Tandem skydives
Amber Robinson
arm.
I have it in a cast and it is several days old now...(the break). I thought
that you had all the control in one hand or the other when descending, not
both.
Would Tandem diving be a better alternative ? This is the only alternative
that the diving club will offer. I told them that I had a broken arm and
that it had only been operated on and set a few days ago but they said I
would lose all my money (deposit and full cost of the dive, ground "school:
and lessons) if I either didn't go solo or go tandem.
They are now recommending Tandem....what risks are involved with that..
Is the instructor somehow buckled to you ? Does he deploy the parachutes ?
Would I need to rely on my broken arm as much in a Tandem dive ?
Kellie
George Rabe
have been refused, tell them that you will take them to small claims court, to
get your money back, if they don't give you an extension on the time limit for
your jump.
If they have any sense, they will do that. If they don't, take them to court,
the judge will more than likely make them give you a time extension.
You're an idiot if you make any kind of a jump with your arm in that condition.
George Rabe
http://www.georgerabe.com/mysite1/noveltys/wayout/wayout00.htm
CRWMike
credit card, cancel it.
James
CRWMike wrote:
>
> Bad business decision on their part. Which DZ is this? If you paid by
> credit card, cancel it.
>
> Amber Robinson wrote:
> >
> > Okay...I just wrote a note earlier to this group about diving with a broken
> > arm.
Yeah, what DZ??
We may be able to help you out a little :-)
I don't believe it unless it was in Nevada!
stuDent,
james@pahokee
cuppcake
Amber Robinson <am...@intergate.bc.ca> wrote in message
news:37e0...@carrera.intergate.ca...
> Okay...I just wrote a note earlier to this group about diving with a
broken
> arm.
>
Paul Koning
>
> Okay...I just wrote a note earlier to this group about diving with a broken
> arm.
>
> I have it in a cast and it is several days old now...(the break). I thought
> that you had all the control in one hand or the other when descending, not
> both.
>
> Would Tandem diving be a better alternative ? This is the only alternative
> that the diving club will offer. I told them that I had a broken arm and
> that it had only been operated on and set a few days ago but they said I
> would lose all my money (deposit and full cost of the dive, ground "school:
> and lessons) if I either didn't go solo or go tandem.
You mean you have to go right away or lose the money? Or you can wait
until it's healed and go then?
If the first, tell us what DZ this is so we can put it on the
"never ever go here" list.
> They are now recommending Tandem....what risks are involved with that..
>
> Is the instructor somehow buckled to you ? Does he deploy the parachutes ?
> Would I need to rely on my broken arm as much in a Tandem dive ?
Yes; yes; probably not. Then again, the landing is a little trickier
and it may well involve a tumble on the grass. Doesn't sound like
a good thing with a fresh fracture!
Wait until your arm is healed, then go. Tandems are nice as a first
jump; when in doubt, I'd say do it that way.
paul
--
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! any member of a civilized community, against his will, is to prevent
! harm to others. His own good, either physical or moral, is not
! a sufficient warrant." -- John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty" 1859
Nick Stovall
I for one would like to know who this is. I can honestly say that
your situation is a bunch of BULLPUCKY!!!
You have a broken arm and IMHO you should not even be thinking about
jumping just yet! Especially for a first jump!!!
Re-think who you are planning on jumping with, because their
alternatives are definitely not in your best interest and knowing
that, you should take the time to find out if all their other thoughts
are in your best interest.
Two cents for the wishing well - One wish for your money or an
extension of time and another for BLUE SKIES!!!
Nick
Cricket202
operation they run so we can take our $$ else where.
Rita
recommend it.
With tandem, you don't wear the parachute, your instructor does. What you do
wear is a harness, which is securely clipped to the front of his harness, and
you descend, both in freefall and under canopy, together ... under the one
parachute. True, the tandem master (instructor) can control the parachute on
his own, which would place no stress on your broken arm whatsoever ... hopefully
... that is, if everything goes 100% correctly.
