What's the role of the Pack Committee Chair vs. Cubmaster
Jeff Edelheit
chair and the cubmaster. I was just "promoted" to cubmaster, and the
formerly ineffective cubmaster has moved into committee chair as a
"temporary".
My first concern is to rebuild pack leadership. This is especially
important as the pack has not recovered from the loss of the old pack
leadership of 1.5 yrs ago and I'll be moving up to Boy Scouts in
March. I'd hate to see the pack fall apart.
Jeff Edelheit email: edel...@mitre.org
The MITRE Corporation voice: (703) 883-7586
7525 Colshire Drive FAX: (703) 883-1397
McLean, VA 22102
Stan Krieger
>chair and the cubmaster. I was just "promoted" to cubmaster, and the
>formerly ineffective cubmaster has moved into committee chair as a
>"temporary".
>
>My first concern is to rebuild pack leadership. This is especially
>important as the pack has not recovered from the loss of the old pack
>leadership of 1.5 yrs ago and I'll be moving up to Boy Scouts in
>March. I'd hate to see the pack fall apart.
For the one year that I was active in Cub Scouts (5th grade Webelos
Leader), the way I saw it done was that the Pack Committee handled
all the support tasks, while the Cubmaster handled anything directly
related to the boys. Our Troop does it the same way.
The result was that the Cubmaster recruited the Den Leaders, while the
Committee Chair recruited the Treasurer, Blue and Gold Dinner Chair,
arranged for meeting space for the Pack meetings, etc.
One final thing- I personally believe that the Committee Chair should
be given visibility because, to most of the parents and all the kids,
the central figure is the Scoutmaster (and they don't even know about
the Troop or Pack Committee).
--
Stan Krieger All opinions, advice, or suggestions, even
AT&T UNIX System Laboratories if related to my employment, are my own.
Summit, NJ
s...@usl.com
robert.p.stawicki
Hi Jeff,
Hope this helps somewhat. I am Cubmaster of 135 boys, my Committee
Chair was one of my Webelos Leaders. We split up the work close to
what follows: I handle the internal Pack policies, training needs,
den assignments, den problems, etc. All are concerned with the
Pack membership. My CC deals with outside events, e.g training
courses, Council and District events and happenings. We both set up
the Pack calendar (I know that we should have a committee do this,
but fewer is faster for this meeting), and the programs initially.
At our first Committee/Leaders meeting all is outlined and discussed
with the other members of the Leadership and if needed, changes are made.
I do not have seperate committee and leaders meetings. My experience
has been that everyone has input. In this manner, all of the members
of the Leadership feel important, and no one is told what to do.
As far as rebuilding your Leadership, go to the parents and explain
the problem. You may find some willing to help.
Yours in Scouting,
Rob Stawicki
Cubmaster Pack 38
Running Water District
Jersey Shore Council
Brick, NJ
>>>>>>> r.p.st...@att.com <<<<<<
LCDR Michael E. Dobson
>chair and the cubmaster. I was just "promoted" to cubmaster, and the
>formerly ineffective cubmaster has moved into committee chair as a
>"temporary".
>
>My first concern is to rebuild pack leadership. This is especially
>important as the pack has not recovered from the loss of the old pack
>leadership of 1.5 yrs ago and I'll be moving up to Boy Scouts in
>March. I'd hate to see the pack fall apart.
>
and Den Leaders work for the Committee and thus the Committee Chairman is
probably the most important position in the Pack. You will notice on the
Leaders Applications that it is the Committee Chairman along with the
Chartered Institution Representative that approves all unit leaders. Thus
it should be the Chairman's job to recruit new leaders. The Cubmaster
along with the Den Leaders is responsible for planning the program while
the Committee and Chairman is responsible for the execution. The Cubmaster
is the MC at Pack Meetings while the Chairman presides at Committee
meetings.
The above was taken from a listing of Pack Leader Responsibilities provided by
our council as part of their recruitment literature. I don't have it with
me but can get it if you'd like more details of the various leader
respobsibilities as defined by my council.
Mike
Eagle Scout
Cubmaster Pack 1071, Rockville, MD.
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Mark Wilson
In article 47...@linus.mitre.org, edel...@smiley.mitre.org (Jeff Edelheit) writes:
>I am curious how different packs split the work between the committee
>chair and the cubmaster.
The Cub Scout Leader's Handbook is the single best reference for your answer. I don't
have mine here (the text would be too long to post, anyway). I'll look up the page
references if you want. Any good Cubmaster wouldn't be without this book. Mater of
fact, all Cub Leaders should have one (IMO).
>I'd hate to see the pack fall apart.
Most of us who have led a pack feel that way. Don't be too worried. If there is
something good going on or even just started, someone will pick up the ball. The
best thing for you to do is try to get a good start and to find an assistant who
will carry on. Most important, rebuilding will take some time. I've been rebuilding
a pack for the last two years and we're not out of the woods yet.
