably let go Alomar only for two of the
following players: (Justice, Gant, Glavine, Avery, Smoltz). And they really
don't need to trade Alomar anyway; they DON'T have a surplus at 2B. If
Alomar gets hurt now, you would see Manuel Lee at 2B and Alfredo Griffin at SS.
Not a pretty picture.
John Navarra
I don't think Leibrandt is their weakest starter. He has been pitching
pretty well lately. (very well over the 32 consecutive outs he got!). He
does get roughed up every now and then, but he is a quality 4th starter
behind the other three. If Bielecki and Leibrandt win 25+ games together,
the BRaves should win the division. Charlie should do his part -- Mike
is the bigger ????.
P.S to the brave's managment:
YOU BETTER NOT TRADE OTIS TO THE ANGELS! HE IS ON MY ROTO TEAM!
(and we don't do AL players!)
-tms
--
From the Lab of the MaD ScIenTiST:
nav...@casbah.acns.nwu.edu
Gene Schwartzman
>In article <1992May4.1...@wam.umd.edu> gen...@envnet2.gsfc.nasa.gov (Gene Schwartzman) writes:
>
>>1B? They got Klesko coming next year (probably)
>>2B? Lemke/Treadway/Blauser (trade all 3 to get 1 decent? :)
>
>What are not decent about Treadway and Blauser? They are among the best
>offensively in the NL for their respective positions. They are weak
>defensively, but there aren't too many whose offense+defense make them more
>valuable. I can only name Sandberg and Thompson as definite ones...
Treadway = .300+ AVG, no power, no speed, no RBI
Blauser = 10 HR, 5 SB, ~.275 AVG (currently it's around .180)
Need I say more?
Lemme see...
HOU = Biggio*
CIN = Doran*
SDP = Stillwell (ok, so he's a Blauser bat-alike)
LAD = Samuel*
SFG = Thompson*
CHI = Sandberg*
PIT = Lind (he's a joke at the plate)
NYM = Randolph (Treadway bat-alike)
PHI = Morandini/Duncan*
STL = whoever is not on DL yet :)
MON = DeShields*
Looks like 7 of the teams have MUCH better offensive players at 2B than
Braves...
Gene
Nelson Lu
> Treadway = .300+ AVG, no power, no speed, no RBI
> Blauser = 10 HR, 5 SB, ~.275 AVG (currently it's around .180)
Treadway has relatively good power for a 2B. A .418 SLG isn't shabby at all
for a 2B (in Atlanta, admittingly.)
His OTS over the past two years were .129 and .154. Let me compare that to
the 2Bs you listed... (Before I start, as well, last year he was only worse
than Sandberg and Thompson in this regard.)
>
> Need I say more?
>
> Lemme see...
> HOU = Biggio*
A converted catcher. He's had OTS of .119 and .134 over the past two seasons.
However, he's still learning 2B.
> CIN = Doran*
.174 and .134. However, 5 years older than Treadway.
> SDP = Stillwell (ok, so he's a Blauser bat-alike)
Not quite. At least he hasn't hit with Blauser's power for the past two years.
.352 and .361 SLGs are over 50 points lower than Blauser's in both years.
> LAD = Samuel*
A joke at the plate. Even in last year, a very good year by his standard,
he was no better than average, and Treadway was very much above average.
> SFG = Thompson*
>
> CHI = Sandberg*
> PIT = Lind (he's a joke at the plate)
He is.
> NYM = Randolph (Treadway bat-alike)
Had similar years. However, Randolph is *9* years older.
> PHI = Morandini/Duncan*
Duncan doesn't draw walks whatsoever (.288 OBP last year).
> STL = whoever is not on DL yet :)
> MON = DeShields*
He's a question mark in this point in my book. He is very promising, but he
was *a lot* worse than Treadway last year (.115).
>
> Looks like 7 of the teams have MUCH better offensive players at 2B than
> Braves...
Not much, if at all. Again, I stand by my statement that only Sandberg
and Thompson are clearly better. Remember that Treadway is only 29 as well.
He should be right in his prime.
DAVID BONAR
>In article <1992May5.0...@wam.umd.edu> gen...@envnet2.gsfc.nasa.gov (Gene Schwartzman) writes:
>
>> Treadway = .300+ AVG, no power, no speed, no RBI
>> Blauser = 10 HR, 5 SB, ~.275 AVG (currently it's around .180)
>
>Treadway has relatively good power for a 2B. A .418 SLG isn't shabby at all
>for a 2B (in Atlanta, admittingly.)
