Asymmetric boards - What are they for ?
well...@my-deja.com
across the back with the 'corner' cut off and assymetric curves on the
front of it.
What is this board used for and why is it not symmetrical ? Presumably
you carve in one way as often as the other ? Yours in confusion....
Dave
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Michael Scott
Asym's were more common about 10 years ago; Burton had a line of Asym
carving boards for a few years in the early '90s.
The idea is that since your feet are angled on the board, your weight is
further back on heelside turns than on toeside turns; therefore the borad
acted differently on the heelside since your weight was further back.
Asym boards supposedly solved this.
The obvious problems were sidecut and flex pattern. Also, you had to have
different boards for regular and goofy footers. Nearly impossible to ride
fakie, but that was okay since it was a carving board.
For whatever reason, they didn't last.
Cheers
nils
began to disappear...
This will explain you better why we went back to symetrical boards.... Rossi
was among the brands that never made assyms ( also because they started in
the business around the middle of the assym years...and rossi riders like
shannon malhuse made people change their minds and go back to Sym.
I loved assym boards ( rode a Hot logical, Freesurf Mustang, Lacroix
EagleRace and Nidafly, F2 Beamer ) before i went back to symetrical...
N.
The Rise and Fall of the Holy Asymmetric
Empire
By Jack Michaud
December 1, 1996
So you thought you were getting the latest and
greatest of snowboardingtechnology when you bought
that asymmetric alpine board right? Asyms arethe
furthest possible progression in snowboard geometry
right? Well, maybenot!
If you've been looking around your favorite mountain
in the past couple ofseasons and you've noticed that
the majority of hot shot carvers areretro-fitting
themselves with good ol' symmetrical alpine boards,
there isa reason. It's not because someone came
along and told them all that asymswere no longer in
vogue, it's because people have discovered that
ridinga symmetrical snowboard with a more advanced
technique works better for manystyles of racing and
alpine freecarving. But as with all learning
processes,it took time for people to reach this
conclusion, and asyms were a vitalstep along the way.
Here is one interpretation of the progression of
carvingtechnique that lead to the rise and fall of
asymmetry.
When people first started snowboarding they stood
with their back foot straightacross the board and
stood sideways like a surfer. The weight transitionfrom
edge to edge went from heel to toe and vice versa.
With the body sideways,in line with the board, the
transition went in a direction straight acrossthe board,
hence the boards were symmetric (duh).
Then, people like Peter Bauer, Jean Nerva and Jose
Fernandes started gettingsmart and angling both their
feet like only the front one had been before.This
helped the legs work together and carving became
more comfortable andstable. The weight transition
again went from heel to toe, along the angleof the
bindings. With both feet angled, this resulted in a
diagonal transferfrom edge to edge. That's when the
concept of asymmetry was born. This workedto
compensate for what we now know is a not-so-good
technique, that is, hangingyour butt out a.k.a. "sitting
on the toilet". This was the last tie thatsnowboard
racers had with their aquatic surfing ancestors.
People like Shannon Melhuse, Mike Jacoby and many
others began to understandthat they could hold a
better edge while carving by keeping more of
theirbody mass closer to the board. This meant, on a
heel side carve, tuckingyour butt in over the board.
To accomplish this, you must square your hipsand
shoulders to the direction of board travel. The most
efficient way tocarve is to keep the hips square and
simply take the hips (center of gravity)straight across
the board and drop them into the next carve while
keepingthe shoulders level to the hill. The weight
transition happens in a linestraight across the board
between the bindings. This is when the conceptof
symmetry was reborn, and it is good!
This is not to say, however, that it is impossible to
efficiently and effectivelycarve an asym. Asyms are
still the weapon of choice for many successful
slalomracers. Peter Bauer is living proof. Many people
maintain that asyms aresuperior in slalom, where only
moderate stance angles are used to maximizefoot
leverage across the board. In slalom, the board
moves quickly back andforth underneath the body,
and the hips and shoulders do not remain squareto
the board throughout each turn.
Peter Bauer and Jean Nerva have developed their
own way of carving smoothly,asymmetrically, but
anybody who tries to imitate them only ends up
slidingon icy conditions. But you'll notice that Peter
Bauer and Jean Nerva areonly slalom racers. That's
because their technique doesn't work in a GS
race.Sure, they are the masters of the "Euro-carve",
but that is no way to takeyourself down a GS race
course. You will also notice that they don't wastetime
riding any sub-standard carving snow conditions!