In article 23...@cbnewsl.cb.att.com, st...@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (Stan Krieger) writes:
>
>For the one year that I was active in Cub Scouts (5th grade Webelos
>Leader), the way I saw it done was that the Pack Committee handled
>all the support tasks, while the Cubmaster handled anything directly
>related to the boys.
Basically, Stan is right. The Cubmaster is responsible for the Pack program and den
operation. The Committee is responsible for everything else. The Handbook outlines
their specific responsibilities.
>The result was that the Cubmaster recruited the Den Leaders, while the
>Committee Chair recruited the Treasurer, Blue and Gold Dinner Chair,
>arranged for meeting space for the Pack meetings, etc.
Leadership recruiting should be everyone's job all the time. I don't know of
any units that have all the help they want.
>>One final thing- I personally believe that the Committee Chair should
>be given visibility because, to most of the parents and all the kids,
>the central figure is the Scoutmaster (and they don't even know about
>the Troop or Pack Committee).
The committee does it's work mostly behind the scenes. It's like being on the
crew of a play or movie. The CM is the star and therefore most recognized. There
should be a special effort to recognize all those (registered or not) who help
make the Pack go.
In article 17...@cbnewsk.cb.att.com, br...@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (robert.p.stawicki) writes:
>Hope this helps somewhat. I am Cubmaster of 135 boys, my Committee
>Chair was one of my Webelos Leaders.
National policy prohibits adult leaders from holding two positions within the same
unit. The only exception is the COR, who may hold one other position in the Pack.
The commisioners should catch this at recharter. At the least, the council computer
might.
>We split up the work close to
>what follows: I handle the internal Pack policies, training needs,
>den assignments, den problems, etc. All are concerned with the
>Pack membership. My CC deals with outside events, e.g training
>courses, Council and District events and happenings.
From a pragmatic point of view, whatever works is great. Perhaps you would consider
shifting the training stuff to the CM and the policy stuff to the CC. That would
bring the division more in line with other units and the handbook.
>We both set up
>the Pack calendar (I know that we should have a committee do this,
>but fewer is faster for this meeting), and the programs initially.
>At our first Committee/Leaders meeting all is outlined and discussed
>with the other members of the Leadership and if needed, changes are made.
The CM and the CC may get together to create a proposed calendar, but the final
calendar should be decided at the annual planning meeting. The annual planning
meeting should include as many registered leaders as possible and, especially,
the COR. The pack calendar should consider the Chartered Organization, Council
District and local school calendars.
>I do not have seperate committee and leaders meetings. My experience
>has been that everyone has input. In this manner, all of the members
>of the Leadership feel important, and no one is told what to do.
Although everything from national calls for separate meetings for the committee
and the leaders, I agree with this approach. Not only do you get more input,
but you don't have to repeat everything and there is one less meeting on the
schedule (and who needs another meeting?)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Wilson
Eagle Class of 1974
SM, Troop 565, Deltona, FL
also CC, Pack 565, CM training award, Cub Scouter training award, for
what it's worth.
Rick Clements
In article <1992Aug31.2...@nmrdc1.nmrdc.nnmc.navy.mil> rd...@nmrdc1.nmrdc.nnmc.navy.mil (LCDR Michael E. Dobson) writes:
>In article <1992Aug31....@linus.mitre.org> edel...@smiley.mitre.org (Jeff Edelheit) writes:
>>I am curious how different packs split the work between the committee
>>chair and the cubmaster. I was just "promoted" to cubmaster, and the
>>formerly ineffective cubmaster has moved into committee chair as a
>>"temporary".
In our pack, the Scoutmaster runs the Pack meetings. The Committee Chairman
runs the committee meetings. We have a Den Leader Coach that recruits and
helps the Den Leaders. That's not to say people don't help in other areas.
(Last year, we had a hard time geting Den Leaders. So, everyone gave a try
at recruiting Den Leaders.)
>>My first concern is to rebuild pack leadership. This is especially
>>important as the pack has not recovered from the loss of the old pack
>>leadership of 1.5 yrs ago and I'll be moving up to Boy Scouts in
>>March. I'd hate to see the pack fall apart.
If your current Chairman is a temporary, try got get someone to take over
as soon as possible. Or, recruit an assistant who will take over next year.
Get an Asst. Cubmaster and make sure that s/he is ready to take over next year.
Find someone who can be a Den Leader Coach for next year. This needs to be
someone who has been Den Leader for a few years. The new leaders like to hear,
"this worked well for me."
>One thing I've always been taught in Leaders Training is that the Cubmaster
>and Den Leaders work for the Committee and thus the Committee Chairman is
>probably the most important position in the Pack. You will notice on the
The COR approves the Committee Chairma. That would make him/her more
important by your logic. I don't believe the highest ranking leader is
the most important. I believe importance is related to closeness to the boys.
I rank them as Den Leader, Cubmaster, Chairman, Comittee and COR.