>
>His OTS over the past two years were .129 and .154. Let me compare that to
>the 2Bs you listed... (Before I start, as well, last year he was only worse
>than Sandberg and Thompson in this regard.)
>>
I agree that Treadway looks like one of the top three or four
2b in the league by OPS or OTS. But in the past he has been a very one
sided player; hitting righted handed pitching very well and doing poorly
versus lefties. This is the more valuable side of a platoon but unless
he has improved in this regard I am unwilling to say he is consistantly
good.
Dave
__________
Dave Bonar
eeb...@lsuvax.sncc.lsu.edu
__________
Mark Reardon
|>
|> But back to the matter, just where is Keith Mitchell? Atlanta's dugout?
|> Richmond? Was he traded somewhere while we weren't looking? With Atlanta's
|> outfield and the number of prospects coming up, should he be?
|>
|> Hmmmmm, could Tino Martinez hit in the National League?
|>
|> - David J. Warner
win the pennant and that are now at AAA Richmond. Mitchell is starting
in center and batting cleanup. The coaches beleive he is getting better
playing every day rather than being behind the logjam in Atlanta. They
say is power is up and he is learning more about stealing. He claims
to be very positive that the braves will call him up if his numbers
continue to be what they are. The other minor leaguers that contributed
last year include:
Relief pitchers Wholers (he's learning a slider that is reportedly
95 plus mph) and Randy St. Claire,
Starting pitcher Pete Smith who had major shoulder surgery before last
season and struggled. Smith threw a 7 inning perfect game recently.
Catcher Cabrerra. Strong arm and bat. Learning to handle pitchers better.
Shortstop Vinnie Castillo. Any report of the future brave SS leaves
this guy out but he played some in september and was a steady glove.
He was also the last cut this spring.
I can't remember the other player but I beleive he is an outfielder.
--
Mark
---------------------------------------------------------------------
| Mark Reardon | AT&T Tridom |
| m...@eng.tridom.com | 840 Franklin Court |
| | Marietta, GA 30067 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Reardon
a left handed bat for pinch hitting, or pitching. The braves have
openly discussed that they carry one extra outfielder and one less
infielder than normal to keep an extra offensive player. They also
have Williard as a third catcher/pinch hitter. If they could get
another middle infielder that can hit they of course would be interested.
My opinion is that other GM's will take a wait and see attitude about
the braves surplus of outfielders. After all, Nixon has to prove last
year was no a fluke. Sanders has to prove that he has improved. If
Mitchell keeps the pressure on in Richmond, Cox may cut lose one
outfielder to bring him up. The braves have released players before
to make room and I beleive they would do it again (Lyons is an
example this year).
In addition, the braves have both Treadway and Gregg coming back from
injuries. Why would other GM's trade for what you may be able to pick
up on the waiver wire?
Dave Heavy Sedation Kirsch
>
>You'd better. Toronto would probably let go Alomar only for two of the
>following players: (Justice, Gant, Glavine, Avery, Smoltz). And they really
>don't need to trade Alomar anyway; they DON'T have a surplus at 2B. If
>Alomar gets hurt now, you would see Manuel Lee at 2B and Alfredo Griffin at SS.
>Not a pretty picture.
Actually, given their depth in starting pitching and Alomar's obvious star
magnitude in Toronto, I doubt they'd even trade him for two of the mentioned
players. Note that I'm not saying it wouldn't be worth it, just that it's
unlikely you'd see it happen. Roberto is fast becoming his own religion in
Toronto .. hopefully he'll run the Cult .. er, Church of Scientology out of
town :-)
And I'd *hope* that someone would have enough brains to force Cito to play
Jeff Kent at 2B if Alomar were traded/injured/whatever. I'd say they have a
surplus at 2B alright, just as much as they have an extreme shortage at SS.
Their best SS prospect at this point is probably glove-wizard Alex Gonzalez,
who has only started to hit this year. (Ouch.) At least he's still young;
only 19 or 20 right now.
--
Dave Hung Like a Jim Acker Slider Kirsch ... of the Warren Newson fan club
kir...@ux.acs.umn.edu "Blue Jays all the way in '92"
"I'm too sexy for my shirt .. so sexy it hurts" - John Stuart Mill
"Welcome to my killfile, it gets larger every day" - J. Axl Lundy