Asym boards depend on you making the edge
transfer from heel to toe and viceversa. This is what
you do in slalom, because it's quicker due to more
leverage.That is why Bauer only stands at about 45
degrees to the board. Anythingmore than that, and
you loose the asym advantage. When you ride
symmetrically,you use the sides of your boots more,
and the edge transition happens moreas a result of a
rolling of the knees. Asyms are not any more turny
thansymmetricals.
Efficient asymmetric riding can be achieved, but the
difference in quicknessbetween it and efficient
symmetric riding is the difference in lengths betweena
diagonal and a perpendicular line across your board.
If you were to ridewith square shoulders and hips,
keeping body mass close to the edge on anasym, you
have to move your body forward and back as well as
side to side,at the same time to compensate for the
offset. This can be tricky to coordinate.Therefore,
symmetrical riding will always be more efficient and
stable forGS or Super-G types of carving
Also, the concept of deeper heelside sidecuts is no
longer necessary on thenew symmetrical boards. With
the new symmetrical carving style, one can getthe
board up on heelside just as high as you would want
and crank the sameradius turns as on toeside. If you
ride asym, and you are still doing thedeep knee
bends on heelside (sitting on the toilet), then it is true
thatyou can't get the board up as high. Your butt
would hit the snow before yougot the board up high
enough. The symmetric racing style gets your butt
outof the way, and you are in full control of your edge
angle.
So try out a symmetrical Alpine board, maybe take an
advanced lesson, andsee if you agree that you've
been missing something. If you feel like yourcarving
has reached a plateau, or that pesky heelside just
keeps lettingyou down, symmetry could be your
remedy. And if for no other reason,
symmetricalsnowboards can give you one more
excuse to go out and treat yourself to yetanother
snowboard. After all, one can never have too many
snowboards hangingaround, and you wouldn't want to
get left behind in the times, now wouldyou?
<well...@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:8u64jr$2g$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
Michael & Vanessa Nixon
Retailers balked at the sight of these things, given that the shape wasn't
freestyle friendly. They positively choked when they realized they had to
stock regular and goofy versions of the same board in roughly equal numbers.
(This was back during the first wave of jibbing, when bonking was cool).
I'll bet you'd find half the shops in Vermont today with a goofy asym in the
clearance rack. They were hard to sell - I know, I still have two of three
models!
VTrider
having a fun time - Brings up old memories. Early in my snowboarding
career, after a few seasons of 'freeriding/freestlye' I decided that I'd
give these things a shot..for how could I not? They looked so fun, and a
good majority of my peers/friends were just 'cutting it up' like Jean
Nerva and Peter Bauer, I told my self that I just had to try it, Just
looking at any weekend USSA slalom race in New England was a sight ot
behold - two dozen assyms slicing down the mountain like indy cars just
finished practice.
Yeah Nils man, I'm suprised we never butt heads together, I also rode Hot
logicals (what a sweet ride that was), Beamers, and the Lacroix for a
time, but PJ's of all sizes were my ride at the time. Being a 'freerider'
type myself, I would get a lot of shit from buddies as to why I would ever
want to ride those 'things' - "Can't take em through the pipe",....."Oh
man, can't 'jib' or 'bonk' on those things" This was once of the reasons
I picked up carving, you could kick some serious arse on these things, and
I didn't care what anybody 'said' I "jibbed" and "bonked" all over their
faces and my assym saw more pipe time than Damian Sanders did on a good
day.
Michael Scott (in this thread) stated and summed it up in a nutshell - it
was basically a weight thing....and "Nils" - great article from "Jack
Michaud" he conveyed much through his writing in that article, especially
how assyms were not necessarily inefficient, but rather improved upon
through more advanced sidecuts and riding technique.
As "Michael and Vanessa" wrote that you probably could catch a mint
condition goofy assym in the 'clearance' section of any Vermont snowboard
shop - it's so true, I get all choked up just thinking about it *sigh*
I've been riding since the late 80's, been on a lot of great rides but
nothing ever will come close the feeling you get asymmetrically cutting a
rhythm down smooth, morning corduroy.