Rick Clements
Asst. Webelos Leader/ Asst. Cubmaster
--
Rick Clements (Ri...@pogo.WV.TEK.COM)
Mark Wilson
>One thing I've always been taught in Leaders Training is that the Cubmaster
>and Den Leaders work for the Committee and thus the Committee Chairman is
>probably the most important position in the Pack.
The most important members in the pack are the boys. I believe, and teach, that
the most important leadership positions in the Pack are the Den Leaders since
they have more direct contact with the boys. This is not to belittle the
contributions of the other leaders. Effective pack leadership is a team effort
and there should be more than enough work and recognition to go around. We just
need to remember that the focus needs to be on the boy. The first line on any Pack
job description should be: "Assist the Den Leaders and Cubmaster in presenting
the Cub program to the boys."
BTW, The first line for District, Council, Regional and National positions
should read: "Assist the unit leaders in presenting the Scouting program to the
boys." I don't know if that's the way it really reads, but it should. It seems
that Scouters at these levels somtimes get caught up in a 'chain of command'
thing and lose sight of the objective of the movement.
Steve Steiner
>In article <1992Aug31....@linus.mitre.org> edel...@smiley.mitre.org (Jeff Edelheit) writes:
>>I am curious how different packs split the work between the committee
>>chair and the cubmaster. I was just "promoted" to cubmaster, and the
>>formerly ineffective cubmaster has moved into committee chair as a
>>"temporary".
>>
>>My first concern is to rebuild pack leadership. This is especially
>>important as the pack has not recovered from the loss of the old pack
>>leadership of 1.5 yrs ago and I'll be moving up to Boy Scouts in
>>March. I'd hate to see the pack fall apart.
>>
>One thing I've always been taught in Leaders Training is that the Cubmaster
>and Den Leaders work for the Committee and thus the Committee Chairman is
>probably the most important position in the Pack. You will notice on the
Being part of my districts Cub Scout Leader Training Team, I have to
stringly dissagree with the above statement. First, the most important
position is the Chartering Institution Rep., for if there is no chartering
orginazation there is no pack or troop.
>Leaders Applications that it is the Committee Chairman along with the
>Chartered Institution Representative that approves all unit leaders. Thus
>it should be the Chairman's job to recruit new leaders. The Cubmaster
>along with the Den Leaders is responsible for planning the program while
>the Committee and Chairman is responsible for the execution. The Cubmaster
>is the MC at Pack Meetings while the Chairman presides at Committee
>meetings.
While I won't start (or try to) a flame war. It has been my experience as
an Assistant Cubmaster, Cubmaster, and now Assistant Weblos Leader, that if
the Packs Committee and Leaders work together as a whole, the program for
the boys is 150% better. As far as recruiting new leaders, we feel as a
pack that its everybodies job to help get new leaders. Because one of the
things training has taught me is that people who have never been leaders
before are a bit intimidated by it. They feel that if they do become
leaders that there will be no help from the rest of the unit. As a
trainer, I try to give the new leaders a warm fuzzy feeling, that if they
need help there are many resources around to get that help.
>
>The above was taken from a listing of Pack Leader Responsibilities provided by
>our council as part of their recruitment literature. I don't have it with
>me but can get it if you'd like more details of the various leader
>respobsibilities as defined by my council.
>
>Mike
>Eagle Scout
>Cubmaster Pack 1071, Rockville, MD.
>--
>LCDR Mike Dobson, Sys Admin for | Internet: rd...@nmrdc1.nmrdc.nnmc.navy.mil
>nmrdc1.nmrdc.nnmc.navy.mil | UUCP: ...uunet!mimsy!nmrdc1!rdc30
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>WIN/TCP for 3B2 R3.2 | MCI-Mail: 377-2719 or 00037...@mcimail.com
--
Steve Steiner Preferred address | Telephone: (708)860-2754 (home)
sl...@gagme.chi.il.us sl...@seswho.chi.il.us| (708)773-5864 (work)
If the elevator to success is out of order... | Address: 564 Gilbert Drive
Use the stairs | Wood Dale IL 60191
f...@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu
Jeff,
I know this sounds like a cliche.. but I swear by it.. find out who your
commissioner is (if you don't already know) and ASK them to come in and
help you decipher the role of your committee.. and then help you
TRAIN them in their roles.. (if not trained already) You sound like you
are excited about the challenge of bringing back an older pack.. but don't
be deterred by your short tenure.. a GOOD cubmaster can do wonders in the
place of ineffective leadership. If you want the good works you are doing
now to continue.. don't do ALL the work.. be sure that people feel that they
are a part of things and make sure that they KNOW their JOBS!! This may
include going over individually with each committee person and scheduling
fast start training (to be followed up with basic training) to get your
committee going down the RIGHT PATH!! Your District commissioner should be
WELL KNOWN to you. the cubmaster.. he/she can provide lots of experience
and tell you what may help or not help you in your task.. Hope this helps.
Gina Gestautas f...@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu
Longhorn Council