Yes, going tandem could work out ... but it's still a risk. What if you have a
hard landing causing you to go down right on top of the casted arm? What if you
slam yourself into the side of the aircraft as you are climbing out? What if
you lose your balance during exit, because you can't properly position yourself
in the door with one arm, and you send both you and your tandem master spiraling
out into space unstable? And even worse ... what if something "happens" to your
tandem master ... rendering him unconscious ... and thus forcing you to have to
steer the tandem canopy on your own? Tandem canopies are huge. They would be
difficult to steer on your own (unless you were in great shape) with both arms,
I can't imagine being able to do it with one.
I can honestly say, Kellie, that I have no doubt that, as a student, I would
have been grounded with a cast on my arm at any one of the dz's that I've done
jumps at ... that is, grounded for either student or tandem jumps. Why?
Because it is just not safe ... plain and simple. It is just not prudent.
Which dz is this, by the way, that won't let you take the course another time?
Something isn't right here. I've never heard of this.
Most conscientious dzo's are more concerned with student safety than with
profit. Yes, if you just "chicken out" and don't show up for your course, or if
you cancel the night before or even the week before, yes ... usually there is
some sort of a financial penalty ... a loss of deposit. And, that's
understandable. They reserved an instructor for you, they made arrangements for
a class, and especially if you are the only student scheduled to be in it, now
they've got the inconvenience of having to cancel everything.
But ... if you have a legitimate problem ... like a broken arm ... making it
rather unwise to jump, I've have NEVER heard of a dz refusing to at least give a
future credit for a course in return for the deposit sum.
I'd be very curious to know which dz is taking such a hard assed stand. I'm
sure others on this newsgroup would be too.
Blue ones!
--rita
Amber Robinson wrote:
> Would Tandem diving be a better alternative ? This is the only alternative
> that the diving club will offer. I told them that I had a broken arm and
> that it had only been operated on and set a few days ago but they said I
> would lose all my money (deposit and full cost of the dive, ground "school:
> and lessons) if I either didn't go solo or go tandem.
>
Rita
it?
Blue ones!
--rita
James wrote:
> CRWMike wrote:
> >
> > Bad business decision on their part. Which DZ is this? If you paid by
> > credit card, cancel it.
> >
> > Amber Robinson wrote:
> > >
> > > Okay...I just wrote a note earlier to this group about diving with a broken
> > > arm.
>
Jan Meyer
>
> > Would Tandem diving be a better alternative ? This is the only alternative
> > that the diving club will offer. I told them that I had a broken arm and
> > that it had only been operated on and set a few days ago but they said I
> > would lose all my money (deposit and full cost of the dive, ground "school:
> > and lessons) if I either didn't go solo or go tandem.
> >
> > They are now recommending Tandem....what risks are involved with that..
If the DZ in question is a USPA Group member,
I would call USPA at 703-836-3495 and get the number of the local
Director.
Contact the Director, explain your situation and ask the Director to be
a mediator for you. The Director personally knows the DZO, whereas USPA
HQ folks may not.
Your injury prevents you from jumping and following the BSRs for first
jump students.
There is a *Medical statement* that all jumpers must sign. It is usually
buried in the wavier, however the text comes from USPA doctrine. It says
something to the effect "I'm healthy and physically fit with no
impairments that would preclude a safe jump."
Wait until your arm is ok. You'll have a much better time, ans at much
lower risk.
If the DZ in question is NOT a USPA group member, try the above
anyway....
If that doesn't work, talk to the local TV station with the consumer
advocate, the BBB, local Chamber of Commerce...
And if that doesn't work, tell wreck.skydiving what DZ this is...
--
Jan Meyer
Aeroso...@MakeItHappen.com
http://www.MakeItHappen.com
jkallend
I have seen photos in Parachutist and elsewhere of tandem students with
disabilities that,
at first sight, seem far more disabling than a fractured arm
(paraplegics, for example). I have
watched a tandem jump performed with a "passenger" who had no use of
the arms at all - they
were strapped in front of her. What are the rules?
jk
jk
--
Posted via Talkway - http://www.talkway.com
Exchange ideas on practically anything (tm).
FREFALLGUY
>I have seen photos in Parachutist and elsewhere of tandem students with
>disabilities that,
>at first sight, seem far more disabling than a fractured arm
>(paraplegics, for example). I have
>watched a tandem jump performed with a "passenger" who had no use of
>the arms at all - they
>were strapped in front of her. What are the rules?