- VTrider
nils -
I loved assym boards ( rode a Hot logical, Freesurf Mustang, Lacroix
EagleRace and Nidafly, F2 Beamer ) before i went back to symmetrical...
N.
"jibbing and bonkin" - Michael and Vanessa Nixon and (goof sym in the
clearance rack!)
mathieu bazart
Michael & Vanessa Nixon
groomed. Back in the day I rode that puppy with the Burton 3-D Flex binding
and a 17 inch stance at 45/36 degrees, and had a blast.
VT Rider: Did I ever see you at Bolton Valley, VT?
VTrider
a 6.3 on the big spring days (although that what a lot of edge for me). I
started out with those same 3-D Flex bindings - mostly on freestyle boards,
even had that hybrid 'Asym Air' board that Burton produced for a season or
two. I had the full hardplate setup with my PJ's with a pair of 'MegaFlex'
boots - now that was a combo, 17 inch stance also and usually rode 49/49 for
slalom. Believe it or not, most of my carving buddies would joke about my
binding angles, seeing they all rode more aggressive steeper angles - I found
that to be to 'constricting' and 'limiting' in view of my riding style.
This was all mostly up in Jay Peak, Burke Mt. Vermont and over in Northern New
Hampshire (Bretton Woods) where I all use to work. I work/ride over at
Smugglers Notch, Vermont now and although Bolton is just right around the
corner for me, have never rode over there. They use to have some great 'big
air' events at night for the last few seasons, I don't think that they will be
opening this season though? I think they were going through some financial
problems last I heard, Don't know if they settled that yet?
-VTrider
VTrider
such as picnic tables, logslides at the time. Bonking on the other
hand, was just the process (for me anyway) of ollying over objects such
as stumps, barrels, snow guns, your best friend taking a rest on the
snow, etc. and 'slapping' it with your board, usually the back-end.
Man, just thinking about it makes me laugh, 'everybody' was either a
jib-bonker, or euro-carver it seemed back then.
-VTrider
nils
I'm french and ride in france so that might be why we didn't carve together
;))...
I begin to collect vintage boards i find on ebay etc...just got a pristine
Safari 175 with emery plates for $35... i can't wait to ride it !! only had
the comp 2 model and loved it !!
You can't imagine how heavy the thing is!! about 5 kilos!!! and no narrow
waist....
N.
dans l'article 3A08F53A...@yahoo.com, VTrider à vtr...@yahoo.com a
écrit le 8/11/00 7:39 :
nils ICQ : 6510968 www.icq.com
nils odigo: 45706 www. odigo.com
pour emmerder les écoutes echelon:
Bombs,Drugs,Terrorist,FLIR,cocaine,crack,Weapons,Clinton,KGB,Airbus,Monica,T
homson CSF, Dassault,DGSE, AK-47,
VTrider
say...they are somewhat collectors items now and they don't stick around for
long. I remember that monster Safari model, with that funky zebra/tiger stripe
decor - I use to have a padded 'safari' travel snowboard bag from Burton, It was
like 8 years old when I sold it in mint condition for like $20.00 (US) I
believe, man I should of held on to that........could of gotten a good price on
Ebay!
nils wrote:
> Hey thanx for your answer ;)) cool!! long lasting memories :))))
>
> I'm french and ride in france so that might be why we didn't carve together
> ;))...
>
> I begin to collect vintage boards i find on ebay etc...just got a pristine
> Safari 175 with emery plates for $35... i can't wait to ride it !! only had
> the comp 2 model and loved it !!
> You can't imagine how heavy the thing is!! about 5 kilos!!! and no narrow
> waist....
>
> N.
>
> dans l'article 3A08F53A...@yahoo.com, VTrider à vtr...@yahoo.com a
> écrit le 8/11/00 7:39 :
>
Robert Ryan
blue on the top and says Burton Air on the bottom, has high backs setup so that you
can add a third strap, these bindings are screw on(no disc) and it's flat on one end
and nearly triangular on the other, it was my first board, I bought it used in 96
for $125..it weighs a ton. Sorry about the run-on sentence..it's late.
Klaus
mogals and the GS course. I guess in '96 when I bought it I was seen as
kind of a freak, being from Minnesota we don't have many carvers, due to the
small size of our "mountians". But nothing was better then flying down the
hill at mach 2 past all the skiers, hitting a big jump and pulling a hugh
tail grab (the only trick I could ever do in a full hard boot set up), then
landing and carving a tight 90 degree "euro". Then I graduated from college
and only get out a few times a year now (I swear this won't be the case this
year) I really wanted to get a new symetrical board this year and see if
they are in fact easier to carve on (especially the heal-side) but I settled
for a Burton Fusion since no one could get me a alpine board before
Thanksgiving. I hope this board is worth a shit, otherwise I guess I will
have to order another board when I get back. Oh well, long live the asyms!
Klaus
Burton 165 Fusion 2001
Burton PJ 7.0 1996
Burton Craig Kelly Air 1992 retired
Burton Safari Air 1987 retired
Sims switchblade 1987 retired
Burton Elite 150 1986 now a coffee table
Gary Farrar
asymetrical you can extend the effective edge length of the board without
extending the actual length, that's how it was explained to me, and who am I
to argue, if I could design snowboards I'd be a much richer man than I am
now!
VTrider
Man, I thought the PJ 6.3 was a lot of edge! I'm about 5'6" and 145-150lb
(depending on beer intake), but a 7.0 - God, they just don't make em like that
anymore. I couldn't agree with you more about pulling the huge tail grabs,
quickly found that the hard boot/plate setup just seem to make those tricks very
accessible - also used to bust those out like there was no tomorrow, plus the
asyms tail shape was right below your trailing hand. I also found 'shiftys'
were easy for me on hard setups.
Hey! Love your board list, it's like a chronological history of my own riding
career with the exception of the Safari, which I still regret to this day that I
never took the time to ride. My first lesson was on an Elite, and first board
that I could call my own was out of the Burton 'Free' model series which I
believe was hanging around circa 'Safari' and pre-"Mystery Air" time.
-VTrider
! BTW: I rode last years 'Fusion' on some nice hardpack courd last season,
smooth and carved nicely, it has a wider waist, little wider than I like, not as
quick as you can imagine, but still a nice ride - hope you enjoy it, would be
interesting to get other opinions on it.
VTrider
I remember when the 'Air' series came out, and man were those bindings a bitch. I still
have a whole bag of broken, twisted, snapped, cracked baseplates and binding parts in my
garage somewhere! If I remember correctly, they directly screwed into the board via 5
screws, something like an 'X' pattern. I rode with that 'third' strap, but disabled the
'forward lean/flex' adjustment on the highback where it was attached to the rear of the
baseplate, this was fine but at high speeds the amount of 'twisting' torque and pressure
that I would put on the highback 'snapped' the baseplate right in half from the heel to
the middle of the binding.
The plastics the industry used back then was far from perfect anyway, even with the same
pressures/forces I don't think you would see the same problem in todays bindings.
- VTrider
VTrider
the turn, for your weight was already over the 'sweet spot'. I think anybody
who has experienced an assym ride would agree in that same sense, For me it was
like riding a 'wild bronco' it took me for a 'ride' the first few times, you
have to 'tame' those things, be fully committed. Heh, God....as soon as I put
that thing on edge it was like 'Phew! Here we Go!', your not even safe if you
find yourself in the backseat :)
-VTrider
nils
of the numbers.. can anyone tell me what numbers i should look for .. i'd
like a PJ in the 160-165cm area.. if my memory is sharp, it was the PJ 5.1
or 6 something that was in that size range.... any hint..???
the 87-89 pre 3D are was indeed the X area for the bindings: one hole in the
center, and two holes on each side of the binding... very weak screw inserts
and rusty screws made it hard to unscrew, and often the inserts would run
loose and you had to drill it and replace it....Hey I am so happy with my
newly acquired safari: the thing has never been riden by a regular :))))))))
I just moved the plates to the "right" position and can't wait to hit the
snow ;)).... i wonder how much modern carve that kind of board can
do.....also the max angles settings for the plates is 45 front and 30 back
!!!the back foot plate only allows one screw on each extremity.. hope they
will hold good !!
Also about the vintage years: some dude is selling a huge load of 70-80's
boards on ebay: he is asking 7000$ for it:WOW :) nice quiver anyway ;)
N.
"VTrider" <vtr...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3A0B6697...@yahoo.com...