Going off the top of my head, I believe that a letter from a doctor stating
that it is "medically ok" for the person to jump is all that is required. My
experience in this area is limited to videoing a parapelegic doing a tandem --
I had nothing to do with the paperwork. There may be more to it, but I don't
think so. Maybe in addition to the doctor's letter a BSR has to be waived?
Anyone know? I'm at work right now or else I'd look it up (and yes, I know the
BSRs are online, I just don't have much time).
BS
Marc
Cindy Pirkkala
<am...@intergate.bc.ca> writes:
>
>Okay...I just wrote a note earlier to this group about diving with a
broken arm.
>Would Tandem diving be a better alternative ? This is the only
alternative that the diving club will offer. I told them that I had a
broken arm and that it had only been operated on and set a few days ago
but they said I would lose all my money (deposit and full cost of the
dive, ground "school: >and lessons) if I either didn't go solo or go
tandem.
Kellie;
Don't do it!!! Any skydiving school that would "pressure" you into
making an unsafe jump is not worth risking doing business with. Any
Tandem Instructor who needs the pay they will recieve from your jump or
any Drop Zone that so badly needs/ wants your money as to make an
unsafe jump with an injured student is more than likely cutting corners
on other safety issues as well. Once again DON'T DO IT. If you like I
can give you the name of a very good attorney with a lot of experience
in Skydiving litigation and I am almost certain you will get your money
back. In fact I personally know of a case where a prospective Skydiving
student was refunded full price of their prepaid jump gift certificate
although the expiration date had long since expired. The judge stated
something about "specific performance" and awarded the fee back.
Also please let us (on the newsgroup) know what Drop Zone this is all
happening at. Maybe some positive peer pressure from other skydivers
would help you get a refund..and as a "last resort" I am certain that
the manufacturer of the Tandem equipment being used at this Drop Zone
would like to "speak" to the Tandem Instructor who is willing to take
you for a jump in this condition.
Jumping is generally pretty safe. Jumping in your condition adds an
unacceptable degree of risk of injury to yourself. Don't Do It.
Cindy Pirkkala
TooyT
>JK wrote:
>
>
>tandem students with
>>disabilities that,
>>at first sight, seem far more disabling than a fractured arm
>>(paraplegics, for example). I
*************************************************
the only true disability is thinking ewe are, fock the Md's & the liberal &
conservative as in I AM GOD mainstream fruitcakes that try to hold people back.
They just trying to project their own mental weakness on strong wills & broken
bodies. They got this attitude geeze I cuddn't live like that so they project
on ewe like the full of fear skydiver who's allways screaming sumone going to
get killed. Thats fear coming out, uncontained. I feel sorry for weak willys
that never faced impossible challanges or lived through war, famin &
pestilige, they face a life of minor hardship & major fear end up as gay
tandem-masters or AFF/JM, better to be a Rooskie or Britttt ha ha ha ha ha. :-*
snuffy
TAP&C
sheep can't coyotes can
Risky business: cypress or not fly like ewe don't have one, stay perimeter &
altitude aware, pull yer handles in order keep loops & flaps tight, Study
SIMS!
SBozo
>the only true disability is thinking ewe are, fock the Md's & the liberal &
>conservative as in I AM GOD mainstream fruitcakes that try to hold people
>back.
So Snuff , when we gonna hook up and make a jump.......<wink>
jim
Mike Spurgeon
TooyT wrote:
>
> I'm trying to buy a Motorhome to live in full time now. If I can buy a good
> second hand one I'm makeing Livingston Texas my Winter base.My last kid is in
> UT now. Lucky I hung on to my rigs. First off to Beeville to do a Tandem to see
> how bad I puke then I'll cruise the Gulf coast DZ's looking for a worthy to
> wear my J-5, sell it and use the money to git the biggest 7-cell I kin stuff
> into my J-7, git zoo toggles & a cypress 7 maybe convert from a throw out to a
> rip cord. Being a Hemi-P I don't need no bridal & PC wrapped around my good
> right arm. :-] Then on to Lodi to give MS & Charlene second dibs on watching me
> puke Bill will probably boot me cuz he seems high strung & I cain't help
> playing tight strings.
Sounds like a plan...