Håvard N. Jakobsen
"nils" <nilsre...@groupesynthese.com> wrote
> I dream of finding a PJ from the 93-94 area to ride.. what are the meaning
> of the numbers.. can anyone tell me what numbers i should look for .. i'd
> like a PJ in the 160-165cm area.. if my memory is sharp, it was the PJ 5.1
> or 6 something that was in that size range.... any hint..???
>
that seems
odd too.
-H
Pasi Tiitinen
even with reasonable speed, straight line stability to amaze skiers,
electra base when properly waxed guaranteed to be fastest on slopes,
and enough surface to ride backcountry and pow if needed.
I think I'll try it with soft boots this season.
Pasi
Burton PJ 7.0 1994 (Nice all-around alpine ride)
Burton FP 173 1997 (Race machine, slim and very very fast..)
Oxygen Super Cross 164 (soft boot setup, for off-piste fun)
Kendo Club
: "nils" <nilsre...@groupesynthese.com> wrote
The numbers are just the last numbers from the length, without the
leading 1. So a 170 cm PJ is a 7.0, and a 151 would be a 5.1. They did
that with all the boards those years, my Asym Air 6.3 is 163 cm.
As far as the comment that 170 is really long, that's actually a little
on the short side as far as modern alpine boards are concerned. Lots of
companies are making 175 cm+ boards, some up to 195 (Coiler, F2, Prior I
think, probably Donek).
Neil
Klaus
speeds, but awesome after you get moving. Nothing like the elite 150 - that
was just a tank to turn (not to mention carrying). The first board I rode
was the Burton "woody" in 1995 with the ankle straps, damn the sport has
come along way since then. I still teach people to board on my Craig
Kelly - I think it makes them better riders after learning on such a big
board compared to the smaller boards of today. When I picked up the Fusion
last weekend it was good to see that Burton still makes a larger (stiffer)
freestyle board, can't wait to try it in two weeks in Colorado. Any
suggestions on stance angles for hardboots on the thing? I don't want to go
quite as extreme as I have the PJ set up. I will definitely let you know
how it rides when I return.
Damn, after reading all the anti-Buton posts on here I am wondering what
happened to my favorite snowboard mfg. I agree that the Burton web site is
a pile of s@$t, but they must still make good boards. I don't know, I have
never had a problem with any of the Burton boards I have owned over the
years. Except maybe the Elite150, the inserts pulled out after 5 years.
But I rode a lot of other mfgs boards and had a Solomon break, Rossi
delaminate, Sims edge come off and a Barefoot binding pull out. Never a
problem with the Burton's - and I have beat the crap out of all the boards I
have owned. It is sad to see them start to pull out of the alpine market, I
always wanted a Ultra Prime and now that I can actually afford a $500
board - I better order one soon.
Klaus
"VTrider" <vtr...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3A0B637F...@yahoo.com...
nils
not 190, because the stiffness was totally different than what it was
today....
so 170cm was very long in 93-94.... 160 was considered the big side board at
the time...
Seems the PJ 6 or 7 is what i am looking for....
ry long in 93-94.... 160 was considered the big side board at the time...
Seems the PJ 6 or 7 is what i am looking for....
N.
"Kendo Club" <ae...@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca> wrote in message
news:DbUO5.51$jo.15...@tomcat.sk.sympatico.ca...
VTrider
> leading 1. So a 170 cm PJ is a 7.0, and a 151 would be a 5.1. They did
> that with all the boards those years, my Asym Air 6.3 is 163 cm.
>
> As far as the comment that 170 is really long, that's actually a little
> on the short side as far as modern alpine boards are concerned. Lots of
> companies are making 175 cm+ boards, some up to 195 (Coiler, F2, Prior I
> think, probably Donek).
>
> Neil
I see your point, but a 170cm carving board back then, is still by me considered a
'long board'. I've ridden a 181cm (libtech? Who made that one, it had a 7 foot
long green skeleton on a black background?) and that was a little ridiculous for
me anyway, hah! I could only turn the thing once I hit like 50mph, almost shot
right into the woods off the trail, probably would of cut down a few saplings
before coming to a stop, and an abrupt one at that.
I've noticed some board mfg's making models in the 175cm+ range since then, and I
would consider those boards 'extremely' on the long side. Things have change
much though, A decade ago, i used to ride in the 160cm range for years (everybody
did), today I would get probably the same effective edge (and probably feel
longer) on a 150cm board w/ a modern sidecut.
-VTrider
VTrider
before that everything had a lame sidecut and were basically 2x4s, Oh I miss
that board. As for angles on the Fusion, I would just start off keeping your
toe/heels angled so they are right on the edge and take it from there, like I
said it's a wider 'freecarving' model so you won't have to do any crazy extreme
angles.
> Damn, after reading all the anti-Buton posts on here I am wondering what
> happened to my favorite snowboard mfg. I agree that the Burton web site is
> a pile of s@$t, but they must still make good boards. I don't know, I have
> never had a problem with any of the Burton boards I have owned over the
> years. Except maybe the Elite150, the inserts pulled out after 5 years.
> But I rode a lot of other mfgs boards and had a Solomon break, Rossi
> delaminate, Sims edge come off and a Barefoot binding pull out. Never a
> problem with the Burton's - and I have beat the crap out of all the boards I
> have owned. It is sad to see them start to pull out of the alpine market, I
> always wanted a Ultra Prime and now that I can actually afford a $500
> board - I better order one soon.
Although I've subscribed to this NG for years, just really started hanging out
here. I live/work in N. Vermont at a ski resort - just 45min. from the Burton
factory. I've also ridden Burton all my life, and everything else under the
sun, but always seem to end up eventually on another Burton. Funny Rossi
statement, happened to me too - Had a couple of Seone boards - blew the edge out
half way down the first run of the season, returned it to the company (also
45min. away) got another once, after 2 weeks and convincing myself that it just
didn't feel right, I noticed that the tip/tail was all bend to shit
(torsionally) - I attributed that to the foam core, maybe, maybe not, but I
always seem to prefer wood cores.
I hear anti-Burton flack now, people bitchin about how their board 'broke' or
something, but come on...show me an indestructible board and I'll sell ya a
bridge in brooklyn. I've broken, trashed, spent, de-lammed plenty of Burtons in
the past, along with many other mfg's, I don't 'brag' about it and I sure as
hell don't 'bitch' about it. I'm kind of biased I guess, because when I break a
board, I just have a short drive to the factory and pick up a shiny, new one -
Presto! Life is good again! I don't have a "Burton Rules' tattooed on my ass or
anything, but they have been making, researching snowboard technology for well
over a decade, an innovative industry leader that is a 'safe, sure bet'. I
wasn't aware that they were pulling out of the alpine market either, why is
that?
-VTrider
Michael & Vanessa Nixon
those big air events with "Big Liz" back when. I think I rode that pj56
switch better than any board since - the short, stiff tail looked to hold an
edge
quickly. Trying to straight-line it switch is a different story. Do you do
the USASA Northern Vermont Series? I heard Smuggs has a
new super-pipe dragon cutter. Now get some faster chairs and you be-ight.
Klaus
> wasn't aware that they were pulling out of the alpine market either, why
is
> that?
I am not to sure myself but from reading some of the posts on the
bombersonline.com looks like they are slowing pulling out of the Alpine
market. The print catalog doesn't even have them included this year. I
finally found them on the web site but you have to special order them. I
guess stores won't carry them anymore because there just isn't the market
for Alpine boards like there was.
> The Craig Kelly was the first board I realized you can 'carve' on, seemed
like
> before that everything had a lame sidecut and were basically 2x4s, Oh I
miss
> that board.
I love the Craig Kelly. Back in 1995 I ordered my PJ in October for the
upcoming racing season - it didn't come in until January, so I rode the
Kelly in a couple slamon races. Funny thing was I won both the races. For
being the Freestyle board of choice back then it sure could carve (with some
big cants and ski-boot bladder softboots) Switching to the PJ always made
me miss the quick turning freedom of the Craig Kelly, but nothing out there
is faster then petek 4000 sintered bottom PJ 7.0. Sad I am going back to a
slower board this year :(
Klaus
"VTrider" <vtr...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3A0C2828...@yahoo.com...
VTrider
> Don't know whatup with Bolton. Trying to find that out. Used to help run
> those big air events with "Big Liz" back when. I think I rode that pj56
> switch better than any board since - the short, stiff tail looked to hold an
> edge
Nice, found myself fakie on more than one occasion on the 5.6, the board wanted
to cut a line no matter which way you were going! That same short, stiff tail
came in handy energy wise springing right up and out of the pipe, was always my
favorite springboard ;)
> quickly. Trying to straight-line it switch is a different story. Do you do
> the USASA Northern Vermont Series? I heard Smuggs has a
> new super-pipe dragon cutter. Now get some faster chairs and you be-ight.