TooyT
>Date: Thu, 16 September 1999
Wrote:
>So Snuff , when we gonna hook up and make a jump.......<wink>
>
> jim
man has that will pack in a J-7 then back to some outlaw DZ do my hop & pop,
should have 3 or 4 Tandems by then & know if I'm good to go if I can git
current I'll go to SDD & SDH jump the tickets I got left out got 18 left from
the Various boogies & Nationals, say goodby to my few friends then find me a
quite Cessna DZ with a DZO who won't freak when I start drilling his sheep ha
ha ha ha. Why I persist? I dunno the Gold medal is out now, numbers don't
interest me but hanging out on the step is my life. UDT/TRA the old CI/SERE & 3
in country tours of Vietnam I may be able to pull it off cuz fear was burnt out
of me decades ago. The main problem is wusspuss's trying to hold me back & 90's
skygods gitting a asswhipping for whine then the DZO booting the coyote. :-]
yuppie money talks, honor walks in modern jumping.But I wud struggle with it
cuz I'm eccentric & the sheep need village elders to sing the warriors songs to
them around the campfires Whoooooo this is going to be a major cluster fock
trip ha ha ha ha woo woo probably next spring or fall. Depends on the motorhome
deal. I can stand a lot since the stroke but not heat & humididty The camp out
days and jump in the heat days are gone forever. I'll have to pay packers too
so theirs going to be major bitching on all sides cuz this is a cardinal sin &
I know how I want shit done, unlike the sheep packers sum of who don't even
jump :-* snuffy
kr...@philly.infi.net
step together ... okay?
Blue skies!
--rita
In article <19990916211516...@ng-bj1.aol.com>,
to...@aol.com (TooyT) wrote:
> Why I persist? I dunno the Gold medal is out now, numbers don't
> interest me but hanging out on the step is my life.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
Peanut4040
TooyT
wrote:
>Just promise me that one of these days, Snuff, we can hang out on that
>step together ... okay?
>
>Blue skies!
>
>--rita
>
>
>In article <19990916211516...@ng-bj1.aol.com>,
> to...@aol.com (TooyT) wrote:
>
>> Why I persist? I dunno the Gold medal is out now, numbers don't
>> interest me but hanging out on the step is my life.
>
>
Notttttttttttttttttttt, never promise women anything, they got lawyers. :-P
TooyT
Wrote:
>Sounds like a plan...
>
ROTFFLMAO I am never without a plan but the people in the white coats have
plans too. Will the coyote escape or will the purveyors of norm prevail? If I
escape their is going to be a lot of skygod roadkill on the DZ trail. And if
the more timmid sheep think I'm arrogant & skurry now they ain't seen nothing
coyotes live to put people on edge. bump them out of the comfortable booshwah
mediocrity that keeps them from reaching full potential. Got to be on the edge
to learn, if ewe ain't tuff and flexible try not to go over the edge into
coyoteville never to return ha ha ha ha ha the plan, the plan on with the plan
woo woo heh heh yuh run the sheep to the edge where the learning field is---
Run the skygods to the edge & push them over hoowah :->
Bill D kin't touch me on crazy, like a howling banchee wind across the hills I
will come & go spreading bubba gospel till the sheep rise up and take the sport
back from the evil pretenders & skurdycats or burn my old ass at the stake, no
matter...only the holy traditions of the outlaw skydivers matter, hooka hooka
hooka Jihad, forward, forward. :-)* snuffy
TooyT
>when you hitting the two coast dz's?
>
What so the skygods can build a defensive fort & hide the sheep? Be at least a
year & hopefully when people have given up hope the mad coyote will come, that
way I kin sneak up on people to see how they really are. Might have to desguise
myself like the angels who went into Sodom and Gomorah to bring the richeous
out hoowah :-P
Minister Pirate At Large
civilian dive it was a tandem, I was given the opportunity to pull at his
direction.
When you exit the aircraft on a tandem dive the instructor deploys a drogue
chute to slow your decent rate to around 100 mph, you follow some basic
instructions and just hang out for a few seconds.
Steering can be done by the instructor or you can reach up and assist and get a
feel for the controls.
The chute is larger as well.
Landing is as they generally come.
Its a good experience and a way to just relax on the dive.