Never competed officially in USASA, I was an official event coordinator for a
couple of seasons with/USASA (USSA?) for a season back in the day, this was over
in N. New Hampshire. As for the dragon, we've had it for a couple of seasons
now, and wow 'pipe-cutting' technology has come a long way since the day of
picking a kind day, bunch of friends with shovels, and your favorite 'Beastie
Boys' tape! We (local riders) have a great rapport with the whole 'operation'
park scene up at the mountain, this is the way it was designed from day one -
and it has worked out great for everyone, "dont' like this", "this is to low",
"I think this tabletop should be moved just 3 feet that way" - and put in your
.02c and 'presto' the park/pipe in adapted to meet most people's needs, quicker
than you can count a ballot in Florida, heh - (sorry).
On the chair issue, I sometimes also 'wish' they had a high-speed detachable
quads, but sometimes I just break out laughing for now reason and say 'No I
Don't' :)
-VTrider
VTrider
> bombersonline.com looks like they are slowing pulling out of the Alpine
> market. The print catalog doesn't even have them included this year. I
> finally found them on the web site but you have to special order them. I
> guess stores won't carry them anymore because there just isn't the market
> for Alpine boards like there was.
Funny thing 'market' is, just ain't no $$$ in 'that' market, that's all the
industry is saying, after all it's a business I guess, right? You know and I
know there will always be a market for Alpine, I mean man, it could 'never' die
- It's not like Disco, heh! It's too bad it all boils down too $$$, the scene
had and still has a good thing going for it, it would be ashamed to see all that
and future technology just 'not' applied to Alpine boards because it's just not
a 'profitable' return, oh well - this is the price we all pay for participating
in this society ;)
> I love the Craig Kelly. Back in 1995 I ordered my PJ in October for the
> upcoming racing season - it didn't come in until January, so I rode the
> Kelly in a couple slamon races. Funny thing was I won both the races. For
> being the Freestyle board of choice back then it sure could carve (with some
> big cants and ski-boot bladder softboots) Switching to the PJ always made
> me miss the quick turning freedom of the Craig Kelly, but nothing out there
> is faster then petek 4000 sintered bottom PJ 7.0. Sad I am going back to a
> slower board this year :(
Heh! Klaus man you're bringing back old memories, I totally dug the whole cant
scene, couldn't ride the PJ's without em (probably all mental!), just made sense
to have those angles and get that 'pyramid' shape in your lower half and knees
driving forward, it was like the hot fudge on the sundae! I remember that old
black sintered p-tek sintered base - what a bitch to wax that puppy, didn't seem
to matter because it was bulletproof and the damn thing was almost always on
edge anyway, right! I use to ride two cants on the PJ's and only the rear on my
Kelly and other freeride/style boards. Hard boots always on alpine, but found
em too restricting for the Kelly, my 'standard' snowboard boot for ages was the
good old Sorel with the seasonal changing of ski boot bladders, some duct tape,
and lots of vibram resole patchwork.
-VTrider
Kendo Club
: I don't know, I have
: never had a problem with any of the Burton boards I have owned over the
: years. Except maybe the Elite150, the inserts pulled out after 5 years.
Wow, you had good luck with your Elite. The "inserts" were just helicoils
straight into foam. mine pulled out the first day I had it on a real
hill (halfway down Brewster at Sunshine, for those of you who know
what I'm talking about - long walk down). I drilled through and put
some bolts in, unfortunately I was stupid enough to put them where the
original inserts were and they pulled straight through. Moved the holes
an inch and had no problems after that, unless you count the 5 minutes
spent at the top of every run farting around with the fastex/web straps
on the bindings. Got a Sims 1710, never had a problem with it except
for extreme foot pain from the bindings, switched to plates on a
Gnu Race Room (178 cm, whattatank) and haven't looked back since.
Neil
Michael & Vanessa Nixon
coolphi...@gmail.com
Bob F
> They are not freestyle or down hill boards, they're free riding. I got mine in 89. I was the only snowboard maybe i might see 2 guys. I'm a girl and barely anywhere let you boa
>
designed to compensate for the difference between toe side and heel side.