The issue of diving with a cast may pose a minor problem, but by securing that
cast to your chest you can reduce risks of it flailing around and turning out
your lights :-(
Not a very forgiving policy at the DZ. considering your present condition, but
those are the lumps in life I guess.
Hope it works out for ya!
john berntsen
Shoot.....I thought you were a "Hey dideldiddle rite down tha middle",
kinda guy ?
Mutt Butt :-)
GQ
GQ
>
>Amber Robinson wrote:
>
>> Okay...I just wrote a note earlier to this group about diving with a
broken
>> arm.
>>
>> I have it in a cast and it is several days old now...(the break). I
thought
>> that you had all the control in one hand or the other when descending,
not
>> both.
>>
>> Would Tandem diving be a better alternative ? This is the only
alternative
>> that the diving club will offer. I told them that I had a broken arm and
>> that it had only been operated on and set a few days ago but they said I
>> would lose all my money (deposit and full cost of the dive, ground
"school:
>> and lessons) if I either didn't go solo or go tandem.
>>
>> They are now recommending Tandem....what risks are involved with that..
>>
>> Is the instructor somehow buckled to you ? Does he deploy the parachutes
?
>> Would I need to rely on my broken arm as much in a Tandem dive ?
>>
>> Kellie
>
TooyT
We wern't jarheds often we operated in units smaller than 16 men on the ground
with only 1,2 or 3 of the party being American so they selected sailors with
higher IQ's than Marines. Some nights I was out alone with just 3 or 4 FN's on
a leaking armed junk in indian country that cud make 8 knots on the river with
the next nearest American being miles away listening for your radio call of
mission complete or HELP, HELP, HELP ha ha ha ha it was great if ewe were cut
out for it. Not many chicken regulations or REMF Skygods around to screw things
up. Wasn't much hey diddle diddle going on amoung the CoVans either. It was
more, lets slip in take a peek, call an air strike and run like hell ha ha ha
ha more adrenalin than skydiving for sure and a lot more interesting if you had
Zen training or could manage a stolic outlook while being curious & skurd at
the same time while handling peasant living conditions & Asian chow without
shitting yer brains out. Still all in all I preferred Europe playing chicken
with the Russians & their east block lackeys..... a few of the russian
professionals appreciated my good-oleboy style & rebel humor more plus the food
& living conditions were way better and the Turks & Italians actually liked me
enuff to invite me home to show neigbors Americans wern't really total assholes
while on standdowns Of course the German, British & French Officers thought I
wuz a mega major titantic asshole & not funny with my world according to billy
bob views on anal ferriners :-P snuffy
Tandem10
off!
mike
Tandem10
mike
Peter Liemberg
<am...@intergate.bc.ca> wrote:
>Okay...I just wrote a note earlier to this group about diving with a broken
>arm.
>
>I have it in a cast and it is several days old now...(the break). I thought
>that you had all the control in one hand or the other when descending, not
>both.
>
>Would Tandem diving be a better alternative ? This is the only alternative
>that the diving club will offer. I told them that I had a broken arm and
>that it had only been operated on and set a few days ago but they said I
>would lose all my money (deposit and full cost of the dive, ground "school:
>and lessons) if I either didn't go solo or go tandem.
Wow! It looks like this DZ goes to great lenghts in pursuit of
customer satisfaction.
;-)
>They are now recommending Tandem....what risks are involved with that..
Depends on the way the DZ is operating its tandem program.
Q.: Now that you found out they are willing to rob you, do you think
they will be hesitant in hurting you? Just a thought.
>Is the instructor somehow buckled to you ?
Yes
>Does he deploy the parachutes ?
Yes - at least one if he is any good
;-)
>Would I need to rely on my broken arm as much in a Tandem dive ?
I think that with some adjustments you could make a tandem jump with a
broken arm. We jumped with spastics, paraplegics etc. It should be no
big deal to somehow fixate your broken arm to your harness and you
could go along for the ride. However, I wouldnt go with THESE folks,
the way they behave. They should - upon you showing a note from your
doctor - give you your money back and invite you to reschedule once
your arm is completely healed. If they are not willing to do that you
should take one or more of the (legal) actions others in this thread
have suggested.
Peter Liemberg
http://www.skydive-pca.com